Area around 18th and 8th?

It's a fine area, I just wouldn't move too close to the projects nearby, which is where a lot of the construction is. The project are safe (albeit ugly), but there's a psychological element to it.

New construction, to me, is waaay better than prewar. But the real estate taxes are much higher.

Actually, "the projects" are between 9th Avenue and 10th Avenue south of the Theological Seminary. They don't impact 8th Avenue in any discernable way. They are not, however "safe," insofar as in terms of crime stats they account for a disproportionate percentage of criminal activity in the 10th Precinct which covers Chelsea (overall the neighborhood is among the safest in the city, though).

8th and 18th is the hub of Chelsea and if you like the 'hood, it's a great place to be. Based on having lived in Chelsea up until recently for nearly 20 years, this section has no hidden drawbacks that only an "insider" would know.

thank you both - helpful to know. glad to know there are no hidden drawbacks. i've lived in the wv for about 6 years so ready for a change.

I know where the projects are, which is why I suggested avoiding them: the further that way you go, the worse it gets. They are not exceedingly dangerous projects like some in other parts of the city, but nor are they as safe as when my family lived in the projects.

In the end I wouldn't want to live anywhere near them.

When I first moved back to NYC 10 years ago, I wouldn't walk in Chelsea, not even on 7th Avenue. Now I'm glad to live here - it's changed a lot since my grandmother grew up here, and my great-grandmother (other side of the family) drank herself to death here.

steve... do you think the new developments going up along the High Line as well as the High Line itself will change the hood for the better (even with the PJs staying where they are)? I ride my bike back from the Greenway down 18th St and while it is at the moment a neighborhood in the midst of a transition, I think a few years from now its going to be a lot nicer..at least I hope so.

I think the projects will always be there, and therefore limit the potential pool of buyers. I can't afford what's being offered along West Street but even if I could I wouldn't live there - between the projects and the noise, it would be unbearable.

Sorry, but I fail to see the appeal of the High Line. I think they should have turned it into part of the subway system: far more useful and needed in far west Manhattan. A subway line along 10th Avenue is precisely what's needed for that part of the island to be accessible.

Stevejhx, I can't believe you think 1998 was a dangerous time to walk 7th Ave or 8th Ave or the side streets of Chelsea. I lived in that area for almost a decade before that, and even then the crime rate was startlingly low in Chelsea. I don't think you could find another New Yorker who felt they couldn't walk on 7th Ave. in 1998. Up to 1998 Barneys anchored the south end of 7th Ave. and small shops and restaurants spread all the way up to 23rd St. The big stores had already opened on 6th Ave., the Cineplex Odeon's multiplex drew huge crowds on 23rd Street, and the most popular gay bars going were all over the area. It was not dangerous in any sense. It still isn't.

As for the Highline, there is a lot of money being invested there and unless something completely derails the park, the new construction around it will have an asset that will help maintain values better than new construction in other parts of Chelsea I suspect. That is not to say it won't get stung in a downturn, though. The western edge of Chelsea wasn't ever especially beautiful and the art galleries above 23rd did everything to put that area on the map. The Highline can do nothing but improve an otherwise non-descript, overlooked area. It has already raised property values extraordinarily in its immediate vicinity.

Well, Kylewest, it's true: the streets were deserted and they felt unsafe to me. Maybe not to you, but to me.

I still think a subway is more useful than a park that you have to climb stairs to reach, that will be 10 feet wide, and (to me) absurd. It would have been better - if the park were needed - to knock down the infrastructure and build it on the easement.

I think you miss the novelty and interest this park will add and are too quick to discount it. In plan it looks fascinating. And preferring a subway over a park is a personal choice that I don't think is at all necessarily a feeling shared by most--particularly when the subway is just 2 blocks away. I like easy access to transportation, too, but having a green space out your window is pretty nice. The prices up there are nuts right now, but in time the park will persist for everyone to enjoy and the prices of new construction can do what they will.

Some of what emerges is how personality and preferences colors our differing views of RE and life in Manhattan. For example, it's worth a lot to me to be able to have a kitchen and bathroom I design with moldings and finishes I select in an apartment I get to change whenever I like versus having to live with what I get in a rental. I know you feel that latter is the better route. I say figure in the quality of life ownership can add when choosing between renting and buying. Those things don't have dollar values. They are personal. A native NY'er's sense of relative safety on the streets versus a transplant's, or the appreciation of a park's aesthetics over a busstop or subway hole outside one's front door are also personal choices. All the economics in the world ultimately fall apart on these things since "unaccounted for externalities" seep in when dealing with aesthetics and lifestyle choices. It isn't all about practicality and a retirement spreadsheet. All things are not equal. And sometimes in all your advocacy for the wisdom of renting over buying I think you ignore that.

And steve, what do you mean know the tracks down and build the park on the easement? What easement? Streets cross beneath the Highline every block. They couldn't possibly be re-routed. There is no ground-level tract upon which to build a park in this parkless section of the city. It's one of the reasons the idea was so ingenious.

I still think you could have built a park on ground level and a subway under the easement. Two birds.

I was born in NYC and raised - except for 3 years in Maryland - in Nassau Dutchess, Putnam, and CT.

Them's a mighty long 2 blocks! I bring my car in for service at Lexus of Manhattan, have to walk from Columbus Circle to 11th Avenue: exhausting. You'd do a lot more for property values if it were accessible, and how easy to extend the L to the High Line, have it run up to the Javitz Center and connect the J. Eventually, all the way up to Inwood under 10th Avenue.

But that's a different thread!

You baffle me or are just playin' with me. Fortify and greenify an existing elevated platform and spur economic development all over the place (as is being done), or as you suggest finance a new multiple site subway dig, put a park on non-existing ground that would require endless condemnation litigation and unbelievable cost? And dude, if 2 blocks between 8 Ave and 10 Ave "exhaust" you, you really need to hit the gym or at least get away from the keyboard and walk around a little more often or you'll be dead before you ever get to use that retirement money!

I do need to go to the gym more often.

It's uphill.

There is an easement running under the elevated tracks with nothing but the supports on it. Turning it into a park would be wonderful, then you could run a subway line under it.

Wait a minute. What? At 23rd St. for example the tracks cross right over the street that passes under it. Same at other places the tracks cross the street. How can you build a park in the middle of a street?