building at 110 Livingston Street

Interesting... because the developer couldn't even sell all the apartments at list!

They had broken contracts, then lied about sales.... and had to resort to renting them.

Every building out there seems to be like that. Most of the apartments for sale seem to have been bought in the past 2 years - and they're all listed for 20-25% more than they paid. It's ridiculous!

Maybe the broker said "price it 25% higher than you expect, so we can discount it later".

Good point. I don't blame them for trying.

This was one of the VERY few successful developments in Downtown B'lyn...and it is unfortunate that those flippers seem stuck... The area has been hit HARD, as Manhattan has become more affordable.

Agreed, downtown was late to the party and, oh yeah, that jail is still there. Neighborhood still needs serious work. Has potential (like the municipal building fix up) but that stuff 'aint happening anytime soon. In 15-20 years, this will probably be a cool spot, but right now its just a couple of fixed up buildings in a crappy downtown.

That stuff off Boerum is just in for trouble for a few years...

I have friends who live in the building. The apartments are nice, if a bit cookie-cutter. It's a very typical Two Trees condo but they seem happy enough.

I feel like it's situated closer to Brooklyn Heights than Downtown Brooklyn (probably since it's located on the west side of busy Boerum), but the block where 110 sits is very blah, and has none of the charm of the Heights.

Overall though, the neighborhood is actually quite nice, especially once you go one or two blocks west. Their building is a block from Brooklyn Heights and a short 4 block stroll to Trader Joe's, Cobble Hill (maybe the loveliest neighborhood in Brooklyn) and Smith Street, so it's convenient--and convenient to transit--if nothing else.

Downtown Brooklyn east of Boerum, say around Belltel Lofts, is indeed "crappy".

"I feel like it's situated closer to Brooklyn Heights than Downtown Brooklyn (probably since it's located on the west side of busy Boerum), but the block where 110 sits is very blah, and has none of the charm of the Heights."

Not quite. On the west side of Boerum is, well, Downtown Brooklyn.
110 livingston isn't *near* downtown, its IN downtown. Almost smack dab in the middle.
Hell, its right on top of the downtown brooklyn stop! (notice how the transit museum is below)

Its east of Borough Hall! Hell, court street has a ton of municipal buildings. In fact I think the largest block of federal stuff is on cadman plaza (which is partially an extension of court street on one side).

I'd actually say being east is LESS downtown brooklyn, because you're getting more toward fulton mall (imho still downtown, but of boerum courts there).

And, more irony than anything...

you get that 100 livingston WAS A MUNICIPAL BUILDING? It was the board of education.

Doesn't get much more downtown than that... if your broker told you something else, it wouldn't be the first time.

People who live in the area consider 110 Livingston to be right where Brooklyn Heights meets Downtown Brooklyn.

The people who the brokers convinced to buy because its "next to" brooklyn heights think its right next to brooklyn heights... not really surprised by that, especially considering the majority of people living there just started living there and couldn't have told you where downtown brooklyn was last year.

But neither livingston nor Boreum are where Brooklyn Heights starts. That at best would be the other side of Court Street...

This is smack dab in the middle of downtown. Not far from BH, but the claim that "it's situated closer to Brooklyn Heights than Downtown Brooklyn" is just plain wrong.

Correct on the location. This building is in downtown Brooklyn, which isn't a bad thing given the great subway access and proximity to Smith Street restaurants - and a much better location than BellTel Lofts !!

I guess resellers want to make sure they cover their purchase price plus closing costs (transfer tax included).

Agreed it is a better location for access to other neighborhoods. Its not the best part of smith street thats close, but it is awful close and not too far from where it really gets going.

But thats its, its an access place. Right now, lousy neighborhood, but central. Its like being on fulton street in manhattan or something.

But its got ways to go to clean up.

It's not a lousy neighborhood at all. The "Bar Tabac" part of Smith Street is a 5 min walk. You're also within walking distance to Brooklyn Heights, Carroll Gardens and Cobble Hill. A lot of shopping/restaurants on Atlantic Ave and Court St (Trader Joe). Movie theater up the block and Borough Hall Station a block away. Fulton Street at night is dead !!! Bad comparison.

nyc10022 has baseless opinions about everything, don't take him seriously.

--"Not quite. On the west side of Boerum is, well, Downtown Brooklyn.
110 livingston isn't *near* downtown, its IN downtown. Almost smack dab in the middle.
Hell, its right on top of the downtown brooklyn stop! (notice how the transit museum is below)"

It's one block from Court Street (where Brooklyn Heights starts). TWO blocks and you're at the corner of Aitken Place and Clinton Street, well into the heart of the Heights. It's hardly a location that is "smack dab in the middle" of downtown.

Anyway, I never said it *isn't* downtown Brooklyn--just that it *feels* more connected to Brooklyn Heights than to downtown. The building is closer to Brooklyn Heights than it is to Metrotech or Macy's or any other downtown landmark you care to name. It's closer to Armando's on Montague than it is to Junior's.

"Smack in the middle" might be a more accurate description for Belltel. As someone else pointed out, 110 is pretty much on the border. Oh, and the MTA thinks the Transit Museum is in Brooklyn Heights: http://www.mta.info/mta/museum/

I don't agree, but it just shows how close the building is to the Heights.

--"Its east of Borough Hall! Hell, court street has a ton of municipal buildings. In fact I think the largest block of federal stuff is on cadman plaza (which is partially an extension of court street on one side). I'd actually say being east is LESS downtown brooklyn, because you're getting more toward fulton mall (imho still downtown, but of boerum courts there)."

