Saw no fee, signed broker paperwork. Ditch broker?
Started by CatMother
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 0
Member since: May 2016
Discussion about
Like the title says, I met with a broker today who almost immediately gave me a paper to sign that said I agreed to pay a 15% broker fee for any apartment they showed me. I mean, that sucks, but it'd be hard to find an apartment without a broker fee right? Fine. She was nice and showed me a few great places, but the last 2 were my favorite. When I looked them up on StreetEasy I found that the 2 I... [more]
Like the title says, I met with a broker today who almost immediately gave me a paper to sign that said I agreed to pay a 15% broker fee for any apartment they showed me. I mean, that sucks, but it'd be hard to find an apartment without a broker fee right? Fine.
She was nice and showed me a few great places, but the last 2 were my favorite. When I looked them up on StreetEasy I found that the 2 I liked were both no fee. I know my broker did work to show me that listing, but I don't think they should collect nearly $4000 when the lister didn't want to charge a fee.
I'm wondering if I could let the broker go and contact the place directly to avoid the fee. I don't know if this would be a legal problem, but if its a moral one well...$4000. Though I'd be absolutely willing to give them 5% for helping, I feel like an idiot paying a bunch for something I could get so much free-er if I can. I'm getting kinda mixed answers and want a real solid one, hopefully from a broker or lawyer.
Here's the paperwork- http://imgur.com/k6BIoLT
TL;DR- If a broker showed me a no fee apartment, can I ditch the broker and contact the lister directly without legal ramifications?
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Response by fieldschester
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 3525
Member since: Jul 2013
If you rent the apartment in question, pay the fee.
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Response by Jazzman
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 781
Member since: Feb 2009
pay the fee - if you go direct the broker will find out and sue you. They earned their money. Would you prefer them to show you 100 apartments you don't like before they show you one you do like? Is that how you'd expect them to earn their fee?
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Response by 30yrs_RE_20_in_REO
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 9882
Member since: Mar 2009
I tried to read the paperwork but the link did not work for me. If it's a "no fee" apartment that usually mean brokers are being paid y the owner. A broker can not collect a fee from BOTH sides in a transaction without their specific consent. So if it's a true "no fee" apartment the broker may be willing to simply collect the fee they will get from the owner and waive the fee to the tenant.
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Response by kcarscaden
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 38
Member since: Jul 2012
you are in the wrong, you morally and legally should pay the fee.
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Response by skrufi
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 57
Member since: Oct 2013
You absolutely should pay the fee. All no fee means is that the listing agent gets paid by the owner and the renter's agent collects their own fee from the renter. Your broker found the listing for you - if you wanted to not pay any fees then you should've taken the time to scour the web yourself. Next time don't hire a broker - right now you're legally and ethically bound to pay.
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Response by reallystate
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 59
Member since: Apr 2009
Brokers have access to both 'fee' and 'no fee' apartments. They all feed into the agent database. A good broker will show you both types, so that you see everything that fits your criteria. It's not a game; it's just the way it works.
If you want a No Fee apartment then you do the research, homework, footwork and follow up. You negotiate with the landlord/rep. You anticipate all the potential snafus and arrange all the typically-forgotten details based on your previous experience in the business. You collect and coordinate the paperwork, review it and submit it to the bldg management exactly as instructed without errors or omissions. Don't forget to vet the landlord so you know how the property is maintained and managed. Then you won't need the agent since you have the free time to handle all of those things. You have clearly earned your "no" fee.
People hire a broker to save them time, to negotiate on their behalf and to help them swiftly secure the right place at the best possible price. Tenants have other things to do with their time, like work for instance. For them, it's worth the extra money to save the headaches and heartache.
PS - 30yrs_RE... is mistaken - a no fee apartment usually means that the bldg ownership is releasing an apartment directly to the tenant marketplace OR the owner of an apartment (a sublet in a co-op or condo for example) is paying the fee of the Listing Agent. Only. No one is "paying both brokers" on a rental.
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Response by HK306
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 62
Member since: Oct 2009
I think Reallystate significantly overstates the difficulty of renting a no fee apartment--I mean, dude makes it sound like a full time job, and it's really not. But it is correct that if you've been shown a no fee place by a broker, then you can't just ditch the broker and rent the place behind his back--your agreement almost certainly forbids that. However, you can typically ditch the broker and rent some OTHER no fee place -- if there's nothing magical about this one, then that may be an option for you. Another option might be to go back to the broker and say that you're not willing to take this place because of the fee, and that you're not interested in continuing to use him now that you've realized that there are so many no fee options out there...but would he take a lower fee for this place, and call it a day? Maybe he would, maybe he wouldn't, but you could always ask.
