133 West 22nd

Cool!

Hello Sizzlack, I wanted to ask you a question. They contacted me from the sales office and there is a storage unit available. I really needed and I am glad about the availability. They told me its a 25sft storage room. How is the one you got? If you dont mind me asking how much did you get it for? Thanks a lot!

The 25 sq ft ones opened at $20K but now are $30K...I got the 7th and 8th amendments today confirming this. $30K is what the sales office quoted me in February so they had seen this increase coming. Hope this helps.

This helps a lot! Thanks! Did you get a storage yourself?

I did...I figured I would either use it or rent it since there are far fewer storage units than apartments, and I don't think anyone every says "this new york city apartment has too much storage".

I got storage too...not at 30K tho. Last summer when I signed it was still 20K. It's a 4 x 5 foot unit.

oh wait its 25 sq ft? 5x 5 huh...I always thought 20. But the more the better

yeah this is what they said, 25 sq ft, so I am assuming 5x5...

Walked by the sales office today. It looks as if the place is being torn down. Anyone know why? Also noticed two plywood additions to the bottom floor on the sidewalk. Anyone know anything about this?

Tearing the place down? It is an active construction site with a lot of scaffolding. Went by yesterday though and didn't notice anything that strange. I did see the plywood part though, nothing that worried me however. Its still pretty raw and has a way to go, perhaps that could explain why you think it looks like its being torn down?

not the building...the sales office. its being gutted. it looks like they are taking down the sales office.

oh yea, makes sense because they only have two units left I believe, both PHs. I dont know if they ever sold the first floor townhouse, but it makes sense they are closing it down.

any updates on completion of the building?

I havent heard anything new...still expecting the first 5 floors to be ready for move in round mid November...I imagine it will slowly get pushed back a bit though

looks like they've started hanging sheetrock on the lower floors. Entire building appears to have its windows. slowly rolling along...

Hey, just bought a 3BR in the bldg a couple of weeks ago. Construction supervisor told me everything will be done and all apts closed by end of December. Who knows if it's true, but that's what they're saying. I also heard that all sheetrock will be finished in two weeks., so consder that early august.

I just bought a 3 bedroom too about a month ago. The construction supervisor told me the same thing and said lower floors would be ready to close in Nov and everyone would be in by end of December. I believe all the sheetrock is up now and it does appear that things are moving along. I'm still planning on Jan-Feb, but you never know.

Hey does anyone know when we will be able to go in the building to see the 'raw' space? did anyone go up yet?

I remember asking Steve that a while ago. There is some stipulation that some level of construction needs to be finished before anyone else can be taken up. I would call Cantor/Pecorella but if I had to guess I'd say soon..maybe a month or so.

I recently tried to get up to my apt so my designers could see it, but was told the drywall STILL isn't up (at least not on the higher floors) and that they're not letting any people in until they get a temporary C of O. They said a lot of people wanted to see the space and it was distracting the workers. They said they had to do this because they want to deliver the bldg as close to schedule as possible

PriceChop @ 133 West 22nd...how could this be????

#3B

06/20/2008 Listed in StreetEasy with Cantor and Pecorella at $1,795,000
08/20/2008 Price decreased to $1,695,000

PHC

05/07/2008 Listed in StreetEasy with Cantor and Pecorella at $3,250,000
07/31/2008 Price decreased to $2,995,000

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/309137-condo-133-west-22nd-street-chelsea-manhattan

this could be because it is apt 3B
I wouldnt want to live on the third floor facing the front in any building

in other news I got a letter saying closings for the lower floors will begin in October

I got the letter too.
Also this could be because these are the two last units left and they want to be done with the sales part.

i agree.
hell they pretty much sold the whole building with barely any advertising

two pricechops hardly discredit the place

there are 4 units left and from what I hear, many more that are 'in contract' will be back on the market because the buyers can not get financing

and Sizzle my Fizzle...I assume you are on a high floor or facing the 'back' as you insulted the buyers of low floor, front facing apts

I said I wouldn't live in a low floor front facing apartment, how on earth is that insulting?. If anyone finds that insulting they need to grow the F up. 3B is over the entrance above the super, probably one of the crappiest apts in the building. It is hardly surprising it hasn't sold.
And the streeteasy listings aren't that accurate, my apt isn't even listed.