I'm not quite sure what you're getting at, but a couple of points. First, Court Street (and I assume we're talking north of Atlantic) has as many frozen yogurt shops as muni buildings. There's Borough Hall, the Municipal building across the street, and a Dept. of Education office at 65 Court. That's three. If you want to include Cadman Plaza, then it's four (the Supreme Court, though it's technically on Adams). Four is hardly a ton.

Second, the Fulton Mall IS downtown Brooklyn. As is Metrotech and NYU-Poly. And they're all *east* of 110 Livingston. I'm not sure why you think being east is "less downtown". Do you really think the Fulton Mall is somehow "less downtown" than 110 Livingston? Or am I not understanding you correctly?

> nyc10022 has baseless opinions about everything, don't take him seriously.

Coming from the guy who said LIC was a great investment.... I take that as a complement.

And lets not forget that that comes right after where I had to correct you on your misunderstanding of the borders of downtown brooklyn.

I'm sorry you don't like being shown wrong, but, wow, this is about as immature a retort as it gets.

> Anyway, I never said it *isn't* downtown Brooklyn--just that it *feels* more connected to Brooklyn
> Heights than to downtown.

Now you're just changing your story.

This is what you said.
""I feel like it's situated closer to Brooklyn Heights than Downtown Brooklyn (probably since it's located on the west side of busy Boerum), but the block where 110 sits is very blah, and has none of the charm of the Heights.""

Thats the opposite of what you are claiming you said. Situated closer is suddenly "feel"?

In fact, you put a BUT in there to separate location from "charm".

You were clearly talking about location, and you were just wrong.

Don't backtrack.

"I'm not quite sure what you're getting at, but a couple of points. First, Court Street (and I assume we're talking north of Atlantic) has as many frozen yogurt shops as muni buildings. There's Borough Hall, the Municipal building across the street, and a Dept. of Education office at 65 Court. That's three. If you want to include Cadman Plaza, then it's four (the Supreme Court, though it's technically on Adams). Four is hardly a ton. "

And Brooklyn Heights has yogurt shops and no municipal buildings.

Way to miss the point though!

> Do you really think the Fulton Mall is somehow "less downtown" than 110 Livingston?

Absofinglutely. Same for metrotech, which came years after downtown brooklyn (and goes all the way to flatbush)

LIC, sorta funny that you backed the horse who has no idea what he's talking about.

> If you want to include Cadman Plaza, then it's four (the Supreme Court, though it's technically on
> Adams).

Only if you stop counting after 1. Keep going up Cadman.... you'll find some more.

nyc10022, how does it feel to have 10013 show how much of a clueless loudmouth you are. Can you once please try to know what you are talking about before you post? You are so clearly jealous of people who are happy owning their homes.

LIC, that you think the guy who doesn't know what he's talking about knows anything just shows how little you know. The dude thinks BOROUGH HALL isn't downtown brooklyn.

Seriously, way to pick a winner!

I'm scared to think who you voted for.

> You are so clearly jealous of people who are happy owning their homes.

Wow, out comes the bitter.

Dude, I'm sorry we all told you LIC would tank, and you didn't believe us, but, WOW, having to resort to this to make yourself feel better. You were wrong, LIC cratered, and its still going. Following me around and screaming "yeah!" after another clueless person makes a mistake isn't going to fix that.

Wow, that is sad.

Perhaps your time would be better spent trying to make up for your losses.

Thanks for another worthless post. Why don't you make up some more things and pretend you feel good about yourself? I'll trust people who actually have lived there for years instead of someone who spouts off about everything without actually knowing anything.

Lets see... the guy who comes on and goes for personal insult when he's got nothing else...
trying to lecture.

Pathetic LIC.

But, your comment was if nothing else extremely transparent. I guess you aren't so sure about your purchase anymore...

> I'll trust people who actually have lived there for years

And thats the funny part of all of this. You don't know how dumb you really are, I guess.

You must REALLY be having a rough day.

You are clearly pissed about your apartment purchase... and now you're wailing on folks because you didn't get into the school you wanted, either?

Sad.

I am very happy with my school and I am very happy with my apartment. For some reason this bothers you. Probably insecurity, but that is your personal issue and I don't care to discuss it thank you.

> I am very happy with my school and I am very happy with my apartment.

Yes, and that is PAINFULLY obvious from your posts.

Sorry, you're quite transparent.

ROTFL.

Seriously, dude, you couldn't have made your discomfort any clearer today if you tried.

"It's not a lousy neighborhood at all. The "Bar Tabac" part of Smith Street is a 5 min walk. You're also within walking distance to Brooklyn Heights, Carroll Gardens and Cobble Hill. A lot of shopping/restaurants on Atlantic Ave and Court St (Trader Joe). Movie theater up the block and Borough Hall Station a block away. Fulton Street at night is dead !!! Bad comparison"

re. I agree with the proximity... thats what I said. "Agreed it is a better location for access to other neighborhoods."

Its got awesome access. I am 100% for that. I'm just talking about the immediate area. Court Street needs a huge facelift over there (which is the muni project they're supposed to work on). Boerum has some work, but it needs more.

More importantly, on the way to those places you and I agree are cool... you walk by...
McDs and Popeys and the bail bonds place. Livingston has the OTB. On boerum and atlantic the jail and the auto parts things.

Yes, GREAT stuff in easy walking distance... but the immediate neighborhood I'm talking about, and its got ways to go. At night, its just not great.

It will get there, as I said, but a lot of work in the meantime and no money to do it.

--Now you're just changing your story.
--Thats the opposite of what you are claiming you said. Situated closer is suddenly "feel"? In fact, --you put a BUT in there to separate location from "charm". You were clearly talking about location, --and you were just wrong. Don't backtrack.

nyc10022--or should I say EddieWilson?--is your reading comprehension really that bad? I never stated that 110 Livingston is located closer to BK Heights than downtown--I just wrote that that's what it *feels* like (although, IMO, it IS closer to the Heights than what most everyone considers the heart of downtown). Do I have to really qualify a sentence that begins with "I feel" with "that's only my impression/opinion"? I feel that's implied (but that's only my opinion).

