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West Side Institution to close

Started by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009
Discussion about
Can anyone tell me how this place made money. Seemed all they did was sell coffee and muffins and provide four floors of free books and magazines to read... It was a nice place visit though ------------------------------------------------------------ The New York Times reports that Barnes & Noble will close its Broadway and 66th Street location, citing a dearth of foot traffic and high rents.... [more]
Response by stevejhx
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 12656
Member since: Feb 2008

The problem is all the sold was books on Austrian economics, and nobody bought them.

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Response by uwsmom
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1945
Member since: Dec 2008

that stinks. i love that store. I vote for a Container Store. I've been obsessing about this for years. How do i make it happen??

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Response by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009

I think it's sad, but have to repeat my earlier comment. When you consider the huge space, rent they must have paid, the cost of financing the inventory of books, it is beyond amazing how they earned a profit. Very much seemed the foot traffic was largely browsers, students looking for a place to study or hang out, which is nice, but it seeemed all they actually sold was coffee and cake(basically a Starbucks with high over-head).

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Response by columbiacounty
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 12708
Member since: Jan 2009

How much do you think it costs to finance the inventory?

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Response by uwsmom
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1945
Member since: Dec 2008

strange, except for the cafe (which is always overcrowded) there wasn't a single seat in the place.

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Response by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009

I haven't been there in a while. I had heard Barnes & Noble took out the comfy chairs....

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Response by spinnaker1
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1670
Member since: Jan 2008

Amazon and Kindle are doing to Barnes and Noble what B&N did to mom and pop. It seems they're following close in the footsteps of the failing Virgin Records model.

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Response by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009

yep, this is Tower Records Redux. Maybe they have a "you've got mail II" where Melanie Grifith celebrates the failure of the big book store.

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Response by stevejhx
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 12656
Member since: Feb 2008

I hear they're moving to Long Island City, in the space next to the Duane Reade: it's where all the fashionable shoppes are now - the ones that spell shops "shoppes".

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Response by Mikev
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 431
Member since: Jun 2010

It's sad. My daughter goes and reads books there a few times a week during the year. But then again this explains why they are going out of business as all the books i buy for home I buy mostly through amazon.

Their business model is a failure because they are great at attracting people to go in but most sit and read through books there, they do not wind up buying.

And how do you pay rent on 4 floors when your income is so low. And as stated in the article they signed that lease so many years ago and rents have gone up, it is just not a good model to pay that much rent when books are moving more towards the electronic device.

So now we are left with borders in Time Warner and the other Barnes and nobles on 82nd, until that one goes out of business.

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Response by Wbottom
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 2142
Member since: May 2010

bodes poorly for retail real estate--internet chicken coming home to roost in many businesses

i actually buy all me books at b&n--like to look through physical books while shopping, the instant grat and for appx 30bux a year am a member--all books minumum 15% off

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Response by Mikev
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 431
Member since: Jun 2010

except you can do better online then that 15% off, that is the whole reason amazon does so well. We actually buy all my daughters books when they run the 4 for 3 deal on Amazon.

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Response by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009

Their business model is a failure because they are great at attracting people to go in but most sit and read through books there, they do not wind up buying.

That's just it. They've had this business model for over ten years(maybe twenty)? There has to be more to this story...

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Response by columbiacounty
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 12708
Member since: Jan 2009

clearly a problem caused by low interest rates.

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Response by spaceboy
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 217
Member since: Mar 2007

Very sad for the Lincoln Center area. Hopefully we get something better than Raymour & Flanigan

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Response by PMG
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1322
Member since: Jan 2008

I hardly consider a single outlet of a chain store that has been around for maybe 10 years as an "institution". Now some of the bookstores that B&N put out of business I would refer to as institutions. And if Gracious Homes closes down, maybe I would use that word.

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Response by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009

Well what's next to go ? Lincoln square cinemas?

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Response by front_porch
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 5325
Member since: Mar 2008

this particular B&N was a very big supporter of my book, so I will be sad sad to see it go!

ali r.