Sizzle my Fizzzle...you said..."probably one of the crappiest apts in the building" plesae list the other crappy apts

The sales office claims its the last 2. Where do you get your info from Apt_b?

What is hard for you to understand? If I were to spend 1.7 million dollars, as is the price of 3B...I would NOT spend it on a third floor apartment over the entrance to a building. That is why I call it crappy. Everyone has their own opinion, if you disagree good for you. 1.7 mil is a lot of freakin money, and if I'm looking to put it into real estate, there is a lot more out there than the apt over the entrance above the super. Thats all.

How is this really shoddy construction project doing with buyers given the current market?

This really shoddy building is in the process of falling over, probably wont get built and anyone with a contract is likely to be thrown in Gitmo. Disgusting these new hellholes are.

I have to agree that this building was really crappy in terms of finishing and layout - I saw 3B and the penthouse that were left about two months ago - of all the new construction I've seen in the area definitely the lowest quality, although the ppsf is lower than other new construction in the area so I figure it's factored in... wonder what will happen to the leftover apts now... 800 psf? I can only hope...

I am very happy with the finishing, the layout, the ppsf and the area of the 2 bedroom 2 bath I got in this building. I guess i am not the only one since only 2 units are left out and no extensive advertisements were ever made.

Taken the area and the location into consideration, I am sorry to disapoint you but I dont think your predictions are even close to what might happen.

Plus, more than an investment I see this apt at a home and I can't wait to move in and enjoy all the amenities...The world can crash around me, ppsf too, I will still enjoy it....trust me

Sizzlack, do you think we can create a group for the people who purchased in this building to keep each other updated on how things are going? how could we do that? I red on other threads that this has been done...

This was definitely an interesting building. Ultimately my wife who is a civil engineer was concerned that despite the ammenities it just wasn't a safely constructed building and definitely wasn't a safe block for when we have a child.

What wasn't safe about it? Can you give some specifics? That's a pretty serious statement.

Isn't this Ben Shaoul's development?

SemiPro is on to something. They built the sucker with toothpicks and plywood. The windows aren't windows at all but cellophane wrapped around concrete.

Myss79...we could start a blog at blogspot...perhaps 133w22.blogspot.com?

Sizzlack & myss79.. you guys are too funny. Time after time these guys wind you up and you guys bite every time...

am I not allowed a sense of humor? I would really prefer living in a pile of tooth picks and cellophane. They call it homeless chic. Next Fashion Week you're going to see models wearing trashbags and newspaper. It's hot.

Hi..I noticed a couple of apts seem to have suddenly been re-listed, 9D being one which I noticed this weekend. Wondering if some people are caught in the credit crunch and defaulting (though that seems odd since there's still some time before closings)...or if the sponsor is allowing folks to try and sell their options (also seems odd since the contracts specifically says you can't). Anyone have any insight as to what might be going on.

I passed the bldg today and it does not look nearly ready for Oct closings. They seem to have made lots of headway with the lobby, but the construction elevator is still there. I'm on an upper floor and thinking Jan or Feb. Not in too much of a rush...waiting for the world to come back to normal.

I like the idea of starting a blog. It would be nice to get to know the other owners.

What is happening to the people who are defaulting on their contracts when they can't get contracts? Are they losing their deposits and getting sued by the developer? Are they getting their deposits back? I know that in a contract on an existing code (not a new building), you get your money back if you can't get a mortgage.

I presume we will see some of going on with this market meltdown.

Anyone interested in learning more about this building can email Rich: rico252@gmail.com

Has anyone had walkthroughs yet? Apparently close letters have just been sent out.

Closing letters have indeed gone out...I got mine yesterday. There is no mention of the walkthrough process however. If anyone has any info it would be greatly appreciated.

