Co Op / Board Approval - What should I be prepared for?

ask your broker

Today they might take your pulse.
They might also give you an intellegence test, for not waiting.
I believe it's two fingers now to check you toleration for discomfort.
Sniff you pits.
Root through your financials very carfully.
Examine you and your kin for overt freakishness or obvious genetic defective phenotypical traits.
You broker will collect your package. This is where your broker shines...in their ability to use a copy machine.

Am I reading this correctly? Has hell frozen over? You are suggesting I solely trust my broker on this?

My broker can't spell the word 'you'.

one thing you should be prepared for at the interview is a complete strip search.

My broker put together all the materials for the package, send us written examples of questions and practiced answering all the strange questions that sometime come up.That is what a good broker will do. The interview lasts typically from 15 min to an hour and you hear back quickly if all goes well.

Can you give some examples?

Since you've gotten as far as the interview, your financials and background check have passed muster. Interview itself should be no big deal. They can't ask you the really interesting things they want to know, so expect some innocuous chit-chat and not much more.

Too late now, but a broker who's sold in the building will have heard back from her previous clients on how meetings went, etc.

My web site is being worked on, so I can't point you to it, but quickly:

Business dress, bordering on funereal. Dark suit or dress, little jewelry. No perfume, no cigarettes. Nothing terribly "fashionable."

Speak when spoken to. This is not a job interview, and you're not "selling." Smile but don't make small talk. When the board asks if you have questions, the answer is "no."

Expect to answer: "what do you do for a living? why do you want to be in the building? Do you know anyone in the building?"

If there are two of you, rehearse who's going to answer what.

ali r.
{downtown broker}

That's helpful. Thanks, front_porch.

yw. enjoy your new home.

ali r.
{downtown broker}

When the board asks if you have questions, the answer is "no."

==============================================================

Wow, sounds like you need to be pretentious.

cleanslate: huh?

I think there was a pretty good thread with answers to the same question. Ali answered very well there too. You should be able to find it. Good luck. Also, check out a rather amusing thread on how to get rejected by the coop board for ideas about what not to do!

Keep any discussion on renovations minimal btw.

front_porch:

"Business dress, bordering on funereal. Dark suit or dress, little jewelry. No perfume, no cigarettes. Nothing terribly "fashionable."
Speak when spoken to. This is not a job interview, and you're not "selling." Smile but don't make small talk. When the board asks if you have questions, the answer is "no."
If there are two of you, rehearse who's going to answer what."

I hate brokers passionately. But if there were any group of people involved in the real estate world who approached brokers in terms of abject a@@holeness, it's people who sit on coop boards. Absolutely full of themselves. Seriously, "speak when spoken to"???? It's people like that that I hope lost all their money to Madoff. F 'em all.

Here's an article from the New York Times, July 1995, on the subject. Nothing seems to have changed since then.

July 30, 1995

"YOUR HOME; Passing A Co-op Interview

By JAY ROMANO

FOR Benjamin Lee, an 89-year-old resident of Florida, the experience was harrowing. Mr. Lee and his son, on a visit to New York City earlier this year, were summoned to a meeting.

"I'll never forget it," Mr. Lee said. "We were led up to a kind of storage space. There were two men sitting at a table. Behind the table was a curtain. A third man came into the room, turned on a tape recorder, and then started asking me about my income tax. It was like a Star Chamber."

The Lees were not in town for a tax audit. They had come to New York for an interview with the admissions committee of a co-op, a relatively commonplace event that many aspiring shareholders find stressful and, at times, frustrating.

"The admissions interview is the culmination of the admissions process," said Mary Ann Rothman, executive director of the Council of New York Cooperatives. "Different buildings operate in different ways."

Under the bylaws of nearly all co-ops, shareholders have an almost sacred right to decide whom they will accept as partners. (And it is the general rule that the co-op may grant or withhold consent for any reason or for no reason, except that a denial cannot be based upon discrimination.) Accordingly, prospective shareholders are typically required to submit an application for admission that gives details about their finances, personal history and lifestyle, sometimes with extreme specificity. Then, if the applicant passes muster on the paperwork, he or she is invited to meet the admissions committee face to face for the final cut.

Indeed, Ms. Rothman said, most admissions committees strive to make prospective shareholders as comfortable as possible by conducting interviews in a cordial, businesslike manner. And in many cases, she said, the scheduling of an interview is a pretty good sign that the committee is already satisfied with the paperwork submitted by the candidate.

Still, even the most self-assured aspiring shareholder would probably prefer an afternoon in the dentist's chair to a half hour in the hot seat for an admissions interview.

Here, then, are some tips to help make it a relatively stress-free, successful experience.

"People need to be prepared for a certain lack of privacy," said William Hunt, co-president of Hunt Kennedy, a real estate firm in Manhattan. "Many people who have gone through this process resent that, but it's just part of joining the club."

