250 West 94th St. #6F Co-op; 3 Bedrooms, 1.5 baths. Asks $1.295MM; Maint.: $1,211 ($1,114 after tax refund); 30% Down. http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/574400-coop-250-west-94th-street-upper-west-side-new-york The Stanton is an amenity-rich coop where values suffered mightily in the 2009 downturn. The extent of any recovery is difficult to gauge, because turnover in the past sixteen months has been... [more]
250 West 94th St. #6F
Co-op; 3 Bedrooms, 1.5 baths.
Asks $1.295MM; Maint.: $1,211 ($1,114 after tax refund); 30% Down.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/574400-coop-250-west-94th-street-upper-west-side-new-york
The Stanton is an amenity-rich coop where values suffered mightily in the 2009 downturn. The extent of any recovery is difficult to gauge, because turnover in the past sixteen months has been limited to a lavish penthouse and two small units. “F” is one of the weaker lines, an interior 4.5-room format in which most windows face the building’s west wing. The one south-facing bedroom window lost its limited view when the Melar rose on 93rd Street.
In #6F, one long bedroom has been divided into two square chambers. The configuration works well, except that one of the resulting rooms lacks any closets. In the intact bedroom that serves as the master, storage is ample, thanks to extensive built-ins. The one full bathroom has been updated in reasonable taste but with some cheap materials; the vanity is conspicuously low-end. The renovated kitchen is attractive and well-equipped. Non-oenophiles might wish the owners had resisted the wine cooler in favor of a larger fridge and additional storage, or a washer/dryer (assuming one was possible). The powder room off the kitchen is fine, aside from its exposed location and excessive heat from adjacent steam pipes.
Floors are in excellent shape throughout the apartment, with herringbone in the public space and strip in the bedrooms. The walls seem OK; molding details are concealed by generations of paint. The wallpaper in the closetless bedroom is fairly neutral, and easily replaced. The shutters in the living room are in good condition. They are also an unfortunate necessity, because #6F looks directly into other apartments. The apartment isn't horribly dark, but it can fairly be called viewless.
250W94 generally competes with nearby coops on West End for buyers who value proximity to the express subway. #6F may have been priced to undercut the various five-room listings at 670 WEA. That would be a sound strategy, with just one catch: those apartments at 670 aren’t selling.
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Response by ph41
about 15 years ago
Posts: 3390
Member since: Feb 2008
West81st - I would not normally agree with W67th, but I have begun to think that UWS buyers have got to be lemmings after seeing a lot of the listings posted on SE - such as this one for the asking of $1.295MM. I have also begun to think that the "pre-war" mystique really does cloud some buyer judgement when looking at not particularly optimal and non-gracious layouts.
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Response by West81st
about 15 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
ph41: Until it sells, talk of lemmings might be premature. At the open house, judgment seemed pretty clear-eyed, and the apartment's shortcomings were discussed quite openly. The listing broker (arguably Elliman's top gun in the UWS mid-range) wasn't there, so the critiques went largely unanswered.
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Response by West81st
about 15 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
203 West 90th St. #4E
Condo; 2 Bedrooms, 1 bath plus maid’s room and bath.
Asks $1.6MM; CC: $824; Tax: $998; 10% Down.
Manhattan Tower is a highly unconventional “pre-war” condo. Six floors were added atop its six-floor 1928 base around the time the building converted in 2002. #4E is a sponsor unit in the old section. The apartment is configured as a six; the positioning of windows suggests that it might have originally been a five.
The living room and one bedroom face east, with decent light and unprepossessing views across Amsterdam Avenue. The other views are interior; some light sneaks over a setback two floor up. The rooms are generally well-proportioned. The maid’s room is of reasonable size, with a useable en-suite bath; but since its one closet contains the washer/dryer and there’s no good position for a bed, the MR seems best suited for use as a home office or utility room. Closet space is tight throughout the apartment, especially in the front-facing bedroom, where the one closet seems shallower than the floorplan suggests.
