What Barbara Fox has to say on the state of NYC RE -

tech_guy: about 11 months ago

"Fess up". I had absolutely no idea what a quit-claim-whatever is. I still don't. I still don't care.

Fess up. You have completely failed to even attempt to dispute my point - that a single closing does not necessarily determine the true value of an apartment.

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

"I said a $1 sale involves a gift tax."

Yup. Because only someone didn't know you can transfer property tax free would even posit such a stupid thing.

Fess up. You didn't know it.

Cat's are underappreciated. They keep the vermin away.

Well, not on this board, but in general.

bmw: about 11 months ago

lol

lizyank: about 11 months ago

If Leona Helmsey's dog can be worth $12MM why not Steve's cat? Cats are always underappreciated.

front_porch: about 11 months ago

I'm still pretty bullish as evidenced by the fact that hubby and I are out there shopping for ourselves, but I recognize that the drop in volume (which I would call a "stall" or a "freeze" rather than a "crash") is a leading indicator of a drop in prices. I'm not just saying this to suck up to stevejhx because he has a $10mm cat to sell; Jonathan Miller and I were talking about this the other day.

The "X" factor, though, is credit. The lending market has been lousy for a year and a half. If it stays lousy, prices should drop, but you still probably won't see a lot of transactions. If it recovers and real people can suddenly get those 5% mortgages, that might provide a level of price support.

ali r.
{downtown broker}

tech_guy: about 11 months ago

stevejhx, at least now you're making it obvious that you're rewriting what I said. I said a $1 sale involves a gift tax. You're telling me its not a sale, its a quit-claim, and obviously there's no gift tax. You can call it Chinese tea if you want. That doesn't change my argument or my conclusion - it just changes your strawman view of it.

The fact that others are so blinded by agenda that they support your stupid arguments is almost as sad.

bjw2103: about 11 months ago

"Yeah, sure, I got it. Same folks who had no problem with "not having a life" when they posted endlessly about how Manhattan RE would go up (or be saved from the national crisis) are suddenly "too busy" now that the crash is in."

Ugh. You weren't even here then! Yes, there is a handful of ridiculous posters who are willfully blinding themselves to what's happening in the market, but it's a minority. Ridiculous to lump JuiceMan, malraux, evillager (all of whom have not "disappeared") in with the DaBulls and steveFs of the world.

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

What "I" don't understand tecchie? Let's get back to the matter of your gift tax on the $1 sale of property, rather than quit-claiming it for free....

Volumes can crash just as well as prices. Indeed, in real estate (unlike stocks), when volumes crash prices must, as well.

steveF: about 11 months ago

nyc10022....hey listen sweetheart.:)..ahh forget it...you misery people are a lost cause....

tech_guy: about 11 months ago

Most people only use "crash" to describe prices, not volume. No, I will not provide empirical evidence to prove this. Its already been established many times over that you don't understand most people.

nyc10022: about 11 months ago

Yes, the rationalization song. I've heard that one before...
Didn't you use the same stupidity to tell us there wouldn't be a decline in the first place?

Thats really working out well for you.

No new developments? Are you that much in denial. Most apartments added to Manhattan inventory in history - 2008. Second biggest.... will be 2009.

Oh yeah, you are the genius who thought that the "buildings are stopping building" articles would have an effect this year... Sorry, thats years away.

Keep trying, though... its pretty funny.

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

"what crash are you talking about?"

"We are in a state of [...] a large drop off in sales."

What, pray tell, is a large drop off in sales if not a crash.

"The majority of transactions taking place are from sellers who must sell."

As opposed, I supposed, to ones who merely want to sell?

In any case - prove it empirically.

steveF: about 11 months ago

nyc10022..what crash are you talking about? We are in a state of buyer apprehension causing a large drop off in sales. The majority of transactions taking place are from sellers who must sell. Even with this scenario happening, inventory is still at normal historical levels. The credit crisis has thawed(look at the ted spread under 100bps). Once buyers are comfortable the recession is under control they will be back and with no new development to choose from. Guess what?...another surge in prices.

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

Not as entertained by the idea as I am!

front_porch: about 11 months ago

I dunno, I'm kinda entertained by the thought of a $10MM cat.

ali r.
{downtown broker}

tech_guy: about 11 months ago

Wow, I'm busy in an evening, and everybody's first thought is that I'm running. Not that I'm... busy. You guys must lead such interesting lives.

Keep insulting me though - its quite entertaining to see what lengths blind-bears will go to argue the dumbest points imaginable (a $1 closing is true, actual value? Should be the subject of an SNL "REALLY???" skit), just because a non-bear is on the other side.

I can see why the other bulls / moderates left. It has nothing to do with running. It has everything to do with mind-numbing stupidity. $1? REALLY???

nyc10022: about 11 months ago

Yeah, sure, I got it. Same folks who had no problem with "not having a life" when they posted endlessly about how Manhattan RE would go up (or be saved from the national crisis) are suddenly "too busy" now that the crash is in. Its like tech guy who knew everything 2 months ago, but now "nobody knows" now that the data shows we are in a bear market...

She doth protest too much...

steveF: about 11 months ago

JM now only does cameos. Spunky went through that phase too, when he was on "vacation." Then disappeared.

As MMAfia predicted, one by one they fall by the wayside. DaBulls, steveF, there are dozens.