How is that the opposite of what I "claimed", much less "changing my story"?.

--And Brooklyn Heights has yogurt shops and no municipal buildings. Way to miss the point though!

Sarcasm is the last refuge of the...well, I'll just say that it's YOU who's missing the point. This discussion wasn't about the Brooklyn Heights, or the Heights vs Downtown, and no one is disputing that 110 Livingston is in downtown Brooklyn.

> Do you really think the Fulton Mall is somehow "less downtown" than 110 Livingston?
--Absofinglutely. Same for metrotech, which came years after downtown brooklyn (and goes all the way to flatbush)

Oh, now I get it. You just have NO IDEA what constitutes downtown Brooklyn, so you just went ahead and decided on some odd and arbitrary boundaries. Your definition of downtown Brooklyn seems to be a one block wide area east of Court and west of Boerum that somehow goes all the way to Flatbush while somehow skipping the Fulton Mall and Metrotech. Gotcha. Now I understand why you think 110 Livingston is "smack dab in the middle" of downtown.

> If you want to include Cadman Plaza, then it's four (the Supreme Court, though it's technically on
> Adams).
--Only if you stop counting after 1. Keep going up Cadman.... you'll find some more.

Of course you can find more if you go up Cadman. But here's what *YOU* wrote:

"Hell, court street has a ton of municipal buildings."

You were obviously talking about Court Street, and I addressed that. I proved you wrong. Now you're saying to look down a different street?

Which is it, Eddie? Court or Cadman?

"nyc10022--or should I say EddieWilson?--is your reading comprehension really that bad?"

No, your ability to write is.

"I never stated that 110 Livingston is located closer to BK Heights than downtown--I just wrote that that's what it *feels* like"

Yes, you need to work on your writing skills. Thats not what you said... and you specifically mentioned location.

You might want to look up what the word means.

> although, IMO, it IS closer to the Heights than what most everyone considers the heart of downtown

Only if "most everyone" is you and your mom. 110 livingston is SMACK IN MIDDLE of the heart of downtown. Sorry.

> Do I have to really qualify a sentence that begins with "I feel" with "that's only my
> impression/opinion"?

Doesn't make it any less wrong, or worthy of correction...

> no one is disputing that 110 Livingston is in downtown Brooklyn.
Except, well, you...

> You were obviously talking about Court Street, and I addressed that. I proved you wrong.

Dude, you don't know much. Court street turns into Cadman! And you thought that proved me wrong!!!

"Oh, now I get it. You just have NO IDEA what constitutes downtown Brooklyn, so you just went ahead and decided on some odd and arbitrary boundaries. Your definition of downtown Brooklyn seems to be a one block wide area east of Court and west of Boerum that somehow goes all the way to Flatbush while somehow skipping the Fulton Mall and Metrotech. Gotcha. Now I understand why you think 110 Livingston is "smack dab in the middle" of downtown. "

Dude, if you think Metrotech is more downtown than 110 livingston, then WOW do you know nothing about downtown brooklyn. Metrotech was built to attempt to extend some of downtown to flatbush (and wasn't particularly successful at it). It certainly isn't the middle of downtown!

And, no, Flatbush is NOT the middle of downtown. Try again!

Seriously, if you know THIS LITTLE about it, why are you still talking?

Wow, dude, you need to pick another topic, you don't know much about this one...

Break it up, kids!
Can we agree on this: 110 Livingston is in a perfect location if, say, you commute to work every day by subway.

-What's that you say? Most people take the subway to work?
Well that makes it a terrific spot for most of them.

-But it's not in the Heights! And I have kids!
Well lucky for you it's in a highly rated elementary school district. Unlike Brooklyn Heights.

-But can't I still tell people I live in Brooklyn Heights?
Sure, if you want to be that kind of person. But why not just say you live at 110 Livingston and let people draw their own conclusions?

-Because people seem to get into shouting matches abut it!
Yeah, but that's just here on Streeteasy. In the real world, people don't get all het up about stuff like that.

Tina
(Brooklyn broker)

EddieWilson/nyc10022, I don't usually resort to ad hominems, but man, you are a moron of epic proportions.

--"Dude, you don't know much. Court street turns into Cadman! And you thought that proved me wrong!!!"

Court street does indeed into Cadman West--however, there are NO MUNICIPAL buildings on Cadman West AS YOU CLAIM. There are muni buildings on Cadman EAST, but to get there from Court St would require one to travel down Cadman West, make a right onto Tillary, then make another left onto Cadman West. Cadman West is hardly the same street as Court.

You originally wrote that Court St was full of muni buildings. WRONG. Then you tried to backtrack and added another street (Cadman) to try and bolster your fictitious claim--except that you probably didn't realize that there are TWO Cadmans, and the street with the municipal buildings DOES NOT TURN INTO COURT. Turns out you're WRONG AGAIN.

Maybe you should check a map before you post again, idiot.

--"Metrotech was built to attempt to extend some of downtown to flatbush (and wasn't particularly successful at it). It certainly isn't the middle of downtown!"

Wrong again. Extend downtown from where? The one block wide downtown of your delusions? MetroTech was built to *revitalize* downtown, not to "extend it".

Downtown's borders were set as soon as they built Flatbush X--long before MetroTech was even a thought bubble in Ratner's head. And yes, MetroTech is very much in the middle of downtown.

