Recommendations for retrofitting antique cabinets?
Started by West81st
about 14 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
Discussion about
We recently purchased a 1912 condo that we had previously rented for many years. The kitchen and pantry feature four expanses of original and vintage-replica oak cabinets that we love and want to retain. In the kitchen itself, the wood and glass are lovely, but the doors and drawers need mechanical refurbishment. Nothing fits properly: closing certain drawers requires the strength of a... [more]
We recently purchased a 1912 condo that we had previously rented for many years. The kitchen and pantry feature four expanses of original and vintage-replica oak cabinets that we love and want to retain.
In the kitchen itself, the wood and glass are lovely, but the doors and drawers need mechanical refurbishment. Nothing fits properly: closing certain drawers requires the strength of a weightlifter; opening others requires the delicate touch of a diamond-cutter; doors swing open randomly and bruise unsuspecting skulls. In the pantry, the cabinets have been painted over heavily, and one unit seems to be coming loose from its mooring on one side.
Does anyone have experience refurbishing old kitchen cabinets, or a recommendation for professionals who do this type of work? Our key goals are:
- retain as much old wood and glass as possible;
- expose what has been hidden by paint;
- enjoy the easy-gliding drawers and securely-closing doors of a modern kitchen;
- add some inconspicuous child-proofing;
- where necessary, reconfigure to make room for modern appliances (basically, removing a shelf or two to accommodate a larger fridge).
On a less-specialized note, we probably also need a new sink base. The current one is Home Depot circa 1995, so no tears will be shed when it goes to the dumpster. Ideally, we would like the new unit to match the antique wood as closely as possible.
Thanks in advance for any input.
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Response by bjw2103
about 14 years ago
Posts: 6236
Member since: Jul 2007
81st, try this guy for the cabinets - and let us know how it all turns out.
For that era of sink, I like the wall-hung porcelain enamel kind with integral backsplash, complete with curtains hung beneath, but they're hard on dishes and maybe too cutesy-precious.
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Response by nyc10023
about 14 years ago
Posts: 7614
Member since: Nov 2008
NWT: yes, that is period-correct. There are some great pictures of new kitchens-as-built from different eras in the NYPL archives.
Is that a dumbwaiter on the back wall? We gave ours up years ago to create more space. Probably would have kept it if the door had been as nice as this one. We still have a little door under the kitchen window (for coal, maybe?).
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Response by West81st
about 14 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
NWT: We'll try the tape before calling in the pros. Thanks.
The maids definitely loved those inefficient kitchens. Of course the " lady" of the house rarely, if ever, saw them .
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Response by ph41
about 14 years ago
Posts: 3390
Member since: Feb 2008
But the cabinets ARE pretty. And , of course, couldn't be replicated by a good cabinet maker . LOL
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Response by ph41
about 14 years ago
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And, of course, I must be a philistine for even thinking such heresy.
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Response by ph41
about 14 years ago
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And I'm posting this as I'm moving all the antiques out of the living room in prep for a major skim coating/ paint job
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Response by KeithB
about 14 years ago
Posts: 976
Member since: Aug 2009
I was told that little door under the window was for storing milk, butter etc...
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Response by front_porch
about 14 years ago
Posts: 5316
Member since: Mar 2008
Keith is right. We just did a deal on West 87th with a similar under-window setup. The little door under the window is an icebox, used to store perishables in the winter. (In the summer, of course, you'd still have to pay the iceman.
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
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Response by NWT
about 14 years ago
Posts: 6643
Member since: Sep 2008
It could be that, too. I've also seen old ads for the same kind of thing to put a hot iron. In an old apartment plan somewhere, they're shown as dotted lines under the window.
In the 1936 edition of Architectural Graphic Standards, there's a front view, with a range of dimensions, but no plan. There they're called "Wall Receiver (for trash pail)."
I vote for trash because in pre-AC NYC that'd be more of a problem between pickups than keeping stuff cool, as higher-end apartments all had ice-boxes or central refrigeration by 1912, and we've seen them in apartments built all the way into the 1930s.
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Response by NWT
about 14 years ago
Posts: 6643
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Ali, I hadn't thought of that. With an ice-box, you could skip the ice delivery during the winter and just use that thingey for the few items that really needed refrigeration.
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Response by NWT
about 14 years ago
Posts: 6643
Member since: Sep 2008
Wait, the ad for west81st's building at the NYPL archive says in its fourth paragraph:
"Electric elevators. Spacious closet room. Patent garbage closets and ventilating flues in kitchens. Laundry and steam driers on roof. Fifteen extra servants' rooms."
