CORE Marketing Group

Here's a conclusion for you luciato, you big old douchebag you, approx. $2 psf in monthlies, wow you gotta be a real douche to buy with that monthly nut. Bless your heart.

luciato if your good friend has reached a point in his life that enables him to purchase in manhattan its apparent that he posseses critical thinking skills. perhaps he is presented with a unique situation that is not conducive to reaching the intended goal.

verain it would not be a pleasant expereince if a seller presents information in an unclear manner despite repeated requests for clarity-stonewall effect.

ok now I'm confused

verain all im saying is if you have a willing buyer and not a willing seller for an available apartment it becomes a problem.

There's no problem, just no transaction. Fundamental elements of a contract include offer and acceptance.

verain what would you call a seller presenting many intentional no transactions?

Not a seller

From The Real Deal
On 05/08/08 at 02:32PM
Core sued by former broker Joseph Bongiovanni
By Lauren Elkies

A former Core Group Marketing agent is suing the company and its key players for allegedly cheating him out of more than $51 million in commissions.

Broker Joseph Bongiovanni filed a lawsuit in New York State Supreme Court March 7 against Core Group Marketing; Co-founder and CEO Shaun Osher; Co-founder Jack Cayre; Principal Joseph Cayre (owner of Midtown Equities); founding member Steven Ganz; and broker Jon Isaacs. Bongiovanni alleges that the defendants stole his clients and refuse to give him commissions on five development deals, including one for $200 million, and three residential sales.

In an eight-count complaint, Bongiovanni claimed that when he left the Corcoran Group for Core in August 2006, he and Osher reached a verbal agreement that Bongiovanni "had exclusive rights" to any client that he brought with him to Core. He claims that meant "no sales agent at the firm maintained a right to show properties to said clients other than the plaintiff."
He also claimed that Osher verbally agreed that "any client which plaintiff procured either prior or subsequent [to] his joining the defendant firm was his and his only with respect to the ability to earn commissions."

Osher said the claims are baseless.

He said in a statement: "We firmly believe that Joseph Bongiovanni's allegations against Core Group Marketing are without merit. We are saddened that Mr. Bongiovanni has chosen to take the actions he has. We are confident that our reputation among our clients and peers alike will not waver as we move through the litigation process as a result of Mr. Bongiovanni's unfounded claims."

Core, which has a staff of 42 people, is marketing 11 new developments, including William Beaver House, Jasper and 520 West Chelsea.

Bongiovanni left Core around this past Christmas after a year-and-a-half at the firm, and returned to the Corcoran Group. He has done several deals in the Onyx Chelsea at 261 West 28th Street, a project that he first marketed while at Core.

The Department of State, which licenses real estate agents, received a complaint about Bongiovanni on January 20, according to a spokesperson, who would not elaborate. The complaint is under investigation.

Another complaint was filed with the department against the defendants in Bongiovanni's lawsuit on March 12, another spokesperson said. That complaint over commissions was dismissed, she said, because it will be handled in court.

Bongiovanni, who has been an agent since January 2003, did not comment on the lawsuit.

Lisa Breier Urban, managing partner and co-founder of Breier Deutschmeister Urban & Fromme P.C., a Manhattan-based real estate law firm, said the lawsuit "seems pretty tenuous" and that compensation cases like Bongiovanni's are tough to win because they often rely on agreements that are only verbal, and aren't in writing.

In order to win the case, Urban said, the plaintiff "needs to show that he would have received an economic advantage — commission — but for the actions of the defendants and that these actions were motivated by malice or effected by unlawful means. He also will have to show that he suffered special damages — measurable damages actually sustained — which are required for establishing a cause of action for a tort.

"Further, for him to show loss of a commission, he will have to show that the claim for the commissions is not speculative — i.e. that the deals were real and closed."

Claims for commissions owed are nothing new.

"It's not highly unusual that an agent who has left a firm might have been disgruntled and may choose to pursue legal action for commissions they perceive to be owed," said Pamela Liebman, president and CEO of Corcoran, whose company has no involvement in the lawsuit.