--"And, no, Flatbush is NOT the middle of downtown. Try again!"
--"110 livingston is SMACK IN MIDDLE of the heart of downtown"

Um, when did I write that Flatbush is the middle of downtown? Oh, right--I didn't. I *never* wrote anything to that effect. Again, either your reading comprehension skills are lacking or you're just a moron. I'd say it's a bit of both.

110 Livingston is "SMACK IN THE MIDDLE" only if you think downtown is a one block wide area located between Court and Boerum Place. I don't have to point out how ridiculous you sound, do I Eddie?

Or maybe you think 110 exists in some weird spatial plane that makes it possible somehow to a block from Brooklyn Heights yet also be "smack in the middle" of downtown?

Everyone (but you) considers the middle of downtown Brooklyn to be somewhere along Fulton where the old Altman & Strauss (now the Macy's), Altman's, Martin's, etc. used to be. Not only is it the figurative "heart", but guess what? It's also *geographically* the center of downtown given the actual BORDERS of downtown (Court, Flatbush, Tillary, and State).

--"Only if "most everyone" is you and your mom."

Oooh, good one! You truly are a mind-bogglingly asinine half-wit.

A friend of ours lives in that building and loves it there. That area has improved a lot especially with the addition of Trader Joes.

oh boy, this is one of those arguments where it's impossible to see the other guy's side.

Personally I agree a thousand percetn with 10022. This is a TERRIBLE location for residential. You folks who think it's livable, have you ever walked in front of the court building, which is nearby? It's the court building, there are people going in there all the time very much from the lower stratum of society, people who involved in criminal trials.

And outside there are all kinds of street vendors that you don't want to be around, like guys selling incense from a table on the sidewalk. The sidewalks around there are filthy and crowded because of the court traffic, and Brooklyn Law School is just around the corner, which is crowded and noisy....

It doesn't matter if there are nice blocks and nice retail a 15 or 20 minutes walk away, because that's not where you're living if you buy here! You're living in the middle of crowded noisy filth.

This place will have no resale value is a few years. It's a sucker deal, totally.

So more people consider nyc10022 a buffoon. Interesting . . .

oh boy, this is one of those arguments where it's impossible to see the other guy's side. So I won't even bother trying!

Personally I agree a thousand percetn with 10022, which is like, way more than a hundred percetn. This is a TERRIBLE location for residential, what with all the transit, shopping like Trader Joe's, Barnes $ Nobles, Sahadi's, scads of restaurants like Morton's Steakhouse, Tabac, Joya, and other conveniences just blocks away. Sheesh, talk about awful.

You folks who think it's livable, have you ever walked in front of the court building, which is nearby? A court building, of all things! Let's get it together, people. This is NYC, not some big, dense, heavily populated city with areas that mix civic, business, and residential.

It's the court building, there are people going in there all the time very much from the lower stratum of society, people who involved in criminal trials. Yes, actual lower stratum of society! I live in Inwood, so I'm completely unused to the lower stratum. Also, I'm pretty sure white collar or wealthy criminals don't go to that court in Brooklyn. They must have a different one, maybe it's in CT.

And outside there are all kinds of street vendors that you don't want to be around, like guys selling incense from a table on the sidewalk. I mean, this has to be the only place in all of NYC where there are street vendors, right?

The sidewalks around there are filthy and crowded because of the court traffic, and Brooklyn Law School is just around the corner, which is crowded and noisy. It's just awful, because we all know graduate schools, professors, and college grads don't add anything of value to neighborhoods.

It doesn't matter if there are nice blocks and nice retail a 15 or 20 minutes walk away, because that's not where you're living if you buy here! That's right, even though nice blocks and nice retail are only a block or two away, it'll take you 15 or 20 minutes to walk there because you'll have to shove through the noisy crowds at Brooklyn Law and dodge all the street vendors. Damn you, halal chicken cart guy!

You're living in the middle of crowded noisy filth. It's unfathomable to me how it can be so different from the rest of NYC, which, as we all know, is empty, quiet, and immaculately clean.

This place will have no resale value is a few years. It's a sucker deal, totally. Like, really, totally. I'm totally hoping places like this have no resale value so prices can come down enough to where I can get me that sweet one bedroom in a really prime, convenient location like Kensington or Inwood.

Ah, Inwood. Who needs shopping, restaurants, transit, or college grads around? That's totally not what I moved to NYC for.

dear misspelled Grafiti: those are the words of a desperate owner, somebody who way overpaid for the real estate he happens to be sitting on. Good luck to you.

dear misinformed Graffiti: those are the words of a clueless renter in Inwood, someone who knows nothing about the area he happens to make false and incorrect comments about.

Considering that you refuse to walk in your local park even in broad daylight, and that your car has been burglarized and/or vandalized multiple times, I say this with all sincerity--good luck to you living in that shithole you call home.

Which witch is which?

And speaking of 110 Livingston #11C, if you really want to move to downtown brooklyn, why not save yourself $330,000 and buy #11D at 96 Schermerhorn one block away instead?

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/415678-coop-96-schermerhorn-street-brooklyn-heights-brooklyn

Reminder, both to LICComment and NYC10022, please have your fights here:
http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/11716-all-fights-between-nyc10022-and-someone-else-should-just-be-here

> --"Dude, you don't know much. Court street turns into Cadman! And you thought that proved me wrong!!!"

> Court street does indeed into Cadman West--however, there are NO MUNICIPAL buildings on Cadman West
> AS YOU CLAIM.

Genius, I never claimed they're on West... they're on East, of course.

Try again, though!

> There are muni buldings on Cadman EAST, but to get there from Court St would require one to travel
> down Cadman West, make a right onto Tillary, then make another left onto Cadman West.

Or, uh, walk straight in the direction of court street along the courts! Cadman east actually follows the line of court!

I don't know why you are walking in circles (other than to try and manufacture an incorrect point), but it doesn't sound like you know downtown brooklyn at all!