I was predicting a 50% fall in property prices. If nothing changes, it could reach 75%.

Listen Squidward(stevejhx)..I have a life where I don't want to spend evry moment here like you and nyc10022. You know why I have a life, like the other bulls, it is because we are positive doers who got in the game, made money and can enjoy life....People don't be sucked into the stevejhx, nyc10022 misery vortex.....

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

"If you lend your cat 10mm at 0%"

If somebody borrows my cat for $10 million, I will gladly pay the difference.

Moreover, if they want to borrow 1 cat for $10 million, let them know I have 2.

"I think the AFR rules only apply to relatives and friends, not unrelated business transactions"

Not entirely, but close enough for this discussion.

nyc10022: about 11 months ago

"JM now only does cameos. Spunky went through that phase too, when he was on "vacation." Then disappeared."

Ironically, he's the first to accuse folks of "running".

patient09: about 11 months ago

correct and incorrect:
"UNLESS it is a transaction with a related party, which must be done @ market rates. But that's a corporate income tax issue, not an individual one. If I want to lend my mother $10,000 @ 0% interest, it is not taxable to either of us."

It depends on the dollar value. If you lend your cat 10mm at 0% you clearly bring AFR into question. If you have exceeded your lifetime gift limitation then you are liable for the difference between the rate you charged and the AFR

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

AFR is not related to the discussion. You can lend money at any rate you want. AFR's are used to value annuities & similar obligations. If I want to lend my cat $10,000 at 0%, no one can stop me. It's a business decision.

UNLESS it is a transaction with a related party, which must be done @ market rates. But that's a corporate income tax issue, not an individual one. If I want to lend my mother $10,000 @ 0% interest, it is not taxable to either of us.

joedavis, 20% is rather niggardly, as they've already fallen 20% in the past 6 months.

patient09: about 11 months ago

tech:

The AFR or applicable federal rate is set by the U.S. Treasury, not the I.R.S. The I.R.S. simply uses the number the Treasury tells them to. Not even close to sure if this is accurate, but I think the AFR rules only apply to relatives and friends, not unrelated business transactions.

joedavis: about 11 months ago

whether justified or not, sellers expected annualized increases of 10-20% a year for the foreseeable past......
the commoditization of assets took place at an unprecedented pace
thus
whether justified or not, the commodity will now depreciate at 10-20% a year for the foreseaable future as speculative transactions mediated by brokers who win in either direction proceed

isnt this what the foxy lady is saying?

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

JM now only does cameos. Spunky went through that phase too, when he was on "vacation." Then disappeared.

As MMAfia predicted, one by one they fall by the wayside. DaBulls, steveF, there are dozens.

I was predicting a 50% fall in property prices. If nothing changes, it could reach 75%.

aboutready: about 11 months ago

JuiceMan's disappeared, again?

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

Or should I say "months"?

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

"The IRS definitely publishes interest rate levels below which any differential is considered a gift."

Show us where. Because if that's so, my 0% promotional rate from American Express is taxable.

Which it's not.

(I'm not a tax lawyer, but this is a pretty basic estate planning principle.)

What the f*ck does estate planning have to do with interest rates?

w67 - true evil.

Where's tecchie to defend his position? And malraux, and juiceman, and spunky, and evillager, and duecescracked, and all the other ones we've lost over the month?!

w67thstreet: about 11 months ago

Comment was deleted by moderator.

Miette: about 11 months ago

The IRS definitely publishes interest rate levels below which any differential is considered a gift. The rates are the Applicable Federal Rates and are referenced in various provisions. (I'm not a tax lawyer, but this is a pretty basic estate planning principle.)

dwell: about 11 months ago

Tech,
I need some structural engineering work done. When can you get to work?

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

He's LICC!

fakeestate: about 11 months ago

Tech can you fix my computer? I mean, you really seem to know what you're talking about here so I bet you're a really good tech guy too.

dwell: about 11 months ago

Tech,
I will bring all my tax planning stuff to you.

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

Tecchie - nearly an hour! Where's that source on how the IRS regulates interest rates?

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

"you redefine what I said, argue against it, and declare yourself right. Its called a strawman. I never mentioned quit-claim deeds. I don't know where you got it from. I said if I sell an apartment for $1, the value of that apartment is not $1."

What about the part where you say the IRS regulates interest rates?

LMAO.

Strawman. It's like your definition of opportunity cost, your own curious way of valuing foreign mutual funds, and everything else you have ever said. All you can do, like your alter-ego LICC, is project your own failings onto me.

Just look it all up.

bender1961: about 11 months ago

nyc10022 - thanks, i was about to reply to the lowtech_guy and then I read your post

nyc10022: about 11 months ago

"Never argue with a fool, they will lower you to their level and then beat you with experience."

stevejhx: about 11 months ago

You never mentioned quit-claim deeds, techhie, BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T KNOW THEY EXISTED! You said "gifting" for a dollar. Who would do that when you can give the place away for free?

Please, you are SO out of your league. Go back to compiling.

tech_guy: about 11 months ago

bender1961: I was talking to happyrenter, responding to his example. Is your reading comprehension really so low?

stevejhx: You're doing your typical thing where you redefine what I said, argue against it, and declare yourself right. Its called a strawman. I never mentioned quit-claim deeds. I don't know where you got it from. I said if I sell an apartment for $1, the value of that apartment is not $1. You've said nothing to refute that claim.