Harlem Prices

the last thing i would like to know is the timeline for people that bought with lotteries to be able to sell and take the extra equity without having to pay a penalty to the city.

for SOHA118, i think around 40 units went to lottery winners all for under $300k (including 1, 2 and 3 bedrooms) on 2006. as i recall they are able to sell and pocket all extra equity on 2016.

say you are a mkt rate trying to sell a similar apartment as a lottery winner, doesn't the other guy have a much lower base price and can actually cut you all the way down? that's not a typical feature on a normal market (people that bought at the same time, the same unit but with way much lower cost basis). wonder whether it will make any difference if prices are declining.

. . .
admin:

]]say you are a mkt rate trying to sell a similar apartment as a lottery winner, doesn't the other guy have a much lower base price and can actually cut you all the way down? that's not a typical feature on a normal market (people that bought at the same time, the same unit but with way much lower cost basis). wonder whether it will make any difference if prices are declining.[[

replace 'lottery winner' with buyer in, oh, say 1990 . . . . and replace 'market rate' with, oh, say, 2005 . . . .
. . . . similar principle applies, assuming the 1990 buyer paid way less for their unit . . . .

so, of course, they have much lower basis, and yes!!--they can undercut the 2005 buyer now also trying to sell, they can undercut that seller in a price declining market by A LOT!! . . . .

cant help but take it personal, notadmin, as it ALL relates personally--in case ya didnt figure that out!
. . . . LOL--not jabbing AT you, though, . . . appreciate the discussion!

Tax Abatements are another X Factor future potential Time Bomb . . . . 5-10-15-20-25-30[?] Year tax Abatements apply to varying Projects . . . . of course these would also factor in to price . . . .

Renaissance Coop is a mess as these owners now try to head things off before the Tax LEAPS hit the stratosphere!
seemingly arbitrary Maintenances Now of upwards of 1200/month for a basic 2 bedroom = major price reductions Now in asking prices, and they are still having a tough sell, especially with the income restrictions, too.

We had eyed 3 bedrooms there for a hot second, then second and third thoughts due to 15-1800 month Maintenance.
Tax Abatements expiring sooner on the horizon than 5 years ago . . . .
Even with some outdoor space and low 400's price tag just did not add up to buy!

Soha had 3 beds for under 300K in 2006??
No wonder Renaissance 3's now wont sell now in 400's!

> replace 'lottery winner' with buyer in, oh, say 1990 . . . . and replace 'market rate' with, oh, say, 2005 . . . .
. . . . similar principle applies, assuming the 1990 buyer paid way less for their unit . . . .

Sure, but part of those old owners would have sold before but now with this feature they artificially have to wait several years to get that equity. Hence the pipeline of sellers looks different, it gets manipulated. The supply of sellers artificially dries up during that intial period (maybe keeping prices high) just to increase it after that period expires (if it's during a bad mkt, would the lottery owner have more incentives to sell quick?).

The relevance depends on many factors: how many got into the lottery for the equity, how many of them want to relocate, how many units got sold with a lottery with this timing restrictions during the bubble... We will see, i think it's interesting to exchange info, think about it and see what happens.

> Soha had 3 beds for under 300K in 2006??

If memory serves me well just a couple of units, most were 2 bedrooms. All lottery winners paid less than $300k and had a negligible maintenance below $100 (around 15% of what mkt rate owners regularly pay). Heard that mkt rate buyers were not told about this. There's need for transparency when it comes to these subsidies, restrictions and manipulations on the normal supply and demand of units.

IMHO these developments worked, it was a great idea. Remember the empty lots everywhere. But they come with many features that will have an effect on pricing. You are right, carrying cost might play a stronger role, i just don't know what's the normal level of taxes without the abatements.

Also take the HDFC buildings, it cannot be that some charge the flip tax and respect income restrictions and others don't. It's too arbitrary and uncertain. If you buy into a building that looks the other way and doens't charge a seller the flip tax, you might end up being on the hook for that missed transfer to the city in the future when the city wakes up. WTF!!?!?

It feels to me that renting a rent stab gives you more certainties than buying into a building with unusual rules unless you know them and know whether/how they will get enforced.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/492533-coop-130-lenox-avenue-central-harlem-new-york

PRICED TO SELL AND WITH MAXIMUM HOUSEHOLD INCOME RESTRICTIONS LIFTED!

why? how can they just decide to get the income restrictions lifted? lol, as you said, the maintenance is CRAZY! no wonder, people with income restrictions might not be able to afford the CC! maybe they are hoping to find a rich european that doesn't ask for such details?