> You originally wrote that Court St was full of muni buildings. WRONG.

Uh, 65 court, Borough Hall, and the muni building in just a block and a half.

Dude, you can put anything you want in all caps, but that doesn't mean you aren't stupid.

> Turns out you're WRONG AGAIN.

Again, all caps doesn't make you right, or any less an idiot!

> be you should check a map before you post again, idiot.

Maybe you should actually get to Brooklyn something before you post, moron!

And, 10013, you complete moron, I'm still RIGHT. 110 livingston is smack in the middle of downtown brooklyn, no matter how much you rant and call me names!

> So more people consider nyc10022 a buffoon. Interesting . . .

LIC, you are amazing at teaming up with every idiot! Any moron, you just in their boat.
Great morons think alike, I guess!

"oh boy, this is one of those arguments where it's impossible to see the other guy's side.

Personally I agree a thousand percetn with 10022. This is a TERRIBLE location for residential. You folks who think it's livable, have you ever walked in front of the court building, which is nearby? It's the court building, there are people going in there all the time very much from the lower stratum of society, people who involved in criminal trials.

And outside there are all kinds of street vendors that you don't want to be around, like guys selling incense from a table on the sidewalk. The sidewalks around there are filthy and crowded because of the court traffic, and Brooklyn Law School is just around the corner, which is crowded and noisy....

It doesn't matter if there are nice blocks and nice retail a 15 or 20 minutes walk away, because that's not where you're living if you buy here! You're living in the middle of crowded noisy filth.

This place will have no resale value is a few years. It's a sucker deal, totally. "

Well said, Graffiti.

Clearly somebody really wants their apartment to be worth more than they paid, but that doesn't change reality (or change the neighborhood that its in)!

This one is smack dab in the middle of central location, but one that needs a LOT of work.

Typical nyc10022/EddieWilson response: ignore facts, obfusticate, back pedal, change stories, lie--anything to avoid admitting you were wrong, right 10022?

--You first write: "Hell, court street has a ton of municipal buildings."
As I pointed out many times, there are *3* municipal buildings on Court street. Since when does 3 buildings constitute "a ton"? Right, it doesn't. Time for you to change your story.

--You then write: "Keep going up Cadman.... you'll find some more."
But wait--weren't you talking about Court St? Oh, that's right, since you were completely wrong about there being "a ton" on municipal buildings on Court, you name a completely different street to cover your incorrect point/outright lie/ignorance.

--You justify it by writing: "Court street turns into Cadman!"
Yes, that's true. Unfortunately for you, Court st turns into Cadman WEST, where (surprise!) there are no muni buildings.

--You then wrote: "I never claimed they're on West... they're on East, of course."
Actually, you didn't specify which Cadman, but since you wrote that "Court street turns into Cadman", you had to be talking about Cadman West (which, if you bothered to check a map, you could see changes over from Court at Montague). For your point to stand, Court St would have to turn into Cadman East, which it doesn't.

--You then wrote: "walk straight in the direction of court street along the courts"
First you claim that Court St will "turn into Cadman" East where the municipal buildings are, which was obviously wrong. Now we should disregard walking on Court street altogether and just "walk straight in the *direction* of court street" instead? Which is it, 10022?

From the end of Court at Montague, you'd have to take the directions I posted previously (which you erroneously said was "walking in circles") OR you'd have to get off Court st, walk across Borough Hall Plaza, then cross over Johnson St to get to Cadman East. Is that how Court "turns into" Cadman East in your world, 10022? Because there's no other way to get to Cadman East from Court.

--You then wrote: "Cadman east actually follows the line of court!"
LOL. Talk about grasping at straws! So Court St somehow 'turns into" Cadman East because it "follows the line of court", even though there isn't a street that connects the two? That's so ridiculous it's almost funny.

BTW, I lived on Pierrepont for the first 18 years of my life and am intimiately familiar with the area, but you don't Brooklyn creds to know that you're completely wrong.

Next time, check a map, you mental midget.

"And, 10013, you complete moron, I'm still RIGHT. 110 livingston is smack in the middle of downtown brooklyn, no matter how much you rant and call me names!"

Let's look at this logically, nyc10022. Here are some *facts*:

1. 110 Livingston is ONE block from the border of Brooklyn Heights. It's a block and a half from the Heights Historic district.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/lpc/downloads/pdf/maps/brooklyn_heights.pdf

2. 110 Livingston is four blocks from the borders of Cobble Hill and Boerum Hill (Atlantic and Court).

There are FACTS. I'd hardly call a location that's a block from Brooklyn Heights and four from Cobble Hill the middle of downtown.

The only way 110 Livingston could be "smack in the middle of downtown" is if downtown were two blocks wide and eight blocks long. It's not.

I suppose in your head, Belltel Lofts, Metrotech, and the Fulton Mall are in Fort Greene.

10013 seems very clear and knowledgeable. 10022/Eddie Wilson seems like a wacko who doesn't have a clue what he is talking about, and then gets whiny and nasty about it when he is shown to be wrong. Interesting . . .

Who is this Eddie Wilson, I haven't seen one post. Code?

"Only if "most everyone" is you and your mom. 110 livingston is SMACK IN MIDDLE of the heart of downtown. Sorry."

"You originally wrote that Court St was full of muni buildings. WRONG. Then you tried to backtrack and added another street (Cadman) to try and bolster your fictitious claim--except that you probably didn't realize that there are TWO Cadmans, and the street with the municipal buildings DOES NOT TURN INTO COURT. Turns out you're WRONG AGAIN."

"Typical nyc10022/EddieWilson response: ignore facts, obfusticate, back pedal, change stories, lie--anything to avoid admitting you were wrong, right 10022?"