What floors were the letters for? Steve at Cantor Pecorella said walkthroughs would be available when you got your letter, so I imagine if you call them they can offer more info on the process.

6th floor...for a late Nov close. I will give Steve a call.

am I crazy or does it look like there is no way the building will be habitable by a month from now? Only about 1/7th of the facade was up last time I checked. I didn't think I was going to be able to be in until early next year...guess I was wrong.

I had been thinking the same thing...although they do seem to be working hard. I walked by on Saturday Oct 4th and they were going full steam, workers everywhere, etc. I do remember them saying that closings/move ins could happen in advance of everything being completed (pool, gym, roofdeck), so they may just be focusing the next month on the basics to get it done.

They are pushing up the closings as fast as they can. The developer's construction loan is due and he can not refinance. If the closings do not start in Novemeber, the building will be foreclosed on and all construction will be in limbo.

Uh oh. Maybe I should make like Rufus and high tail it to the safety of Chicago right quick.

Price Chop #3B

06/20/2008 Previously listed in StreetEasy by Cantor and Pecorella for $1,795,000
07/16/2008 Listed in StreetEasy by Cantor and Pecorella at $1,795,000
08/23/2008 Price decreased to $1,695,000
08/27/2008 Cantor and Pecorella listing de-listed at $1,695,000
10/23/2008 Price decreased to $1,650,000

Do we really need to discuss this again? I don't exactly see how price chopping the most undesirable apartment in the building is proof of anything other than the apt itself is undesirable (hence not worth what they are asking).

OMG, this is not a price chop. Not even 10%. Please. Isn't this development on the watch list for construction quality?

I just got a closing notice for November. However, my realtor has been telling me that the building won't be ready for closing till January. I don't know what bank will give anyone a mortgage if the building is not ready. Is there an obligation to close per the contract or can you refuse to close until the building is ready? That's a bit of a danger if you close and then the developer forecloses due to lack of financing without finishing the building. You are then stuck with a unfinished building that they won't have any obligation to finish up if they go bankrupt.

Does anyone have any thoughts, I am getting worried about this.

Let me understand: you signed a contract involving hundreds of thousands of dollars and have no idea if you have to fork that cash over if the building is not finished? Are you insane? Did you use a real lawyer or a blow up doll? Seriously, that is about the first question most people would have wanted an answer to. New construction buyers continue to fascinate me.

I have not received a notice yet, but spoke with a number of banks and mortgage brokers. It is not going to be easy to get a mortgage for this building. It would be great to know if anyone has gotten a mortgage and who they used.

I am very concerned and feel like no one is telling me the truth about the financial health of this building or the quality of construction. I can only blame myself for buying a new development, but it was in a different market.

This situation is keeping awake at night and making my stomach churn.

I would like to know what you guys are talking about when you are mentioning the quality of contruction?
I am not an engineer so on what is based the assuption that the construction quality is low?
Also why the financial health of the building should be threatened if it is sold up to 98%?
I went to see the building on Thursday and it looked in pretty good shape. Construction is going ahead well!
Please give me some concrete explanation!

bellagavin - why are these lenders saying it will be hard to get financing for this building? I understand its close to fully sold. The only thing I can imagine is completion. We do require a TCO but do not require the buiding to be finished. We can do a handful of "spot" loans in the building if unfinished. Of course, I do not know the details of the building yet. But I can reach out to sales, management, or sponsor to get the building approved. I have personally gotten several buildings approved in Manhattan and I can find out what issues there may be for financing or even if there will be problems. Plase let me know what you know so far. sunny_hong@countrywide.com

call me stupid (maybe I am), but I signed the contract in a different market when the question of a developer default would never have arosen. actually i know what the contract says, but the issue is that suppose you close on the apartment prior to "full" completion of the building and the developer then doesn't complete the rest of the building due to whatever circumstannces, it doesn't matter what the contract says. You have a bunch of people who would then have a situation on their hands.

myss79 there are no concrete explanations. Two anonymous people on here made unsubstantiated claims regarding construction and finances, yet followed it up with zero proof.
It isn't hard for me to do the same thing about any other building, so until someone shows you something solid don't believe half the stupid sh*t you read on here. Some people just have sour grapes.

