lease renewal

who is your landlord?

Landlord owns several large buildings - not sure how much they care if an apt is empty for a couple of months.

As a LL, my current decontrolled renewal rates are anywhere from 0-5%, depending on how much I like you...

12% sounds high, but impossible to tell since there is a chance (albeit small) that you started out with a great deal. The only way you can tell is to go out and see a couple places in your range to compare and then make a decision - maybe you will find out you're already paying too much. If not, can't hurt to make a counter offer and see what they say - the worst thing they do is say no. Good luck.

Forget what you're hearing about free months and waived broker fees - those incentives are used by landlords who need to rent vacant units. There's less negotiating power for a current tenant as the landlord knows you'll likely take the increase rather than have to go through the hassle and expense of moving.

12% on its face sounds high, but it depends too on whether you are currently paying below market. If so, the landlord may be bringing your rent closer to market with this increase. Do a bit of research on comps in your area. If the increase brings you in line with comps, you probably won't get far trying to negotiate. If, however, you find the increase brings you significantly above average then I would absolutely try to shave off some points.

When we got our lease renewal a couple of months ago it was %6 instead of the usual %4. But we'd been paying under-market and still pay what I consider a bit below average, plus electric is included. So we felt the increase was fair and within reason.

Thanks all. We've been paying $4000 for a 2-bed 2-bath in a high-rise doorman building in Kips Bay/Murray Hill area. I don't think it's below market.

If there are apartments in your line available, have a friend call the management office to inquire about price for new tenants (or look online if they post). Compare it to what you're offered. If new tenant gets a better deal than you, I'd threaten to move. Obviously better if it's a credible threat.

MAV,
"as a LL, my current decontrolled renewal rates are anywhere from 0-5%, depending on how much I like you..." LOL, me too! It pays to be nice.

Renter, it also pays to shop around so get busy & gather some facts & then you'll know if/what is an appropriate counter.

vacancies will slowly climb as this recession gets worse. there will be no choice but to lower rates to entice renters as sitting on vacant units each month carries heavily.

A broker friend told me that he is seeing rents going up -not down. Even with the layoffs, won't rents go up since everyone is looking to rent instead of buy?

rentals will have to go down. equity markets are 40% down this year alone, 50% down from peak. home prices are down 20-25% in manhattan. how can rents go up 5-10%? job losses are increasing at a rapid pace and will continue through 2009. if rents do go up, there won't be a bid left in the market for those units. 1 month vacancy for a landlord is an automatic 8% decline in the yearly fees generated for each unit.

But people still need a place to live, and if they are not buying they'll rent-increasing the demand. There are still lots of jobs left in manhattan.

of course they need a place to live! but does it have to be manhattan without a job with rent increases?

There are also a number of large rental buildings coming on the market, and a number of new condo developments will probably convert to rental. New hiring for summer/fall is likely to be extremely low, and occupancy rates depend on new people to replace natural attrition rates. And these will not be natural attrition rates, nor will there be normal household creation rates. Graduates will have to move back in with mom and dad, roommates will have to spend a couple more years together, and many people will delay having a child by a couple of years. Development plans presumed both a robust economy and certain demographic trends, neither of which will come true.

This has been covered on other threads. People need a place to live, but it can be a lot smaller or farther when "people" don't have any money. The family of 4 might settle for a 2-bedroom, instead of 3-bedroom. Or they might say screw it, and move out to the suburbs. The 25-year old lawyer seeing colleagues get laid off might live with roommates instead of getting his own 1-bedroom. And the laid off young colleagues might move back in with their parents, at least temporarily. Or, any of those could say screw it, and move to Brooklyn or NJ.

I saw all of the above in 2001-2002, and this time is a whole lot worse.

have you people lost your mind? look on streeteasy and craigslist, even the TREGNY report! PIRCES ARE DOWN! renter, tell your landlord to F-off and find another place. It won't be hard in this environment.

Hot Property rents are going one way and that is down. I just rented an apt $600 off last years price and it will be fully renovated. I just got my lease renewal for my current bldg and it was zero increase. $4000 for a 2br 2bth is low. You need to get the comps for your bldg and it also depends on your floor etc. You should be able to deal. Give the landlord an offer.

If you are ready to move, I think you will have a lot more bargaining chip against your LL. As a renter for a long time, my look at it is that it'll cost you about $500~$1000 to hire a full server moving company to do a short-distance move. A lot of them will pack your furnitures with content not touched so there is very little re-organizing after moving. Of course, if you are the kind that likes to do some renovation in your rental, you have more to lose. so this really depends. it's a matter of money spent to recreate what you have now comparing to the saving you can get from a better deal. also, moving to a new nb can give you new experience. moving to a nearby building can give even better return as you can keep friends from the area and enjoy new/better amenity at a better price.