Is Fort Greene in the ghetto?

The entire NYC a neo-ghetto.

Yes. So is WEA in the '70s (body dumped last summer) and any other murder location.

Isn't ghetto a racist term?

maly are you from Ohio?

Yes. Its a cool area but its ghetto.

Yes, it's about as ghetto as ghetto gets.

This again? samadams, what's your angle for starting a whole new thread on the same thing? This is a joke.

"Isn't ghetto a racist term?"

No

let's not use the word ghetto...it's so unPC and,...........70s

High crime, educationally and, opportunity disadvantaged via a combination of social prejudices and personal performance factors. This creates a environment non conducive for relaxed outdoor family activities and personal safety .
Other than that it's a beautiful place.

Actually since the word "ghetto" originally applied to the concentration of one ethinic group and the exclusion of others (the Jewish ghettos of Rome and Venice) and Fort Greene has become more, not less, diverse lately...I would say it doesn't even qualify technically...aside from Falco's good poing about the 70s....

So maybe we should use the word "slum"?

i think this area is disgusting! what a shit hole

Do we simply turn our heads and look the other way?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Ox1Tore9nw

samadams, that's a peculiar observation for someone who hasn't been alive since the early 19th century. I think your perspective might be a bit off.

http://www.amsterdamnews.com/articles/2009/10/18/news/doc4ad64c490a38e583066259.txt

this is hilarious. ft. greene is one of the most interesting, attractive, convenient, and diverse areas in the city. i live in the west village, and ft. greene reminds me of the village before the sex and the city tours and marc jacobs stores took over.

anyone who thinks ft. greene is in any way, shape, or form a bad neighborhood just doesn't know what he's talking about.

And his mumma cries

It's true, we've had this discussion a lot!

Ft. Greene was recently a ghetto, that much most folks would agree on. It started to become more diversified several years ago, and that has changed some stretches here and there. The streets with better housing stock and subway access are generally considered to be more gentrified and safer than those without such features.

One that thing always amazes me is this absurd idea that newbies can magically "discover" a neighborhood that somehow all the previous generations missed. As if good housing deals in good areas are something that nobody ever thought to value before!

Puleeze. The reason that people "overlooked" Ft. Greene in the 70s 80s and 90s was that it was a ghetto then and people were afraid to live there. Same with Boerum Hill, Clinton Hill, Bed-Stuy, etc. It's not that these radically brilliant young professionals in the 2000's suddenly happened across these areas that nobody had ever noticed before.

It's that the areas were unliveable in earlier times, and after many many years of pioneering home buyers and people slogging it out trying to turn downtrodden nabes into safe ones, these areas finally got a little bit better.

If you're interested in Ft. Greene you're going to have to study it block by block. There are some areas that are probably ok but you can't generalize about the area yet. Spend time there.

Friends of my parents (interracial couple active in the African American community) purchased a townhouse in Fort Greene in the late 60s...it was an amazing house that had once been extremely luxurious but fell on hard times. The neighborhood was way sketchy and I remember really not liking the long walk to their house from the subway (it was unspoken but someone always gave us a ride back to the subway after dark) but my father was so intent on proving what a great liberal he was (and they were old and close friends) so we continued to visit. Later after I stopped having to accompany Mom & Dad on social calls, I heard it got worse and my parents would take a cab the few times they went there. (Bet the cab driver loved it...). But in the early 90s I started to hear positive things about Fort Greene, initially from young African American professionals and then from a more diverse population. Alas, my parents' friend isn't here to reap the benefit of the change in the neighborhood.

FG - beautiful and varied housing stock (you should see some of the free standing mansions as well as the wood frame houses). Safety - I have only gone there in the daytime. I felt perfectly safe (a little edgy in the Classon subway station). Don't know about nights.

Is the East Village a ghetto?
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2009/08/23/2009-08-23_deadly_shooting_at_east_village_bar_bouncer_killed_2_wounded_outside_forbidden_c.html

Taz was such a sweet teddy bear of a guy. They caught the shooter, and he was out on bail for another murder. That makes my blood boils.

http://fort-greene.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/10/27/the-week-in-crime-beatings-and-muggings/

Hey look, I can link to a police blotter too:
http://www.thevillager.com/villager_338/policeblotter.html

Is the West Village a ghetto?

I attended Brooklyn Tech in the early 70's - I don't like the term "ghetto" for many reasons, but needless to say, it was not a great neighborhood. Plenty of abandoned brownstones, garbage everywhere, and Ft Greene Park was only "safe" during daylight hours and if you traveled in large groups. I have returned several times over the years, and Fort Greene has become a wonderful, diverse, and charming neighborhood. I am sure there is still crime, filth, and fear, but it is not pervasive.

since the days of the notorious BIG swinging crack rock on the corners it does seem to improved a bit. But the question is would this still be classified as the ghetto? I am leaning towards yes but let us discuss this.

Discuss it? You're pretty clearly in the minority here and seemingly have an obsession with labeling Fort Greene as something it's not. It's weird.

bjw you seem to be the one with the obsession. Are you an owner at the Forte? Why are all those building failing? Has the market voted Fort Greene Ghetto?

samadams, you're the guy who started this thread even though this thing was beat to death in another, mostly by you (http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/14576-to-those-who-live-in-fort-greene). I don't even live in Fort Greene, but I do enjoy spending time there. Either you're trolling or you genuinely consider the neighborhood to be a "ghetto." If it's the latter, you might still be a bed-wetter considering what makes you feel afraid and unsafe.