I enjoy this ... lying is fair game after all. But educated parties should reach contracts and do their diligence on all relevant facts. And when they don't, it is their problem as much as the other party's.

Lie with dogs, wake up with ... no commissions.

We made an offer on a unit in a development where Core Marketing Group is handling the sales. The offer was rejected and we walked away (they wouldn't concede to any of our requests). Now, a couple of days later, the broker from Core called and said that they now have someone interested in the same unit. Given market conditions, we thought it might be best to wait a little before making a final decision on the unit. I know brokers generally use this "scare" tactic to get buyers to act so I'm not sure if I should take this call seriously - esp given the chatter on this board? Any advice?

What difference does it make if there is an offer the agent has received? I may be missing something. You made an offer, it was rejected and you were so far apart that you chose not to revise the offer. I assume you thought your offer was reasonable and realistic. If it wasn't, why did you make it to begin with? The supposed arrival of someone else who is interested doesn't change that CORE didn't accept your terms. So now that someone else is claimed to be interested you are going to do what? Start bidding against yourself? Increase your offer without ever having received a counteroffer? Abandon the terms you felt strongly enough about to walk away a couple of days ago?

You need to breathe and take a step back. This is not how you negotiate effectively. If you are still interested, I would renew your offer (assuming it was one you believe was reasoned and realistic) from a few days ago and invite the agent to counteroffer. Otherwise this sounds silly.

Agree completely with Kyle

Great listings at Core Group

My agent was great.

"The industry lost a lot of credibility with those outlandish marketing programs," says Shaun Osher, CEO of Core Group Marketing, one of the leading condo sales groups in the city. "We're going to use our new retail space to hold buyer seminars so people fully understand the home buying process. We're back to where we were 20 years ago when I started in the business. Build a building, educate someone to what that building is, and if they like it, they'll buy it. For me, that's refreshing."

http://www.nydailynews.com/real_estate/2009/06/12/2009-06-12_crash_course_in_tough_times.html?page=2

Interesting how CORE's shady style continues. I could be wrong about "GVharber," but the three last posters on this thread are likely present or former CORE shills.

"fredd" is nowhere else on streeteasy threads except here and one other thread in which he tries to start a discussion for a new development for which he is likely working for the marketing agent.

"sillyrabbit" made the one appearance here touting CORE and then disappeared.

"GVharber" is unknown to me over the course of two years participating on this forum.

Time and time again, CORE and its agents strike me as oily and these most recent posts just reinforce that opinion. Do they really think planting bogus posts on a thread like this is effective?

kylewest
about 2 weeks ago
this is exactly the kind of petty back and forth that is diluting the value of these board. ... Please see if you can find the restraint to refrain from the back and forth gripes.

Applecore, I've never heard of you. For all I know you are yet another CORE-invented personna. My post on this thread is not personal against anyone of the other posters--it exposes them as frauds based on my years of familiarity with this site, its posters, and its workings. I value the site, attempt to keep the info shared accurate and call games when I see them. Someone posting a self-serving link for their marketing group serves no one. It clutters the threads with garbage. If you feel the posts aren't useful, let the thread drift back to oblivion with my warning marking its end for any unsuspecting reader in the future who unwittingly comes upon it when searching the site.

Applecore, if there's a top-20 of valuable contributors to this board it includes kylewest. For you to arrive out of nowhere with that claim is literally laugh-out-loud funny.

"We're going to use our new retail space to hold buyer seminars so people fully understand the home buying process. We're back to where we were 20 years ago when I started in the business. Build a building, educate someone to what that building is, and if they like it, they'll buy it. For me, that's refreshing."

Translation: Buyers no longer fall for the old routine, so we're trying a new one.

Anyone notice these guys and SHVO have a lot fewer listings, especially new developments?

Tenenetal & Kyle I almost never post although I've read this board for 7-8 months. I think you're wrong about Kyle being in the top 20 of SE contributors. I'd rate him top 5. His comments are always accurate and very helpful.

NYCDreamer, I initially thought top-10, but I worried I would be spinning the thread off into people listing their favorite posters. I wanted to leave myself some room. :o)

Has any buyer or seller actually gotten cheated in a deal with Core?

