Rental Rant !!! Talk me off the ledge please...

No. Many (I would argue most, but others have differing opinions) listings on craigslist are either scams or a waste of time or both. Go to the management companies directly, or try searching nybits.com. There absolutely is no fee rent - just usually not with a broker. Again, go to the management companies directly. If you're bound and determined to pay a fee, consider using one of the brokers who post regularly here. Good luck with your search. It's a maddening process.

the irony is that paying the fee will not necessarily result in getting a better place. the system works to drive you crazy so that you throw up your hands and say the hell with it. if having a nice place to live matters to you, you have to make the personal investment in time and physic energy--nothing else will work. just get ready for everyone involved to tell you endlessly that you are too picky, too unreasonable, too demanding, etc.

AHHHHH....I took a few steps back from the ledge...thank you, how comforting...
sigh...
evnyc...makes me think of envy and NYC...and I do...envy, how in the world do people find places? IMHO, Craiglist has been...MADDENING is a good word.
and columbiacounty...also great advice...I have to make the personal investment in time and energy, cuz yes, it does matter...
the rain today did not help..
thanks New Yorkers...

reprinted -

AVOID BROKERS AND THEIR FEES - GO DIRECTLY TO THE SOURCE OF YOUR RENTAL NEEDS. BROKERS TEND TO TAKE YOU TO SEE THESE NO-FEE APARTMENTS FIRST AS THEY EARN 100% OF YOUR 15% BROKER'S FEE. HUSH...HUSH... THEY WILL NOT TELL YOU IT'S A NO-FEE RENTAL PROPERTY :( NOR WILL THEY REPRESENT THAT PRIOR TO SEEING THE APARTMENT. SO IF YOU NEED TO RENT, CHECK OUT THE RENTAL PROPERTY MANAGEMENT WEBSITES AND CALL THEM FOR UPDATED LISTINGS. SAVE YOURSELF THAT 15% TO BUY YOURSELF NEW FURNITURE OR HAVE A MOVE-IN WELCOME PARTY FOR FRIENDS AND FAMILY. PLUS FREE RENT IS NOW COMMON -- 1 - 2 months!!!

Excellent “BIG-TIME” Manhattan Rental Property Management:

Rose (www rosenyc com)
Related Rentals (www relatedrentals com)
Equity Residental (www eqr com)
Rockrose Management (www rockrosenyc com) [mostly chelsea, village, financial district, downtown condos]
Sky Management (www skymanagement com)
Glenwood Managment (www glenwoodnyc com)
BLDG Management Co. 115 E 92nd St New York, NY 10128 (212) 722-4931
Brodsky Management, Inc (www brodskyorg com)
Maclowe Management (www macklowe com) [condos below 60th street]
Urban Associates – 400 W 59th St # 3, New York, NY (212) 245-1870

ny bits

also -- go to buildings in the hood of your choice and call the posted numbers -- I would NEVER pay a broker fee in this market .. and if they tell you its no fee -- it just means that you gave the free months rent to the broker -- still net money out of your pocket!!!!

Thanks, Manhattanfox - I found my apartment using your list. It's fantastic information and bears repeating.

NoDiggity, craigslist will truly drive you around the bend.

Thank You so much Manhattanfox...I am on it!
yep, I've been driven around the bend alright, and much too close to that cliff...
Craig is OFF OF MY list!

@manhattanfox is right, the agencies are good. Also, a company I freelance for, Post Grad Apartments was founded just for this. They've formed relationships with reputable brokers all over the city and help you find one that fits what you're looking for. Their focus is really just on making things easy, so they don't charge an extra fee. Check us out on Twitter, let us know if you have any questions.

http://postgradapartments.com

http://twitter.com/postgradapts

i would be careful of this poster...note from their website.

Our goal is to make PostGradApartments.com the perfect resource for anyone seeking to rent or buy an apartment in New York City. However, from a practical perspective, we have found that there are some types of renters who prefer not to use our services. These include:

1. Renters who refuse to work with an agent and prefer to do all of the work on their own. Keep in mind this is not an easy process. Nonetheless, there is a segment of renters who prefer to take the time to schedule all appointments and deal with all agents directly. Simply put, if you do not want any help in renting an apartment, then we cannot help you, no matter how much we may want to.

2. Renters who have unrealistic expectations of the market. We can only help you rent or buy what is currently on the market. The market sets the prices and we have no control over this. Our map should help you get an idea of what the price range in each area is, generally.

