apts that should trade soon

I like it (the thread that is).

But it doesn't seem like a screaming buy. Although it is a beautiful renovation.
12F went into contract with an asking under $3.5.
Do you think they cleared $3M?

Even if so you say they purchased an extra room in 12F? That and the higher floor with a peak of park views seems to more than offset a beautiful renovation. I think fairly priced based on comps about $2.4...still $800K away from current asking price..

I am missing something or did I just break your heart?

nothing, just trying to show I can make nice with the other kids on the block.

Dude, be careful, they'll Manchurian Candidate you.

22 e 88 is a great bld, but, I don't know what it'll trade for.

LOL! So you really can't find a good one! Maybe that's why these threads don't work!! Ha..

Yo: 2.4 vs 3.1 is very valid.....i would clearly agree that a bid of 75% of ask is worthy of consideration in the current environment.

i like it also. does anyone recall that murray hill apartment cccharley, i believe, found that we were talking up? i was trying to find it yesterday and i couldn't. wonder what happened to it. the owner/broker reacted to our criticisms and comments with a great deal of professionalism, explained the issues with the apartment without excessive emotion, and we concluded it was quite a decent deal.

i think we can only compare a listing to other active listings and the properties that we have closing info on. if something is a good deal under those circumstances, it doesn't necessarily mean that a full price offer is warranted, just that an apartment's listing is reasonably close to what apartments have been going for as of a month or three ago.

that last sentence doesn't work. just that an apartment seems like a reasonable deal compared to what apartments have been going for as of a month or three ago. need more coffee.

aboutready, may have been this one: http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/394113-coop-35-east-30th-street-midtown-south-new-york

thank you NWT. and it went into contract within three weeks of our thread. impossible to tell if we had anything to do with it, although it's undeniable that encouraging the seller to present a better floorplan could only have helped his efforts, but this was a well-priced apartment that deserved some attention. hope it closes.

dwell - Odd thing... I checked the HTML source of some recent SE threads, and found this image tiled in the background, at 95% transparency:
http://www.joystiq.com/media/2006/02/queen_of_diamonds.jpg

Why does 3m for a 7 room with no views in a good bldg seem too much to me?

Why not pass the time by playing a little solitaire?

Which reminds me, imdb.com lists 67RSD for interiors/exteriors of Raymond's apt, but 258RSD must've been the interiors. Unless it was a set that happened to match.

nyc10023, the sellers may be addled by the horrors of what must've been a long renovation. Odd that it didn't get central AC, as far as I can tell.

Unlike patient09, I haven't seen the actual apts, but I have saved all the current/recent listings in this building and think they are important comps for the neighborhood. For me, the tiny children's rooms are the killer for 8F. I don't think the playroom fully makes up for it and think that many families will find the layout an unfortunate constraint on the long-term (i.e., as kids grow up) appeal of the apartment. A family with very young children that is buying the $3mm apartment as the 5-year plan way station on the way to a larger apartment or townhouse as the final family dwelling might like this, but I have to wonder how many such families there are kicking around Manhattan these days.

Good luck bidding $2.4mm. This apt is fully renovated.

But then again, I feel bad for people that settled for apts with no view (but space) in 06/07 because that was all they could afford and then did these expensive renovations. Hard sell in this market...! I look out on a Park Ave Classic 7/8/9 (??) (huge but all windows but the living room face the back, looking at the courtyard. They did a high-end renovation for over a year and now they sit in this dark apt seeing no sun ever. How depressed they must be that they didn't wait to buy.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/394602-coop-170-east-88th-street-carnegie-hill-new-york

I haven't seen this one, but it looks compelling in today's market. 2/1.5 duplex. Currently listed at $1 million even, so the mansion tax is definitely avoidable. maint. just under $2000, about $1.50 psf. Renovations look lovely, nice outdoor space, unique space, rooms very spacious, convenient location but not on top of 86th street. Downside is no en-suite master bath or full second bath, but first bath is well situated to the bedrooms. 6C traded at $900k in '04, but unable to determine condition. This unit was previously listed at $1.25 05/06.

