Bush & Obama neck and neck

They are both incompetent puppets

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

In other news, 50% of Americans are complete morons.

More evidence of a poorly-educated and horribly misinformed public. This country has lost it's way.

In other other news, 50% of Americans think the other 50% are morons.

...and 100% of the 50% who know the difference between Obama and Bush,(the lesser), are correct.

Juicy, I thought you were a diehard Obama supporter?!

Personally, I voted for Hillary. She's got balls.

No politican can get us out of the economic crises that developed during the Bush years. It's going to take lots of time. It's a world recession especially when it comes to jobs.

Sorry Bronxboy, this crisis took more than the Bush Years to develop. Traces back to Clinton era policies, but Bush did lend a helping hand.

Are you saying that the problem started with Clinton but your point is that Bush couldn't do anything to stop it in the 8 years he was in office? The momentum that Clinton created was that powerful? Certainly that would let Obama off the hook for just about everything, right?

or two presidents who didn't realize a problem created and a problem growing. Very few saw a mortgage/credit crisis brewing as late as 05 & 06

what about the two unpaid for wars and the trillion dollar plus tax cut? and the prescription drug addition to medicare? did clinton have a hand in that as well?

Someone say something?

yes.

"but Bush did lend a helping hand."

That's the biggest understatement in the history of the world.

And what traces back to "Clinton era policies" is for the most part directly linked to Dick Armey and his Austrian-based economic theories. And to Allen Greenspan - worst Fed Chairman in the history of ever.

I love the Right like RS: Nothing is ever Bush's fault! 9/11 was Clinton's fault even though Bush was president, bailing out the banks was Obama's fault even though Bush was president, and so on and so forth.

Time to take some responsibility, RS, instead of just parroting failed, fringe economic theories as the gospel.

Sorry Clinton signed and did nothing to dissuade the passing of the act that ended Glass Stegal or the act that prevented derivaives from being regulated. Even Gary Gensler admits it was a big mistake. And those annoying ads on tv for drugs....Clinton too!

but what about the two wars? the trillion dollar tax cut?

RS, let's say your house burned down and is now one wet mass of charred debris. Who do you blame:
1- the builder who chose a wood frame
2- the arsonist who poured gasoline and threw a lit match
3- the firefighters who blew thousands of gallons of water until the fire was gone?

the builder who soaked the wood in kerosene.

You mean Gingrich and his contract with America? What about the arsonist, George Bush, and his puppeteer, Cheney?

hah!

"Sorry Clinton signed and did nothing to dissuade the passing of the act that ended Glass Stegal or the act that prevented derivaives from being regulated."

You will never see Glass Stegal reenacted. It was the proper thing to do - banks being limited in that manner was untenable in light of today's technology.

Derivatives ARE regulated, where they can be. Some derivatives are bespoke, much like facultative reinsurance, and therefore can't be regulated. For instance, the difference between futures and forwards is that futures are regulated and cleared through a single counterparty - the clearinghouse - and forwards are not. Only standardized instruments can be regulated and cleared centrally; customized instruments cannot be.

What you wrote is just foolish, and indicates, yet again - like your theory that money is made in exploding stars, or that banks don't create money - that you have NO CLUE what you're talking about.

If what you mean is that companies were not required to set aside capital when writing credit default swaps - which aren't even swaps: it's an insurance contract - then you're right, that was a serious mistake. In fact, there's an excellent argument to be made that parties without an interest in the underlying security should not be able to buy CDS's, and I agree with that. But the blanket statement that derivatives aren't regulated is just stupid.

ETF's are derivatives. Mutual funds are derivatives. Options are derivatives, make up the bulk of the derivatives market, and are highly standardized and regulated.

So - what do you mean?

Look up Brooksley Born and the CTFC. Enough said.

Why don't we stick to w67thstreet and Hitler?

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/23059-3508-open-houses

Riversider: Never mind 3508comm1, or whatever name he posts under again -- he probably still lives with his parents in Stuy Town, has nothing, and has no other adult interaction except for streeteasy.

cc is married and should have better things to do -- yet he's on streeteasy; acting on the orders of his master. Same for AlanHart, Falcogold. As was proven on that other thread, where those slaves offered nothing to help a person in need; they were just posting on there to impress their master.