Oh good. Another poster I've never seen post before.

I've never dealt with them dude, I'm asking. If you have, your input would be appreciated whether it be a good experience or a bad experience. And if you don't know then fine

My experience with CORE is that the three agents I dealt with while looking at two properties and a sales office is that they all gave me a headache and left me feeling like I needed a shower. They spoke in the most ramped-up broker talk I'd encountered at any agency. They acted slick in a cheesy way that reminded me of the lack of self-awareness that people on reality shows have, and one agent in particular just could never say die and would spin the negatives endlessly. If you look at past threads on CORE and my comments on them, I offer more thoughts on the manner they handled the closing of a particular sales office (sort of a dark-of-night disappearing act and grossly unprofessional notes tacked to storefront windows and stained ads in the windows).

Surely some of their agents are better than others, but I haven't met them. To me, they more or less embodied the characteristics that people discuss when ranting about why they hate brokers.

I dealt with these guys. I guess slick is appropriate. But I'm an adult, no naif.

i guess slick describes them although i'd call the ones i've met oily

Different strokes for different folks, right?? If I am selling I'd rather have an aggressive broker like CORE, especially if my condo had more lifestyle and amenities to sell. If I was selling an upper east side co-op or some white brick building or walkup, maybe I'd go with one of the more boring companies.

I bought a condo they sold and it was great!

They are exclusive for 141 Fifth Avenue which is a really nice building, great area. I'm still in discussions

"aggressive broker" (see RTreamer, above) is not the same as oily, or even as slick. If you think they are synonyms, I think you're idea of good business needs retooling.

Hi, I was looking for info on CORE, they are the broker at what I'm looking at. Seem professional but I waned to know if there were any issues I should be aware of, didn't see any so far just little nuissance complaints.

well, philfrain (whom I 've never seen on here before), what kind of "issues" were you looking for? Have you found whatever these issues are with other brokers so that you are now concerned and want to know if they are also found at CORE? Can you just be more specific....?

Kyle, thanks, no I haven't seen any problems at all or heard about problems either. I'm just being prudent but of course if there are no actual issues then that is great.

Are I wrong or are these guys only new developments

Well, philfrain, I think the subject of CORE has been beaten to death on these boards over the last 2 years and you can simply search "core" and come up with the relevant threads. I doubt there is anything new anyone has add at this point. You can then conclude on your own if you find the things discussed to be issues or non-issues for you.

Theyre pretty cool, they have the listings at 53 Warren which is a good building they are representing too. I"m not sure what the fuss is about, I don't know anyone's who'se ever had a real problem.

I've looked there, Core was helpful, but we are thinking more about the Financial District.

Wife and I were in Chelsea today and saw their office. Pretty nice. Good projects too. Not that we are in the market, according to my better half.

is that a real post? that office looks like it belongs in time square.

They were the brokers in a development we bought. The developer failed. they did not give us straight answers and claimed that they have no information. At the same time the developer was failing, they kept their office open potentially misleading other buyers. It was a very bad experience. We got our money back. I have not seen threads about Prudential or any other brokerages that were similar in negativity and /or resentment as I have seen about Core. personally, based on my own experience, I would recommend all to stay away from them. Their associates are useless and their marketing material completed by 7 art is what kept (oops- a freudian slip, should be keeps..) them alive. Run as far as you can.

Yes, that is the impression I had of them. They seemed to be young, well-dressed sharks who were out to make as much money off of unsuspecting clients as possible. I get the feeling that they actually don't think there's anything wrong with dishonesty or hiding the truth/telling half-truths to make the sale. The CORE brokers seem to be all about appearances, selfish gain, with little to no substance.

Truth be told, their objective is to represent the people they are selling for and they do it well and ethically. Not everyone wants to be a buyer and if you don't you might not like that they are sellers. But in selling, appearances count, and representing your seller selflishly matters. As far as substance, that's a matter of style. If people buy without substance and more can be sold "without substance" than with substance, then they are right to do what they do the way they do it because their clients are satisfied. So far all I've seen are complaints about the superficial, which leads me to believe that either you weren't a buyer of a property they sold in which case you have no reason to complain, or you were but you couldn't find anything more real to complain about because there was nothing.