BTW room #3 doesn't come with a door...

dont get me going on hdfc Units!

Some are well run, and others are a nest of nepotism and financial mismanagement, amid a general disconnect from reality.
It often seems that the City is either indifferent, because its Harlem, or busy with bigger more lucrative HPD properties, or just whatever.
I've encountered hdfc Boards that are extremely well run, to some that dont even have a clue, that they NEED a clue!

They are either rigid super low income Units . . . .
or like the Renaissance with crazy numbers that just dont work!!

And some of these brokers say anything in these ads that you need to have your attorney check out before ya sign anything!
I dont know how these restrictions are just 'lifted' cause they sure do 'apply' on some other current units for sale in this building!
I do know that price and maintenance at Renaissance require an income surely above those low income restrictions!
It doesnt make sense. And they are still working with Tax Abated numbers, no? what happens when full Tax kicks in???

I'll bet there is more than a lil dissension among those different categories of owners at Soha--especially if they thought everyone was on the same level!
Are you certain there were/are those differences? Thats one building I never knew about in time to check the details.

There's a new building we checked out on 7th avenue on CP-North.
Nice Unit, great size, nice location, and it would work.
Some sort of HDFC . . . .
I say some sort, because supposedly no underlying mortgage--but a Coop . . .
Somehow maintenance of almost 900--and of course we couldnt get financials till some unspecified time in the future . . . . so couldnt make sense of maintenance numbers . . . .
Income restrictions of a typical HDFC, but priced at almost 500K

We could pull together enuff as everyone really really liked it . . . . . We would have to get a mortgage and finance . . . .

THEN . . . . the agent says there are 4 cash offers!
CASH Offers from Income Restricted folks at a 500K HDFC??? say W-H-A-T ? ? ?
I actually said something a lil different, but I'll go easy . . . . . working class folks with 500K Cash laying around?

Thats more of why we took it personal . . . .
The whole RE scene kind of just says F-U! to folks like us!
Even in Harlem, where we actually LIKE a lot of the micro neighborhood blocks!

Life aint fair, blah-yada-etc . . . . but after 2+ years of looking, and seeing all the stuff thats out of reach for being too expensive or out of reach because its super super low income, a certain level of annoyance sets in.

Washington Heights may yet save us!!
Also lately been looking a lil more closely at E. harlem, which is some years behind Central Harlem; and a decade or more behind S-Harlem. . . .

> And they are still working with Tax Abated numbers, no? what happens when full Tax kicks in???

Listings by now your include by law the real tax after the tax abatement is gone imho.

> I'll bet there is more than a lil dissension among those different categories of owners at Soha--especially if they thought everyone was on the same level! Are you certain there were/are those differences? That's one building I never knew about in time to check the details.

I'm 110%. The modus operandi with lotteries seems to be to get the lottery in first to fake scarcity of units and interest (somehow people reconsider prices less when they think others are jumping quickly). They don't mention the lottery thing nor the 2 tier CC system during open houses for ex. The brokerage even held separate open houses, for those interested on the lotteries (where very low CC were emphasized) and mkt rate (where the investment potential was emphasized) while showing the same units. I know cause I played both roles, both times the broker used me to fake "high interest" to those that went looking to buy at market rates.

Now, this I think only hurt market rate buyers that don't even know how the intricate housing system works in Harlem, let's call them the newcomers/gentrifiers and the like (all locals seem to know about the lotteries). It's not fair to them at all imho. There are stories that many got to know about subsidizing the lottery during the meeting about the 1st assessment, so anger ensued as they realized that only 50% of them will pay assessments (lottery winners cannot be charged for those costs).

jesus, need some coffee! Sorry about that.

> And they are still working with Tax Abated numbers, no? what happens when full Tax kicks in???
Listings by now SHOULD include by law the real tax after the tax abatement is gone imho.

Re HDFC: for me a huge issue is that a board that doesn't enforce the flip tax that should go towards paying quickly the loan to the city is basically transferring wealth from the owners to that person that sells. If you are a buyer for the long term, what tools do you have to make sure that this rule is enforced? I think none. I wouldn't be surprised to see that many buildings under this system flirt with bankruptcy in a cyclical manner cause of this, just to get rescued by the city over and over again.