Aboutready: I think it is interesting...but the boutique building with maintenance approaching $2,000 scares me. Definitely would have fetched $1.25 at peak of the market. Makes you wonder why it didn't sell..

i don't know, go take a look at it. maybe they just decided not to sell, it was on for less than 5 months which to me might indicate they got an offer and then got cold feet, who knows. i'm interested in doing open houses just for fun and research, but i'm fully booked up on weekends (my weekdays should be so active) through the middle of July. although i guess i could do some weekday open houses, and punt on the book research for awhile.

the maint. isn't so high for the size and type of building, not these days. but, as with all smaller buildings, you do need to be extra vigilant. i was in a small building, 20 units, that was superbly run. if they have taken good proactive care of things, and have decent reserves, it's not such a negative.

it's definitely not the type of apartment that comes on the rental market with any regularity.

this is a cookie cutter apartment, but it is a three bedroom selling almost 10% below seller's 2005 closing cost, and it appears as though the kitchen has been renovated as well. on 79th street but in a very family-friendly building. real 3/2 for $999,000. it has been on for quite awhile, but the comp should be compelling to some buyer.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/362004-coop-333-east-79th-street-yorkville-new-york

04/07/2005 Previous Sale recorded for $1,100,000.
11/04/2008 Listed in StreetEasy by Prudential Elliman at $1,495,000.
01/05/2009 Price decreased by 8% to $1,375,000.
02/18/2009 Price decreased by 9% to $1,249,000.
03/10/2009 Price decreased by 12% to $1,099,000.
05/17/2009 Price decreased by 9% to $999,000.

I saw this apt. It's really lovely.

aboutready: 333 E 79 -- Now we're talking

I love the deal. I went to see this apt on a higher floor (12X) asking $889K but in estate condition. I was scratching my head because at the time 8X was asking $1.49 and I couldn't understand why Douglas Elliman would ever put themselves out there like that.

The bedrooms are kind of small, and in fact this is not a real 3 Bedroom but rather a 2 Bedroom with a generous alcove. 1400 SF is a stretch (12x had it listed closer to 1200 sf but I would go with 1300). The maintenance is high and the building's common areas and exterior do look like they need some work.

But I think all these issues are offset by the fact that this is a 20% down building with a relatively lenient board and is in PS 290.

It's been reduced by a 1/3. Scary thing is that it is still asking a million bucks.

lr10021, yes. anyone who has been looking on the ues over the years could tell you that this building used to trade CHEAP. but it's heading in the right direction, and for today's market, it isn't a bad deal for a unit that works as a three bedroom.

Are you guys seeing any apts on the upper west that have similar values?

See, the thing that scares me is that 340E80/333E79 used to trade at <300/sqft back in '99/even '00.

PS290 is packed to the rafters, no solution in sight.

this wouldn't be everyone's cup of tea, but i could get my groove on here.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/407529-coop-876-broadway-flatiron-new-york

impossible to compare them, but #4, which was listed as being slightly larger, closed for $3.15mm in 07/06. #3 is listed for $1.995.

RE_PRO, i haven't looked. west81st and others have noted large price reductions on WEA. what are you interested in, size-wise? or just a general state of the UWS market question?

this apartment has some issues (on 86th street, small living space, relatively). recently renovated pre-war, listed at a 2004 price (4A sold for $749k in 08/04, and 3A is now listed for $749k).

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/406465-coop-107-west-86th-street-upper-west-side-new-york

i don't think it's 1150 sf, but it's still on the market for a fairly low ppsf and seems in decent condition.

RE_PRO: I haven't seen any compelling deals yet, but I think north of 96th will get interesting pretty soon. Trumpville too, if RSB floats your boat.

what is it about 333 East 79/340 East 80 that makes it so cheap?

It's not cheaper than comp. buildings. It's a pair of undistinguished post-war 80s era doorman buildings. Okay location. Maintenance a little higher than average.

AR,
Where do you think the flatiorn apt will end up at?
It's weird,yes...but, no shortage of space.

