$4500 / 2br - True 2 bedroom 2 Bath 1250 Sq Ft NEGOTIABLE-NO FEE (Upper East Side)

Are you going to show us this "perfect layout"?

Yes would be happy to. I just didn't know how to attach images. Do you have directions on how to do so? Thanks in advance.

Just provide us a link to the page.

How far in the upper east side? Yonkers?

Sure, here is our listing (The location is Lenox Hill):

http://renthop.com/apartments/311_east_71st_street/3g/800136?1

And here is our Craig's List posting as well (it has better access to the floorplan)

http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/abo/1269948505.html

2500 seems about right

One-bedrooms in that building are renting for $3200 a month; $1300 seems like an awfully high premium to pay for an extra bedroom. (Plus, the 2008 1-bedroom rental was for $2850, so even that $3200 seems overpriced.) Family would need a minimum of $202,500 annual income to rent this place, assuming the 45x rent ratio.

a real ad is $50 for 2 weeks on this site....

if you are not paying that, what makes someone think you would be a good LL?

The ansonia is renting 2br for similar pricing with 13 ft ceilings --

Nice layout and great pics, but $4500 is a bit steep for being way over by First Avenue. For that price there should be a second full bath, a proper dining room, and at least a small office nook.

This is a classic example of people trying to cover purchasing costs through a rent -- but there is such a disconnect in pricing (RENTING IS MUCH CHEAPER) -- that you get high asks. This will sit a long time (especially since there is a coop vetting process...

Agreed, manhattanfox. There's this assumption that rent should always cover carrying costs, when in fact the rental market and the sales markets are two completely different animals.

shaniweiss, remember that the more particular you are about the tenant - which is your right and is sensible given this is your personal place - the more accommodating you should be on the rent. Also, the particularity I speak of extends to the co-op process and even the timing required for the co-op process. People usually have a typical timetable for renting in this market and if in your circumstance they have to fill out extra paperwork, go through an intrusive review with a co-op, pay fees, spend extra time meaning that you have to find someone looking extra early than what is typical, etc. then you are limiting your pool of available tenants even more. Limiting demand drives down what you can charge.

Also, if you aren't willing to sign a long-term lease (you didn't state) then that makes it less attractive, as in, imagine that every year or every two years someone had to go through this process with the co-op board, etc. Renting from an individual unit owner has more hazards for the tenant, and if a co-op in particular, if there are co-op limitations on the rental, that makes things more difficult.

But, take all what I said above as "theoretical" and instead let us be practical. I don't know your personal circumstances, but take the assumption that you are willing and your co-op board is ok allowing a two year lease, but no more. Your asking rent for 24 months is $108,000. If you mis-priced, and it should actually be $4000 per month (this isn't guidance from me, I'm just picking a lower number) that is $96,000. But if it takes you two months extra to find someone because you overpriced and you have to realize it and lower the price, you lose two months rent ($8000) that you can never recover off of the LOWER $96,000 base. The longer it sits on the market unrented, the more you lose out.

Best strategy, find actual apartment building rentals by a management company in your area and price accordingly, but with a discount because of the co-op hassle, AND because actually for you, in this nice apartment and with your own family's time as a manager of the apartment, it should be more important that you find a nice high quality tenant who pays on time and doesn't destroy things, etc. etc. than it is to get the last $$ of rent. And consider throwing in some incentives which is where the market is today and will also help offset the co-op extra time requirements - e.g. 2 months free on a 26 month lease. Also it is worth saying what the co-op fees are and being clear how long a subletter can stay for in the building per the co-op's rules.

Lastly, you have a bit of extra language that turns off people on this site, like "this apartment is in move-in condition," well of course it is in move in condition its like saying that the fast food from McDonalds is ready to eat. And the "truly has it all" sounds nice but is meaningless.

Good luck.

shaniweiss: We fixed your listing so that your photos show up properly now. If you click on each photo, you will get the large size version, so the direct link to the floorplan is here:

http://RentHop.com/photo.php?on=n&l_id=800136&b_id=600372&n=4&t=8
(You might need to refresh the browser to see the new photos, I had to on Firefox).

I also made your listing one of our featured listings for a week, as shown below. You get this one on the house.

http://RentHop.com/?id=800136

If you have other questions about your listing you can shoot a message to our feedback@ email.

Renthop, it looks much better.