But, she has their real names and she owns them.
They have a mutual SE friend, out of work for years. They do nothing to help her financially and in fact, their master advises that friend about job/career decisions. That friend feels compelled to "check in and give updates" to the master. That's why she will never get more work from me. And, I've got a lot of work for people who have marketing experience.
They are the garbage of SE. The lowest, slaves on call to their master.

The story ALSO says:

""But that doesn't mean that Americans regret their decision to put Obama in the White House in 2008. By a 50 to 42 percent margin, the public says that Obama has done a better job than Sen. John McCain would have done if he had won. And by a 10-point margin, Americans also say that Joe Biden has done a better job than Sarah Palin would have done as vice president," adds Holland."

Since Bush was constitutionally barred from running...its meaningless to ask about it.

On the Clinton question, for all four years of Bush's second terms, similar polls showed Americans thought Bill did a better job by double digit margins...and on favoribilty polls, Bill is the most popular living President by a mile.

Truth
about 10 hours ago
ignore this person
report abuse
Riversider: Never mind 3508comm1, or whatever name he posts under again -- he probably still lives with his parents in Stuy Town, has nothing, and has no other adult interaction except for streeteasy.

What if nothing you said is correct?

"Born was particularly concerned about swaps, financial instruments that are traded OVER THE COUNTER between banks, insurance companies or other funds or companies, and thus have no transparency except to the two counterparties and the counterparties' regulators, if any."

The bulk of derivatives are regulated. Derivatives were never "deregulated" as you claim. You just don't know what you're talking about (yet again).

steve actually said that mutual funds and ETFs are derivatives. Why does a person with no significant knowledge or understanding of these things insist on posting obnoxious and ignorant comments? He has an odd attraction to speaking without thinking and then being combative about it.

The financial crisis was exacerbated by the inter-connectivity of financial institutions via unregulated derivatives swaps(credit default swaps and even interest rate and currency swaps). Nobody knew who owed anybody what or who held what position. There was no central clearing firm or central trading place. The notional value of swaps is huge and unregulated. We're not talking S&P futures and oil contracts.

they are not making the decision for this country, there are other people!
when are you going to learn?
when bush said,"mission acomplished" meant "the war is acomplished"
learn people.

I'm still shaking my head that steve does not know what is a derivative, and ETF or a mutual fund.

"steve actually said that mutual funds and ETFs are derivatives."

Would that LICC should bother to look up the definition of a "derivative": a financial instrument that derives its value from other instruments.

Thus, an ETF derives its value from an index; a mutual fund its value from its net assets.

In common parlance - the best that LICC can hope to accomplish - a derivative would be an option, future, forward, swap, etc. But these "derivatives" have something in common with the broader definition of a "derivative": an instrument whose value is "derived" from other, underlying instruments.

An MBS is a derivative as well, LICC, and it differs not very much from a mutual fund.

steve you are clueless about this. ETFs and mutual funds are investment vehicles. They pool investor assets and invest that money. They are not derivatives. An ETF does not derive its value from an index. It is a fund that buys securities and other financial instruments to replicate and track the performance of an index. A mutual fund's value is based upon its net asset value. That does not make it a derivative.

In steve's world of the clueless, every investment fund that uses NAV to determine the value of its investor's interests would be a derivative.

"The bulk of derivatives are regulated. Derivatives were never "deregulated" as you claim. You just don't know what you're talking about (yet again). "

As the only person here who ACTUALLY knows about these things from my day to day work (and was in Washington just this week hearing from Senate Staffers and Gensler himself on the topic) and well, wrong.

The Dodd Frank Bill regulated OTC derivatives, and by notional values OTC derivatives DWARFED listed derivatives by many multiples. Only NOW have all derivatives come under regulation. And the CFTC and SEC won't finalize the regs until 9-15-2011. So Steve is smoking crack.

As for Bush...see this story from this week:

"...Republicans, who paid electoral costs in 2006 and 2008 for Bush's unpopularity, are hardly clamoring for the 43rd president to join them on the campaign trail. After all, an Associated Press-GfK poll last month found 55 percent of all Americans have an unfavorable opinion of Bush and 51 percent blame him for the economic crisis that began on his watch...."

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5izunszG_wI8-c765o2Y1rA2t6G9wD9IODKO01?docId=D9IODKO01

...And the AP results mimic Rasmussen and Gallup polls on the same topic. So Obama is unliked, but its silly to think people long for Bush.

Change we can't believe in it sounds like. The soundbite back then made us think we were getting new ideas when we what we got are old ideas.