"this wouldn't be everyone's cup of tea, but i could get my groove on here.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/407529-coop-876-broadway-flatiron-new-york

impossible to compare them, but #4, which was listed as being slightly larger, closed for $3.15mm in 07/06. #3 is listed for $1.995."

here you go:
http://www.corcoran.com/property/listing.aspx?Region=NYC&ListingID=858463

BTW: it's all full floor lofts in that building: what do you think the chances are that there's any real difference in square footage between any of them? (5th floor was listed as 2800 back in ?1998?)

30yrs, exactly, but the only difference is that some people may have built out different mezzanines, and they may be counting the sf differently as a result.

10023, i think 333 is cheaper than comp buildings, or at least that apartment is. and yes, i recall the days when 2 beds in that building were under $500k, and it seems odd. but many of the undrpriced buildings have played catch up the last few years.

falco, i might be interested in purchasing the flatiron property at aboout $1.5. i don't know where it will end up. is it priced for today's market? maybe. you need to find a purchaser who wants it, but now the public school available is quite good, not merely acceptable.

"30yrs, exactly, but the only difference is that some people may have built out different mezzanines, and they may be counting the sf differently as a result."

This is going to fall into my "why Sf is bullshit" rant again. OK, so you build a mezzanine. So now you have 2 SF for every one. But BOTH the SF suck in comparison to the original one: odds are they have less than legal ceiling height (or barrly) the light is severely diminished, etc. Besides, all floors are still equal because if the new owner wants to simply build their own mezzanine, they can. so how much "extra" SF is there really? none at all.

Is a 2 BR with a dining alcove that has been enclosed by pressurized walls and a door, now a 3BR. Should you count a staircase into the square footage of an apartment even if it is merely a staircase. Folks, we are exiting the "propaganda market" and entering the "it is what it is - take it or leave it" market.

30yrs, i'm no fan of sf manipulation. i can recognize a full-floor loft for what it is. i was just pointing out what might have been someone's justification for the difference. this apartment, i believe, doesn't include the mezzanine in the sf'ge, and only added it above very little space.

some people would love a place with a mezzanine, others not. lr10021, if you're clever you'll put a closet under the stairs, and then what!

AR - have you seen the flatiron property? Interesting, but definitely not for everyone. I had a feeling there may be extermination problems (did you see the stairwell?). But for $1.5 it would seem like a reasonable deal.

hurting, no i haven't. if it's still on after mid-july i'll take a look just to see. doesn't seem perfect, but i like the location and the amount of space is awesome. and this neighborhood is grossly overpriced, so it jumped out at me.

AR - if you look in the area, you should check out the 3BR 2300 SF one at 29 East 22 too. Interesting space as well. Some drawbacks too, but I think it will eventually sell for a reasonable deal.

i saw that one when it was still over $2mm. it's lovely, and thanks for the heads up, I think this is a better deal than the one i posted!

the bathroom placement is weird, but very few of these lofts, particularly in the Flatiron area, are issue free. i'm pretty certain i could be happy here. and to think I almost went for a $1.4 three bedroom in Harlem. maybe i'll have to reconsider my will not buy stance. but i need a flexible board, because i would gift it to my daughter. oh well, no hurry.

Nice! I wish I were your daughter. Agreed, it seems like not hurrying is the best strategy for now.

Trumpville... is it cheap enough yet?

RE_PRO, i haven't looked. but i hate to sound like a debbie downer, and i think people should make buying decisions based both on their needs and economics, but if you don't need or really want to buy i don't think anything is cheap enough yet. on here i'm just trying to point out some pricing that might seem compelling at today's prices. p09 has disappeared, lout that he is, i'm not sure his intent. and my apologies to my friends who have recently purchased, many of you have done very well, want to own for any number of reasons, and have no apparent need to sell in the medium to long term. that would change the dynamic. so if you want an opinion, maybe more details as to goals, expectation of how long you'd hold property, size of unit, etc.

I am in no rush to buy. I have a 3yr old boy and want to have another but nothing yet. If we were to have another baby, the apt that I am in will no longer be enough space. Just planning ahead, I would like to buy a 2b/2b 1300 min sqft, but that would be the min size. I have been looking the last two weeks but I didn't see anything worth buying at the UWS. I dont think I would pull the trigger anyway because of the uncertainties in the job market and the palm steak/lobster thread is scaring me to death. The pref size would be a 3b/3b 1600sqft+. If we find something that we like to live in and in a good school district, we don't plan to move for 5+ yrs or may be even longer probably until the kid/kids finsh school. Both the wife and I are from the city and love living in the city.