Sizzlack I guess you are right. I went last week in the building with steve. I saw unit 7h and the penthouse. The North view is really nice. The constrcution seems to be going very well. Did you have a chance to go and see it?

This is from my broker who spoke directly to Steve today. With regard to the couple of 1 bedrooms that have come up in the last week or so, these special situations, not signs of impending foreclosure as has been rumored. They are all in contract, but were purchased by friends and family of the developer who have special privileges and are allowed to assign their contracts prior to closing. If they cannot find someone to buy their contracts, they will have to close. Everything looks good with the November closings and the move-ins will be scheduled immediately after. Sorry to disappoint the seemingly large number of doomsayers here, but the news is positive and things are moving as the new owners have hoped. Good luck to all of the new owners...look forward to meeting you soon.

One of the mortgage brokers I spoke with said that she can't get me a mortgage because new condo rules have changed so now they require the building to be 100% complete or the association needs to take control. I'm not sure what others have heard. I'd appreciate any insight on how best to get mortgage on this building.

tfly, you've brought up an interesting point. "friends and family of the developer who have special priveleges and are allowed to assign their conracts prior to closing". Was this disclosed to you prior to you signing your contract or at any point since?

tfly have you had a chance to go up and see your unit? I still need to give Steve a call.

I haven't done my walkthrough yet...its scheduled for the week after next. I wanted to wait until it was pretty close to closing so that my punch list reflects as much progress as possible. As for the special privileges deal, I wasn't aware of it, but it may have been buried in the offering plan (400 or so pages). I had an outside attorney review it and there were no red flags according to them, so I am not too worried about it (that may well be fairly standard). The initial purchasers are still obligated to close if they can't assign them to someone else so it doesn't seem like a major deal.

Hi Bellagavin,

We are able to finance the units in this building. Please email me for more details.

Shaun_Mirza@Countrywide.com

Hi, wondering if any of the concerns about the developer and construction have been ruled out?

Hi everyone, I also share the concern that some of you raised here. I have trouble obtaining financing, is anyone in the same boat?? To be honest, I do not feel that great to move into the building in late Nov.... which seems would be in major construction for at least six months. I am also a new father to a 10 week baby, and i do not think that this is a good environment for a newborn. Please, if anyone have similar issues please email me, id be happy to get some new input and info. thanks alainedery1@hotmail.com

one more thing... would anyone want to meet and discuss some of these issues??? it seems much easier and faster than typing back and fourth. thanks

Good lord people. Can there be a little less bed wetting please? There are two groups of people posting things to this site. One group consists of people who have units in the building. The other group are people who work for other buildings who have been posting negative and unfounded information about this building since day one.

That goes for you too Abba. I want proof of this baby. A picture of you next to the building holding the baby with todays newspaper will suffice.

Well put, although it has been somewhat fascinating watching the trolling...why anyone who isn't an owner or prosepctive owner would care about this thread is beyond me.

As for anyone that is actually trying to get a mortgage in the building and is having trouble, my broker at Wells would be happy to assist. Post back and I will provide his contact info.

for anon: i am a real owner, u can check the list that you received from the sponsor with the names of the people who purchased units in the building. if you have any doubt, please feel free to call me at 9178436699 and i will introduce you to my wife and baby any time you want. Your message is very strong lets see if your strong enough to call me.

I guess sarcasm is hard to get when its typed out in sentence form.

Tell me about it.

Hi everyone,

I was just notified by my attorney that closing for my unit would be on December 8th. Please let me know if you guys heard anything as well.

myss 79, what floor is your apt?

its on the 8th

myss79...me too...for the 9th.

Building still looks NO where near ready tho...

