Many of you have been so helpful over the past couple of years as I've posted my sad stories of searching for an apartment. Now that (it looks like) we've found one that we love, I'm going to the well again to seek some more advice. This is both a sales and renovation issue. We learned indirectly--not from the seller--that the building's management has advised owners in her building line that they... [more]
Many of you have been so helpful over the past couple of years as I've posted my sad stories of searching for an apartment. Now that (it looks like) we've found one that we love, I'm going to the well again to seek some more advice. This is both a sales and renovation issue.
We learned indirectly--not from the seller--that the building's management has advised owners in her building line that they can't use the master shower until they've made repairs to the shower, as there have been leaks from behind the tiles into the common hallway. The owner hasn't made these repairs. Though we've been told the fix until a renovation is an "aqua glass" that the building can likely install for no more than a couple thousand dollars, this seems like it would be temporary.
We'd like to renovate the bathroom and other parts of the apartment eventually, but it seems like it might make sense to just start with the bathroom right now because of this problem.
We've phoned the building's management to try to get more information, but they have a temp only until Monday. Meanwhile, our lawyers are ironing out the contract. Wc can get a contractor in to the apartment before then to try to assess the cost, but I don't know how effective this will be if he can't open the wall. Our inspector didn't catch this when he did his inspection a few days ago. Maybe we should just ask the seller to subtract a few thousand from the asking price?
I know there are a lot of knowledgeable SE folks here, so I welcome any feedback on the situation. Many thanks in advance.
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Response by West81st
over 15 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
Since you can't exactly quantify the cost yet, perhaps your attorney could propose that a few thousand dollars be held in escrow after closing to assess and resolve the problem.
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Response by holly1
over 15 years ago
Posts: 36
Member since: Aug 2010
get an quess-timate from your contracter and most certainly ask for a reduction in price. the sellers are already invested in you. they will concede. This is a problem that will have to be resolved anyway. good luck. we are in contract ourselves on a home and its ugly getting things resolved. good luck
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Response by csn
over 15 years ago
Posts: 450
Member since: Dec 2007
If you can get in touch with either the management or people who have had this work done in their showers you will be able to get a cost factor or a quote from one of the contractors that had fixed the problem.
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Response by rlmnyc
over 15 years ago
Posts: 273
Member since: May 2009
Thank you--so helpful!
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Response by front_porch
over 15 years ago
Posts: 5325
Member since: Mar 2008
So let's clarify: the building told the owners in a line that the shower was unusable because it creates leaks, and that disclosure didn't come over to you?
I'm with Westie on an escrow, but I'd say $20K just to be a little punitive about the nondisclosure.
Big "I am not a lawyer" disclosure here.
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
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Response by West81st
over 15 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
$20K for a $2-3K repair? I like it!
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Response by rlmnyc
over 15 years ago
Posts: 273
Member since: May 2009
Yes, Ali. It makes me wonder what else we don't know...
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Response by front_porch
over 15 years ago
Posts: 5325
Member since: Mar 2008
well, imagine a world in which the shower has to be ripped out with half the wall tile and floor tile in order to install a new shower pan, and then the shower is replaced, and everything is retiled. That probably won't be the situation, but arguably that could be $20K, and it's not like people who forgot to tell you stuff are going to be gracious about fulfilling their ethical but non-contractual obligations post-closing.
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
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Response by rlmnyc
over 15 years ago
Posts: 273
Member since: May 2009
I'm imagining, Ali. I smell a price concession...
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Response by front_porch
over 15 years ago
Posts: 5325
Member since: Mar 2008
send me flowers when it comes.
:>
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Response by inonada
over 15 years ago
Posts: 8085
Member since: Oct 2008
You have to seriously tax their asses for this. Have your agent play good cop, you play bad cop. You're no longer interested, this might've a $20K expense. The sellers didn't disclose this, what else are they hiding, you don't want to deal with unethical people. Who knows what they've done with the home. Basically, make it seem like you're going to walk over this issue. Have the others talk some sense into you and convince you that you should simply accept a price concession.
I would imagine such a strategy would work best if your broker wasn't really in on your true final intentions.
