Co-op board 3rd time rejection

You don't understand?

Each time they ask for more, you give it.

What don't you understand?

Sounds like unusual and inappropriate behavior by the board. Be glad you have grounds to get out of your contract and find something else.

This must be the most f'ed up story I have heard in 2 years on SE. I just can't decide which part is the most f'ed up - the board's behavior or the OP force feeding Pavlov's dog

Let's be honest for a moment .

If this story is true and you lived in the building, who would you be rooting for?

This gets interesting when you take Miette's advice and walk. At that point, the seller goes to his buddies on the board and says, "Guys, thanks for putting all that extra money in my pocket over and above the market deal that I originally negotiated, but we've got everything there is to get out of this guy so it's time to give the approval and close this thing." If at that point you agree to close on the +14% number that these guys conned out of you then all I can say to the seller and the board is, "Well played."

And think of how much fun it will be for you when you see one of the board members in the elevator and he tells you to get out and wait for the next one.

"Let's be honest for a moment .

If this story is true and you lived in the building, who would you be rooting for?"

1) I don't believe that the board can sustain higher than market prices over the long term. One deal, or a couple, sure, if the buyers blink like the OP, but eventually the market sets the price, not the board
2) I value liquidity

Therefore, I prefer being able to get out at what the market bears when I want or need to do so. How the board manipulates prices in the interim is not of much interest. So I'm rooting for the OP. And especially rooting for the OP not to get rolled by the board and seller in their 3 card monty game.

this whole thing is fishy - who voluntarily raises their own price by 15% in an otherwise flat market? Maybe 2 or 3% I'd believe if the OP had time constraints or truly loved the place, but 15%? That implies its some sort of related-party sale or something that was knowingly done under-market, and the board just doesn't want the appraisals to suffer going forward.

Is this by any chance in Queens or Brooklyn?

Also, how is it that the management company was in direct communication with you? Where's your broker during all of this? What did it say to you about the situation? What did it say to you when you put in your initial offer?

You walk. The experience you've paid for would be cheap at twice the price. As sidelinesitter said, there's no guarantee that the board culture will be any different in ten or twenty years if you go to sell.

And alanhart's right. Your broker should've known enough about the building to steer you clear to begin with.

What's the seller's opinion of the board's behavior? This poor bastard "sold" his apartment in Feb/March, and here we are the last days of June and he can now look forward to putting his or her place back on the market as the market's sentiments turn rapidly bearish. I would think that a lawsuit hovers this entire proceeding. This co-op madness can only happen in NYC.

this is absolutely a no brainer. walk. there are other apts and probably better deals. plus the seller has to put the apt back on the market in the hottest month of the selling season when every buyer is going to be sweating the stock market tanking. do you really want to see these people in the halls for the next 10 years. And just imagine what they say about you. you will probably be hearing from one of SE's more colorful posters regarding the condition of parts of your anatomy. That is the kind of thought that will be running through your neighbors minds every time the see you. Please choose some choice words when you bail.

co-op boards, what a fking bunch of loons doing shit w/o getting paid. You either need the "help" to recognize you or you are a RE borker, and this is your "lock" on the bldgs... otherwise who the F'k does this w/o compensation? Seriously?

can you hear me now, nycmatt?

Thank you for all your comments. I do feel the board has really not acted cleanly on this. I feel if they weren't happy about the price, they should have brought something up the 1st time and settled it - not 3 times over, then by smaller percentages. In the last round, they want me to increase price by another 3-4%, which I think is crazy. The original contract price was probably 10% below market price, but the apartment had been on the block for more than a year and hence the lower than comp price. I feel the board is nikcel and diming, which is just unethical. Is there a way I can take legal action against the board? I'm just very frustrated because they should have just rejected (whether its price or whatever) the 1st time around instead of keeping me hanging.
@alanhart - Manhattan based Co-op and board. Also the price negotitation was done with the brokers help, I never spoke to the management company directly.

Isn't America great? Your parents could have been part of the toilet cleaning caste, but then you come to America and you can buy a yacht and a Porsche and a Rolex.

Do you have a broker? Roll back your offer to #1 and let them know they have x days to approve or deny. The shoe will be on the other foot then.

"The original contract price was probably 10% below market price, but the apartment had been on the block for more than a year and hence the lower than comp price."

If the apartment was on the market that long and the seller agreed to sell to you and not to someone else at a higher price, then the market price is the price in your original contract. Manhattan apartments, esp. in buildings where apparently price needs to be discounted to account for the psycho, control freak board, are not fungible enough that what looks like a comp is really accurate within 10%, in my view. I hear you trying to convince yourself that you had a good deal ("below market") to rationalize paying more because you are attached to this process. My advice, look in the mirror and tell yourself, "Hello, my name in pointgiven and I am overly attached to this apartment." If needed, then proceed to the other 11 steps in the program.

"I feel the board is nikcel and diming"

The numbers in question don't sound like nickels and dimes to me

Walk. Your original offer was market price at best. Places that are 10% below market don't take a year to transact.

Sideline and Inonada are worthy bloggers on this site. I would listen. I think maly also has sage advice here. But I would roll back my offer to 10% below your original offer. Let the seller get a sense of the angst he has been fomenting. If he doesn't take the lower offer..... Walk. And know you walked away from a ridiculous board and years of headaches.

This whole thing is odd. The full story isn't being told.

Well, most of the posters here are worthy bloggers; some of us are just less colorful and controversial than others. The real point here is that everyone who has given an opinion has said that you best walk, reduce your bid, etc. Here's a question: what do people from real life say? Has any disinterested party said you should up your offer? Perhaps it's easier for strangers to voice an opinion other than "whatever feels right to you" (friends and family may not want the burden of you looking back on your decision based on their advice), but has anyone come on the other side, brokers/sellers/coop-era excepted?