#4E has been renovated, with new floors, kitchen and baths. Some work clearly remains to be done – for example, the dishwasher’s bay is currently an empty space – so it might be unfair to assess the quality of the renovation. The completed work shows some questionable design choices, such as a nice refrigerator that appears too small for the space it inhabits. On the positive side, an assertive buyer could still specify certain finishes and make sure the loose ends are addressed.
On paper, $1.6MM is a defensible asking price for a renovated C6 condo. #4E generated steady traffic on Sunday. Most visitors seemed unexcited by the reality of the building, location, views, space and quality. At the current price, #4E will appeal mostly to buyers who absolutely must have a pre-war condo. Inventory in that class is very tight.
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Response by spinnaker1
about 15 years ago
Posts: 1670
Member since: Jan 2008
Can you offer any insight on perma scaffolding Westie?
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Response by West81st
about 15 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
Spin: I think another poster (most likely NWT or nyc10023) wrote up the engineering problems and related history on this board a year or two ago. I haven't stayed current on the topic, and I don't know whether the current work is connected to the original issues.
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Response by West81st
about 15 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
201 West 89th St. #12G
Co-op; 2 Bedrooms, 2 Baths.
Asks $1.295MM; Maint.: $1,782 (includes utilities); 25% Down.
Chester Court’s “G” line is something of a chameleon. The rectangular footprint, with three exposures, can be adapted to different uses, and can even accommodate three bedrooms if necessary. The original layout straddles the boundary between Edwardian Five and Classic Five. The rear bedroom, with its small en-suite bath, looks more like a servant’s room than a master to me, so I’ll go with Edwardian. (I'll leave it to RSM321 to illuminate the influence of various WWI-era trends on the subsequent work of Emery Roth.)
In #12G, as far as I can tell, the living and dining rooms have been joined, the foyer reduced, the kitchen bumped toward the entry (losing its window) and the smaller bedroom expanded to function as a modest master suite with two exposures. The other bedroom – the master in the E5 plan – has given up its original closet (the door incongruously remains, linking the bedrooms) and has only a shallow corner closet that was added during the reconfiguration. Overall, I think the public space flows pretty well, while the bedroom wing seems relatively jumbled. Condition is mixed. Again, the public space has fared better than the bedroom wing, where floor damage is evident and the hall bath needs major attention. The en-suite bath is in better condition, though the color choices are rather bold for such a small space.
The “G” line is landlocked; all three exposures are blocked. Unfortunately, share allocation at Chester Court reflects square footage and elevation rather than the qualitative appeal of each line. The formula favors better-situated apartments on lower floors (such as #4A, a current listing where maintenance is notably low) at the expense of a unit like #12G. The monthlies on #12G are not unreasonable; they just aren’t a particular strength. In the “A” line, low maintenance is a genuine selling point.
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Response by falcogold1
about 15 years ago
Posts: 4159
Member since: Sep 2008
West81,
Great read!
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Response by apt23
about 15 years ago
Posts: 2041
Member since: Jul 2009
Thank you w81. These reports are great insight for value readers and will probably be dredged up decades from now as historians try to understand our market. And may I just mention that you are one of the most brilliantly tactful beings on the planet. Edwardian indeed. hilarious.
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Response by front_porch
about 15 years ago
Posts: 5320
Member since: Mar 2008
I know there's only so much one can do with a 2BR, but to take an apartment that was originally intended for two, possibly three, people -- one of whom owned barely any clothes -- and to reconfigure it for three, possibly four people, all of whom own 21st-century amounts of stuff, and not add any closet space?
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
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Response by West81st
about 15 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
Front_porch: Five, I think.
Could be a tough year for families that have outgrown modest 2BRs. There seems to be a widening spread between those apartments and the sixes and sevens that represent the next step up; and banks aren't exactly eager to lend the difference.
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Response by columbiacounty
about 15 years ago
Posts: 12708
Member since: Jan 2009
ok...can't help myself. i put in $1,195,000 with 20% down and the monthly (pretax) is $6,914. Do you disagree that you can rent a significantly nicer place for that amount?