Some of those things on that blog are not even neighborhood crime. Domestic Violence, violating order of protections, and at least 2 people being stupid enough to leave their wallet or blackberry in a business do not make Fort Greene a ghetto

every inch of brownstone-ish brooklyn will continue to get rapidly gentrified except the areas immediately surrounding actual projects. look at bushwick! i think this is happening too abruptly and without grace, the demographic is not shifting, it is careening, creating a lot of friction in these areas. my boss's parents live in bedstuy and he keeps telling me he can't believe he is seeing white people where there were non before, in areas considered dangerous until very recently, "with bicycles and dogs and sh*t, they're not scared, just oblivious, riding down the street, i can't believe it."

yeah glamma i think that is going to be a big problem. People think they are still on the UES and they are oblivious

i mean that is a perspective from someone already established there. on the other hand you can't blame people for buying in a fringe area that is pretty much a sure thing as far as ROI goes in a few years or however long. i just think there is a way to integrate into an existing and established neighborhood that respects and acknowldges the existing demographic, and another way that pisses and pillages all over it. unfortunately the latter seems to be the trend. examples of the former would be in bushwick they started a food co-op, and advertised the low cost and healthy farm foods to the whole neighborhood and even posted flyers for it in the projects so it could benefit the whole community, they also have community-based art nights and stuff like that to really try to bring some unity to the whole neighborhood, not just marginalize, segregate, white-wash, "clean up." this leads to a greater argument about NYC losing its soul and how to prevent that from happening without returning to 70's era NYC (which actually, many say was quite a golden era in some ways) soooo......

glamma, that's a far more interesting discussion, though clearly not the intent of the OP here. It's good to hear some residents in Bushwick are handling this with grace and respect. That's obviously not true everywhere. South Williamsburg, for example, has had a very tough time gentrifying due to the antagonism between Hasids and artists moving into the area. It's tough to argue over who's right and wrong when it comes to something intangible and with so many varying definitions as "soul," but that doesn't stop people from trying. It's a long, painful, but always interesting process.

Glamma: I knew BedStuy was ovah when I saw a young English couple profiled with their "Victorian" Bed-Stuy 4 years ago in a UK lifestyle mag. Perceptions have changed.

yes... with real estate at the heart of the matter! love the title of this thread.. classic

Its not a ghetto, there are plenty of whities around now.

I was going there in the late 80s, it was pretty shady off the main drags (and on as well) but its a million times better now. Still needs some work, but some of the prettiest blocks in all of the city, and more and more options for the yuppies.

> Yes, it's about as ghetto as ghetto gets.

I guess NYCMatt has never been to an actual ghetto then.

I used to tour the grand hoods of Brownsville, Bushwick, Crown Heights, East New York, etc. on a regular basis growing up. FG is not now, nor was it ever, as bad as those spots.... and, I think other countries have us beat for as ghetto as ghetto gets.

Comment Of The Day

"I used to tour the grand hoods of Brownsville, Bushwick, Crown Heights, East New York, etc. on a regular basis growing up. FG is not now, nor was it ever, as bad as those spots.... and, I think other countries have us beat for as ghetto as ghetto gets."

I just want to be very clear on this being the one who started this thread. In no way does ghetto have anything to do with the ethnic makup of an area for it to be classified as ghetto. Ghetto is when a women cant walk down the street at night by herself and feel safe of danger. At least that is what I meant by it for the purpose of this thread.

i like fort greene, great mix of people and many good restaurants. for certain, not the ghetto now. used to be though

"I just want to be very clear on this being the one who started this thread. In no way does ghetto have anything to do with the ethnic makup of an area for it to be classified as ghetto. Ghetto is when a women cant walk down the street at night by herself and feel safe of danger. At least that is what I meant by it for the purpose of this thread."

The folks with brains clearly noted its not this. I have female friends and relatives that walk the area all the time now. I wouldn't hang by the projects, but fulton is pretty decent across the prime streets. Lafayette is pretty. Atlantic isn't very nice, but thats more because its the mall now. Still very safe.

> i like fort greene, great mix of people and many good restaurants.

Agreed.

I'm a fan of smoke joint. And people keep talking up the burger place.

Falling rental prices might be a death knell for lots of overreaching young buyers who got in over their heads buying small buildings in marginal areas. Many "need" numbers which are now not attainable because people can move into much better areas for those same numbers. In general, gentrification doesn't occur because people want to move to bad areas to improve them: it happens because people are forced out of better areas and go to where they can afford to live. For example, in Manhattan the "gay ghetto" went from West Village to Chelsea to Hell's Kitchen.

Has anyone been to "Nite Of The Cookers" across the street from "Cakeman Raven"? Good eats.

Where do you live, samadams?

"Falling rental prices might be a death knell for lots of overreaching young buyers who got in over their heads buying small buildings in marginal areas. Many "need" numbers which are now not attainable because people can move into much better areas for those same numbers. In general, gentrification doesn't occur because people want to move to bad areas to improve them: it happens because people are forced out of better areas and go to where they can afford to live. For example, in Manhattan the "gay ghetto" went from West Village to Chelsea to Hell's Kitchen."

Absolutely. A lot of politicians don't want to admit it, but housing shortages are what cause gentrification to increase.

ethnicity does not dictate quality of life, generalizations made to the contrary are offensive to many

One can debate causation (could just be the fault of racism)... but there certainly is correlation.

Any neighborhood that has a shop called Connecticut Muffin cannot possibly be classified as a ghetto.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/12/nyregion/12wings.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss

Gonna get some 40 cent chicken wings! Ghetto style

buffalo wilding

let me get two 40 cent wings

they always hang in a buffalo stance

>Any neighborhood that has a shop called Connecticut Muffin cannot possibly be classified as a ghetto.

^This...I'll move there end of January I'll bring my gat and crumpets.

All I can say is, the majority of this people have never actually seen a ghetto.

are rents still falling in fg