Graiger, it sounds as though the language was borrowed from the sales listing (based on the description and photos, this appears to be the same apartment).
http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/412567-coop-311-east-71st-street-lenox-hill-new-york
I would maybe rewrite the description to reflect that you are now looking to rent it, and as Graiger notes, rental apartments sort of have to be move-in ready by definition. Recycling the sales ad copy won't be an effective marketing strategy for the rental market because renters and buyers are looking for similar but slightly different qualities.

Thank you so much for all of the responses above. With that said, I would be glad to pay for and post a "real" listing on street easy however there is no mention on the sight on how to do so. I sent an email under the contact us link on the street easy site asking how to do so and have gotten no response. So it is not my unwillingness to pay for a listing that would help someone conclude I am a bad landlord.

I have no problem lowering the cost of the rental (all of our postings do mention that the pricing is negotiable) but I do happen to know 3 recent families one, a May 1 move in and two July 1 move in dates who just rented similar units for more. Two of them actually a bit smaller for $4800/mo, $5200/mo and another for $4950/mo and 2 of those 2 bedrooms are on York avenue in the 80's-One was actually a Junior Four.

The language on our ad was taken from what our previous broker had written when we had the apartment on the market for Sale. I will change the language of the postings to be more appropriate. If anyone has any suggestions on language that would be more useful, I am up for any suggestions.

Clearly I am not a real estate professional, we are just a family that is being forced to move to London for my husband's job. We have done our homework, however. There are very few true two bedroom two bathrooms in Lenox Hill that are renting (even through management companies and Brokers) for less than $4500 including apartments in our own building, in fact we are currently the only owners who have our apartment on the market for rent. Yes taking into consideration the Co-Op Process is a factor and again that's why our postings say negotiable but comparing our apartment to one in the Ansonia (which is on the west side) is not really here nor there.

The bottom line is we are not trying to "pull one over" on a perspective tentant. The apartment is my home, it happens to be in great shape, comparative to many apartments that I have seen on the market recently as another perspective renter. We are very flexible and are not trying to make money in this environment, just trying to rent out our apartment to a good credit worthy furture tenant. I am so glad I posted this here though because the insight and feedback is priceless and definitely helpful-so keep it coming.

Again Many thanks!

Yea, you have to click on "rentals" at the top to even see anything about rentals on this sales driven website (even though a much smaller % of people own vs rent)

Kind of retarded and a bad business decision for this website

Best of luck!

I also agree that $4500 probably wont give you the traction you want, especially if you need to move to London soon. I suspect $4000 is likely the current "sweet spot" for this listing. However as mentioned, the co-op process will deter a LOT of people. Unless your board has a fairly simple approval process, you should consider that it might be a turn off for many people who otherise like your apartment.

I had a personal experience about 8 months ago where I was looking to rent a condo here on the UES. When the broker sent me a (literally) 30 page document, asking for absurd things such as the make/model of my car and the value of my life insurance policy, I laughed out loud. Those are things I wont be providing during a purchase, let alone a rental. As I said though, if you board is simply looking for credit worthiness (totally reasonable) then you should shout that from the hilltops. Many people see "approval process" and they think of things similar to what I was presented with at the other rental. NOBODY will be willing to go through a 3 month protology exam just to rent your place, so be aware of that.

You can get two one bedrooms for this price.

This is way overpriced.

Sorry, 2 one bedrooms on UES for $4k.

So you can get two one bedrooms and a mediocre hooker each month for this price.

Just out of curisoity how would getting two Onebedroom apartments help a tenant looking for a 2 Bedroom apartment? Would they be living seperately from their family or guests? Only relative feedback please-if you wish to have a non relevant conversation go elsewhere. Thank You.

shaniweiss, nyc10022 is just a unemployed, over-educated Bitter Betty Blogger. There are a lot of that type online, you see it above, MAV, Stevejhx

"Just out of curisoity how would getting two Onebedroom apartments help a tenant looking for a 2 Bedroom apartment?"

Seems fairly simple to me... they help point out that the 2 bedroom in question is mis-priced.

it's a a bit overpriced for the location. UWS usually commands higher rents and you can get a pre-war classic 6 renovated in a 24hr doorman building off the park and 1/2 block from subway for $4200. Also i think columbus square is renting 2 beds for $3995. I'd lower it to 4K and maybe offer some concession if it doesn't get any interest at that price (ie one month free rent).

another consideration is that there are a lot of rental units on the market now and more coming as coops/condo new devs go rental.

good luck

I only see a 900sqft 2 bed in the Ansonia for $4200.... People need to distinguish a little between 1200 and 900 sqft 2 beds. All this said, over near First Ave, this should be $4,000...$3,900 if you want to catch more eyes.