3. Why Can’t I Just Call An Agent?
Go ahead! If you have already found the person you trust to find you your dream apartment then follow through. If things don’t work out, call us.

4. “I heard I can get an apartment for NO FEE, why would I want to PAY you”?
If an apartment is no fee for you, it’s no fee for us also. Why bother doing the work on your own, let us do it for you.

this is the exact bunch of crap that you will hear from agents. steer clear.

dont forget algin mgmt--they deal direct and are generally reasonable, esp now where they have many units avail--they give 2 free months often in here--i negotiated poorly and only got one free month

On a related note, I still look at CL a fair bit and yes I find 80% rubbish combined with some decent posts. Here is my predicament,
I already found the apt I want - it is a rental of a co-op in the west village. And As far as I can tell it is only represented through a Broker. The 15% commission is paid by the renter, I am just waiting to see if the owner will come to their senses and agree to pay some or all of the fee (It's been on the market almost 2 months) So far No Go. And there is no way I can contact the owner of the co-op independently etc as far as I can tell. So it's either give in and pay, give up and move on, or just plain wait. I do find in certain parts of town such as the Village and areas with many co-op rentals, one must often deal with a Broker unfortunately.

There's some good advice here about various strategies to find no-fee apartments:

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/14412-advice-sought-for-ues-rental-in-3000-range

hey bd--id try to reach the owner--good chance the broker has not conveyed that youd rent were the owner to pay the fee--broker doesnt want owner to know that the reason the apt has gone unrented is the fee

where (which areas) are you looking to find your pied a terre?

FWIW - we recently found a great place - on Craigslist - directly from the owner. It can happen.

I looked at CL multiple times per day, only in the nabes we were interested in. I then shot at/pounced on/called on everything that flew by that met our minimum requirements.

Thing was - in the aggregate, we could target more expensive no-fee place because we wouldn't be paying a fee. 12% of the annual rent is the brownstone Brooklyn standard, and with rents in Brooklyn Heights, Cobble Hill, etc., being what they are, a broker's fee can easily add $100-$300 per month for the next two years of your rent.

We weren't doing a no-fee ONLY search, but previous posters are right - just because a broker is involved, doesn't mean it's a higher-quality place. We would have paid a fee for the right place, but I'm glad we didn't have to.

And yes, searching is maddening. No argument there. Good luck!

For a broker, try Joshua Hebert [jhebert@bondnewyork.com] 212 206 1720
He picked apartments in the area and size I specified, was up front about fees (or no fees) and apartments with one month free.

what a great group of people...so smart!...so helpful!
The more I learn, the less I know, and if I HAD TO have a place, as in, I had no place to live, I'd be in big trouble...I can't decide if NYC real estate is amazing, awful, horrible, or exciting, or hell.
So, where to buy a pied a terre?...So this is how it went down. We have stayed in hotels for the weekend several times a month in varying neighborhoods since January, and hit the pavement and restos and bars and shops of the UWS, UES, TriBeCa, SoHo, LES, NoLita, the West Village...(lots os fun)
I had an ideal image of a bridge view but soon realized I do not have enough money, an "on top of the world" feel...uh, not enough money, a loft feel (LUV'd the 111 fourth ave building)...uh, not enough money...we fell in love with the UWS, we settled on 2 places we loved, both brownstones, both fireplaces, exposed brick, beautiful and about 500k...and watched the prices fall, and fall.and soon realized we didn't know enough yet to buy...
SOOO, let's rent! and not worry! and learn more! and we found ourselves "playing" downtown...alot.
Why not have a place where we play?
So, we have been looking in NoLits, LES, SoHo, triBeca, and West Village...
and guess what? not enough money...LOL.
I might give up and buy a mansion in, oh idk...any ideas? LOL

what's your budget, size requirements?

Thank you Value Shopper...

OK, no laughing allowed (or rather, "aloud"...LOL)
I honestly thought I could get a decent 1 bedroom for 2k...ok, I'll do the laughing for everyone
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA! and yes, that is Count Dracula's laugh, cuz I visited his cave yesterday in Nolita, but he was gone, cuz even HE was scared to live there...seriously, I could have cried!