10013, this is pretty entertaining stuff, and not at all surprising, given that you're arguing with a troll (and an angry, vulgar one at that). You're clearly right here - 110 Livingston is indeed in downtown Brooklyn, but quite close to the Heights (two blocks to Aitken/Clinton is pretty convincing for anyone who knows the area, no?) though not nearly as charming, as you said. I don't get what the big fuss is, but don't let the same guy who said including 5th Ave in Park Slope is "pushing it" and McCarren Park is "dangerous" bait you into another silly neighborhood border discussion he knows preciously little about. Cheers.

"110 Livingston is indeed in downtown Brooklyn, but quite close to the Heights"

Which is exactly what I said!

Wow, bjw, I did not expect you to back me up! I guess you did it accidentally....

"Typical nyc10022/EddieWilson response: ignore facts, obfusticate, back pedal, change stories, lie--anything to avoid admitting you were wrong, right 10022?"

Its funny.... you can say that over and over again, but I WAS RIGHT.

No need to backpedal, I was right.

Sorry, try again!

"and then gets whiny and nasty about it when he is shown to be wrong. Interesting . . ."

LIC, did you really just try and call someone ELSE nasty?

ROTFL.

We have 2 different threads where a multitude of folks called you out on that. Whining about ivy leaguers because you didn't get in, and then going off on all renters.

Many, you're a funny one.

Wow, sad.

"BTW, I lived on Pierrepont for the first 18 years of my life and am intimiately familiar with the area, but you don't Brooklyn creds to know that you're completely wrong. "

ROTFL.

Ok, now you really got me...

Sorry, too funny.

"--You then wrote: "Cadman east actually follows the line of court!"
LOL. Talk about grasping at straws! So Court St somehow 'turns into" Cadman East because it "follows the line of court", even though there isn't a street that connects the two? That's so ridiculous it's almost funny"

Dude, if you don't think Cadman EAST isn't more the continuation of the line of court street, then you just don't know diddly. You're arguing over traffic patterns? Really? Because they plaza off central sections, they don't count? (and they were almost all streets previously, Cadman east and west are just fulton and washington renamed).

You are REALLY streteching to try and make a point.

All of it is WEST (and some north) of 110 livinston... which all goes to the original point.

Try again though! Maybe you can get some more folks who don't know brooklyn like bjw and LIC on your side!

"Which is exactly what I said!
Wow, bjw, I did not expect you to back me up! I guess you did it accidentally...."

It's what everyone else said as well, but you somehow turned it into dozens of nasty posts. Go figure! Some of us actually live in Brooklyn - it's amazing you think you're a know it all if you don't even live here.

> It's what everyone else said as well,

Uh, no its not. But I wouldn't have expected you to have actually read the thread first, would I?

Try again though!

> but you somehow turned it into dozens of nasty posts.

Yes, its all me. You're a funny one bjw!

> it's amazing you think you're a know it all if you don't even live here

Yes, we'd all know better if we were tourists like you! Who know "better" about schools they or their kids have never been in because they "talk to people". Who know about neighborhoods they have never lived in because they "talk to people". Seriously, why do you even bother to post? Why not get all these "people" to come to the board. You yourself are useless.

And did you just discount 10013's entire brooklyn experience in a second? Suddenly his 18 years don't count?

I love it. Nothing like a fresh shot of hypocrisy from you!

> It's what everyone else said as well

Except, of course, the two people who tried to insult me the most!

Guess being wrong makes you edgy.

Right bjw!

and, had they just admitted it, it would have been a much shorter conversation!

"Uh, no its not. But I wouldn't have expected you to have actually read the thread first, would I?"

I did - no one said 110 Livingston is NOT in downtown Brooklyn. You should doublecheck: "Anyway, I never said it *isn't* downtown Brooklyn" Whoops.

"Yes, we'd all know better if we were tourists like you! Who know "better" about schools they or their kids have never been in because they "talk to people". Who know about neighborhoods they have never lived in because they "talk to people". Seriously, why do you even bother to post? Why not get all these "people" to come to the board. You yourself are useless.
And did you just discount 10013's entire brooklyn experience in a second? Suddenly his 18 years don't count?"

You do know how angry you come off as, right? Only you would argue that living in a neighborhood (or borough in this case) and interacting with people who live here on a daily basis are somehow negligible facts. I did not discount 10013's experience - he's totally correct here, and you're brushing off the fact that he grew up in the very same area you're talking about, just because you can't admit you're wrong. Congrats nyc10022, you're truly a special case!

--nyc10022 wrote: "All of it is WEST (and some north) of 110 livinston... which all goes to the original point."

What original point? Your ridiculous assertion that "110 Livingston is smack dab in the middle of downtown"? There's exactly *one block* of downtown to the west of 110 Livingston before you hit Brooklyn Heights. You know what's _east_ of 110 Livingston? Boerum Place, Brooklyn Marriott, MetroTech, NYU-Poly, all of Fulton Mall--pretty much the very definition of downtown Brooklyn.

And, as I've previously mentioned (which you so conveniently ignored) it's also 1.5 blocks to the Brooklyn Heights Historic district.

Explain how being a block from the Heights and four from Cobble Hill is the "middle of downtown", especially since it's closer to the Promenade at the western end of the Heights than it is to the eastern border of Downtown.

Do you even know what the word "middle" means?

--nyc10022 wrote: "Because they plaza off central sections, they don't count? (and they were almost all streets previously, Cadman east and west are just fulton and washington"

As usual, you got it wrong. Cadman East used to be a part of Washington street, not Fulton.

And how, exactly, does this prove your contention that Cadman East "turns into" Court Street? On right--it doesn't!

Thanks for making my point, moron!

