major new crime zone: the heart of the W. Village

NYCMatt, hol4, and alanhart seem to speak some special secret language.

ho: Strike a pose
there's nothing to it
VOGUE!

( hogue? ;) )

huntersburg: How's the crime situation on the edge of Gotham?

> But I'm sure you still have a bod for sin.

nice pull...

and, yeah, I wasn't kidding about the PATH. I always remember young kids hanging out around the stop, and I actually had to take the PATH for the first time in a while, and there is definitely a nighttime contingent coming in from Jersey.

To be honest, I think a lot of it are the young gay black and latino kids who don't have anyplace to go where they won't be screwed with in Jersey. Christopher St. is an obvious stop. I actually think that is great... having a place where these kids can be themselves.

But it seems to overlap a bit with the hanging out around the PATH stations weekend nights. I've seen some folks camped out around it.

"To be honest, I think a lot of it are the young gay black and latino kids who don't have anyplace to go where they won't be screwed with in Jersey."

ding ding ding...

same complaints from 2 years back..

.. kids from west JC/Newark/Irvington/etc came into the city to "vogue" and drink/smoke/etc on the west side piers...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZDG3AXBovU&feature=related

let your body moveee to the music, hey , hey hey

It's all the fault of olds like Matthew: http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/SeriesReport-201107012046421_1911_image001.png

How do you know that the kids voguing in the WVill are not from BK, Harlem, Washington Heights, or even the nearby projects in chelsea? You don't.

Newsflash: gays of all stripes gather in the Village, Chelsea, and HK.

"How do you know that the kids voguing in the WVill are not from BK, Harlem, Washington Heights, or even the nearby projects in chelsea? You don't."

You think if they lived in Harlem, they're taking the PATH in from Jersey?

jason isn't the brightest guy here.

It's not the gays. It's the (illegally) armed muggers and the roving gangs.
Wherever they come from.

But somewhereelse isn't wrong, nor is jason: the bad congregrate with the other bads.

the village has had a reputation of being a place to go if you want to just hang out - not only gays, and not only from Jersey - it has changed over the years, and looks and feels a lot less "gay" to me, but it's still a magnet of some kind, and I have no idea what's pulling people there

Do people hang out in Columbia County?

lowery, seriously? GV as a "hang out" or "magnet" for "gays"? Uh...maybe 20 years ago a lot of gay people were there. But the great gay northern migration had already begun. On we went to Chelsea, and some years ago continued on to Hell's Kitchen. Today the migration north is coupled with the diaspora around NYC as younger generations don't ghettoize themselves as readily. But one thing is for sure: the Village is not a gay hang out. Please. That sounds as silly as my father when he would call marijuana "grass" when I was growing up.

Actually Kyle, the area from the Path to the Pier on Christopher Street is a gathering point.

kylewest you're showing your age here....

yes, HK is now the official "chelsea" as it has more 'local' parties (ie Industry) vs touristy venues in chelsea (ie Barracuda, etc)

...yes hardly Manhattan-living gays go to party in the village for a gay party (save maybe some bear party)..

...but malthus is correct, the PATH station is a gathering point for Newark/Irvington black/latino gays..

..now it's turned from gathering point to "hangout" point...these kids don't want to pay a cab to schlep it to HK and pay $7 for a beer..

you're discounting the PATH's direct effect as well as different socio-cultures within the gay 'community' itself.

seriously do you see this going on in any of the Hells Kitchen establishments??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZDG3AXBovU&feature=related

strike a pose Jersey, there's nothin to it.

http://www.spotcrime.com/ny/manhattan/neighborhoods

This conversation has really veered off in a lot of strange directions

agreed, kylewest is a little out of date.... the PATH area is a HUGE hangout for the younger gays. Not the old white rich ones who moved on to other neighborhoods...

"you're discounting the PATH's direct effect as well as different socio-cultures within the gay 'community' itself. "
yup...

I overheard some conversations... apparently the younger black/latino set is congregating in some of the "classic" w village gay hangouts now.