I've almost never seen a Unit listed with the Tax amount post abatement!
My guess is the specific tax will not be known until that exact point in time!

The City seems to levy property taxes in direct relation to its needs . . . hence the increases in times like these.

In particular, Is there any rhyme or reason to the situation with property taxes in Harlem?
Side by side TH's with much different taxes . . . . as well as the various Projects with much much different abatement periods?

Also seems that these folks with different taxes in the same project, like soha 118 may have some sort of potential lawsuit due to the different levies which come to light only accidentally!

Only time will tell whether the city comes after flip taxes which should have been collected over the years, and whether new owners will be held liable to errors of the past!

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/10/nyregion/10bigcity.html?_r=1&ref=susan_dominus

Economically as well as racially diverse, Harlem is a place, in other words, where a block party can turn into a deadly police shoot-out just minutes away from brownstones worth seven figures, a place where pricey music classes for children are held in ZIP codes where high numbers of children qualify for free lunch.

Last week’s contentious thread — make that one of last week’s contentious threads — revolved around a real-estate listing someone had posted for a $1.2 million town house.

“It seems to me that the seller wants to win the lottery at the expense of a naïve buyer,” came a response. “Hope it’s a trust-fund baby and not a hard-worker guy without the time to reflect.”

Another offended member suggested seceding to form a new, income-sensitive “Harlem4Kids Working Families forum.”

-----------

who is this susan dominus!?!? "deadly police shoot-out" it hints to police brutality. that's not as i see it. the ones i've known off involve corner boys reassessing their power by killing each other (they are basically teenagers). the ambulances and the police show up after the shooter is gone and the killed is on the sidewalk dying.

it wouldnt be HARLEM without the 'corner boys' . . .
Prices would be higher and opportunity would be less . . . .

It is what it is and ya deal with it!

Sidestep any crowds.
Go to sleep at nite.
And definitely stay away from ['everyone invited'] 2am summer block parties on the avenue or at the B Ball court!

Wifey and I interested in buying below 125th but people I work with who grew up an still live in Harlem advise me to stay away. Concerned about their boss' quality of life?? or fearful of further gentrification?? or just don't want their boss living in their nabe?

if they are locals they might know that many HELOCed their way towards negative equity and will be foreclosed soon?

prices are coming down in Harlem, that's for sure. but, maybe you don't have a concern about that. being the boss, your income level is higher than theirs, so you could afford to pay more than you should?

Blooms - I've been looking in the 120s. We have many friends in the area - all types - and a kid. While we currently live in midtown, we have spent a lot of time in central harlem. The quality of life is just fine. We go to great restaurants (Chez Lucien, 5&Diamond, Zoma, McDonards, Starbucks, etc.), visit with friends, walk the streets, etc. Our kid goes to Little Gym, parks, etc. Only time will tell about how the area develops. More likely than not, someone with a little dough will buy some of the 100s of high-end condos on FDB. However, if you don't like the area now, then I would stay where you are. Life is too short to move someplace you feel uncomfortable.

> people I work with who grew up an still live in Harlem advise me to stay away.

wait a second, they say you should stay away from the area? or just avoid buying? sure you could get a great rental from an owner in distress. it's a much better biz proposition than buying right now, you get to know the area and if you still like it say, a couple of years from now, you can buy a much better unit (again, from sby in distress). there's no need to hurry, you're getting paid for waiting.

all brownstones i've check myself had been HELOC like there's no tomorrow and the seller still feels entitled to ask the buyer to pay those bills and on top of that a good chunk of equity... sorry but your workers are right on that one, you should avoid being a sucker in this type of mkt.

I wouldn't stop at 125th street....I would search up to about 129th-130th.

I don't feel uncomfortable there at all (like you Pawn, we know lots of families up there) but prefer being closer to CP than 130th (116th - 120th); but like some cannot afford UWS and want a piece of Manhattan for legacy sake. I agree, notadmin, that the rentals are plentiful and cheaper than buying but we rent now and I don't know, if I move, I want it to be a game changer (i.e buying) but I'm in no rush whatsoever. Nothing is moving in Harlem now anyway, I'll see what the fall brings....there is a ton of inventory.

