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Since 2008, i am an original owner... extremely nice building.. nice friendly professional neighbors , lots of kids , great maintenance....lots of amenities....It is safe and the neighborhood is changing..extremely convenient for commuters- 1,2,3,6,B trains and Manhattan buses 116th str and 5th ave.
BUT STILL- its not the same as UWS or UES .
Also you are getting fresh 25 ( not 10) year tax ab for Adeline and 19 years left for Kalahari. Low maintenance. So your expenses for 2 br 2 ba apt incuding RE tax -750 $/mo for Adeline and 850$/mo for Kalahari.Can you bit that for full svc building in Manhattan with gym , play room , garage , doorman/concierge, courtyard , rooftop deck etc ( both buildings), 5 blocks to central park and 15 min walk to Madison ave shops and Broadway/Columbia?
Muromec - you have a ton of posts on the adeline and kalahari - how long have you been living in Kalahari? Do you feel that the neighborhood has changed since you've been living there? Does it feel safe to walk around at night?
latest price increase can be seen only for units that are not in a contract yet ,
price was not updated for units already in the contract...
but sales are slowing... new pricing is somewhat expensive for the harlem
Looks like not all the latest price increases are on Street Easy yet.
Last I have is they're still planning to start the closings in October;however, they are at the mercy of DOB at the end of the day.
Neither the stock market nor RE will go down significantly. Those of us with cash in the bank will, as always, be left holding the bag.
Feelhong, do not forget insurance and routine repairs and periodic updates to maintain the same quality. That will be another $400-500 per month. 10 y holding period will get you to your original number.
^^10:09, no content^^
That equation sounds right to me.
rb345, welcome back. where are the bears?
To answer the original question, real estate up another 5-7 percent. SE condo index 2400+ for Dec 14. SPX 1775-1975 range this year. In short, risk assets will maintain a bid barring significant Russia or China issue.
They sold the retail to cover the land lease jump. what to sell next time?
They do not own the retail space. It is separate. One should review the landlease with an attorney. It is a mixed bag.
Hi mssn, just saw your post. You are incorrect about the landlease at 100 W. 57th. The coop owns the garage and have step ups in the lease to coincide with the ground rent escalations. The rent escalations are completely covered.
The building has a unique landlease and great financials.
An offering plan may also be at www.offeringplanet.com, but often missing recent amendments.
Are your rates reasonable?
I would teach you but I have to charge ;)
Still renting and not worried about it. I took the $300k I could have put towards the downpayment and instead built a business that nets that every quarter. The rent will be paid for life in about a year or 2. Then I will continue cloning the business. "
THIS, I concede, was a brilliant move.
Still renting and not worried about it. I took the $300k I could have put towards the downpayment and instead built a business that nets that every quarter. The rent will be paid for life in about a year or 2. Then I will continue cloning the business. Call me when rates go up, your ARM explodes and there is no financing available...buying is great, if the prices are reasonable and no more than 10-20% of your equity is tied up in real estate...otherwise, you are as foolish as your inability to remember your multiple posts.
Wow - again, I am incredibly impressed by the level of detail you know about the building and these specific apartments. Would you consider purchasing either apartment? Do you think they are appropriately priced?
On to the big-first floor apartment. It's called 124C because the dressing room and bath, raised half a floor above the master bedroom, are actually on the fourth floor. The bedroom/bath/kitchen wing of 3C is tucked in underneath. It's the David Duchovny/Tea Leoni apartment. They bought it from the building's sponsors, who decamped to a smaller apartment when their kids had all gone off to school.
That's the problem with those buildings where a stack of two high-ceilinged living rooms is backed by a stack of three floors of the other rooms. For half of those apartments the LR is half a level down from the kitchen etc.
This one's plan isn't quite accurate. It shows a sort of dining balcony that isn't there. A picture of that side of the room is at http://media.bhsusa.com/pictures///1567736-4_l.jpg
The high floor triplex has a very strange layout. The kitchen is all by itself on the top floor, overlooking the "great room" - very very inconvenient for actual living.
I just like the building. The plan for one kind of floor is at hathitrust.org. It shows four corner apartments, all more or less the same, and the upper part of the two middle studios from the floor below. That one floor makes it seem symetrical and tidy, but it gets complicated on the in-between floors, with the interlocking, and the apartment letters change from floor to floor. There is a pattern, but you'd have to build a 3D model in your head to see how it works.
