what do we think of this apt and the pricing?

Crazy layout and: Maintenance: $2,311.

It's big - I've seen 2 brs with that maint. Some studios have M over $1000 already. Not that it's right

Maintenance is not high for the size. layout is weird, but not so much so if you need a 2-3 bedroom. i don't know if it's just the quality of the photography, but in the listing the apartment presents dark. kitchen seems reasonably well done. I'm starting to see more stuff in the $700 psf range, though. Not in this size, however.

I'm seeing alot of desperation moves/signs. Empty apartments, Negotiable!!, maintenance/closing cost payment offers. Guess the sellers didn't get the memo that the market is picking up.

Don't mean to be heartless, btw. It has to be horrible to need to sell now, if you don't have sufficient equity particularly. i can't help but feel sorry for the following seller, as an example:

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/206777-coop-137-east-36th-street-murray-hill-new-york

All I need is 200K less than that! Nice find AR

aboutready's find will, I'm guessing, need some serious updating. Looks like an older person has lived there for a long time given the fussy furniture, 1970's style cans and track lighting, and the formica-ized and mirrored bedroom. What is it about these buildings in the east 30's that so many seem to have very high maintenance?

As for the OP, I find the layout almost indecipherable as posted. That is the best the agent could come up with? You can't really read it--it is more like you just sort of guess what is going on.

I think the high maint. is priced in. There are lots of buildings on the UES/Yorkville with similar M and they are cheaper to buy

kylewest, i'm noticing outrageous maintenance prices across the board, almost. buildings I've looked in for years are suddenly (or so it seems to me) at $2/psf. Is this just something coincidental, or have tax increases recently hit coops? Does anyone know?

also, look at the listing history. i did not post that as an example of a good buy. i posted it as an example of what is happening to sellers. even if they sell, they may not. closings aren't happening in some instances, and it's got to be painful. i don't think that apartment is worth more than about $500k in the medium term, which is where cookie-cutter kind of two bedrooms two baths were in 1999.

The AE combo looks as if the combiner had the usual difficulty in putting back together a large apartment that'd been split up in the 1930s. Plumbing gets in the way, etc.

Doesn't seem bad at all if the location's OK with you.

Tax increases, labor costs and increases in fuel/insurance, etc. Tax assessment in NYC is notoriously patchy. The only way to keep mtce down below $2/sqft is if the building did not provide a lot of services to start off with, has a low tax assessment (don't forget the 6% annual cap) and/or has a commercial income stream. There are several buildings downtown and uptown that retained or won ownership of commercial space from sponsors.

So what do you think it would have been priced at at the peak?

Maintenance is LOW for an apartment this size. I would check out the buildings' financials thoroughly and if its in good shape I think this apt.is in fact a deal. The location is not "hot" but it is very central and a 4BR in NY is pretty rare.

cccharley, which one? the one in your OP i'd put at around 1.9-2.1 in 2007, assuming the renovation is as nice as the description and pictures are portraying. if it had been located elsewhere (i.e. 20th instead of 30th, what a difference 10 blocks makes), quite a bit more.

i don't think the one i listed ever would have gone for much over a million, maybe $1.1m if the seller got lucky.

Mt is not at all high, for the sq footage. One can even go to 1.50 per sq ft and not be too high. Depends on many factors.
The apt is clearly a combo.
That being said, if you like, go for it. In the mrket today there is still a bit of room to negotiate.
Get it for 1.2 or even 1.25 and you'll have yourself a long term sound investment.
It is a good deal.

That floorplan rendering has got to go. I'm surprised the broker hasn't bothered to have a better one drawn up--that just seems lazy to me.

From what I can make out, the DR is terribly narrow, and really not usable as a DR (the photo shows a dining set squeezed uncomfortably into a terribly claustrophobic looking space). I do agree the apartment comes across as dark, and the layout lacks flow. Kitchen looks pretty nice from photos, though, as long as you lose that jarring red back-splash.

Another thing I don't like is your entry foyer leads directly into one of the so-called bedrooms, so if you were to use that room as a BR you (and your guests) would have to march through it to enter and exit. Also, I don't see any indication of a second egress so all kitchen garbage would have to be hauled out through the bedroom as well. That seems extremely unwieldy and a huge PITA.

This is a nice apartment. Maint is a bit high but factored into price. Building financials prob aren't that bad, just high maint becuase combo apartment. DR is small, but with 4br + DR can't go wrong...

I don't think the maintenance is high, but the floor plan gave me a headache. Are there actually three bedrooms in this apartment that you don't have to walk through to get to another room (discounting the maid's room)? Even so, seems like a pretty good deal.

Has anyone noticed that the mirror-image apt (configured differently) on the fifth floor sold for just under 2m at the peak? That's a huge loss for the current sellers. Look at the original floorplan, a small railroad-esque classic 8 without a separate bedroom hallway. To some, the current floorplan may be an improvement.

Listen I wish I could afford it. It looks like a good deal and it's renovated so it's turnkey. I don't need that much space but would love it. I was also thinking the owners are taking a loss and maybe they need to sell. I think we'll be seeing more apts with this pricing- or so I hope.