No mention of central refrigeration (brine piped to apartments) so would've had ice-boxes, and the "garbage closet" could do double duty.
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Response by KeithB
about 14 years ago
Posts: 976
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The box under the window is too small for garbage, we had one in our last apartment. It could just handle a few perishables in the cool, cold weather.
Keith Burkhardt
The Burkhardt Group
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Response by NWT
about 14 years ago
Posts: 6643
Member since: Sep 2008
I think west81st should settle it by spending a few tens of hours stripping its paint to see whether there's a manufacturer's name cast into the door. That's what I'd do, getting to hear the spouse say "What're you doing that for, when x and y and z need doing?"
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81st, try this guy for the cabinets - and let us know how it all turns out.
http://www.bakersfieldcarpentry.net/Home.html
W81: I emailed you this morning.
And stop making me drool over your cabinets, they sound great.
I like the addition of an apron-front white butcher sink to your setup.
I'm a big fan of the counter-depth fridge, don't know if it makes sense in your space, but I like the idea of 2 24" refrigerators.
For the drawers, a quick fix for some of them might be http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=214&filter=friction%20tape
There's also under-mount drawer-glide hardware.
For that era of sink, I like the wall-hung porcelain enamel kind with integral backsplash, complete with curtains hung beneath, but they're hard on dishes and maybe too cutesy-precious.
NWT: yes, that is period-correct. There are some great pictures of new kitchens-as-built from different eras in the NYPL archives.
http://digitalgallery.nypl.org/nypldigital/dgkeysearchdetail.cfm?trg=1&strucID=298990&imageID=486742&total=307&num=100&word=kitchen&s=1¬word=&d=&c=&f=&k=0&lWord=&lField=&sScope=&sLevel=&sLabel=&imgs=20&pos=112&e=w
Nice pics! Here's the kind of thing we're working with:
http://images.nypl.org/index.php?id=1583575&t=r
Is that a dumbwaiter on the back wall? We gave ours up years ago to create more space. Probably would have kept it if the door had been as nice as this one. We still have a little door under the kitchen window (for coal, maybe?).
NWT: We'll try the tape before calling in the pros. Thanks.
That thing in the kitchen wall is probably a garbage receptacle: http://books.google.com/books?id=myxEOOgjI50C&lpg=PA24&dq=%22garbage%20receptacle%22%20apartment%20kitchen&pg=PA24#v=onepage&q=%22garbage%20receptacle%22%20apartment%20kitchen&f=false
The maids definitely loved those inefficient kitchens. Of course the " lady" of the house rarely, if ever, saw them .
But the cabinets ARE pretty. And , of course, couldn't be replicated by a good cabinet maker . LOL
And, of course, I must be a philistine for even thinking such heresy.
And I'm posting this as I'm moving all the antiques out of the living room in prep for a major skim coating/ paint job
I was told that little door under the window was for storing milk, butter etc...
Keith is right. We just did a deal on West 87th with a similar under-window setup. The little door under the window is an icebox, used to store perishables in the winter. (In the summer, of course, you'd still have to pay the iceman.
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
It could be that, too. I've also seen old ads for the same kind of thing to put a hot iron. In an old apartment plan somewhere, they're shown as dotted lines under the window.
In the 1936 edition of Architectural Graphic Standards, there's a front view, with a range of dimensions, but no plan. There they're called "Wall Receiver (for trash pail)."
I vote for trash because in pre-AC NYC that'd be more of a problem between pickups than keeping stuff cool, as higher-end apartments all had ice-boxes or central refrigeration by 1912, and we've seen them in apartments built all the way into the 1930s.
Ali, I hadn't thought of that. With an ice-box, you could skip the ice delivery during the winter and just use that thingey for the few items that really needed refrigeration.
Wait, the ad for west81st's building at the NYPL archive says in its fourth paragraph:
"Electric elevators. Spacious closet room. Patent garbage closets and ventilating flues in kitchens. Laundry and steam driers on roof. Fifteen extra servants' rooms."
No mention of central refrigeration (brine piped to apartments) so would've had ice-boxes, and the "garbage closet" could do double duty.
The box under the window is too small for garbage, we had one in our last apartment. It could just handle a few perishables in the cool, cold weather.
Keith Burkhardt
The Burkhardt Group
I think west81st should settle it by spending a few tens of hours stripping its paint to see whether there's a manufacturer's name cast into the door. That's what I'd do, getting to hear the spouse say "What're you doing that for, when x and y and z need doing?"