--nyc10022 wrote: "Dude, if you don't think Cadman EAST isn't more the continuation of the line of court street, then you just don't know diddly."

More absurdity from the imbecile. Besides the fact that that's not at all what you previously claimed (that "Court street *turns into* Cadman!"), it's not even REMOTELY close to your original contention.

Here's what you originally claimed: "Hell, COURT street has a ton of municipal buildings." (emphasis mine)

You went from claiming that:
-there are a "ton of municipal buildings on court street", which I pointed out was false, to

-insisting that the municipal buildings on Cadman East should be included in your argument because it "turns into Court" when I pointed out that there are only three on Court, to

-whining that Cadman East "turns into" Court because it's the "continuation of the *line* of court" when I pointed out that Court actually turns into a completely different street.

Keep clutching at those straws, Eddie. Continue on this ridiculous line of thought and soon you'll end up arguing that Cadman "turns into" Court because you can see Brooklyn from your house.

EddieWilson

> I did - no one said 110 Livingston is NOT in downtown Brooklyn. You should doublecheck: "Anyway, I > never said it *isn't* downtown Brooklyn" Whoops.

Yes, you should say whoops.

"I feel like it's situated closer to Brooklyn Heights than Downtown Brooklyn (probably since it's located on the west side of busy Boerum"

LICC - "People who live in the area consider 110 Livingston to be right where Brooklyn Heights meets Downtown Brooklyn."

Yes, you said it bjw, whoops.

Want to try that again?

"Only you would argue that living in a neighborhood (or borough in this case) and interacting with people who live here on a daily basis are somehow negligible facts."

So, you live in downtown Brooklyn now? And Park slope?

Oh, I get it, you CHANGED THE RULES AGAIN to fit yourself.

Sorry, try again.

You hypocrite liar.

" There's exactly *one block* of downtown to the west of 110 Livingston before you hit Brooklyn Heights.. You know what's _east_ of 110 Livingston? Boerum Place,"

Yes, its ON Boerum!
Doesn't help your point.

> Brooklyn Marriott
One block the other way! Its in between the two major spots established here! Less distance than you mentioned!

Wow, really not helping your point here.

> NYU-Poly
Jay Street. Just one more block.

Wow, thanks for proving the point!

all of Fulton Mall--pretty much the very definition of downtown Brooklyn. "

Fulton mall as the definition of downtown brooklyn, you have little idea of what you're talking about.

"-insisting that the municipal buildings on Cadman East should be included in your argument because it "turns into Court" when I pointed out that there are only three on Court, to"

And because they're WEST of the building! You can scream all you want, but the court buildings in question are WEST of 110 livingston.

Cover it up all you want, but those buildings are closer to BH than 110 livingston is...

just proving my point.

Thanks!

> whining that Cadman East "turns into" Court because it's the "continuation of the *line* of court"

Actually, thats a lie. I said court turns into Cadman. Not east or West. I mean the plaza / park area.

It was you who tried to claim I didn't know there was a difference.

> when I pointed out that Court actually turns into a completely different street

Yes, correcting an answer YOU MADE UP!

Sorry, but those buildings are all WEST of 110 livingston. All closer to BH.

Jump and down all you want, but you were wrong.

I'm sorry I hit a nerve, but you were WRONG.

"feel like it's situated closer to Brooklyn Heights than Downtown Brooklyn (probably since it's located on the west side of busy Boerum"

Make any claim you want, talk about anything you want, but this was just a stupid, stupid statement that you not only refuse to correct, you actually tried to rationalize!

Hey, btw, are you the expert on Coney Island, too? Because you live in the same county?

My, my, my, it is SO sad on how you'll change the rules to fit your own agenda!

Hypocrite hall monitor is back!

"I did not discount 10013's experience - he's totally correct here, and you're brushing off the fact that he grew up in the very same area you're talking about, just because you can't admit you're wrong. "

I'm STILL ROTFL on this one.

BJW will literally change the rules within 10 seconds depending on which rule fits his agenda!

"Yes, you should say whoops.
"I feel like it's situated closer to Brooklyn Heights than Downtown Brooklyn (probably since it's located on the west side of busy Boerum"
LICC - "People who live in the area consider 110 Livingston to be right where Brooklyn Heights meets Downtown Brooklyn.""

Now tell me, which one of those statements says that 110 Livingston is not actually in downtown Brooklyn? All they're saying is that it's quite close to the Heights, yet you blow it up into a "stupid, stupid statement." You see how nutty your arguing can be here? Yikes.

"So, you live in downtown Brooklyn now? And Park slope?
Oh, I get it, you CHANGED THE RULES AGAIN to fit yourself.
Sorry, try again.
You hypocrite liar."

What "rules" are you talking about? These are grade-school comebacks, not actual arguments. I'll just quote aboutready again for you: "frankly, i find bjw much more credible in your interchanges than you."

and i wasn't even finished!

"Oh, and the MTA thinks the Transit Museum is in Brooklyn Heights"

> Now tell me, which one of those statements says that 110 Livingston is not actually in downtown Brooklyn?

The first one for sure, the third one for sure, the second one, only if you give LI the benefit of the doubt.

Want to try again??!?!?

> You see how nutty your arguing can be here?

Can only be as half as nutty as the nonsense I'm responding to... like yours!

> What "rules" are you talking about?

I think you're pretty dumb, but I don't think you're dumb enough to not know what I'm talking about here. I'm pretty sure you know how much of a hypocrite you are... otherwise you wouldn't argue so much!

"no one said 110 Livingston is NOT in downtown Brooklyn"

"Oh, and the MTA thinks the Transit Museum is in Brooklyn Heights"

TOO funny.

Try again, bjw!

"The first one for sure, the third one for sure, the second one, only if you give LI the benefit of the doubt."