Also, walk down 6th ave near W4 on a saturday night... similar crowd to the christopher path street station.

It is a new generation...

The crime map is interesting, but you will notice that it has MUCH more crime in Greenwich (central) village than in the West village. And more in Soho to boot. So this has thrown a tub full of ice water on this "its the PATH Vogue kids what did it!" theory.

Your first mistake is assuming that the crime map is accurate.

So most of us are in agreement that this has to do with the Path.

Realistically, the Path should have stops only at 34th Street and the WTC, and when you combine that with NJTransit to Penn Station, and bus service to the PA, that seems sufficient for mass transportation access to NJ.

i thought most of us were in agreement that this has more to do with the abundance of easy marks in wv

"I overheard some conversations... apparently the younger black/latino set is congregating in some of the "classic" w village gay hangouts now."

where did you overhear this?

It's 2011 -- the whole county is chock-a-block with easy marks.

troll, there used to be more stations -- at 19th & 28th Sts. -- plus of course the Manhattan Transfer.

"the whole county is chock-a-block with easy marks"

it's a nightlife destination for pretty much the entire tri state area. people there at night have cash, are tipsy and their guard is down. the bad guys are not just ghetto gay kids from nj, they are dealers and hookers who CATER to the partyers. as well as the roving gangs who later mug them. those elements would still be there without the path station. in fact, by removing the path station, you'll just really remove the gay kids. and that's a pretty fucked up position to take.

uncle cc! i'm saying keep the path station! you can still go down there and pick up a pretty latino boy for the night

> where did you overhear this?

On the PATH, coincidentally.

> So this has thrown a tub full of ice water on this "its the PATH Vogue kids what did it!" theory.

Uh, check out what the PATH stops are...

... and notice how the central village crimes have a cluster at 6th and 7th avenues... near 4th street

sort of thows water on your kneejerk reaction...

The problem isn't limited to a misdemeanor (a word that strikes me as very funny) here and a felony (fancy- and ethereal-sounding word, maybe like melody or harmony or pharmacy) there. There's also drunken-puppy buying ... as if ANYBODY could resist something as cute as a drunken puppy; better even than a stoned cat. Hicccccck!

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/07/07/puppy-purchasing-when-drunk-a-common-city-scourge

i always thought Felony had a decent chance to become a popular girl's name with hipsters who wanted to be "cool" parents. let's make it happen!

"is a decision that might last for 18 years,” “I want to make sure they’re not doing it because of a couple tequila shots."

there goes the human race

go away, hfs.

where should i go?

away.

will you come along?

kylewest, I don't think you read my post. Yes, I think it has continued to be a hangout place where people congregate. Yup, 30 years ago you'd see swarms of gays. I don't know what it is drawing people there at night with no good reason to be there, other than its reputation for someplace to go. I do know that a friend who has lived there for decades complains about the village being overrun at nights with young gays from poor neighborhoods who have nowhere to go, and I have had arguments with him about this, that this seems counterintuitive when there's no real gay scene to speak of in the Village. And then he insists that the streets are congregation gathering points for young gays who are trouble. One thing has not changed much about the village, the number of people who don't live there but who hang out there at night, especially on weekends. I have no idea what they're drawn to. Basketball courts? Did you dad really call marijuana "grass"? It was "pot" when I was young, and "grass" always seemed pretty oldfashioned to me, but "weed" seemed ancient, and now it seems to have come back in.

To prevent crime in Columbia County, You can help the Sheriff's Office work to keep our communities safe by reporting criminal or suspicious activity. This can be done by calling our 24 hour tips line and leave a voice message at 518-822-8477, or by submitting a tip over the internet, (see below). "Its better to be safe than sorry". If you see activity that does not look right, report it.

"I do know that a friend who has lived there for decades complains about the village being overrun at nights with young gays from poor neighborhoods who have nowhere to go"

Well that's his problem right there.