"classic 6 renovated in a 24hr doorman building off the park and 1/2 block from subway for $4200."

Serious? Please post an example? I think the weakness of the rental market has given to some hyperbole.

Hi.
I went to one of your open houses.
The apartment is very specious and very well done.
Nothing needs to be fixed or upgraded.
I hope you will find a great tenant.

very helpful...when can we expect your check?

Thank you-that is very sweet-a kind word goes a million miles-especially when you are in the middle of the stressful task of renting your home!

yes...often...

how about yourself?

OP wanted feedback on trying to rent his/her apartment. does she/he want nice talk or feedback?

if it were me, i would want feedback.

each month that goes by, OP is losing $4K?

Shani, no time tonight, but I will try posting a couple of suggestions tomorrow. You are free to take them or leave them as you wish, with no offense. Best of luck finding a renter for your apartment before your move. I had an offer overseas a few weeks ago a few weeks ago, and just the thought of breaking a new lease was panic-inducing.

columbiacounty
7 minutes ago
ignore this person
report abuse how nice...can you deposit it?

That was your feedback? I don't see anything else from you other than "very helpful...when can we expect your check?".

So normally to answer your question I'd say I'd take the advice. But hard to view advice when the person is barking like an asshole at you, no? And none of the advice actually came from you. Maybe apologize to this person instead of being a smart ass like a bunch of the others here.

are you kidding?

my feedback echoes others above....price is way too high.

and if you think i'm barking like an asshole...wow, i guess you've never dealt with a real barking asshole.

Thank you! Anything real estate related is panic inducing!! I appreciate any feedback anyone has to offer!

What is it about being online that people need to be nasty

Can't people just tell shani this might be overpriced and if she wants to move it, quickly, that a lower price might help, and because of the complexities and if she wants to rent it before she moves, make it go faster with a lower price and save some headaches?

IS IT THAT SHE'S JEWISH that people are jerks? to point out a few, marco, 10022, columbia?

shani, are you coming back to this apartment after one or two or more years? Is your husbands company paying for relocation, housing and otherwise?

Your ad on renthop lists some of its own comps, and interesting after everyone gives their POV, the comps show you are actually well priced! 1250 is a lot of square feet in a 2 bedroom too.

stemboat
about 4 hours ago
ignore this person
What is it about being online that people need to be nasty. IS IT THAT SHE'S JEWISH that people are jerks? to point out a few, marco, 10022, columbia?

Stemboat, Why are you so defensive about being Jewish? You should be proud.

Maybe shaniweiss is figuring that people are going to "offer" something lower if it's close enough. If I were looking I might offer something lower and we would probably meet somewhere in the middle. However if she starts at 4K then some may be tempted to negotiate her down, but there would probably be more interest overall.

I agree with Montyort. If you do a search for 2 BR/2BA with similar sq ft in her area, your pickings for anything in the low $4k are slim!

i just did the search for 2 beds and got 100+ on upper east side between 3 and 4 K. here is one of the first at 4K

http://www.fkgrealestate.com/listing_details.aspx?lid=47619

"shaniweiss, nyc10022 is just a unemployed, over-educated Bitter Betty Blogger. There are a lot of that type online, you see it above, MAV, Stevejhx"

OK, ill bite. What did I say that you did not like?

and thanks for the compliment, but I am employed and certainly not over educated.

Here's my ad copy-writing attempt:

"Huge 2 Bedroom 2 Bathroom Upper East Side Apartment available September 1st. Featuring the perfect layout, this spacious 2-bedroom truly has it all: an extra large living area with sunny, southern exposure, and treetop views from both pin-drop quiet bedrooms. Recently renovated and in top condition, you will feel immediately at home in this friendly coop. NO FEE! Easy board approval required; no pets. Laundry and Garage in building."

Given that there's a board approval process, I concur with other posters' suggestions of dropping it a bit. If you're sure you want to try for $4,500, maybe hold an open house and see what kind of response you get; if someone seems like a good tenant and is interested, maybe try baiting the hook with an offer to knock down the price a bit. There are actual brokers on this site who can better advise you on the language regarding families. I took it out because I thought it might violate fair housing act, but I'm not a broker and not trained in this, so please take my edits with a heaping tablespoon of salt.