Because you seem to have trouble with semantics, let's go over what you've made such a massive deal about:

"I feel like it's situated closer to Brooklyn Heights than Downtown Brooklyn (probably since it's located on the west side of busy Boerum"
- The feeling is closer to that of the Heights than downtown. Definitely NOT saying that it's actually physically in the Heights. Strike one.

"Oh, and the MTA thinks the Transit Museum is in Brooklyn Heights"
- The MTA is not posting here, to the best of my knowledge, and 10013 explicitly disagreed with this statement, so still no one saying 110 Livingston is not downtown. Strike two.

"People who live in the area consider 110 Livingston to be right where Brooklyn Heights meets Downtown Brooklyn."
- Again, it's a block from Court, which is the dividing line. Never says the building is not physically in the Heights. Strike three, you're wrong.

BJW, you can say "you're wrong" all you want, but that doesn't make it so.
Its incredibly pathetic how you're STILL trying to argue it!

Even saying it doesn't "feel" like downtown is painfully wrong... because it is EXACTLY how downtown feels. Because it IS downtown.

And trying this "he didn't say it, the MTA did" nonsense. WOW, that is a pathetic stretch, even for you!

But, do keep going, please. You talked to a guy who once took a subway to Borough Hall, so you must know what you're talking about.

Please, hall monitor, give us some more!

nyc10022, I do say it, because you're so clearly wrong here! Some parts of neighborhoods certainly can feel a bit disconnected from the real heart of the area - that's so basic a notion, I took it for granted that you'd understand. It is downtown, as we've all said time and again here, but it does have a different feel from the true heart of the neighborhood, kind of like how Atlantic feels, even though it's part Cobble Hill, part Heights.

"And trying this "he didn't say it, the MTA did" nonsense. WOW, that is a pathetic stretch, even for you!"

Here is, verbatim, what 10013 said. Notice the "I don't agree" part. So once again, you're totally wrong here:
"Oh, and the MTA thinks the Transit Museum is in Brooklyn Heights: http://www.mta.info/mta/museum/
I don't agree, but it just shows how close the building is to the Heights."

--nyc10022 wrote: "Cover it up all you want, but those buildings are closer to BH than 110 livingston is...
just proving my point."

What point? That the 3 municipal buildings on Court are west of 110 Livingston? Congrats on pointing out a completely useless fact. No one was arguing otherwise or "covering it up", dimwit.

The fact that you think the location of 3 municipal buildings somehow bolsters your claim that "110 livingston is smack in the middle of downtown!" is really pathetic.

110 Livingston is CLOSER to Brooklyn Heights that it is to the Brooklyn Marriott, NYU-Poly, or Fulton Mall--it's closer to Brooklyn Heights than it is to Borough Hall. Anyone can gmap it and fact check that, but we all know you don't like *facts*, right nyc10022?

And, as pointed out numerous times by various posters, 110 Livingston is ONE block from Brooklyn Heights and FOUR from Cobble Hill. Again, explain how that puts 110 Livingston in the "smack dab middle of downtown" as is your assertion?

--nyc10022 wrote: "And trying this "he didn't say it, the MTA did" nonsense. WOW, that is a pathetic stretch, even for you!"

http://www.mta.info/mta/museum/

Under General Information:
"Since it's inception over a quarter century ago, the Museum, housed in a historic 1936 IND subway station in *BROOKLYN HEIGHTS*, has grown in scope and popularity."

The museum is located on the southeast corner of 110 Livingston (it's part of the building) . As bjw2103 pointed out, I explicitly disagreed with the MTA's assessment that it's Brooklyn Heights.

It's on the MTA site, and I didn't say it.

What's so hard to understand, moron?

--nyc10022 wrote: "Actually, thats a lie. I said court turns into Cadman. Not east or West. I mean the plaza / park area."

So when you definitively claimed that "hell, court street has a ton of municipal buildings", what you really meant was Court street AND the Borough Hall "plaza/park area" AND Cadman East has a ton of municipal buildings?

Yeah, that's not a stretch.

So you're not only an idiot, you're also a liar.

And, unfortunately for you, anyone with a map can figure out that you're both fairly quickly.

--nyc10022 wrote: "Actually, thats a lie. I said court turns into Cadman. Not east or West. I mean the plaza / park area"

What the hell, let's have some fun. Even though you wrote that "*court* street has a ton of municipal buildings", let's assume that what you really meant was that there are a ton of municpal buildings on
Court street, AND the "plaza/park area", AND Cadman East.

Hey, there's bound to be "a ton" of municipal buildings if we count all those places, right?

Let's see. On Court Street, the "plaza/park area", AND Cadman East, there are a total of *six* municipal buildings (including the beautiful Post Office building that's listed in the National Register of Historic Places).

SIX. Total.

And that municipal building on Cadman East (you know, the street you keep insisting is a "continuation of the line" of Court)? It's a half mile from 110 Livingston.

Half a mile. In LESS than half a mile, one walk from:
-Union Square Park to Madison Square park.
-34nd Street to Times Square.
-Ground Zero to the South Street Seaport!

Are you really going to claim that six buildings in a half-mile span constitutes "a ton"?

Even you can't be that stupid, nyc10022/EddieWilson.

bjw, 13 - reminder: http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/11716-all-fights-between-nyc10022-and-someone-else-should-just-be-here

.

I'm not going to weigh in on whether or not 110 Livingston is Brooklyn Heights or Downtown Brooklyn. Either way, these units shouldn't be dismissed. The building and the units are non too shabby. http://wp.me/pkLe1-aM

Bump!

Do we have any recent opinions on this building?

Ok, I'll chime in. If all you people who argued about this building had bought in it two years ago today you'd be making a nice profit on the sale even in this market. Plus, I think there's more upside here.