Living in the Village is for 20-somethings and maybe 30-somethings. Eventually, however, you have to grow up and move to the Upper East Side with all the other grown-ups.

" I do know that a friend who has lived there for decades complains about the village being overrun at nights with young gays from poor neighborhoods who have nowhere to go, and I have had arguments with him about this, that this seems counterintuitive when there's no real gay scene to speak of in the Village. And then he insists that the streets are congregation gathering points for young gays who are trouble. One thing has not changed much about the village, the number of people who don't live there but who hang out there at night, especially on weekends. I have no idea what they're drawn to. Basketball courts?"

Lowery, I think you nailed it. In terms of what they're drawn to... each other? I don't mean that to be a joke. But if those kids know that similar kids will be there walking around, getting slices at Joe's, then they'll head there too.

I actually gave directions to one of these groups on the PATH train I took - they were going to Henrietta Hudson. Seemed like nice kids, I think it is great if there is somewhere they feel more comfortable.

The village, since at least the 60s, has been one of the highest crime areas of Manhattan. I repeat, this is not anything new.

The crime is directly attributable to that dastardly duo, Jane Jacobs and Mark Jacobs. They need to level the whole neighborhood, rebuild it entirely in a way that better maximizes density, and call it "Renaissance Village".

alan what is your profession? other than giving bad blowjobs?

Jim, that's pretty much the entirety of it ... I have no education, I provide no valuable service (plus for spite and anger I use teeth, or don't show, or fail to return phone calls, or at the list minute sway out the spot that I agreed to give to someone else), I'm contemptible beyond belief, smarmy and unwashed, and yet I collect money undeservedly nonetheless, and kick a little back to lobbyists and referring owners so I can keep it up and don't wind up homeless due to my lack of skills or smarts.

Wasn't the truce broken?

It was just this guy the entire time....
http://wallpapermovie.net/wallpaperOnizlemeDosyalar/Adrien_Brody_in_The_Village_Wallpaper_2_800.jpg

you sound like a real worthless piece of shit alan. no wonder you spend so much time here. have you thought the world might be better without you? i certainly think it would be.

I apologize, Jim: I meant "last minute swap", not "list minute sway".

i almost feel empathy for someone with such a low opinion of themselves. when is wrist cutting time alan?

Ooh, wrist cutting. Alan, can I suggest tips from aboutready who can show you how to get maximum blood and attention, but without any fatal damage?

Otherwise alan, on your post about leveling the west village, be careful, people like HappyRenter want to eliminate low buildings and replace with larger buildings to increase density.

"In terms of what they're drawn to... each other? I don't mean that to be a joke. But if those kids know that similar kids will be there walking around, getting slices at Joe's, then they'll head there too."

Yes, and I'm not convinced the people drawn to that area are drawn there because they're gay. Some may go there to buy pot - I mean, grass -- I mean, weed -- I mean, reefer. Uh, like -- whatever.

Matt .... I couldn't live down there either (and can't afford it at today's prices), but some people have really nice deals. A really nice deal is when you started living there when rents were below $300 a month and rent stabilized.

> Wasn't the truce broken?

nice pull...

> Yes, and I'm not convinced the people drawn to that area are drawn there because they're gay. Some may go
> there to buy pot - I mean, grass -- I mean, weed -- I mean, reefer. Uh, like -- whatever.

Straight kids don't like pot?

"Straight kids don't like pot?"

I don't get it. Haven't I said several times that I don't know what it is that attracts people to the village? Why would you think I would think straight kids don't like pot? Do you think it would surprise me that kids buying pot in the village aren't gay when I have said a few times that I don't think it's necessarily "gay" that gives the area a reputation as a place to go to hang out?

Kids buying "pot" are not the problem. Kids buy dirt-weed all over town on the streets.

The West Village is dark, narrow streets. Perfect for the muggers who lurk in the shadows.

Amen, Truth, amen.

lots youngish people going drinking, often from suburbs and colleges outside the boroughs, with wallets - sounds like as good a place as any to mug someone