According to the DOB website the building does not have a temporary CofO, which obviously means no closings can happen until they have that. It says they have an inspection scheduled for Nov 12th, a week from today. So keep that in mind when talking to your lawyers.

ok thanks Sizz. So when do you think closing will happen realistically spealing? why do you think they are rushing?

I do my walk-through next Friday...I will report back after that.

Myss79 says: why do you think they are rushing?

As stated 2 weeks ago:

They are pushing up the closings as fast as they can. The developer's construction loan is due and he can not refinance. If the closings do not start in Novemeber, the building will be foreclosed on and all construction will be in limbo.

But none will believe this as only 'Nice' news can be reported here and anything negative is only from a 'competing' building

They better hire a Gardener for this building, because it will be filled with Pansies!!!

I thought they were closing only 1-5 floors... How come 8 and 9th floor have got closings?

Also anyone know how Bloomberg's cancellation of the tax rebate impact us? Is that one and the same with the tax rebate we get due to investing in a new construction?

Has anyone addressed the concerns of value engineering in this building?

Apt boy could you please tell me more about your sources/?
Noone can close if the Temporary CoO is not there....so whether they try rushing it or not does not really matter...
I am ready to listen to anything negative you have to say as long as it is substantive and reliable...Just give let me know where you are getting your info from...Because so far it sound like your dark assumptions

i'm on the 4th floor and scheduled to close next week but no C of O yet! It's quite stressful because i have to put all the moving plans on hold and worried that my mortgage will expire....

timing-wise, i wished the building can manage everything better.

nycgal...what day were scheduled to close next week?
Given that the inspection is scheduled for Wednesday, they certainly seem to be cutting it close.
It wouldn't surprise me if they were trying to hurry up some closings because they need money to finish the building
I don't think AptBoy is totally off base but Im not sure why he expects people to blindly trust what he says after how much hes hated on this building.

were you rather

they said we are penciled in for friday the 14th...
yeah im getting anxioius because there is a lot to do if we do indeed close, was hoping to move in the same day..

The sales office and sponsor's attorney deny any problems with financing or defaulting on contracts...so take that for whatever it's worth. A few people have flipped their contracts. And the common areas of the building aren't supposed to be "finalized" until Spring '09, with no specifics.

yeah i was a bit bummed knowing that we still have to pay common charges for areas that arent finished yet. i heard other condos delay these charges...

They did say back in Feb that it was likely that closings would take place ahead of all of the common areas being finished. My realtor said they have laid down temporary carpets in the hallways so damage is limited during the collective move-ins. It does seem like they are relatively on top of it. As for the CofO, I can't see why they wouldn't wait until the last second...get as much done before the inspection and assuming it goes through, start closing. I doubt other new construction buildings operate any other way...why would a building want a big gap between the CofO and the closings?

Is it common for banks to ask for a copy of the offering plan? Has anyone worked on this? Do you give your copy?

Yes it is...my bank (Wells Fargo) asked for it as well as the Schedule A for apparaisal purposes.

Spoke to a bank - they said

"The difficult part of this is the zip code in which this property states that it is in a stressed market and that the bank will lend 10% less of what the maximum loan to value is."

Is anyone having similar feedback?

I cant speak to that Laughinreverse but I just noticed your post from last week about closings on floors 1-5. I just remembered that myself and thought it odd, Steve had said a while ago they were getting the tempCofO in November for floors 1-5 and now they're all of a sudden up to 9? I walked by today (inspection day) and I still don't see how this place is anywhere close to being finished. Apartments on the second floor still looked very raw.

Anyone with concerns or questions regarding banks and closing due to appraisal values (declining market) or Amount of units sold (some of the stipulations raised through the Condo Questioner). I can assist, I am a bank and I work with Portfolio Lenders that will lend up to $2.5M on one loan. With rates as low as 5 3/8 on a 5-1 ARM. The PL have tight lending requirements (regards to DTI #'s). Please feel free to contact me to discuss your new purchase. You can reach me at 646-419-4192. daniel.ledven@stanleycapital.com

I heard that one unit closed already. Not sure how it would be possible to close without the building having insurance...