Anyway, the offering plan details are at http://offeringplan.datasearch.ag.ny.gov/REF/planformservlet?id=CC880032. Somewhere else on the site there's a form where you can put in a Freedom of Information Law request to see the offering plan and make copies. A guy from the AG's office will call, and you can go down to the Equitable Building to make copies.
The easier way is to just have one of the sellers let you look at theirs, but buyers hesitate to do that, as if it's an odd pre-contract request for a multi-million-$ investment.
On the other hand, those sellers don't really want to sell, or they would've by now.
Historically one of the roughest, most dangerous neighborhoods in the nation.
Can anyone provide any insight into this building/neighborhood?
1 do you think you could flip your condo today
2. if so, by how much in dollar and/or percentage terms
3. and why do you believe that you could do so
rb345 is exactly right, at least in our case. As I keep bragging, we bought a condo (closed early April) in brownstone Brooklyn.
We were in the market, getting outbid and outmaneuvered, for a full year. A previous deal fell through on this condo but I was watching every deal out there like a hawk, and we swept in. (The apartment has good bones, but needs a lot of upgrading, so it's not a place anyone would fall in love with.)
I wanted to offer $5,000 over the asking price just to make sure we got this one, but my husband said no, just offer the asking price, and we did. We also bet a dishwashing on the strategy.
Husband was right--they accepted the asking price immediately. But he was wrong about which direction 9th Street goes, so neither of us had to do an extra dishwashing.
front_porch - thank you for the comments, they do make a lot of sense. This is where a good seller's broker value lies.. Still, 6% of the total of the likely "biggest investment in one's life" is really excessive.
Nice - pay $300, save 6% of the price - great ROI. Maybe something I should try. The more I think about it, the more humorous I find brokers dismissing 6% as "just a few percentage points, which the real (read wealthy) New Yorkers can't bother with." If you assume annual price appreciation of 2%, 6% = roughly three years of return on your property, which you should hand to a RE broker for a few hours of work. And most wealthy people are surprisingly thrifty (or at least are well aware of price of money.)
And frankly, how is it that a broker fee can be $60K on a $1M apartment while a RE lawyer, who is a lot more involved and working a lot harder, plus I assume takes on legal responsibility making sure the contract is worded property etc, only gets $2-3K? Makes no sense to me.
To the brokers griping that they only do a few deals/year, hence the fees do not add up to a meaningful annual compensation, I say maybe there are too many of you out there? There are almost no barriers to entry = oversupply; as a result home owners are required to support a huge army of agents who on average can not sell more than a handful of properties/year.
Lastly, on having to share the fee with the brokerage firm - then maybe you should go on your own. I think Keith'sB model is the future, and am surprised there are not more agents like him. It looks like instead of sharing the fee with his brokerage, he shares it with the buyers = gives them a clear incentive to sign up with him. Bet he does a lot more volume/year that a typical buyers broker.
Too summarize - maybe no broker + 15-20% premium = the answer to listing an easy to sell place..
went to an openhouse for a friend to look at a small Brooklyn heights apartment listed here just on SE (paid $300 for the listing is the answer I got from the vendor)
has had multiple offers after the first openhouse for above asking price.......pretty good investment return for $300 if you ask me (would I pay more to SE.....no but I think what they are asking for is fair and they could increase their sales listings as long as they keep it at this price and Zillow doesn't get greedy).
It now looks like there is going to be a 14 story building where the parking lot is currently situated right across the street from 4 West 21st. It is supposed to have 239 apartments. That will block the view for the whole building except for possibly the 15th floor and will be really horrible to live in such close proximity with for the year or so it will take to build it.
About 6 months ago they were testing the soil in the parking lot to see if they can build on it. Nothing further has happened but I wouldn't be surpised if they built there relatively soon.
There are not. They actually just replaced a couple of car lifts.
Does anybody know if there are plans for the parking lot across the street?
6B and 11B seem reconciled to taking their losses, while the PH sellers are looking for someone who both willing to give them a profit and wants a 900-gallon fish tank: http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2010/08/18/garden/20100819-aquarium-slideshow.html
There's an open house for 6B this Sunday, at which the broker should have financials to hand out.