By notional value, jason, you are correct, but that is only a recent development. By number of transactions, no.

And there's a good reason for that: the notional values of OTC derivatives are much higher than those of traded derivatives.

Dodd-Frank does not cover all OTC derivatives, and you can be sure that as soon as the ones we have are regulated, they'll invent new ones that aren't.

Notional value is the single best way to measure exposure. And this linking of swaps to the broader category of derivatives is ridiculous. It should have been painfully obvious that the unregulated and over the counter subset is what contributed to the inter-connectivity problem that gripped our financial markets during the Lehman, Bear and AIG scare.

What about the two wars and the trillion dollar tax cut?

obama lied, business died.

Iraq war is winding down. Obama made Afghanistan his war..so point is moot.

What about the trillion dollar tax cut?

And...where did the money come from that we have already spent on Iraq?

Riversider: You are appreciated by SE readers with an open mind. Those who read and/or respond to your comments and the articles/links that you post. By their own choice.

Those who are not weak and subject to the Machiavellian demands of a bully pig who seeks to keep them under her control.

They will do anything to appease her, including posting useless, abusive comments on a thread started by a person in real need of information and advice. They have no offers of help, no advice to give. Just childish bully-talk.

A disgusting bully pig (by any of the various names that she posts comments under), and her slaves. Showing their true colors.

They provide nothing to SE, just their garbage. Smug "comments" of no value. And worse--they are proud of themselves for it.

NWT and SunnyD came on that thread with compassion. Answers and advice. Well-meaning and heartfelt.
Thanks to both of them for exhibiting class. They both are good, kind people.

So...what's the Truth about bush and Obama?

cc.: Within minutes of my comment being posted. Right on schedule.

ZAP!!!

What's your point?

This thread is about the difference between Bush and Obama.

Do you have a position on that?

and, once again. Within minutes: cc. Slave to his SE master.

cc. Pour your master another drink.

You're obsessed.

And a fruit loop.

cc... Leave the truth alone...Go away,let the truth ring throughout the land.

Oh yeah. If this is truth, were all screwed.

columbiacounty and julialg seem to agree.

Again

julialg: "Hitch -22". If you haven't read it yet, you will agree with me about it: Hitchens at his best.

"It should have been painfully obvious that the unregulated and over the counter subset is what contributed to the inter-connectivity problem that gripped our financial markets during the Lehman, Bear and AIG scare"

Then you agree that markets are imperfect and must be regulated, and therefore Hayek is wrong.

Thank you!

Thanks truth.. " Then you agree that markets are imperfect and must be regulated, and therefore Hayek is wrong." Totally disagree. The markets by nature are perfect. It is imperfect when the government intrudes. For example; fannie,freddie,regulations galore,taxes,cronyism, quantitative easing, etc,etc,etc....The government always destroys wealth stevejhx.

governments are made up of people and people are here to stay.

"The markets by nature are perfect."

Them and Jesus. Amen!

BTW that's the smartest thing that CC has ever said.

"The markets by nature are perfect."

"Them and Jesus. Amen!"

No stevejhx... The markets consists of millions and millions of individuals making independent decision on what is best for them. Not a corrupt governmental approach with incompetent clerks who couldn't run a hot dog stand.

millions and millions of individuals?

really?

how much of the so called markets are controlled by the top 10 world wide banks?

"By notional value, jason, you are correct, but that is only a recent development. By number of transactions, no."

And by actual dollars and cents made by the investment banks, too. By a factor of like ten.

> In other other news, 50% of Americans think the other 50% are morons.

My favorite stat is that 85% of Americans think they are smarter than average.

and for posters on SE, its 100%.

columbiacounty
5 minutes ago
stop ignoring this person
report abuse
and for posters on SE, its 100%.

Don't sell yourself short.

its a new record for you. you really are ridiculous.

And what percentage can keep up with somewhereelse, the energizer bunny of streeteasy?
P.S. This is meant as a compliment, somewhereelse.

c-rat: Oh, so that's an example of what I've been missing, by not reading cc's comments?!

It sounds like it was dictated to cc by his master.

Nothing like an open mind.

ZAP! cc, your slave collar is draining New York state's electricity supply.

I don't understand your point. You continually goad me and then pretend no to read what I say...what is the point?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WlqW6UCeaY

cc. Your leader..... imam obama

Here's the thing about some liberals, they can dish it out but they can't take it:

Bill O'R. was a guest on The View. Whoopi and Joy didn't like what he was saying so Whoopi got up and walked off the set and Joy followed her.