Most of those that pushed prices higher were priced out of the UWS. If your source of income is stable and believe that the price declines needed for you to be able to afford UWS are possible, why not wait?

If you buy in Harlem even though you liked UWS better, end up with negative equity and find out that you could have afforded the UWS thanks to the price drops, you'll regret it (or rationalize it to make it tolerable).

What about making the game changer a financially neutral (at least) proposition? Like renting a bigger place, or a home with outdoors space?

For full disclosure I'm looking at townhouses. But so far, all of those my hubby is interested on have sellers with a huge sense of entitlement. Yes, even in this mkt.

All of them have taken a ton of equity out, which a fraction seems to have been put towards the house (and I'm not willing to pay full price for a used remo done according to somebody else taste, sorry!).

Worse, they want a ton of equity on top of that. Give me a break! Many bought when the economy was doing much better. Why should the buyer be the sucker that pays their credit card bills (HELOCs) and retirement portfolio? It's gonna take a while for sellers to get real, not much is going to move meanwhile. Only those sellers on distress will set prices imho, the rest will stay in a delusional state.

harlem townhouse = $1.5 - $2.5 million
townhouse outside of harlem = $3.5 million and up

Do you think harlem RE should be less than 50% of downtown RE?

Do you think harlem RE should be less than 50% of downtown RE?

Yes because downtown Manhattan townhouses attract a market of filthy riches in total disconnect with the median income of NYC which is less than $50K/year. Harlem is a working class neighborhood, the white peepz who bought there did so only because they were priced out from downtown Manhattan. With downtown prices dropping over 30%, there is no reason for these upper class families to pick Harlem over Downtown Manhattan.

Harlem is very diverse. Working class and wealthy living side by side.

Harlem vs. queens and brooklyn is a no-brainer for Harlem.

^^^ I think, and most every broker will tell you (I AM NOT A BROKER) that in "up and coming areas" walk-ups deserve a bigger discount versus "established" areas than do doorman buildings. I am black and have lived in Harlem for three years and DEFINITELY think that if doorman buildings are worth 25% less in Harlem versus the UES or UWS, that yes, brownstones should be 50% less than the UES or UWS.

I lived on Mt Morris Park west for 2 years and heard many more than two gunshots and had police raid the park a few times and they recently had a few stabbings. Not things you would likely have as often at John Jay, Riverside (below 96th), or Hudson River Parks.

Also, even in areas like my former one, while there were many luxurious re-done brownstones, there will still MANY boarded up ones with stray cats living in them, or partially boarded up ones with one or two floors occupied by humans, and the rest semi-condemed. Plus all the empty lots.

All of this you don't see below 96th to any great extant. And all of which you notice a lot more if you live in a brownstone versus a doorman condo building in Harlem.

So yeah.

"the white peepz who bought there did so only because they were priced out from downtown Manhattan. With downtown prices dropping over 30%, there is no reason for these upper class families to pick Harlem over Downtown Manhattan."

BINGO!!!!! What happens when those priced out of UWS or other better places are not priced out anymore? My gut feeling is that most will not even bother looking at open houses in Harlem unless the spread of $/sq feet is much bigger. What happens if at the same time those that live out of HELOCs their townhouses realize that all suckers already bought?

What are the positive drivers that are going to compensate for these 2 big forces to avoid prices from sinking? I don't see them, and also believe that to finish cleaning Harlem you need another big bubble.

Do you need more negative forces hitting at the same time on Harlem?
* permanent high unemployment
* phase out of tax abatements
* lottery winners start to be able to bailout without paying a fee to the city
* change in psychology that now considers housing at high prices as a money pit instead of an easy road to riches

What are the positives?

Another BIG negative is the need to send your kids to private school unless you are ok with 80% of your kids classmates living on the project with food stamps thinking that your kid is rich cause you took a family vacation.

Also peer expectations (like thinking that going to college is expected instead of an achievement) and how involved are the parents in the educ of their kids has a big impact on the quality of the school. The schools in Harlem have a long way to go imho.

Hmmmm, I think the current 50% discount of Harlem THs versus the UWS already prices in all the negatives. Home prices below 96th have stabilized, and even though I think many developments in Harlem are overpriced, in aggregate you still cannot get like for like in Lincoln Center or Lenox Hill versus anywhere in Harlem for anything close to the same price.