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Response by West81st
about 15 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
I'm pretty sure you can.
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Response by falcogold1
about 15 years ago
Posts: 4159
Member since: Sep 2008
cc,
sure you could but what about the equity over time?
Isn't that meaningful?
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Response by columbiacounty
about 15 years ago
Posts: 12708
Member since: Jan 2009
you're right.
at the end of 10 yrs you've picked up about 100K in equity less your in and out transaction costs of 8% or so which nets about $4k.
but, think about the underlying appreciation!
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Response by falcogold1
about 15 years ago
Posts: 4159
Member since: Sep 2008
Got it.
Thanx
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Response by w67thstreet
about 15 years ago
Posts: 9003
Member since: Dec 2008
Lookiee. Ph41 ...... Come to papa
Non-refraction force field on! Homeowners, where it never bends.
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Response by West81st
almost 14 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
Final scoreboard:
250 West 94th #6F cut once, from $1.295 to $1.25MM, then sold for $1.22MM after ten weeks on the market.
203 West 90th #4E cut five times, from $1.6 to $1.275MM, then sold for $1.344MM after twenty-two weeks on the market.
201 West 89th #12G cut once, from $1.295 to $1.25MM, then sold for $1.2MM after twelve weeks on the market.
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Response by 875gator
almost 14 years ago
Posts: 193
Member since: Sep 2010
How about 318 W 100th Street? There are a couple of apts for sale in that pre-war condo.
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Response by w67thstreet
almost 14 years ago
Posts: 9003
Member since: Dec 2008
Omfg. They all sold?!!!!! How how is that possible?!! The mkt is shitty.
Oh.... It took 12 months and a bunch of price cuts... Oh never mind.
West81st - I would not normally agree with W67th, but I have begun to think that UWS buyers have got to be lemmings after seeing a lot of the listings posted on SE - such as this one for the asking of $1.295MM. I have also begun to think that the "pre-war" mystique really does cloud some buyer judgement when looking at not particularly optimal and non-gracious layouts.
ph41: Until it sells, talk of lemmings might be premature. At the open house, judgment seemed pretty clear-eyed, and the apartment's shortcomings were discussed quite openly. The listing broker (arguably Elliman's top gun in the UWS mid-range) wasn't there, so the critiques went largely unanswered.
203 West 90th St. #4E
Condo; 2 Bedrooms, 1 bath plus maid’s room and bath.
Asks $1.6MM; CC: $824; Tax: $998; 10% Down.
Manhattan Tower is a highly unconventional “pre-war” condo. Six floors were added atop its six-floor 1928 base around the time the building converted in 2002. #4E is a sponsor unit in the old section. The apartment is configured as a six; the positioning of windows suggests that it might have originally been a five.
The living room and one bedroom face east, with decent light and unprepossessing views across Amsterdam Avenue. The other views are interior; some light sneaks over a setback two floor up. The rooms are generally well-proportioned. The maid’s room is of reasonable size, with a useable en-suite bath; but since its one closet contains the washer/dryer and there’s no good position for a bed, the MR seems best suited for use as a home office or utility room. Closet space is tight throughout the apartment, especially in the front-facing bedroom, where the one closet seems shallower than the floorplan suggests.
#4E has been renovated, with new floors, kitchen and baths. Some work clearly remains to be done – for example, the dishwasher’s bay is currently an empty space – so it might be unfair to assess the quality of the renovation. The completed work shows some questionable design choices, such as a nice refrigerator that appears too small for the space it inhabits. On the positive side, an assertive buyer could still specify certain finishes and make sure the loose ends are addressed.
On paper, $1.6MM is a defensible asking price for a renovated C6 condo. #4E generated steady traffic on Sunday. Most visitors seemed unexcited by the reality of the building, location, views, space and quality. At the current price, #4E will appeal mostly to buyers who absolutely must have a pre-war condo. Inventory in that class is very tight.
