Living in a Loft

"Loft" can mean at least three different things:
1. Huge, essentially raw, mostly undivided space that was formerly used as a factory or warehouse
2. What you described, inspired by a hayloft, much more common in other cities, and always what is meant when they build new-construction "lofts" in cities that don't really have downtown areas.
3. Item #1 above, so completely renovated that it's basically a suburban tract house -- with full walls and real rooms, but somewhat shy on windows, usually -- within an old factory building.

I myself personally, me, I don't care for any of these options.

Alan, thanks very much for the explanation. I was aware of loft styles numbers 1 and 2, but not the third option. Now that I've learned from you that they can be described as "basically a suburban tract house", I can see the appeal of these spaces.

Good renovated lofts are nothing like suburban tract houses. They have massive combined living/dining/kitchen areas, which are not present in the suburbs and certainly not in tract homes.

Modern, I think that Alan meant that there are some walls within the loft that divide some of the space from other parts of the, maybe the bedroom is sectioned off from the LR/DR/kitchen area. Is that your experience with renovated lofts?

Yes, the "Great Room" that you describe is a standard feature in suburban tract houses over the past 15 years or so, as are "industrial look" Viking ranges and big massive industrial-look exhaust hoods. "Lofty" ceilings are enshrined in suburban tract house vaulted ceilings, especially in the Sopranos entryway.

Lobster, most larger renovated lofts have 2-3+ bedrooms, and assorted bathrooms.

Alanhart, if you think suburban tract houses look like downtown lofts, you have a confused design sensibility.

Wait, maybe you are right! Renovated lofts have large master bathrooms! Suburban tract homes have large master bathrooms! Therefore renovate lofts = suburban tract homes!

Obviously, everyone has their own tastes. After having lived in a loft for many years, I really don't think I could ever live in the traditional "classic" whatever apartment with all of those rooms that are of no use (to me at least). Lofts also provide space and privacy that is difficult to replicate. I have only one neighbor, and 15 foot ceilings and a 2 foot thick concrete floor between us.

I think most lofts that were not converted in the last 10 years are somewhere between Alanhart's #1 and #3. Mine was "converted" almost 20 years ago. The rear of the apartment has "normal" sheetrocked bedrooms and bathrooms; the rest of the floor is a huge open room with a kitchen and another bathroom.

The privacy of a loft comes with the size of the space as you "should" use up a lot more space for the number of rooms. E.g., while 700 sq ft may be adequate for a 1BR apartment, I think you need at least 1500 sq ft to get a nice lofty feel in a 1BR loft. For 2BR, at least 2000 sq ft, etc. You go smaller than that, and the dimensions just don't work out. The key feature of a loft, I think, is expansive open space. A key component of this is ceiling height: e.g., you cannot support a 20' x 40' room with 9' or 10' ceilings. It just feels strange. Not to say that people don't try it; it just doesn't turn out to be a super-pleasant experience.

In terms of what it "feels" like, like anything else, you just get spoiled with it. When you first move in, you're like "Wow, this is so spacious!" After a year, you feel like it's just "normal". You go to your friends' NYC apts (which is similar to what you were living in), and you're like "geez, this is cramped; why are all the rooms so cut up, what's the point?". You go to your suburban friends' McMansions, and you start saying "hmm, this doesn't seem as large as I remember; I wonder what happened". You go to some friends' super-duper apt in the city and you say "yeah, this is pretty awesome, but a couple more feet on the 10' ceilings would make it even better".

I never understood why lofts cost more than apartments. Technically, builders used way less construction material as there are no separate rooms, need to extend electric wires etc... The greatest scam of the latest generation! Paying 30% to 50% more/square foot to live in a raw space. Sounds like a raw deal to me! :-)

Negatives I have seen in some lofts is small windows, and they also often do not have any outdoor space, which makes some to me feel like you're trapped in a box.

Lofts have HUGE windows typically, 10 feet or taller is not unusual, in the living areas.

They can have small or no windows in bedrooms, but I think large windows in bedrooms are overrated. You don't need them when you are asleep, and I don't hang out in my bedroom when I am awake much.

They do have limitations with windows in that they are typically only at the front and back of the loft.

With the high ceilings and open spaces, are there heating/cooling issues?

"I never understood why lofts cost more than apartments. "

Um, because they're BIGGER?

Modern, why are the windows often small or nonexistent in the bedrooms? Katie, very good question about the heating/cooling?

"With the high ceilings and open spaces, are there heating/cooling issues?"

Same as any other place: as long as you pay the bills, there are no issues.

More seriously, heating/cooling is more expensive and uses more resources simply because of the larger volume of space. In classic-style lofts where you have a building with old bones, insulation is certainly not as good as a more modern building.

inonada is right, most lofts don't have the proper insulation. So the heating costs would be higher that in an appartment.

Heating a space, in particular, is much more demanding and costly, if it's large and has high ceilings. High ceilings are certainly nice in the right context, but they can be quite costly, especially when oil prices start to creep back up.

Windows are often small / non-existent because of the structure of the buildings that get converted. Often they have a footprint of something like 25' by 100'. You get a big windows on the two ends, and typically the living room goes on the street end (where the light is best) and 2 bedrooms go on the back end (where light is compromised by closeby buildings). Maybe there's a small window in the middle, and you use that to plop a small bedrorom. Like anywhere in NY, height is important for light, and being top-floor is best because then you get skylights. Obviously, corner buildings don't have many of these issues.

Craziest layout I've ever seen: some loft building that is 170' by 25-30' as it spans a FULL street in the middle of a block. I.e., it's got an entrance to the north to one street an another entrance to the south on another street, and buildings on east and west sides.

"Heating a space, in particular, is much more demanding and costly, if it's large and has high ceilings."

This is true in particular because heat rises, and because heating is inherently a more energy-consuming activity than cooling.

I have 3 sliding patio doors, each 6x8. They are low-E double pane, modern aluminum frames, etc etc... But when sitting beside them it can be damn cold. I can imagine how cold those large, ancient and drafty windows are in some old lofts. I would guess most come up with solutions out of necessity, such as inner removable panes that seal the opening, then can be removed in warmer weather. Having said that, the benefits would far outweigh the drawbacks imo. Definitely not for everyone though.

I've had a big loft before. And I posted on this before, but some highlights...

heating/cooling definitely costs a lot more. Get a good ceiling fan asap
throwing big parties rocks
while not having a lot of walls is visually very cool... its actually not very easy to "live" in. People forget that so many things in apartments "need" walls. Like bookcases. Or couches most of the time (freestanding isn't easy, it slides around). Even if you put a table behind it... where do you plus in the lamp. Yes, no walls usually means no outlets. It can be a challenge to make usable sections of the loft. Yes, if you're a 22 year old guy with just a large tv, you're fine. But if you actually want to make really usable space, there will be challenges.