Mr. Hunt said it was important to be able to substantiate all information included on the admissions application and any financial statements that accompanied it. In addition, he said, applicants should not assume that just because a mortgage company has said it will provide a shareholder loan, the board will be satisfied that the prospective shareholder's cash flow is adequate.

"Co-op boards are far more stringent than banks," he said.

Dennis Greenstein, a Manhattan lawyer who represents co-ops and condominiums, said that in addition to being ready for a thorough grilling on finances, applicants should be prepared to disclose personal aspects of their lives.)

"The board can ask anything from where your kids go to school to where you're going for vacation this summer," Mr. Greenstein said, adding that most boards will also want to meet and interview every person who is going to live in an apartment, including Fido. "And I always tell my clients that this is not the time to fudge anything."

Gordon C. Dixon, board president of a 562-unit co-op at 142 West End Avenue, said the interview was an opportunity for the board to size up a prospective shareholder to determine what kind of neighbor he or she would be.

"Character is important," Mr. Dixon said. "We want to make sure that people can get along with others and respect others. Sometimes couples come in and start bickering with each other, and you wonder if they really want the apartment after all."

Applicants should dress appropriately, he said, and perhaps even dress up a bit. "And never, ever, contact board members individually," Mr. Dixon said. "Go through the managing agent."

Bruce Cholst, a Manhattan real estate lawyer who served for seven years on the admissions committee for his own building, said that what he looked for in a prospective shareholder was an indication of "reliability, competence and a willingness to adhere to rules and regulations."

Projecting that image, Mr. Cholst said, begins before the board interview. "One of the criteria I looked at is how meticulously a person filled out his application," he said. "Does he omit stuff? Does he cross out stuff? Is it a haphazard application?"

On the other hand, Mr. Cholst said, "If a person is too precise, he conveys signs of being neurotic, and boards don't want neurotics because they often become troublesome shareholders."

What boards do want, he said, is someone who will "fit" in the building. "I think a candidate should express a willingness to volunteer for service on the board or one of the committees," he said. "Boards love to hear that."

And if it appears that the board believes your finances are borderline, Mr. Cholst said, "you might offer to pay a half-year or a year's maintenance in advance."

Much advice culled from the experts centered on what should and should not be said during an interview. Mr. Cholst said it was wise for a couple being interviewed to try to anticipate what would be asked and decide in advance which questions each would answer.

"And you should avoid asking questions about pets and sublet policies," he said. "If they don't bring it up, then you don't bring it up either."

Mr. Hunt, the real estate broker, offered a similar strategy. "Speak only when spoken to," he said. "Board members can be moody just like the rest of us. It's their building, so let them run the show."

And Mr. Cholst's admonition regarding subletting, it seems, is on target. "The one thing we don't like is people who come in and intend to sublet," said Sheldon Palmer, vice president of the board at 201 East 37th Street in Manhattan. "If it's a husband and wife about to have a child and they're buying a studio, or if its a couple who have another residence they plan on keeping, that's when my antennae go up."

Indeed, Mr. Lee, former chief surveyor for New York City, may have raised some antennae during the interview when he told the board that he and his wife expected to live in the apartment for part of the year and then allow their two granddaughters to use it while they were in college.

Or perhaps, as Mr. Lee suspects, the board simply decided that the price he was paying for the apartment was too low.

In any case, it is doubtful that Mr. Lee will ever find out why his purchase was ultimately rejected. Because when a co-op board says "yes" the applicant doesn't need an explanation, and when it says "no" it is not required to give one -- and usually doesn't."

If they have asked to meet you, you are pretty much in.
Go in business attire. Do not ask any questions. Let them do the asking.
Even is you plan to gut the apartment, never say so at the interview. ( that little sweet old lady in the corner, she may just be your downstairs neighbor.)
If the opportunity comes up naturally, compliment them on the building.
And then tell them you just lost your job and you are not sure if you'll be able to pay mt.

Good luck, whichever way you want it.

Slope, look at it from the point of view of the board -- they live in this building, and they presumbly like it, and their neighbors have put them in charge of making the MOMENTOUS decision of who should be the building's new co-shareholders, and if they guess wrong, they and their neighbors are out a LOT of money.

If you were in their shoes, wouldn't you want someone who was fiscally responsible but not ridiculously flashy, and took the proceedings seriously without trying to step in and run them?

ali r.
{downtown broker}

do not discuss any renovations you have planned

I have been on 2 boards in lax buildings. Fundamentally, the board is looking to make sure you are financially able to meet your obligations as a shareholder. If you have gotten to this point, chances are you're OK. I showed up in a suit to both my interviews; the first was for an apartment in the East 70's, east of Lex, and I fit in. The most recent was low West 80's off Columbus, and I all but got laughed at. So it kinda depends, but you can't go wrong with a suit in general. Don't be nervous, if you are financially capable and don't have a criminal record, and you aren't shopping on Park or Fifth Avenue, you are fine.