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Response by PMG
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1322
Member since: Jan 2008

The big box retail in Lincoln Square seems a bit vulnerable. At one time that multiplex theater was one of the nations' highest grossing. I wonder if that is still the case. Remember when Tower Records closed? I doubt Raymour & Flanigan has the product mix to satisfy urban lifestyles, but they placed a big bet by taking over all that space.

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Response by spaceboy
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 217
Member since: Mar 2007

Agree on Raymour & Flanigan... how the heck can they afford the rent? Does anyone buy anything there either?

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Response by NYCMatt
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 7523
Member since: May 2009

This reminds me of a "New Yorker" cover a couple years ago: Sidewalk scene ... a guy (presumably the owner) unlocking the front door of his bookstore, looking over with a frown at a woman next door accepting delivery from the UPS guy of a box from Amazon.

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Response by PMG
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1322
Member since: Jan 2008

I wonder whether the sales tax advantage to Amazon should be repealed. It seems like the emerging internet business has grown into a sizable threat to local retailers.

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Response by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009

Amazon can store books in a cheap warehouse or perhaps have the item shipped directly from the publisher/printer and avoid prime west side real estate rates. Again, a seemingly crappy business model.

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Response by MeMe
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 68
Member since: Sep 2007

This is sad. I like having it there but admit I did little to support it. The childrens section is often overflowing with children and their caretakers reading books, I doubt many purchase them. It would be a shame to have that big of a store empty for long. I love the way the redesign of Lincoln Center is looking and was hoping the area was on the upswing.

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Response by HDLC
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 177
Member since: Jan 2009

What goes around comes around. B&N helped to kill off Coliseum and the smaller mom and pop book shops that used to dot the UWS. It's actually strange seeing B&N Lincoln Center referred to as an "West Side Institution"

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Response by PMG
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1322
Member since: Jan 2008

MyUpperWest.com blog tipster is reporting that Century 21 will take the space. They should gross a lot more dollars per square foot which is good, since it's better than a vacant storefront. I know I would more likely travel 25 blocks to shop there than head all the way downtown.

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Response by front_porch
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 5325
Member since: Mar 2008

Isn't there a new C21 in Times Sq?

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Response by PMG
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1322
Member since: Jan 2008

No, I think the Virgin Megastore was rumored to become a C21 and became a Forever 21. This C21 tip may prove equally inaccurate.

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Response by uwsmom
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1945
Member since: Dec 2008

my husband and i met at a Barnes and Noble. I buy almost all of our books and CD's/DVD's there. We're in a B&N weekly. so sad. I might leave the neigborhood if a C21 goes in. you've got to be kidding me!

Container Store anyone?!?!

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Response by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009

Movint neighborhoods because of a century 21 sounds excessive....

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Response by uwsmom
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1945
Member since: Dec 2008

Sorry. yeah, I don't have the best impression of C21. I'm honestly not that familiar with the store, don't shop there, and only really notice tourists carrying C21 shopping bags. Maybe it's not as bad as i think.

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Response by NYCMatt
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 7523
Member since: May 2009

"Maybe it's not as bad as i think."

No, it really IS as bad as you think.

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Response by PMG
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1322
Member since: Jan 2008

Barneys started out as a discount store and I bet shopping their Warehouse Sale is depressing. Frankly, shopping at Fairway is annoying. If you're shopping for a bargain in NYC you'll likely pay for it some other way besides $$$.

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Response by ProperService
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 207
Member since: Jun 2008

Maybe, this C21 will have a mens' changing room. I mean come on, watching dudes drop their pants in the middle of the store to try on jeans is pretty disgusting... on the other, maybe they should get rid of the womens' changing room. Store full of females dropping their pants to try on jeans... ;)

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Response by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009

To put it in perspective Times change, Technologies change.
Blockbuster is gone as is the neighborhood bakery and the neighborhood pharmacy. Personally I miss my German bakery with the fresh rye bread and neighborhood proprietor pharmacist a lot more than a mass-market chain book store.

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Response by jamba97
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 79
Member since: Dec 2009

Confirmed via Bloomberg....C21 to replace Barnes and Noble at Lincoln Square

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Response by w67thstreet
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 9003
Member since: Dec 2008

AWESOME! more tight jean wearing too feminine EURO trash walking the hood! Nice nice.... it's the equivalent of american men walking the streets of bangkok for "recreation."