I wouldn't even consider buying this place. The make-up and character of co-op board is important to one's overall quality of life. These characteristics often aren't known by a buyer until it's too late. You have had the good fortune to know that this particular board is run by a bunch of losers. There are so many apartments in NYC available right now... anything less than a near perfect situation is a deal breaker right now, from a buyer's perspective.

CONSIDER YOURSELF VERY LUCKY! If you are having difficulty buying this apartment, you will have at least as much difficulty selling it. Do you really want to risk not being able to sell it at your convenience and at your price?? You are lucky to find out about the board BEFORE you are committed to buy it. This board turndown will allow you to get out of the contract and you should jump at this chance. There are alot of apartments available now and I am sure you will find another one with a reasonable board........

I'd be really tempted to walk away from purchasing in the building controlled by crazy people.

However, the other thing that strikes me about the story, what we see of it, is the lousy seller's brokering. To have to do a deal with a board for a floor price ... well, maybe ... but to not have that price stick? The early May bid is the result of board contact, and I don't see why the "price" has to go up from there.

I think the point here is for your lawyer to rain holy hell on seller's lawyer to the tune of "we did our part, you control your side" ... the seller is a shareholder and should actively try to make the May bid stick and consider what recourse he has.

Also, at this point in the process, the lender has surely sent an appraiser to the property, and I'd be really interested to hear where that price is in the scale of all these bids. It may be ammo for the seller to point out to the board that their higher wish prices don't appraise out.

ali r.
DG Neary Realty

Walk, no run. If you were to get this place at any price, you will be unhappy there forever.

Another question for you is: What is the market price for the apartment? The seller would have agreed to a higher price if he had other buyers at that higher price. In addition, If the apartment 8 floors higher has an ASKING price only $35K higher (final price will probably be lower than this), then clearly your offers are within market. So, are you really willing to pay more than 15% higher than your original ACCEPTED offer to get into a building with a very restrictive board?? I would stick with the ORIGINAL OFFER (the contract price before you verbally agreed to increase it). If they refuse it, then I would RUN AWAY as fast as possible.

Also, I agree with Front_Porch regarding the Seller's Broker. Clearly, the seller's broker and lawyer did not do their job of monitoring/controlling the process... Have your lawyer tell them you are sticking with your original contracted price and that, if they continue with this runaround, you will be asking them to pay your lawyer's fees.

Lastly, is it possible that the board has another issue with you? Maybe they are trying to find reasons to turn you down. How is your credit, financials, references, etc.?? Sometimes, boards give a vague answer for a rejection and people assume it is because of the price.....

You have a crazy board, a lousy broker, and your lawyer leaves a backbone to be desired. Why in the world would you put up with all this? Is it the Best Apartment on Earth? The board is most likely violating its own charter, and perhaps even the law, but boards are never held accountable - do you really want to live in a building they run? Your broker, just in case you had any doubt, is working for the seller - even if he's a buyer's broker. Your lawyer just seems to be MIA. Any competent one would have told you to not deal with a board of terrorists. There is no happy end to a situation like this. Think of the money you paid as tuition.

the op's story is fiction--relax all

this sound craaazy...i understand a board not wanting apartments to sell below "value" but to tell a buyer what to offer..maybe the seller wants more money and since the seller is in contract is pulling the strings of the board requesting you to pay more...sounds like blackmail, move on..something fishy is going on there.

You have no legal rights, other than the right to run, very fast, in the other direction. I would not even bother reverting to your original offer now, or even a lesser offer. I would not even have put $5 on top to appease the board, much less 15%.

Have you offered to buy off the board president? I would try that first. Toss some Franklins at the doorman and get him to pass him/her a message for you. Happens all the time. What are you up to now, 20% above contract? 1/10 of that to the pres and you're golden.

take maly's excellent advice and enjoy how good it feels. if it doesn't work, enjoy strolling away from this hot mess, and enjoy going back to the drawing board. these people will do the exact same to you when you try to sell. this sucks, but you have no legal recourse and i don't know why you would waste your time and potentially even more money trying to get all litigious with this bunch of jerks. all of this sounds like a lot of negative energy and that is not how you want to walk into a new home. it should be a nice, fresh welcoming start to something new, not a power game.

sideline had it right when he said....
"This gets interesting when you take Miette's advice and walk. At that point, the seller goes to his buddies on the board and says, "Guys, thanks for putting all that extra money in my pocket over and above the market deal that I originally negotiated, but we've got everything there is to get out of this guy so it's time to give the approval and close this thing." If at that point you agree to close on the +14% number that these guys conned out of you then all I can say to the seller and the board is, "Well played."

Does the seller/board have a signed, enforceable contract with the higher bid included in it? If so, you might not have as many choices as you think.

Hope it works out and you are able to walk away WITH your deposit. Something tells me that, if things are as you say, that will be a battle in itself.

going to have to concur with SSitter - effedup is right. You had/have no hand.

Nice new strategy to create a phantom bidder after a contract has been signed.

the post is garbage--dont waste time responding

Let me check with my manager, maybe I can get you a good deal.

Walk. You will be held up by the board when you need to sell to get out.

pointgiven, when you're all done I want you to come back to this thread and tell us which building it was, and which brokers were involved.

Alan: Yes, this info needs to be put out there.

"Very interesting -- if true." (Gertrude Stein)

I thought Arte Johnson is the one who said that.

"Verrrrry in-ter-restingggg" (Arte Johnson, "Laugh-In" television program series).