Can you offer any insight on perma scaffolding Westie?
Spin: I think another poster (most likely NWT or nyc10023) wrote up the engineering problems and related history on this board a year or two ago. I haven't stayed current on the topic, and I don't know whether the current work is connected to the original issues.
201 West 89th St. #12G
Co-op; 2 Bedrooms, 2 Baths.
Asks $1.295MM; Maint.: $1,782 (includes utilities); 25% Down.
Chester Court’s “G” line is something of a chameleon. The rectangular footprint, with three exposures, can be adapted to different uses, and can even accommodate three bedrooms if necessary. The original layout straddles the boundary between Edwardian Five and Classic Five. The rear bedroom, with its small en-suite bath, looks more like a servant’s room than a master to me, so I’ll go with Edwardian. (I'll leave it to RSM321 to illuminate the influence of various WWI-era trends on the subsequent work of Emery Roth.)
In #12G, as far as I can tell, the living and dining rooms have been joined, the foyer reduced, the kitchen bumped toward the entry (losing its window) and the smaller bedroom expanded to function as a modest master suite with two exposures. The other bedroom – the master in the E5 plan – has given up its original closet (the door incongruously remains, linking the bedrooms) and has only a shallow corner closet that was added during the reconfiguration. Overall, I think the public space flows pretty well, while the bedroom wing seems relatively jumbled. Condition is mixed. Again, the public space has fared better than the bedroom wing, where floor damage is evident and the hall bath needs major attention. The en-suite bath is in better condition, though the color choices are rather bold for such a small space.
The “G” line is landlocked; all three exposures are blocked. Unfortunately, share allocation at Chester Court reflects square footage and elevation rather than the qualitative appeal of each line. The formula favors better-situated apartments on lower floors (such as #4A, a current listing where maintenance is notably low) at the expense of a unit like #12G. The monthlies on #12G are not unreasonable; they just aren’t a particular strength. In the “A” line, low maintenance is a genuine selling point.
West81,
Great read!
Thank you w81. These reports are great insight for value readers and will probably be dredged up decades from now as historians try to understand our market. And may I just mention that you are one of the most brilliantly tactful beings on the planet. Edwardian indeed. hilarious.
I know there's only so much one can do with a 2BR, but to take an apartment that was originally intended for two, possibly three, people -- one of whom owned barely any clothes -- and to reconfigure it for three, possibly four people, all of whom own 21st-century amounts of stuff, and not add any closet space?
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
Front_porch: Five, I think.
Could be a tough year for families that have outgrown modest 2BRs. There seems to be a widening spread between those apartments and the sixes and sevens that represent the next step up; and banks aren't exactly eager to lend the difference.
ok...can't help myself. i put in $1,195,000 with 20% down and the monthly (pretax) is $6,914. Do you disagree that you can rent a significantly nicer place for that amount?
I'm pretty sure you can.
cc,
sure you could but what about the equity over time?
Isn't that meaningful?
you're right.
at the end of 10 yrs you've picked up about 100K in equity less your in and out transaction costs of 8% or so which nets about $4k.
but, think about the underlying appreciation!
Got it.
Thanx
Lookiee. Ph41 ...... Come to papa
Non-refraction force field on! Homeowners, where it never bends.
Final scoreboard:
250 West 94th #6F cut once, from $1.295 to $1.25MM, then sold for $1.22MM after ten weeks on the market.
203 West 90th #4E cut five times, from $1.6 to $1.275MM, then sold for $1.344MM after twenty-two weeks on the market.
201 West 89th #12G cut once, from $1.295 to $1.25MM, then sold for $1.2MM after twelve weeks on the market.
How about 318 W 100th Street? There are a couple of apts for sale in that pre-war condo.
Omfg. They all sold?!!!!! How how is that possible?!! The mkt is shitty.
Oh.... It took 12 months and a bunch of price cuts... Oh never mind.
Caps for sale. Caps. Caps for sale.
You Fkig monkeys you, give me back my caps!
The peddler was so hungry he took a long nap.