On the plus side, it's a good-looking building. Too many connections to low-end reality-TV, though: the 6B broker and the PH seller.
Any feedback / experience on this community?
this has already been the case in NYC for many years. The only difference is that now investors are funneling money into small buildings.
I just sold an investment property to a hedge fund. For proof of funds (cash deal), they provided me their bank statement showing $9,000,000 in that account.
Sounds like Dealboy is flaunting his dung-aries is public
You left out a letter, and misplaced another.
I am interested in buying in this buiding. Can anyone comment on how this may affect light/views?
In our building they built a new massive storage closet just to put all the packages. Incredible the number that arrives everyday. With the advent of amazon, doormen are now more important than ever as they add so much convenience.
" while the accepting of packages was convenient, my super handles all of that and more. "
Until he can't.
Unless it's a specific duty outlined in his job description, he will make accepting your packages a priority at his convenience.
I don't know what your super does that enables him to sit around and accept packages, but my super is ALWAYS on the move, and very rarely just happens to be in his apartment when USPS/UPS/FedEx rings his buzzer to accept other tenants' packages.
I recently just bought an apartment and was looking specifically for non doorman buildings. I've lived in doorman buildings before and, while the accepting of packages was convenient, my super handles all of that and more. I just found the whole doorman/tenant relationship to be very artificial and uncomfortable and prefer my privacy. Also, while some doormen are great, some are more of a hassle than they're worth imo. I'd rather have a good live in super.
It is no brainer that all else equal having a doorman is better. Problem is how much it costs. For a very large building, per apartment it could be reasonable. But for a small building it would be way too much. These days all new construction buildings that don't have doorman utilize Virtual Doorman or similar remote doorman services that let delivery people into the lobby and into a package room where they leave packages, drycleaning etc. They provide some safety as well as there are cameras all over the place. So if you have this all you need a doorman for would be safety.
1. I have recently dealt with a lot here in NYC on CL, and on the net with websites
2 most are parasitic scum, frauds and/or point pimps
3. then there are the ones I wouldnt do business with
4. the dominant modus operandus is to bleed prospects
as much as possible, and mislead them about being
funded until they have no choice but to borrow from a
particular lender, at which time points, rates and fees
are sharply increased
5. although many dont need to be licensed, they all need to
comply with the fraud prohibitions of Banking Law section
351, and very few do
HARD MONEY LENDERS. Are there any reputable ones out there for NJ and NY?
Thanks jelj13 and NWT...very helpful!!
The spreadsheets listing all the city's co-ops, and the rental buildings they're compared to as one factor in determining taxes, are on the Department of Finance's site.
You could pick up the one for your borough, and find 19-unit co-ops whose other factors are the same as yours. Then look up those co-op's taxes to see whether they're more or less than yours.
Keep in mind, though, there's probably a money reason why co-ops never reduce the number of units in the DoF's records. Mine hasn't, and neither have lots of other buildings in my neighborhood that're full of combos. Maybe they're just lazy, or their tax certiorari lawyers never thought of it, or something, but I doubt it.
Background info on how coop taxes are determined are based detailed at:
I believe your coop would have to hire a law firm that specializes in appealing the building's real estate taxes. The valuation of the building is based upon comparable rental buildings. The number of apartments within a building is just one of many factors that go into the valuation....
I want to bump this. I think its technically possible. Does anyone know the percent that taxes could get reduced if a building applies for the reduction in units?
uhm if someone does this successfully I'd really like to see it.
we've combined 3 apartments in an 8 (originally) so that there are now only 6 apartments.......did it change the tax bill NOPE.
anyone actually done this and saved money before?
I've lived in an illegal loft building in Williamsburg for the past 18 years. We (the tenants) have recently applied for protection under the Loft Law (approval still pending). The landlord is now offering us to buy our respective units below market under a non-eviction condo conversion plan if we agree to drop our Loft Law application. Is it something worth considering or should we first make sure to be protected by the loft law and then consider buying? And how far below market price can we go to make our offer? The landlord has asked us to make an offer below the low end of market price, which they valued at $800.
At some point, it just becomes ridiculous to make sacrifices at that price. Screw Manhattan. In Brooklyn a million bucks enables one to live like a grown-up: http://streeteasy.com/sale/1066132-house-3043-avenue-r-marine-park-brooklyn
Right. Looking at the 95 2/2s now available under $1,000,000, it's easy to see why they're that cheap.