The apts that I have seen are too small, some 1200sqft looks bigger than others. a 1m apt for a dark lit and for a bad layout apartment doesn't seem reasonable to me. I am really shock to see that FiDi is still offering at 1k+/sqft. Are there any good public school down there? I would rather live in UWS, UES, or Kips than FiDi.

RE_PRO, if you can do kips/murray hill, you should have some great options soon. do you only want new? FiDi should have a good school option, but who knows. Murray Hill/Kips Bay has a better than decent one.

You don't need 1600 sf on an old floor plan, but you do on a new one. on the older ones there are 1400 sf plans that have 3/2.5 and are relatively ample. not that i'd necessarily recommend the building, but if you look at the St. Tropez floorplans on e. 64th you'll see what i mean.

I don't need new. Does Murray Hill have any good public schools, like ps 199 on 60 something street? I don't particularly like FiDi but I think the prices will drop the most there. I need to investigate the school choices there. So do you think I can get a 3/2.5 for under 1m.

876 broadway, noted above, is in contract. Will be interesting to see if it closes, and for how much.

With the DOE failing to adjust to rapidly changing conditions, I would not buy if you are 100% sure you're going public. I would rent in what you consider a good school zone. Have your oldest go for a year or two. If you are still happy, then buy.

I saw 22 E. 88, apt 8F as well as 12F which recently went into contract. 12F had incredible park views unlike 8F; 12F was a corner apartment. 8F is dark with zero views. Also, 12F had a huge additional living room like 22 feet by 12 feet which 8F didn't have. If 12F sold for 3.4 why on earth would the owners of 8F think they're going to get anywhere near 3.15? Maybe 2.6? or 2.7? I think the problem is that some sellers just can't acknowledge to themselves that they are going to lose money on a sale. The owners of 8F bought it just a few years ago for like 2.57 or something and put plenty of money in, no doubt. But like the Meineke muffler commercials used to say, "pay me now or pay me later."

RE_PRO, PS 116 in Murray Hill is generally well regarded, and has G&T program. Know a number of kids who went on to very good privates from here.

The 333 e. 79th street apt, 8X went into contract on 6/2. new listing, 17O, for $779k seems to get the way the market is heading, but no pictures or floorplan yet. Seems in the 2005 range, but still a bunch of room for negotiating as it appears they bought pre-2004.

This one's heading toward 2005 prices, and the owners probably renovated. Good location (generally, haven't seen apt or checked out block), 25% down building.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/375682-coop-140-east-81st-street-upper-east-side-new-york

05/26/2005 Previous Sale recorded for $909,000.
01/16/2009 Listed in StreetEasy by Corcoran at $1,125,000.
02/21/2009 Price decreased by 4% to $1,085,000.
03/21/2009 Price decreased by 3% to $1,050,000.
06/12/2009 Price decreased by 5% to $999,000.

ok so you schooled me before when I was seeing some apartments still above 2006 prices. Anyway, corrected now, I wonder, anyone have a POV on which of Manhattan's areas are closest to their 2006 prices for that specific area? closes to 2005 prices for that area? 2004? ... and, which area might is still closest to their peak prices?

gleeclub, i think the declines on the UWS have been so far the greatest in terms of correction in terms of date. yorkville is catching up. murray hill and parts of midtown east are also close. all of these have apartments available in the 2005ish range, sometimes many. you still see apartments listed, though, at 150-200% of 2005 prices in just about every area. should know a tremendous amount more soon as the wave of apartments that went into contract over the last couple of months begin closing.

downtown (excluding FiDi/Wall Street, which i don't follow), has been stubborn, but there doesn't seem to be much trading there right now. harlem hasn't seen the reductions that one would expect, although that should change soon. chelsea, i would guess, should see accelerating price corrections, along with midtown west.

certain UES prime properties have seen stunning corrections, others not. not much trading there also.

jr4 for $399k, significantly less than 2005. is this a typo?

