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Owners have tons of gravy, including a multi-million dollar payout when they retire or 30 more years of rent free living. The deduction is almost a moot point, and most owners earn too much anyway. Take the million dollar lottery payout at retirement and be happy.
Renters, they can't afford to buy. They will need to be broke renters until they can amass 6-figures liquid. Most idiots can not manage to do this. Hence, they do not get the jackpot at retirement and 30 years of rent-free living, to boot. Lifelong paycheck to paycheck renters?
Buyer buys $80k townhouse in 1980. Sells it for $6mm when he retires. And no, saying he could have taken that $8k downpayment to the racetrack and put it all on some horse (or investing into a company on the verge of bankruptcy) is not a valid opportunity cost comparison, you blithering imbecile.
What if stupid renter eventually buys in old age? Owners would be living rent-free at that age. Instead, she subjects herself to $60,000 a year in rent. LOL, nice "retirement" sucker. Correct, she is a ginormous fool. This is a case of "too little, too late" She should have bought something back in the 1970s or 1980s, like other people her age. She'd be sitting on millions and be living rent free. A true idiot renter who had made things even worse. At the least, should have moved to a $1500 studio.
Maybe not NYC, but owners have literally recouped 100% of the cost of their apartment in the 10 years of paying below market cost to own than to rent (owning is much cheaper than renting). Even if the apartment was today valued at $0, owners am still ahead. Wrap your mind around that.
2 years ago, I recall seeing $200k studios being posted here. Of course, some of SE crazies told buyers they were CRAZY. Now, there seem to be none of these $200k studios. If the cheapest studios are now listing for $300k, can we infer that the smart investors who bought 2 years ago are now sitting on a 6-figure profit cushion? Pretty damn incredible. Live for $1000/mo, and get paid $100k to do so. A renter doesn't see that sort of money in a lifetime!
Renters LOSE: Bought in 1983 for $1m. Sold in 2012 for $8mil. Owner walks away with a $7m profit. Renter's profit? $0. Yes, those brilliant renters can avoid the increasing cost of electricity and point out the 6 people who bought in 2009 who are underwater. They are so frickin' smart! Just think owners live for free for decades after paying off the mortgage. And get $7 million bucks as a parting gift.
Renters get ZERO percent return. And, renters pay MORE every single month, both during the mortgage and after it's retired.
Average renter net worth $5k
Average owner net worth $250k
Renting is for short-term thinkers. People used to say Manhattan was overpriced in the 1950s, 60s, 70s, 80s, and 90s. Guess what? Anyone who paid off their mortgage over 30 years was looking at a jackpot of wealthy when they retired. Renters? Nothing. Just sniveling ants trying to keep their rent control. If you take a long term perspective, buying is ALWAYS a no-brainer jackpot lottery system for your retirement. And, no, being down on your purchase from 2010 does not negate this.
Wow, anyone who bought a studio or 1BR in the 1990s is sitting on about $300,000 of cold hard cash for apartment sitting. Real estate is truly a money tree, if there ever was one. Oh, and you'be be living mortgage free by now as well. For the rest of your life.
NOT BUYING NOW VS. NOT BUYING EVER? BIG difference. Sure, this is a stupid time to buy at inflated prices after prices have gone up x00% in the last x years. Anyone who already bought from 1850 to 2008 has made out like a robber baron. That boat has sailed. Anyone who bought in 2009 or 2010 lost lost money. BUT, anyone who never EVER buys in their entire lifetime is a stupid f*cking renter idiot funding someone else's retirement. It's an important clarification that some here are too dumb to understand.
I am 100% agreement that prices are headed down. If you're not already sitting on a mountain of pre-2008 profit, then don't bother. That ship has sailed. Owners should now just concentrate on paying off the mortgage, and living rent free for the rest of their lives. Renters, well, I guess can just keep paying off their master's mortgage.
can we get a translation from stevejhx?
dealaboya lamentente nopa terminende en leasado.
Couldn't agree with you more, dealboy - I think you could give Suze Orman a run for her money!
Thanks for laying it on the line; hopefully it'll wake up some renters who actually are in the position to buy, but are either afraid or think (as you do), that it's too late in the game. But (believe it or not), bargains still can be found if one puts in the time & effort to look hard enough.
They may be few & far between, but they're out there.
What you've stated can also be summed up by the following short dirty:
As an owner your showered with gold from a nozzle,
One man's tsuris is another man's mazel!
Should be everyone's mantra - Happy New Year everybody!
I meant "DITTY" - Sorry!
DEALBOY!!-I agree with what you have to say!! RIGHT ON!!
On balance, I'd definitely like to hear your comments, with Applied Number$, where you can, re: "The Harlem 2013 Situation" relative to the rest of so-called "Prime Manhattan"
Is there any reason you felt the need to post this in two different threads?
"(owning is much cheaper than renting)"
When you start with this as your PREMISE, then you argument is fundamentally worthless.. and the rest is useless.
"Renters get ZERO percent return"
The long term stats say buyers get zero return.
Renters get whatever return they put the money they save on a down payment and/or cheaper monthly payments.
>When you start with this as your PREMISE, then you argument is fundamentally worthless.. and the rest is useless.
Seems to conflict with the statement that "renting is ALWAYS financially more beneficial over time than owning" http://streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/3500-renting-is-always-financially-more-beneficial-over-time-than-owning
What is dealaboya's rant for short-term renters?
We who have made out like robber barons by buying in the 1990's (In my case, the late 1990's, paying all cash) and recently sold.
I can afford to rent. Even 24k a year is nothing to me. 48k would be no problem. I'm renting in a beautiful Brooklyn rental for less than 24k.
Still plenty $$ left and I get to live for free in Italy and Barcelona, while traveling the world without spending any of the half-million dollars in profit I made on the sale of my condo.
Don't even need to touch that profit money, plenty already in investments and bank accounts.
I work when I want and only then, for a big paycheck. I have time to work on charity projects without getting paid.
I just earned 9k for 7 days work in San Francisco. Not even for a 9-to-5 work-day job.
I'm going to Maui tomorrow where I'll work only a few days of the 2 weeks that I'm there.
Bora Bora is my week of no work and then I go to Australia where I'll earn even more than I did in San Francisco.
So, dealboy: what is the point of your comments, recently posted on two different threads within a day?
Dealboy is ringing a bell that I wouldn't even bother to use.