I like charming, I like pre-war, I don't need a doorman, a gym, or all that jazz...LOL (like I could afford it anyway, LMAO)
BUT IT HAS TO BE NICE, LIKE I CAN HAVE PEOPLE OVER FOR DRINKS...I'm thinking I should be back on the UWS...
I have heard to "LOVE THE APARTMENT OR LOVE THE NEIGHBORHOOD"
I went for Love the neighborhhod.
and have changed my mind...
I want to love the apartment, maybe I need to spend more..OBVIOUSLY
but how much more is the question...
maybe brokers are the least of my problem...
maybe Im broke-er
least I have gained a sense of humor about this nonsense...LOL

go nybits.com and stop with the jabbert--if youve exhausted what you find there, only then try a broker--and push for concessions "why only one free month? my friend told me your company had offered 2 on an apt she looked at" etc

rental brokers are an impediment to finding an apt

you use a broker your next thread will be named

rectal rant!@!!

Have you tried looking at studios? You could get a really nice one for under 500k (or rent under 2k), especially on the UES. Since it's for a pied a terre (i.e., you're not going to be living there full time), that might be sufficient. Some of the alcove studios are pretty big, and can be set up so the sleeping area is separated from the living room area.

Nodiggity you are rich in humor.

The UES would work well because, yes...we will not be there full time, juz weekends. And we come in from the island...(remember...I said no laughging allowed) But I am getting really tired of people telling me what they think of the UES, it is def. my next stay...to dream of a view of the 59th st bridge...
And actually, the west 87th place that we adored was what I think is considered an "alcove studio", in that the bedroom did not have a door, omg, you can't make this stuff up...but I liked it.
Alright, sigh, guess I will start looking at studios...
besides, newbie says I'm rich in humor ;)

oh, and ubottom...nybits is great and I am going to go by some of the places...good advice, good good stuff...
oh but i jabber on...;)

nodiggity, related already has the alcove studios at one carnegie park below $2500, and that's a new building (awkwardly located, though). as this is a second home, take your time. the slow period for landlords is about to hit, and they have lots of extra inventory to work off. prices should keep going down.

and yes, you do seem to have a certain joie de vivre.

good nodigs (in ny so far)

and stay away from rental brokers lest we rename this thread so inappropriately

Have you looked at East Midtown? Not cutesy, but lots of restaurants, easy access to other places, theater, etc. Would think as a pied-a-terre actually might work better for you than way uptown (East or West)

Brownstones,

What is the best way to find Brownstones for rent? I am not a big fan of the high-rise buildings and that seems to be what is advertised everywhere. Any advice would be great.

Should rename this thread to "why renting sucks"

jm, why finding a decent apartment right now at $2000 per month sucks.

you're getting testy. comps in your building not doing so well?

NoDiggity - I remember you. Stop running around the room touching everything. Slow down and take deep breaths.

My 2 cents - You have to approach the rental market with very low expectations, hoping to find a good deal or diamond in the rough, b/c quite honestly, so much is crap. In dealing with brokers, assume they are all idiots. Serioulsy, b/c many are! Then, if you're lucky, when you do come across a competent, intelligent, socially appropriate one, you will be pleasantly surprised. But, don't assume a great broker will get you a great space. We got a great space for a pretty good price via a horrible broker. If you've done your research, assume you know more than they do (or that you're just willing to be more honest about the market). This saved me a lot of bullshit conversations when i was looking.

Also, in my opinion, limiting your options is NOT a good thing (unless you have the money to hire someone very reputable to weed things out for you). I wouldn't limit my search to only no fee apartments. Just b/c a listing is not "no fee" doesn't necessarily mean you'll end up paying that fee. Broker fees are negotiable. You should keep your options open and negotiate your ass off once you find a place, or two, or three that you like. Be well-informed. Look for weaknesses with the listing, the broker, or the owner that you can use in your favor. Keep things in your backpocket. We ended up with a July lease for a place that we initially saw in January. Didn't love it when we saw it in Jan, but after we looked for 5 more months, compared apartments and prices, it really ended up being the best option for us (and I do think it's a great space!).

Also agree that you can find a decent listing or two on Craigslist. Just have to search thru the pile.

Sounds to me like you either don't have the time, or don't want to invest the time in some serious searching/researching. I apologize if I'm wrong. Time really is on your side.

Good Luck!

More Viagra juiceman more Viagra.

I'm a good broker. Sorry if that comes as such a shock. I can be reached at me@rutenbergrealtyny.com. I grew up here in manhattan and know the market inside and out. I don't care!!!!!! If you want a "no fee" apt, great, let's find you one.

aboutready, if you can't understand why renting sucks by reading this thread than I over estimated your intelligence. I read it quickly and the first thing that came to my mind was that I am really glad I don't rent. I’m glad it works for you, it doesn’t for me.