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/398637-coop-301-east-63rd-street-lenox-hill-new-york
05/03/2005 Previous Sale recorded for $586,000.
04/01/2009 Listed in StreetEasy by Prudential Elliman at $399,000.

aboutready, I think there may be something wrong, because when I tried to click through to the PE site, I got "Listing Not Found"

That E81st street listing IS interesting. I might check it out myself. The renovations look nice.

this is very cookie cutter, but it has some flexibility and it's really close to its mid-2004 price.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/351879-coop-301-east-87th-street-yorkville-new-york

06/22/2004 Previous Sale recorded for $567,500.
09/26/2008 Listed in StreetEasy by Brown Harris Stevens at $705,000.
11/26/2008 Price decreased by 15% to $599,000.
05/20/2009 Price decreased by 4% to $575,000.

I think this will trade soon at a low 700k price.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/371611-condo-71-nassau-street-financial-district-new-york

12/20/2005 Previously Listed in StreetEasy by Prudential Elliman at $1,195,000.
09/14/2006 Prudential Elliman Listing sold. Last priced at $1,090,000.
09/14/2006 Previous Sale recorded for $980,000.
06/27/2008 Previously Listed in StreetEasy by Halstead Property at $1,300,000.
12/17/2008 Halstead Property Listing is no longer available. Last priced at $1,170,000.
12/21/2008 Listed in StreetEasy by Prudential Elliman at $1,170,000.
02/27/2009 Price decreased by 8% to $1,075,000.
03/23/2009 Price decreased by 7% to $999,000.
04/29/2009 Price decreased by 10% to $899,000.
06/10/2009 Price decreased by 6% to $849,000.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/375682-coop-140-east-81st-street-upper-east-side-new-york

Building has big financial issues -- $700 yes $700 assessment on Apartment

Rent_or_Buy - where did you get the info about the assessment? I don't see anything in the listing about that.

when i visited the place -- on the show sheet -- more intresting is that it wasn't the first time i visited a couple of months ago -- broker says in ends in december but i tend to doubt it

not having any great love for brokers, i'd still doubt that they'd misrepresent a special assessment's duration. no point in doing so.

and that's the type of thing you can negotiate a seller paying, particularly since you probably wouldn't close before September anyway.

when I went 6 weeks ago the assessment wasn't listed -- it is not mentioned in any ad -- seller isnt offering to pay for it -- lots of stuff going on here -- nothing good

so? they had a special assessment. it may be a sign of a very conservative coop board that doesn't want to reduce reserves and wanted to pay for something quickly, rather than spread it out over time.

"lots of stuff going on here -- nothing good" is meaningless, and quite possibly misleading. the only way to know what is going on is to have a good attorney take a good look at the financials. and you have no idea if seller would AGREE to pay for it during the negotiation process. i agree the assessment should be noted in any advertisement, however, so negative points to the broker on that one.

AR - I think that bulding has a land-lease.

waverly, which one? if it's 140, it's kind of ironic as the building description touts the financial acumen of the coop.

It is definately all on the broker -- i asked the broker about the seller paying -- she said nope -- seller is also on the board -- suspect he knows more than what is being said re: end date of the assessment.

40 East 88th Street - #6F and #3F are in competition with each other. The price seems reasonable, and the maintenance is really really low. Does anyone have any insight on why they haven't gone into contract yet? (And can that maintenance really be true?)

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/378204-coop-40-east-88th-street-carnegie-hill-new-york

this is clearly an estate sale, needs new kitchen and probably baths, but floors have been redone and walls have been painted. mtnc is a very reasonable $1350 for an apt that's about 1100sf. location, if you're into that neighborhood, is great. ps6. 2/1.5 for $775k. 6D just sold for $930k, and also sold for $909k in 05/05. with an ikea kitchen and nice but modest baths it seems to me you could get a decent discount to an early '05 price. and that's assuming one paid at listing price.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/473820-coop-140-east-81st-street-upper-east-side-new-york

AR: Interesting listing. If one was looking for a 3-4br in the PS6 area, might be a good idea to look for potential combos in this building. Floorplan won't yield a classic X-room layout, but flow isn't horrible - particularly D+E, and F+G.