I would say that spending $4MM for a brownstone in the 70s versus $2MM for an identical one in the 110s or 120s leaves you with more than adequate money for 13 years of private school for several kids, assuming they can't get in to any of the "good" publics.

And as a current resident of harlem with a white roommate, we both notice how much white our area gets every day. Mainly because RENTAL prices have started to climb back up, and 20-30 somethingswho would have picked the EV or LES or HK can't get anything close to what they could a year ago, but can in Harlem.

I mean what's striking is seeing the basketball court with TWO all white teams of 20-somethings playing full court (maybe one asian dude.) Or seeing a restaurant filled with NOTHING but white people.

I long ago gave up being surprised by white couples strolling their babies.

And the census backs this up, BTW. 2010 data, I mean. See

"No Longer Majority Black, Harlem Is in Transition " from
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/06/nyregion/06harlem.html

or more recently "July 4, 2010 - White Population Rises in Manhattan" which says "...The changes reflect several trends, including the dispersal of black and Hispanic Manhattanites, in part because of gentrification in Harlem, East Harlem and Washington Heights..."

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/07/04/white-population-rises-in-manhattan/

So no I don't thinks non-hispanic whites are fleeing harlem in greater numbers than they are coming - but what is happening is NORMAL rather than forced gentrification. Its natural to have young, single white people, including gays and "artists" move in, THEN families. What you had last decade was deveopers and speculators trying to make it families first. Families don't feel safe until they see lots of other white faces first.

Think San Francisco in the 60s and most other big city gentrifications in the past 20 years, including Chelsea, HK, and the UWS. This is basic entry-level college coursework, people.

I can afford to live outside of harlem, but i want to live there. It's got it's problems, but so does my mid-town, white-glove co-op.

Private school is necessary. Would not send my kid to public school in Harlem.

"I would say that spending $4MM for a brownstone in the 70s versus $2MM for an identical one in the 110s or 120s leaves you with more than adequate money for 13 years of private school for several kids, assuming they can't get in to any of the "good" publics."

Or you can buy the same-sized house in the midwest for only $100K, and then you could even walk outside at night without getting mugged.

Depends on where in the midwest. There are plenty of places in the flyover country with higher crime rates than manhattan or Harlem. St. Louis, Memphis, Cleveland, Nashville, Kansas City, Tulsa, Minneapolis, Indianapolis, of course Chicago, Toledo, Wichita, and Oklahoma City are just a few of the fly-over cities that have double or more the crime rate of NYC as a whole, and significantly higher than Harlem in particular. I am talking just violent crime, per the FBI stats.

I was on 125th and FDB last night at around 11pm. Seemed pretty safe.

"I was on 125th and FDB last night at around 11pm. Seemed pretty safe."

You have a weird idea of "pretty safe."

Is Washington Heights "pretty safe" for you?

"You have a weird idea of "pretty safe.""

Just because there are black people on the street does not make it unsafe.

Crime ON 125th is low by any standard. Its a main thoroughfaire with lots of potential witnesses to any crime and a visible police presence.

Depending on where you are in Harlem (by zip code) the crime rate is higher or lower than the NYC overall average, but in general MUCH lower than meatpacking, west village, soho, or other whiter and thus perceptually "safer" areas.

But my comment above was on Harlem versus "the midwest", and here, even the legitimately unsafe areas of Harlem *by NYC standards) are WAY safer than St. Louis, Memphis, Cleveland, Nashville, Kansas City, Tulsa, Minneapolis, Indianapolis, Chicago, Toledo, Wichita, and Oklahoma City.

^^I should have said SOME zips in harlem are generally safer than meatpacking, etc, per FBI crime stats...

I spend a decent amount of time in harlem. Stangely, there was a higher proportion of white people on the street at that time.

Harlem has got a lot going for it - cheap real estate is one thing, but not the only thing. If real estate prices come down in NYC, they will probably come down in Harlem. Rising tide lifts all boats...

^^^Not on 125th, no way. But I have seen it from time to time, for example one day walking from my then residence on Mt. Morris Park to the 116th/Lenox stop, I say probably 2-1 white and maybe 5% asian a few times.

But most of the black people who lived on my then-block, and all of those who live in my current building are solidly middle or upper middle class.