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Response by fieldschester
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 3525
Member since: Jul 2013
>I think Reallystate significantly overstates the difficulty of renting a no fee apartment
and overstates what the broker actually does: "Don't forget to vet the landlord so you know how the property is maintained and managed."
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Response by Schott
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 4
Member since: Jun 2012
It seems they were very up front about the fee. Just ask them if they are getting any concessions from the owner, if so they should disclose this. They should not collect 15% from a renter then collect more from the owner. Usually it is the difference.
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Response by hanklin
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 36
Member since: Apr 2016
The worth of the broker to the renter seems to depend on whether it is the broker's own unique listing via his client the owner, or pulling off the database that everyone has. The first seems to be value to the owner, with the fee foisted on the renter, which I guess is fine if that is what the market will bear. The second seems to be valuable to the renter if the renter is saving time and sees things that aren't advertised without a fee that he could find himself through a search he's willing to do anyway, right?
If you rent the apartment in question, pay the fee.
pay the fee - if you go direct the broker will find out and sue you. They earned their money. Would you prefer them to show you 100 apartments you don't like before they show you one you do like? Is that how you'd expect them to earn their fee?
I tried to read the paperwork but the link did not work for me. If it's a "no fee" apartment that usually mean brokers are being paid y the owner. A broker can not collect a fee from BOTH sides in a transaction without their specific consent. So if it's a true "no fee" apartment the broker may be willing to simply collect the fee they will get from the owner and waive the fee to the tenant.
you are in the wrong, you morally and legally should pay the fee.
You absolutely should pay the fee. All no fee means is that the listing agent gets paid by the owner and the renter's agent collects their own fee from the renter. Your broker found the listing for you - if you wanted to not pay any fees then you should've taken the time to scour the web yourself. Next time don't hire a broker - right now you're legally and ethically bound to pay.
Brokers have access to both 'fee' and 'no fee' apartments. They all feed into the agent database. A good broker will show you both types, so that you see everything that fits your criteria. It's not a game; it's just the way it works.
If you want a No Fee apartment then you do the research, homework, footwork and follow up. You negotiate with the landlord/rep. You anticipate all the potential snafus and arrange all the typically-forgotten details based on your previous experience in the business. You collect and coordinate the paperwork, review it and submit it to the bldg management exactly as instructed without errors or omissions. Don't forget to vet the landlord so you know how the property is maintained and managed. Then you won't need the agent since you have the free time to handle all of those things. You have clearly earned your "no" fee.
People hire a broker to save them time, to negotiate on their behalf and to help them swiftly secure the right place at the best possible price. Tenants have other things to do with their time, like work for instance. For them, it's worth the extra money to save the headaches and heartache.
PS - 30yrs_RE... is mistaken - a no fee apartment usually means that the bldg ownership is releasing an apartment directly to the tenant marketplace OR the owner of an apartment (a sublet in a co-op or condo for example) is paying the fee of the Listing Agent. Only. No one is "paying both brokers" on a rental.
I think Reallystate significantly overstates the difficulty of renting a no fee apartment--I mean, dude makes it sound like a full time job, and it's really not. But it is correct that if you've been shown a no fee place by a broker, then you can't just ditch the broker and rent the place behind his back--your agreement almost certainly forbids that. However, you can typically ditch the broker and rent some OTHER no fee place -- if there's nothing magical about this one, then that may be an option for you. Another option might be to go back to the broker and say that you're not willing to take this place because of the fee, and that you're not interested in continuing to use him now that you've realized that there are so many no fee options out there...but would he take a lower fee for this place, and call it a day? Maybe he would, maybe he wouldn't, but you could always ask.
>I think Reallystate significantly overstates the difficulty of renting a no fee apartment
and overstates what the broker actually does: "Don't forget to vet the landlord so you know how the property is maintained and managed."
It seems they were very up front about the fee. Just ask them if they are getting any concessions from the owner, if so they should disclose this. They should not collect 15% from a renter then collect more from the owner. Usually it is the difference.
The worth of the broker to the renter seems to depend on whether it is the broker's own unique listing via his client the owner, or pulling off the database that everyone has. The first seems to be value to the owner, with the fee foisted on the renter, which I guess is fine if that is what the market will bear. The second seems to be valuable to the renter if the renter is saving time and sees things that aren't advertised without a fee that he could find himself through a search he's willing to do anyway, right?