And, fellow posters, savage away at my marketing attempt!

here's yet another comp at $3,995 which seems like the high end for an apartment this size and location.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/rental/541089-condo-220-east-65th-street-lenox-hill-new-york

from their copy: "ncluded are the hotel-like amenities that add to the Concorde desirability. Free Pool, Health Club, Children's Playroom, Roof Garden. Lobby level Laundry, Storage and Garage are available as well."

cc - I think the second is a good comp. I only checked in Lenox Hill, 2 BR/2 BA. Which this has. The f/p looks good. And since it's in a condo, which usually has more relaxed rules about sublet vs. coop, this would look more desirable. This listing only has one interior picture so can't compare quality of finishes. It looks like a really good deal though.

The first listing is on EEA, which given the distance to subway, would deter a lot of people.

personally, i agree with you about the walk from EEA but personally I wouldn't live anywhere on the UES. Given that this is a rental and these people were ( I thought ) looking for some advice on how to get some action on their property, I thought the fact that a 30 second search brought up 100+ apartments in the general vicinity for a minimum of 10% less would be relevant to their thought process about the pricing of their unit.

This seems like an unusually long conversation about the idea that this listing may be $500 above what is optimal...unusually long even for this site. If someone won't pay $4,500 they'll offer $4,000. I only think people on Streeteasy are a little overzealous about all the $3,500 2 beds out there on the market. $3,500 two beds in nice neighborhoods are small (sub 1000 sqft) and/or suck.

columbiacounty,

Trust me, 110 EEA is NOT a comp. If you do a quick search here on SE you will see that all of the apartments in that building have been listed for MONTHS. I got so curious one day that I went over to check it out. The building is a total dump, and the apartments wont move anywhere near the prices they are asking. The hallways are dark and dingy, and the buttons in the elevator are falling off. That $4k apartment you listed (from 110 EEA) wont even move for $3k, its really that bad.

May I ask a silly question? Why do apartment owners ever list their own rentals? Wouldn't it be easier to have citi habitats do it so you don't have to deal with showings, collecting deposits, background checks and then you can have the tenant pay the fee.

wad = broker

anon = complete moron, born in 2002.

>>$3,500 two beds in nice neighborhoods are small (sub 1000 sqft) and/or suck.<<

Not true at all. We're paying $3500 for a 1,000-plus sq ft sunny, high-floor 2/2 in a prewar doorman building on WEA in the low 90s. Great nabe, great view, great building.

They're out there, you just have to know where to look.

Great deal squid! What is your secret? Have you been in this building a long time?

Squid - was that found today, or is it a holdover from a softer market? Either way, its sounds good. WEA has always been a place to find a deal, relative to its objective niceness, in my view.

wad - Your question is silly. Economics 101, the cost of broker will be borne by both parties, regardless of who writes the check...depends on their relative bargaining strength. So in a market like this, it will be borne by the seller. In 1999-2000 your question would be less silly.

Rhino and kands--

We moved in in Dec of 2005--so no, the rental was not found 'today' but we also aren't long-termers. We were pleasantly surprised at the rental prices in this building (which include electric) and they seem to continue to remain very reasonable, especially in this market. And yes, Rhino, I agree re: WEA.

Nice deal. Are you comfortable sharing the building info? Do they do their own leasing?

Rhino--

The mgmt office is in-house, though they use a broker to handle the rentals. They don't seem to advertise anywhere, so I honestly don't know how they find tenants (I just happened to stop in during my search asking if there was any availability).

I don't mind sharing info with you--you can email me at streeteasymail@gmail.com

NYC2005 wrote - it's a a bit overpriced for the location. UWS usually commands higher rents and you can get a pre-war classic 6 renovated in a 24hr doorman building off the park and 1/2 block from subway for $4200.

Can you show me one?

Yeah I agree that classic sixes for $4200 off the park (unless its 110th) is an exaggeration.

In the 70s or 80s I'd be surprised to see a classic six in great condition for less than $6000, no less $4200.

I agree that a $4200 reno'd 6 in a prime UWS doorman building is pushing it, but it is absolutely possible to find a 2/2 for that price.

Remember, classic 6s have formal DRs and maid's rooms (both of which are often touted as extra BRs in the rental market). A standard 2/2 is a whole different animal.

Nice price reduction (now listed at $4100). Any luck with prospective renters??