"you're getting testy. comps in your building not doing so well?"

testy? Just calling them as I see them. Sorry that doesn't fit with your $2000 rental.

Oh cool... uwsmom remembers me, I'm famous...
makes me want to do the Count laugh again
Bwa Bwa Bwahahahaha...!!!
You have officially talked me off the ledge...
Well at least from running around the room touching everything,
and yes, it's about time I work like wonderwoman without the super powers

ok I can't thank all of you enough
I can add the "no doubt" back to my "no digs"...
Ph- yes, midtown east is a possibility, I actually like it there.(does that stand for penthouse?)
I am almost "aboutready" ;)
and west 67th is a great block...

jm, if you can't understand why renting AND buying sucks by reading this thread...

unless one is very well off, they both aren't particularly attractive in manhattan. one is just more binding.

if one is well off, right now the rental options are very, very good.

I know of a broker that actually, believe it or not, gave a % of their commission to the renter/buyer. At first, I thought that he was 'an idiot broker' but it turns that he was doing exactly what I would have done. "Do what you gotta do to get them to sign." Some may think it is illegal, but in the end, it wasn't after all the deductions went through the appropriate channels. (Update about 1 minute ago: client and broker are doing very well right now)

I am a real estate broker. I love this work, however I would love it better if the lazy and unethical brokers would stay out of my way. The rental market is soft and you can find good deals all over Manhattan without paying broker fee. You do have to have a realistic budget though. There is no $1500/month one bedroom in a doorman building with gym and rooftop deck below 96th Street. Go to the broker firm's website and search. We are not allowed to advertise no fee or owner incentives on our website, but in fact, many of those listings have no broker fee and you might even get a month free rent. Call a couple of agent to see how they react to your questions. Ask about the market! If the agent doesn't want to bother to answer or doesn't take you seriously don't even think working with him/her. Many real estate agents too caught up churning out deal after deal and they forget to maintain good customer service, even though that is the base of our business. Calling about ad after ad on Craigslist doesn't make sense. Think about those ads as baits for you to call. You are better off choosing someone knowledgeable. Of course finding that one broker is difficult. Good luck.

tre1976: What are you looking for?

As a owner/property manager who rents my own apartments for no fee (4-5 story walkups in Manhattan), mainly on Craigslist, I will tell you that I and others like me are out there. There is indeed such thing as a no fee apartment, I rent a few every month to very happy tenants.

What is frustrating for me, is I have been renting on CL since 2002, back when most ads were honest apartments and there was trust. Now I spend half of my time convincing people that it is indeed no fee, I am indeed the owner, and I still get questions at the end of a showing like "will the owner fix this for me if it breaks", ah hello, NO FEE / BY OWNER means I am the owner...

....and as for that list of "Excellent “BIG-TIME” Manhattan Rental Property Management:", that might be a way to get a no fee apartment, but some of those landlords (especially Related) are about as evil corporate giants as you can get.

I'm a rental agent and I understand the rental agent hate, I really do. Most of the people in this profession have no scruples, and just want to make that fast buck. There are some of us, however, that are honest and will be completely upfront with you.
I agree with citysong - Finding a $1500 1BR with a doorman, and a gym, and a rooftop desk is probably not going to happen. But if you're a little more realistic with what your looking for, and specific, you can make it happen.
A good agent wants your referral, not that percentage of the fee (they do not get 100%, part of it goes to the listing agent, part to their senior broker, part to the brokerage firm). The problem is, with the soft market, agents are forgetting that. Find a good agent, and stick with them. Let them guide you and find you the right place, and make sure they're an expert on the area that you want to be in. Good luck with your search!

And IInycII, giving part of your commission to the renter/buyer is illegal, it's called a kickback fee. If caught by the DOS, that broker would have their license revoked.

I would stay away from brokers. You will be paying for very little added value, if any. 12-15% of annual rent is RIDICULOUS. Landlords, renters, whoever pays it, is paying too much. I know you're talking about renting here, but when people talk about the mortgage/housing problems, everyone had a piece of the blame, including brokers who took 6% out of EVERY transaction! Imagine the total aggregate dollar value of inflated real estate transactions just over the last 5 years, multiply by 6%, and you realize why brokers had as much incentive as appraisers, mortgage lenders, and others to keep the bubble inflated regardless of who it really hurt...