The Core Development group has produced some of the more inventive amenity rich properties here in the city over the last bunch of years. The theory that has so handsomly rewarded them is that buyers and their agents are absolute morons that look hard at the amenities and ignore everything else. Josh could take a shoe box and dress it up with enough sexy looking extras to make a bidding war. If this guy didn't get a 4-5 fold return on his invertment he simply did not bother. You might notice that this development group did not get caught out in the cold as much as others. One thing is for sure...if it's Core, you got taken to the cleaners. Josh is one smart dude. Bow your heads.

"The theory that has so handsomly rewarded them is that buyers and their agents are absolute morons that look hard at the amenities and ignore everything else."

I remember looking at 129 Duane (which has another side on Thomas) when they were doing the initial marketing back in ?98?/?99? (and this was a building which I had looked at as a semi-shell / half built building a few years earlier when the original developer was crapping out for some reason) and seeing the "high end finishes" like Viking stoves and the like, but also looking at piano hinges on doors which were installed crooked and thing to myself "what morons are going to buy this awful construction". Well, that's the building I think of as "ground zero" for "high end finishes/gold plated turds" of loft development in Tribeca ever since.

falcogold1 what specific development are you speaking of?

these guys totally saved my friend's ass. Totally bought in over his head, then had to move temporarily and rent in LA. Core got his property sold quicker than I expected and got him hole even that the economy was bad late last year.

lux 74

Buyers should beware no matter which firm they are dealing with. Lazy = loss. Speaking from experience these guys don't happen to be any worse than anyone else and frankly represent a property well. Doesn't mean I need to buy though.

They are a very solid firm with very good people.

No one is saying "lazy-loss" and that CORE is lazy. In fact, I believe the agents with whom I've dealt working quite hard. But their approach was oily and indeed focused on things to distract from substantive issues (e.g. finances) by concentrating on Viking stoves, etc which really matter little in terms of overall longterm value. It isn't about lazy. It's about peeling back the puffery (and no one does puffery better than CORE) to really see if a property is right for you. CORE is handsome and slick and often effective--much like the attorney in Chicago, Billy Flynn. "Give 'em the ole razzle-dazzle 'em. Give 'em the old three ring circus, stun and stagger 'em. When you're in trouble, go into your dance. Though you are stiffer than a girder, they'll let you get away with murder. Razzle dazzle 'em!"

Honestly, if you are a luxury developer or luxury property owner, you want to work with people who understand the language. If you aren't a luxury buyer, you probably won't like either their properties or them. Not everyone can satisfy everyone.

Just used the handy trick that columbiacounty taught us about revealing user #s, and it sure seems like this thread is riddled with a quite a few one-off posters who signed-up very close in time to one another--folks at CORE not that busy, perhaps?

Prince... I tried to "hoover over" "ignore this person" Nothing came up. What am I doing wrong?

Thanks

Nice try larrflipper. Guess I'm one of those rubes who doesn't understand luxury of the type CORE is peddling. You can't blame me. I live in an isolated bubble of a GV coop and the Hamptons. Maybe if I can just get out once in a while and hang out outside the Onyx lobby at 29th and 8th Avenue (one of CORE's projects), I'll learn something about class. What do you think? Man, that Onyx and its views of the homeless and Penn Station is a kind of luxury I can only dream about I suppose.

NYCDreamer--unfortunately, I'm quite computer-challenged and completely the wrong person to ask about questions like this. However, I had a problem yesterday as well, so I went to the "Tools" section of my internet browser page, left-clicked and checked the "Status Bar" thing, and then the user number shows up on the bottom of the page in the status bar. If this makes absolutely no sense to you or doesn't work for you, hopefully a kind and much more computer-literate SE poster than me will come to your rescue.

wow kyle, with your sarcasm and denigration of the homeless, you're a real great guy. Maybe if you could get out of your bubble life in a Greenwich Village co-op (let me guess one of the classic white brick co-ops like Breevort) and your home in the Hamptons, you'd actually be able to relate to a real human being.