NY and NYC state tax revenues as a function of WS boni

not just money from the bonuses, for the city increased sales tax revenue, real estate transfer taxes etc.

from memory (which may be faulty, others should feel free to chime in and correct), the state spent everything. bloomberg created a "rainy day fund" which was used, along with stimulus money, to largely insulate NYC during FY 2009, i believe the budget actually increased for both the city and the state. FY 2010, which starts sometime later this year (july, maybe?), is a mess. a complete and utter shit show.

i might be off on the FY thing. but you get the general picture.

that is what i thought - on the bright side - services weren't so bad in 98 were they? So can't we just retrench to that level?

no, it's the pensions. bloomie gave a lot of love in the pension arena. also health care costs and benefits.

maybe notadmin can chime in here.

ah yes - i remember this
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/03/nyregion/03actuary.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1

isn't this worse than madoff?

I don't know why Obama is lambasted as a savior gone bad, when Boston Bloomberg's big selling points were 1. that he's a businessman (so he can manage the financial aspects of the city, after which everything else will magically fall in line)
2. his wealth means that he's not beholden to any "interests."

Where's the outrage?

I was pretty outraged when I saw the actuary article. Reminds of the couple in Podunk who are hired annually to do demographic projections for NYC school population (no joke, true story).

So, he made what, 1m max for his consulting work, payoff of 500m for the unions? Yeah, not on the scale as financial shenanigans of WS. But everything adds up.

On the other, this is a stroke of the pen thing, right? Granted with a stroke of the pen, can be taken away w/o amending State Constitution?

"The stakes are especially high on pension bills, because under the State Constitution, once public workers are granted pension benefits, they cannot be reduced, even if they cost much more than expected."

Ah, well it will be interesting to see what happens. Will unions protect pensions as services provided go down? Or is the union machinery too well-oiled to let that happen... Hmm.

"In the earlier part of the last decade, did NYC/NYS spending increase that much and use up the unprecedented increase in bonuses? Too lazy to google and research this. Anyone know?"

Yup.

Folks just figured out that Shelly, the Assembly, and the Legislature are corrupt?

wow.

I'm waiting for Internet busybodies to post the names, addresses, ages and public pensions of retired state workers. Shouldn't be too hard to pull the data. I thought I saw it online.

Given how much outrage there is at fatcats of all stripes and spots, I wouldn't be surprised if this is next.

Yeah, of course they're corrupt. But union employees still form a minority of the voting pop. (or am I wrong there?)

Try getting elected in this town without union support.

If you think its just their members voting...

Remember, these guys not only give money, they control HUGE banks of callers, and then see what kind of commercials they air when you don't do what they say ("oh, he's going after working families and giving to the rich") bla bla.

WFP is the unions + ACORN. They cost Yaasky the democratic primary. They also knocked off a democratic candidate and got their own in.

And Weiner, etc... TOTALLY in their pocket.

Unions own the politicians in this town.

At some point, don't they want the goose that lays the golden eggs not to be killed off? Presumably unions are mostly comprised of "middle class" families who use the same services they provide.

If rich pension benefits are not the norm, it doesn't make sense (okay I know, nothing makes sense) for the voting pop. to support this.

Eh, it's almost enough to make one go Republican or libertarian or something. Wait, gay marriage, wait, Iraq...

Union have never had any problem with killing the golden goose.

Remember the 70s in NYC (or at least heard about them)? You think the unions weren't still grabbing for their piece then, too? They were most of the municipal budget then, too.... and we needed the federal government to bail us out.

And, hell, the reason we have the pension problems is because of promises made THEN!

The problem with the pensions is that voters just don't get it. They don't get that those are the costs killing America. They and the Democrats will scream "kill the rich" if you try and talk about this obvious problem.

The politicians also have no problem making promises that some guy 20 years later will have to keep. And now that they have to pay the bill, they say "well, we can't change it" and then REFUSE TO DEAL WITH FIXING THE NEW PROMISES. THe person in charge of the pension bills in the assembly, when asked about creating a new tier so NEW employees get only "normal" benefits - not the crazy ones we have now - she CACKLED "why, that won't make a different for 20 years".

No sh*t, moron.

Loving it. Sooner or later, the shit will hit the fan for poor old little boomers :)

Yeah, its all about the pyramid schemes finally falling apart.

Exploding pensions to be paid for (union contracts + social security), and then because they retired, noone to pay the bills for them.

> "no, it's the pensions. bloomie gave a lot of love in the pension arena. also health care costs and benefits." maybe notadmin can chime in here.

sure! pension costs are already about half on what goes into each of the 3 main service areas (in education about to cross it, but fire and police we are already past that point). within pension costs, we are at the point in which health care costs begin to be bigger than the pension check perse (now roughly at 50%-50%). this doesn't include administrative personnel and city workers from other areas.

the pension check is non-discretionary and cannot be cut without changing the state constitution. but health care benefits can and will have to be cut (either not covering benefits and/or increasing copays). this also opens up the "accounting" gimmick of transferring that health care debt to the feds in case we ever have a nationalized system.

> about how much of the bonus bounty went into the nyc's revenues, i included the tax revenue sources in a previous threat. there are more spill overs than actual nyc income tax (as it's only 10% of tax revenues).

"At some point, don't they want the goose that lays the golden eggs not to be killed off?"

Any former General Motors shareholders (or lenders) on the thread who might have a perspective on this one?

from
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/18247-obama-about-to-expire-tax-cuts-for-the-rich

page 8
http://www.ibo.nyc.ny.us/iboreports/understandingthebudget.pdf

State and Fed aid 30% (how this aid amount varies is the key more than how well do the hedge funds do)
Property Tax 27%
Personal Income Tax is only 10%
Other Non-Tax Revenues 10%
General Sales Tax 7%
Business Income Taxes 7%
Other Taxes 7%
Real Estate-related Taxes 2%

i can't believe i am in complete harmony with somewherelse's view.

"Any former General Motors shareholders (or lenders) on the thread who might have a perspective on this one?"

hee, hee. well said.

"i can't believe i am in complete harmony with somewherelse's view"

Well, I did find it amusing you telling me I had an inflatable rat a couple weeks ago... but there were bigger mistakes than that to correct in your posts at the time.