Thank you for your comments. In light of these comments, I have posted a new floor plan that will hopefully clarify any confusion regarding the layout of the apartment (such as the wrong impression that one must go through a bedroom to reach the front door of the apartment). Note that the fourth bedroom was originally a formal dining room and buyers who only need three bedrooms could use it as such. However, the foyer is quite large and is currently used as a dining area.

Also, please note that the apartment on the fifth floor that sold in Septmber 2008 is approximately 200 feet smaller than 4AE.

35east30, bravo!! thank you for responding, that floorplan improvement makes a HUGE difference. This is a great set up for a 3 bed + family room, with either the narrow far bedroom or the former dining room becoming the family room.

I like it.

Looks like a really cool space especially in the 3br configuration. The neighborhood is superconvenient, has really improved (back when the welfare hotels were around it was extra-sketchy) and I'm assuming its zoned for PS 116 which would probably be of interest to anyone seeking that size apartment. Maintenance doesn't seem high for the space except that there is no doorman. Since I'm no expert on apartments larger than 2BRs does it make sense in that context?

I think it does. The extra space counters the no doorman (unless, of course, you must have a doorman). PS 116 is a big plus. Renovations done. Love the extra wet bar.

I think the apt. is a good deal in today's market. It is basically twice as big and expensive as what I'm looking for, though. The maintenace is reasonable considering the square footage. Most jr.4's have maintenance between 1,200-1,700 and this apt. is literally twice as big, if not bigger.

It is a combination of what kind of apts?

Tromp, looks like large 2bed/1.5 bath + studio. Owner?

It was originally built as one apartment (as indicated on the original floorplan found on the apartment's webpage). At some point in the 20th century it was split into a 2 bedroom apartment and a 1 bedroom apartment.

The only negative I see is that the only en-suite bathroom is in the narrow bedroom. That wouldn't matter to me, particularly with 2.5 baths total.

Otherwise I'm really loving this floor plan.

I answered my own question: it's a combination of a pretty small 1/1 (one sold for 515K at peak) and a big 2/2 (apparently one sold for 950K in 2005, although the history of that sale is weird). It those values are correct and you can attribute values of, maybe, 500K to the smaller unit and 1.1M to the bigger unit, at peak, the combination at 1.27M is well priced for today but by no means a fire sale.

You have to add something for reno too, assuming you like these results. This size isn't easy to find in this neighborhood, you'd usually be relying on combos.

Tromp, 5BC sold for 1.95 in September 2008. As noted in my earlier post, 5BC is 200 feet smaller than 4AE.

I did a rentals comp attempt. Very difficult. But bottom line is that i'm getting nothing close for less than $12.5k, and they are generally not pre-war. Of course, those are crazy rental prices, but still.

Kudos to 35 for updating the floorplan. It's a vast improvement and the apartment looks far more appealing. Personally not crazy about the separate wet-bar thing (seems like wasted space to me) but there may be someone out there who loves it. If not, it could certainly be converted into, perhaps, a laundry room (if such is allowed).

squid, one of the good things about keeping the wet bar is that if you're afraid to buy such a large apartment (demographic reasons), you can always in the future split it back up pretty easily. I would like having a family room or master suite with a wet bar (but I'm a bit of a lush).

I only have one kid, but this is the kind of space I would still love to have.

Wow - not crazy about the neighborhood, but this seems like a great deal to me. If I were sitting on about $500K in cash, I would try to make this work.

Seems like a very good price, have you seen this listing also:

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/392305-condo-303-e-37th-street-murray-hill-new-york

Mark, nice job with the floorplan. It pays to go with a pro rather than the usual slobs.

That former kitchen, now wet bar, would also make a good dressing room with shaving sink. Hate to waste plumbing.

AR, I agree, and definitely wouldn't consider the separate wet-bar a major drawback (though there's something tres 70s bach pad about it, non?). And hey, I'm as much of a lush as the next person, but I don't know that I'd need or want to dedicate an entire (albeit small) room to my lushiosity :)

I vote laundry room.

squid, that bach pad comment made me look inward a bit. stop that, introspection's a bitch. i guess it's space with plumbing that could be used for a couple of things.

craberry, that needs a gut, but it looks like decent space, and if the board isn't too uptight at least you'd get what you wanted at the end of the day. certainly is cheap by today's standards, area a bit challenged, but I don't mind it.

now i must run to the wine store.

I've seen everybody referring to 5 BC as the comp, but this apt. is 4AE. What I found going through the previous listings in the building was a few listings for E line apt. listed as 600 sqft 1/1, which sold by 500K aprox at peak, and a listing for 8A that had a curious history, sold for 377K (if that's true) and then was flipped? for 950K, all in 05. Crazy.

On a side note, I wanted to point out that, to the chagrin of those who characterized this forum as a nest of bitter catastrophists who would shoot down any owner who would dare engage us, we are giving 35east30 lots of kudos, and deservedly so.