And you can have largely black areas with lower crime rates than mostly white areas. As you do within some areas of Manhattan itself, per the crime stats.

For me, Harlem near the park is the best option in terms of buying on the lower-end of Manhattan RE for my family. I prefer it to similar price options in Brooklyn (be@ etc...). That said, I hope the psf drops below $500 for one of those condos on the FDB corridor.

> ^^I should have said SOME zips in harlem are generally safer than meatpacking, etc, per FBI crime stats...

These stats don't take into account the change in behavior that white people apply to Harlem due to safety. Most of the white women I know in Harlem don't walk around at night just cause they feel like it, but they do it in teh UWS, UES, downtown, ... So your FBI stats don't imply "walking at night in Harlem is as safe as walking around at night in the meatpacking district".

Was thinking about unemployment in Harlem, it's hitting several of my neighbors, but so far, they do have unemployment insurance (who knows how many extensions they can count on).

Any thought on this? I guess it hits way much more those that are self-employed than those with modest stable incomes (which might be the core of Harlem's homeowners income profile!?)

"These stats don't take into account the change in behavior that white people apply to Harlem due to safety. Most of the white women I know in Harlem don't walk around at night just cause they feel like it, but they do it in teh UWS, UES, downtown, ... So your FBI stats don't imply "walking at night in Harlem is as safe as walking around at night in the meatpacking district"."

In fact, the reason the west village meatpacking soho etc have crime rates higher than parts of upper manhattan is PRECISELY because of night time crime. Ooops!

Based on this map, Grammercy is as bad as Central Harlem (and worse that m'side heights).

http://nymag.com/docs/08/01/080114crimemaps.pdf

> In fact, the reason the west village meatpacking soho etc have crime rates higher than parts of upper manhattan is PRECISELY because of night time crime. Ooops!

jason, don't have time to spoon feed you, that's my point. live in Harlem like you do in the meatpacking district and you'll get raped and mugged several times. the reason why it doesn't happen in Harlem is cause you don't see a white soul walking around alone at night over here for prevention. so you cannot even compare.

"it's just as safe!" sure! only if you are not good with stats.

> Based on this map, Grammercy is as bad as Central Harlem (and worse that m'side heights).

again, Pawn, show me it's just as bad after you adjust for change in behavior, ok?

I am not really sure what you are on about. I rented from a white condo owner who lived there with her kids before her husband moved to Singapore with them. Her neighbors were mostly white. My two roommates at the time were white. My current roommate is white now that we are over in east harlem, and there are LOTS of white people in my area. They all "live" like they did when I lived in 10006 - you never saw a soul, white or black, on the street at night in FiDi or BPC either. You ALSO never see anyone on the street at night where I live now or when I lived in 10027.

Neither me or my roommate live any differently than we would if we lived in area with no real bar scene.

Also, the FBI crime stats are per 1,000 people, which is the only correct way to look at it.

I am making my move on a Harlem condo. Mid-500K with 25% down. Wish me luck. First time home buyer. Any final words of advice????

is it a 2 bedroom?

Yeah, its really what is the price per SF and is it doorman or no. But good luck no matter waht.

2br w/doorman @ 525 psf.

Oh, that sounds reasonable. So many on these boards say they would only do Harlem at 500 PSF or less, so with a doorman that is good. I think that will be trend for a few years, but eventually, it will converge with the rest of Manhattan, so in the long run you should be good.

What building did you buy into?

I think 500 psf is the price point for Harlem , but this has nicer features so I'm willing to go higher.

You can buy an awesome townhouse for less that $500/sq ft. I assume you are considering a far smaller investment. Perhaps a 600 square foot apt on lennox?

Doormans are a bigger premium in harlem than in other areas.

1050 sq feet.

You should step up for a small townhouse. Probably set you back $900,000. Rent out a floor or two to make up the difference in price.

@PH... I haven't really considered it....I'll check SE for listings.

The deal I spoke of above fell through due to condo's finances so I may be going in that direction P_H

"You should step up for a small townhouse. Probably set you back $900,000"

about 33% too low, at least. A ready to move-in refurbished TH below 125th no, not that cheap yet. If ever.

See for example:

http://www.halstead.com/detail.aspx?id=916995

Now, if you want really far east Harlem above 106th, or above 130th anywhere, MAYBE...but even then refurbished ones go for well over $1mm.