Also, don't agree with the renovation comments. If you do plan to renovate within the next year or 2, bring it up at the meeting. The board always has the ability to kill your renovation plans later and may be disappointed that you didn't bring it up when they first met you. If your plans are further out, no problem. But at least you will know where they stand. Most boards have no problem with renovations - it typically increases property values for the whole building. But they do have a problem with applicants withholding key information. And if you really want to renovate and they have an issue with it, better to know before you commit a ton of money to a place you now no longer want to live in.

I can't imagine worse advice than to not discuss renovations you have planned. If you are buying a place based on planned renovations, why would you want to run the risk of not being able to do what you intend once you buy it? The board has to OK your renovation plans, so if you blatantly lie to them, or even if they feel that you were cagey, why would they feel comfortable approving your plans? We brought it up at our board interview (several years ago), and the board was actually giving us various ideas on what to do, suggesting we try and see some the same-line renovations that had been recently done. By discussing with them face to face, we gained a much better idea of what we could and could not expect to do, which saved us time (and money) down the road. Only the sellers and the brokers would suggest that you stay silent on reno plans in order to get the transaction closed.

Okay. What is considered a 'renovation'? Is laying down hardwood floors a 'renovation'?

I showed up wearing a suit to a board interview in Chelsea one hot summer and all 7 of the board members were in tank tops. Still, that's better than the alternative, that you show up too casually dressed and lose points for it.

I still remember trying to kill the Corcoran broker who told her buyer candidate that he didn't have to wear a tie to interview at one of my listings because it was "downtown."

ali r.
{downtown broker}

and most important of all, SHOW UP ON TIME!!!! Don't show up an hour late!

"What is considered a 'renovation'? Is laying down hardwood floors a 'renovation'?"

oh boy. You just don't understand what you are in for. Be prepared to kiss the ass of nosey yenta neighbors for no apparent reason. these folks will be up in your business about everything. try hammering in a stubbron nail after 7 PM. oh boy. good luck!

relax people. I did a lot of work on my co-op without any board approval or problems fom the neighbors. It's not that big of a deal.

All you guy, please excuse if I say so, are wrong about the renovation comment.

The board will not kill a renovation once you are in the building.
But that little old lady who lives downstairs might kill it for you and the owner.
The wisest thing to say is, I like the apartment as it is. Haven't really thought out what I might do.
All this should be said, only if asked.

If you bring it up and that little lady doesn't like the idea of the noise, you don't get the apartment.
Boards don't mind renovations...but why complicate things when you don't need to.

The best interviews are short and sweet.

You're right, totallyanonymous. And your completely useless comment is certainly appreciated. I'm sure folks searching for that very question will appreciate your informative response for years to come.

I don't think that laying down hardwood floors would constitute a renovation, no. Generally speaking, anything that requires permits would be considered a renovation. I don't think you need permits for a new hardwood floor, so I wouldn't consider that a renovation.
And Brokerage 101 - they certainly can kill a renovation once you're in the building - maybe not entirely, but they could certainly limit what you planned to do. And most every renovation is going to run into a problem here or there, and they can make it very time consuming/expensive to resolve - so why run the risk? Maybe 3 yrs ago when places were trading at the open house it made sense to be cagey b/c you didn't want to get declined, but what's the downside now? There are 10 other comps you could get tomorrow.
And most boards aren't stupid - they know the condition of a given apartment, and they know your finances, so pretending you aren't going to renovate when its obvious to everyone that the apt needs it, and you have the means to do it, doesn't exactly reflect well on ones character.
In Mdasch's case, if the floors need to be replaced, I can't see what the harm is in mentioning that he plans to replace them - I mean, why would you want to live in a building that won't let you replace your floors anyway - remember - the board interview is about you getting to know them too - they are going to be your neighbors and have influence on the quality of your life and your finances (including approving the buyer when you look to sell).

Printer
Of course they can kill a renovation if they want to but in the vast majority of cases they don't.
All I am saying is that it is a real rule of thumb that you do not offer anything or introduce anything at a board interview.
The board is much more likely to reject you, than to reject your renovation as a share holder.
Yes, boards know the condition of an apartment but they may also understand that your palace could be someone else's hovel.
Anyway...do as you please, I am just imparting the words of wisdom I learned after having been in the business for 22 years and probably having done well over 350 coop board packages. I might ad, with only 1 refusal...and that was because the buyer lied to me about his recent debt.
Good luck Mdrasch

"You're right, totallyanonymous. And your completely useless comment is certainly appreciated. I'm sure folks searching for that very question will appreciate your informative response for years to come."

Asswipe you're the oe asking an anonymous board how to renovate some shit studio coop. You asked. I answered. Good luck kid