Barbara Walters scolded them , and they returned back on set.

No Truth,
What you saw was two actresses on "THE VIEW" playing to their fan base.

The Whoopi walk-off thing is really bothering Barbara Walters.
I have a feeling that Whoopi and Joy got a talking-to after the show.
I don't think that Whoopi will be doing the walk-off again.

theatrics...
sole purpose of which is to have people say, "can't believe whoopi and joy walked off th set"
to which people either respond "good for them" or "thank g-d Barbara Walters set them straight....Just my two cents. This is an entertainment show not a news show

Actually, Whoopi has done it before.
It's not even entertaining anymore - if it ever was.
It also pisses advertisers off.
Barbara Walters doesn't like that.
ABC doesn't like that.

Well Truth for many in show-biz there's no such thing as bad P.R. just as long as it is P.R.

And is it any different than wrestling where characters do the same skits week after week.

I meant publicity....not (p.r.)

Riversider: Here's what happens: If a scene on a t.v. show is staged for publicity, the director would know where to put the camera angles. In this Whoopi walk-off, it didn't seem to be anticipated.

Whoopi did the same walk-off before, but not when Barbara Walters was on the show that day.
Today, Walters seemed very surprised. And not happy about it.
She's the executive producer. She has other shows/t.v. specials that air on ABC.

She wears an earpiece on set. She hears the director in the control room. Her exec producer, Bill tells her the ABC bigwigs are calling in. She scolds Whoopi ,and then Whoopi and Joy are told backstage by Bill to get back out on to the set.

The whole idea of them both walking off the show that they co-host makes them look like sulking kiddies.
Liberals watching the show notice that it does nothing to help them. Or liberals out in audience-land.

Barbara Walters is the boss.
They forgot that they shouldn't do the walk-off when Barbara Walters is on the show.

What it's like to be so important?

And if you're so important, why the hell are you talking to a shut in loser?

Within 2 minutes: cc. Twice, because just one dumb comment on my trail isn't enough to appease his master; what's her SE name today?

aboutr...no, ...happyr...uh, no she outed herself on that one right in the middle of an SE exchange. Just pour her another drink, slave.

Fruit loops unite

Hey, cc: Look - over there on that other thread- you missed me.

ZAP, ZAP, ZAP!!!

Why are you goading me?

zap, zap, zap, zap!!!

More of the truth.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/10/15/hugh-shelton-book-clinton-iraq-war-albright_n_764403.html
53420
views749 Get Politics Alerts

Email Comments 747 In the publicity sheet that St. Martin's Press has been sending out to spur interest in General Hugh Shelton's new memoir, Without Hesitation: The Odyssey of an American Warrior, the last highlight is a doozy: "A high-ranking cabinet member suggests intentionally flying an American airplane on a low pass over Baghdad so as to guarantee it will be shot down, thus creating a natural excuse to reltaliate and go to war."

Turns out the incident took place during the Clinton administration, and Shelton's response to the suggestion...well, let's just say it more than lives up to the title of the memoir

OMG, stop Riversider.

In "Hitch 22", Hitchens writes about something that has been suspected about Clinton for decades:
Clinton,while in England persuing his "higher education", was ratting out the students who were planning anti-war protests.

Is that what Clinton really did?
It all "depends on what the definition of is, is."

Getting back to The View episode:

Joy wasn't happy with Bill O'R. But, she didn't get up to walk off the set.
Whoopi was unhappy, and she got up out of her seat to walk off. Joy was still seated.

As Whoopi walked, she stopped in front of Joy. She looked down at Joy and made a head motion : follow me.
Joy was still unsure, but Whoopi was standing in front of her. So Joy got up and followed Whoopi off the set.

They both came back, heads down,
Joy walked to Whoopi's seat. Whoopi had no choice but to sit in Joy's former seat.

Joy let herself be manipulated. The walk-off won't happen again.

columbiacounty
about 23 hours ago
stop ignoring this person
report abuse
Why are you goading me?

Really? You need to be goaded to post? Huh, who knew?

C-ro: cc.is a slave. He doesn't need to be goaded to post comments.
cc follows his master's orders.

JuiceMan got it right.

Neologism of the day: The "Puppedent".

Love it!!!

Yep...

Another one for you to blame.

columbiacounty