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Response by uwsmom
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1945
Member since: Dec 2008

ahaha - thumbs up! i didn't want to say it.

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Response by dwell
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 2341
Member since: Jul 2008

C21 sells cheap crappy crap

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Response by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009

so in other words C21 is the spirit of our times.. the Zeitgeist. At least until the economy improves.
I think the neighborhood can withstand some 20 year olds in tight denims.

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Response by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009

Broadway is a thoroughfare. And it's the 60's I don't think the store contrasts too much with the neighborhood. The Lincoln square aspect of the area doesn't make itself felt until later in the evening at which time Century 21 is no longer the attraction.

I've often felt that the movie theater on 68th and Barnes & Noble supported each other. I believe the loss of the book store will hurt the movie theater at least a little.

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Response by Salut
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 132
Member since: May 2010

Best Buy, that Flanigan thing, West Elm, Pottery Barn — I thing C21 actually will be an improvement.

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Response by uwsmom
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1945
Member since: Dec 2008

where the hell is Flanigan's? how am i missing it?

so, where are we going to put the Container Store? I really want one. why not trash the area up a little more, right Salut?

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Response by Salut
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 132
Member since: May 2010

Flanigan is that humongous place on Broadway @ 66. Never saw any human being going in or out.
The Container Store will be right next to a casino in the wasteland of West End below the 70th.
No harm in dreaming...

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Response by spinnaker1
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1670
Member since: Jan 2008

mom, you're freaking me out with the container obsession, man. I mean you don't consume containers, you just buy them and then you have them forever. Right? I don't like containers. I mean I like them, I just hate using them and just about everything else about them. I like the idea of them, all organized and a clear view inside. But usually it's the 4 yo looking for that froggy that lights up. I better find the damn thing or else there will be no sleep for anyone. Then the containers come down and all hell breaks loose. Its like hell in a bucket. The sheer amount of work needed to extract the simplest of things eats at my brain. F container store. nite nite.

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Response by spinnaker1
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1670
Member since: Jan 2008

how do I get the thumb to go down and light up?

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Response by spinnaker1
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1670
Member since: Jan 2008

there.

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Response by lucillebluth
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 2631
Member since: May 2010

a trusted bathroom stop through 2 pregnancies. rip.

i've scored some great designer threads at century. it's a few seasons old, but still good quality. yay for century! although it's not for the impatient, you have to dig.

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Response by uwsmom
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 1945
Member since: Dec 2008

Spin - I have a 2.3 y.o. and a 9 mos old. I HAVE to be organized. But honestly, the love affair started way before the kids. Organization soothes my soul.

I call b.s. on the nite nite. i know you're a fellow Bravo whore and it's time to cook!

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Response by lucillebluth
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 2631
Member since: May 2010

uwsmom, container store is great. their plastic shoeboxes are the best of any other plastic shoe box type item.

mr. bluth was out of work for a while, and when he ran out of normal things to keep him occupied, one day when i was out with the kids he photographed all my shoes and put the pics on the box. so now all my (way too many) shoe boxes have a picture for easy identification. true story.

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Response by tricky7
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 16
Member since: May 2009

C21 sucks. I cannot believe this is happening. There are already a loehman on 73rd and a filene's basement (expanding) on 79th. what's next? daffy's on 86th? this neighborhood is turning into herald square. six flags should branch out to central park and we'd be all set.

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Response by lucillebluth
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 2631
Member since: May 2010

"what's next? daffy's on 86th"

westsiders should be so lucky! there is already a daffy's in the newsweek building, though. so.

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Response by Salut
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 132
Member since: May 2010

tricky7, 86th is a world away from 67th, emotionally, RE-tly, aesthetically, big box-ly, an so on. From the 70th down on Broadway, it's been big box stores forever.
And Filene's, even with that damned Syms, is still in the two-storey building. It don't hurt nobody

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Response by Riversider
almost 16 years ago
Posts: 13573
Member since: Apr 2009

Anyone who has a kindle or ipad should not be Surprised. Books are going electronic.

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