For about half, it's accounted for by the usual neighborhood/condition/exposure (ground floor, no light, etc.) issues.
Lots of the rest have high (e.g. more than $4,000) maintenance and/or are land-leases, so really are more than $1,000,000 and fall out of the mix.
The consumer profiled in the story seemed to have a big appetite: she wanted to jump three rungs up the ladder: (move from a one-bedroom to a two-, move from a one-bath to a two-, and move downtown) ... all for the same price.
It sounds like she was willing to give up sunlight, but as she found out, that doesn't get you three rungs, it gets you two.
>and to live somewhere other than Greenwich village...
Thank you Kyle. Thank you. Finally pointing out the bright side to the market - that most of the better, non NYU infested areas are actually cheaper and definitely more attractive than areas that have for the past 30 or so years (and not much longer) had premium valuations. Obviously if you are a NYU professor or New School professor , or Bryan Singer, etc. this doesn't apply to you, but the good news is that Manhattan is a fairer place to buy and live.
Your problem isn't pricing, the market will tell you the price, and you will get the maximum the market will bear. You don't have to worry in this market about that. If it's a good apartment you'll be barricading the doors.
Your problem is screening buyers. (However slight underpricing is much better than over pricing.) You don't want to invest time and money in a buyer who can't afford the apartment.
We just sold a co-op (now in contract) and bought a condo. We sold this Manhattan co-op with no brokers for full asking price, all cash. The owners had a listing agent for our new condo, so that brokerage got paid 6%---we provided the check as buyers (so much for the notion that the sellers pays the commission hahaha).
I was truly surprised that the broker-represented clients did not win out for our co-op sale, I was offering 3%, as you are. (Your husband went to some unnecessary trouble. You don't need a license to represent yourself, not even in court. I've done pro se there too). It's a lot of the clerical work of the board package, but I also thought we'd get the best price with a represented buyer.
But what I found is, buyers who were under qualified for our building were being brought by experienced agents! This was maddening and a big waste of my time, but true. In one case, most of the buyer's liquid assets were held in an LLC, and this *extremely* experienced agent didn't even bat an eyelash when I told her none of that money would count as liquid assets with a co-op board. She knew that; she was just playing games. Her client would never pass our board.
So I think, if you plan on buyer's brokers helping you, and you paying 3%, don't bet on it. Agents want exclusive listings at 6%. They don't want to mess with you.
I also think smart buyers are avoiding brokers, as they should. So the poor agents are left with what's at the bottom of the barrel.
If a co-op, google "REBNY financial statement" and make all your people with offers fill that form out.
(I did accept an equivalent net worth statement from one offer, but you get the idea.)
FSBO is a lot of work. If you're not up to it, you should just get an agent. If you are up to it, you will save a very very nice chunk of money.
The only way you are getting a bidding war is to price your Apr below market. Whether there is a bidding war or not, you will get a fair market price for it.
Isn't this how it works anyway?
We are about to put our uws 2bd/2 bath apt on market.. my husband is an attorney so he applied for his brokers license so we can try to sell ourselves, saving the fee. Our strategy is to invite brokers over offering to split the fee so that they can be motivated to bring clients. We are hoping to create a bit of a bidding war to maximize our price.
Would love to hear thoughts on if we are making the right move or not. Thanks..
why Tudor City apartments cost less per SF comparing to other similar buildings in the area? fishy...
Am thinking about buying in this building but worry about these future developments which will rise 12 stories and cutting off the light.
Anyone have any other information?
He's lived for $950/mo, and is sitting on a $50k windfall.
For doing nothing but living below market.
LOL, the awesome irony....
Am I missing something... or did everyone completely forget about a down payment?
I don't see how this is typical of anything even if he can rent it out for 10 years at a time. Anyone can do a the price to rent ratios and see (as Schiller, JMiller, and others have done for us) that NY, like SF and a few other places, is much more expensive to buy than to rent UNLESS you assume home prices will go up for many years for much faster than other potential investments.
BSexposer. I love your screen name.
Hmmm...$200K for 200 sq ft in NYC or $200K for 1500 sq ft anywhere else in the country [other than CA]. Which to pick?
No wonder people that live in NYC are all in favor of welfare - they're all broke after paying absurd amounts for housing!