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Response by Wbottom
over 15 years ago
Posts: 2142
Member since: May 2010
def---play your broker along with the seller/selling broker---your own broker's actual fear that the deal may be lost will effect best dancing on your behalf
do NOT trust that your broker will play your game if he/she knows it's a game
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Response by rlmnyc
over 15 years ago
Posts: 273
Member since: May 2009
Thanks, inonada and Wbottom. This is more great feedback. We've got a lot to think about.
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Response by nyc_real_estate
over 15 years ago
Posts: 41
Member since: Feb 2011
if the management requires you to repair the leak, they might as well require you to get plumbing back to the stock (very common)equals to the bathroom at the very minimum it is 20k so I would check with the management company first
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Response by front_porch
over 15 years ago
Posts: 5325
Member since: Mar 2008
I strongly disagree with the tactical approach to go full-bore negative on this. There is a time for "good cop, bad cop," but it is not in a negotiation over a once-in-two-years apartment that you "love."
Seller deserves a counterpunch, but it should be one punch, not three, and not a choke hold coming from a person who appears to have done a 180-degree-turn on their intention to purchase the apartment. This is a negotiation, not a trade, and keeping a consistent persona counts for something.
As for lying to your agent, don't even get me started.
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
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Response by rlmnyc
over 15 years ago
Posts: 273
Member since: May 2009
I see your point, Ali. We're not looking to make a killing on this apartment; we just don't want to be saddled with an unlivable environment. And nobody likes to feel as if someone's putting one over on them.
Since you can't exactly quantify the cost yet, perhaps your attorney could propose that a few thousand dollars be held in escrow after closing to assess and resolve the problem.
get an quess-timate from your contracter and most certainly ask for a reduction in price. the sellers are already invested in you. they will concede. This is a problem that will have to be resolved anyway. good luck. we are in contract ourselves on a home and its ugly getting things resolved. good luck
If you can get in touch with either the management or people who have had this work done in their showers you will be able to get a cost factor or a quote from one of the contractors that had fixed the problem.
Thank you--so helpful!
So let's clarify: the building told the owners in a line that the shower was unusable because it creates leaks, and that disclosure didn't come over to you?
I'm with Westie on an escrow, but I'd say $20K just to be a little punitive about the nondisclosure.
Big "I am not a lawyer" disclosure here.
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
$20K for a $2-3K repair? I like it!
Yes, Ali. It makes me wonder what else we don't know...
well, imagine a world in which the shower has to be ripped out with half the wall tile and floor tile in order to install a new shower pan, and then the shower is replaced, and everything is retiled. That probably won't be the situation, but arguably that could be $20K, and it's not like people who forgot to tell you stuff are going to be gracious about fulfilling their ethical but non-contractual obligations post-closing.
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
I'm imagining, Ali. I smell a price concession...
send me flowers when it comes.
:>
You have to seriously tax their asses for this. Have your agent play good cop, you play bad cop. You're no longer interested, this might've a $20K expense. The sellers didn't disclose this, what else are they hiding, you don't want to deal with unethical people. Who knows what they've done with the home. Basically, make it seem like you're going to walk over this issue. Have the others talk some sense into you and convince you that you should simply accept a price concession.
I would imagine such a strategy would work best if your broker wasn't really in on your true final intentions.
def---play your broker along with the seller/selling broker---your own broker's actual fear that the deal may be lost will effect best dancing on your behalf
do NOT trust that your broker will play your game if he/she knows it's a game
Thanks, inonada and Wbottom. This is more great feedback. We've got a lot to think about.
if the management requires you to repair the leak, they might as well require you to get plumbing back to the stock (very common)equals to the bathroom at the very minimum it is 20k so I would check with the management company first
I strongly disagree with the tactical approach to go full-bore negative on this. There is a time for "good cop, bad cop," but it is not in a negotiation over a once-in-two-years apartment that you "love."
Seller deserves a counterpunch, but it should be one punch, not three, and not a choke hold coming from a person who appears to have done a 180-degree-turn on their intention to purchase the apartment. This is a negotiation, not a trade, and keeping a consistent persona counts for something.
As for lying to your agent, don't even get me started.
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
I see your point, Ali. We're not looking to make a killing on this apartment; we just don't want to be saddled with an unlivable environment. And nobody likes to feel as if someone's putting one over on them.