Hurricane Preparedness

Oh please. This is New York. Would have to be a full-on cat-5 for ANYTHING to be closed. And even then, dollars to donuts CVS and the corner Korean will still be open. TJ Maxx and Filene's will probably offer a special Hurricane discount. But close? Never.

My Chinese delivery guy has a special hurricane raincoat

whatever...the stormpulse link is great..better yet is that my house on the CT coast is tracked for a dead-on hit..could wipe my property to a clean slate

I came down to Miami to close things up. Gentle rain this morning and now nothing. I hope the same for New York even though as Squid points out, nothing will be closed. It's 81 degrees and kind of nice now. Might as well stay and enjoy the weekend.

Squid, I think you overestimate NYC's defensibility against storms. A mere Cat3 would result in saltwater in the subway system, which carries a high risk of damage to all the signaling equipment etc. down in the tunnels and could cripple NYC transit for weeks or months. Not sure how CVS or the corner bodega will be able to stay open if its employees can't get to work.

Sold all my gold and went long in Pop Tarts and Beer

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/11/14/business/yourmoney/14wal.html

Wal-Mart's chief information officer, pressed her staff to come up with forecasts based on what had happened when Hurricane Charley struck

"We didn't know in the past that strawberry Pop-Tarts and beer increase in sales, like seven times their normal sales rate, ahead of a hurricane,"

trucks filled with toaster pastries and six-packs were soon speeding down Interstate 95 toward Wal-Marts in the path of the hurricane

All jokes aside, would love advise on protecting trees in planters on a roof deck.
Any links with pictures, paint by numbers, anything....thank you :)

Of course NYC is not only immune to real-estate market downturns, but also earthquakes, hurricanes, tsunami, civil unrest, and basically anything else that citizens of this fine city rate as beneath them.

Sudden barometric pressure change can lead to uterine contractions during the latter stages of pregnancy. So if that is your currnet condition, don't travel too far from the hospital and get ready to call your kid either Irene or Ira.

If you are not in the 3 day cone, you are fine. Days 4-5 are NOT reliable. Repeat; not reliable for day 4 and 5. It will probably shift.

Here's the radar off of Miami; the green area is sprinkles. The clear area, in the middle, is the wind.

http://radar.weather.gov/radar.php?rid=AMX&product=N0Z&overlay=11101111&loop=no Not a big deal.

This time . . .

Truth, if the tree is not heavily leafed it
it might be okay as it won't act as a sail. For the others, if you have a sturdy railing around the terrace you might try using some rope wrapping it around the trunk and then the railing. I've done this with one tree that always went over in the wind using wire wrapped in some green foam

and a partridge in a pear tree.

Will Irene hit Columbia County?

Rain in Miami Beach is now getting steady nothing out of the ordinary. Just a gloomy day of which there aren't many.

Truth, they carry the foam wire at harrisseeds.com,comes in a roll and you might be able to find it a local garden store.

home depot and lowes if it hits. People will have to rebuild

Thanks PH41,
My other problem is my decking fences are a bit weathered with loose boards so my tieoffs are gonna have to be very specific.
Im debating between securing those loose boards or pulling them off and secure after.

How did your trees fair after the storm...leafless? Maybe some pruning on saturday as well.

I would take as many plants in as possible. You can cover the plants if they aren't too high with thick black plastic type bags and use duct tape to secure it. You can also use a stretchy type plant tape (like you would use on tomato plants) to tie them together. Then you pray.

I don't think you trees will be leafless following the storm. They are pretty strong if they are fresh and not ready to fall off. It's kind of remarkable the way nature remains following a storm but things we built can go fall down. I wouldn't bother pruning unless you have a weak tree. Go with the flow.

If you are near water or have big windows you can tape them or take a few pieces of wood and hammer them onto the outside.

I know this is what my parents did when they were preparing for Hurricane Gloria. They lived right on the Bay on the South Shore of LI at the time so they were a dead hit. I don't think we had any broken windows or glass doors.

When Hurricane Floyd hit Manhattan (eye of the storm over Queens), my local restaurant was still making deliveries.

If a potted plant from someone's landscaped private terrace flies off and hits my Chinese delivery guy I'm going to be really mad. So please tie them down.

Can you get any more hipster Manhattan? Expecting hurricane force winds, torrential rains, flooding and coop board members are only concerned that some poor guy on a bike with a big chain wrapped under the seat and twelve plastic bags draped on the handlebars can deliver his pad thai.

and he probably won't tip him either!

Indian Point after earthquake, storm surge and sustained 75+ mph winds. I want my pork fried rice, dammit!

Everything is 3 to 8 feet high, can't really take anything down and nowhere to put them anyway.
Some japanese maples, those bushes that look like baby pine trees (sorry Im a landscape novice),a couple cherry trees, grape vines, blackberries, some rose bushes,etc.
Praying for the storm to hang a sharp left. Sorry NC. lol

Anyone been around an asian typhoon? A northeast hurricane is a drizzle to your pork fried rice deliveryman. I bet you get your order faster than usual because he'll have more available open spots to tie off his ride.

TS10: I am in similar sitch. Roofdeck and planters. First get as much as you can off the roof. Chairs, umbrellas, anything you can move. Think if you can move it a 60mph wind can. Next take the big pieces and put them somewhere safer than the middle of everything. Maybe wedge against parapet walls. Dont bag and tape. The bag makes it worse. The plants let the wind through. Your old plants have good roots and will probably be ok.

@truthskr10
Why don't you call a nursery for advice? Would call ASAP as Saturday may be too late. There's a possibility that the public transit system will being shut down completely.

Good luck. Also, make sure that's heavy duty rope (again ask at the hardware store)...maybe chains?. I'm a sailor. Been in 30 knot winds. 'Nuff said.

@pulaski
Thanks for the http://www.stormpulse.com/atlantic site. I live in one of the A flood zones, so for me this is personal.

Oh, lordy.

Truthskr; lay the plants down on their sides, they will blow over. Also, water them thoroughly the day before. There's not a lot of water with this storm, and the wind can dehydrate your plants to the point of killing them. Pines are probably fine, anything with leaves is an issue. You can also tie them to the railing with strips of cloth or pantyhose.

The concern about a hurricane like this is not really the hurricane; it's the possibility of tornados spinning off of the main storm. They are unpredictable and can cover a very wide area. They are a LOT more damaging than an 85 mph storm.

And the one thing that is unique to Manhattan is the wind tunnel effects of air forced between large buildings. That should be really interesting.

Battery Park is not looking so attractive right now.

Basement apartments are not the great deals they appear to be.

Thanks all. I think Im gonna support the trees as much as I can tying off with rope to sections of the deck.
There is no option of laying anything down, everything is in planters that are built in or part of the deck.

Right now Im so pissed my A/C compressor went kaput. Sounded funny after the earthquake.
SO what's the verdict on cracking the windows during the storm as I recall someone asking somewhere on this thread or another.
Does it alleviate pressure? Take away stability?

NYC flood zones: http://econyc.journalism.cuny.edu/files/2011/05/LilyKara2.jpg

Then the question is, how does one prevent window breakage on high floors? Can't exactly batten the hatches normally (plywood boards nailed to the outside windowframes) on a high-rise...

windows closed

http://www.snopes.com/science/hurricane.asp

Anyone leaving NYC this weekend due to the storm? I'm thinking about leaving, but I am very concerned about how the media and gov't over sensationalize just about every weather related event to the point of making all the warnings a meaningless shout of "crying wolf".

Anyone leaving NYC this weekend due to the storm? I'm thinking about leaving, but I am very concerned about how the media and gov't over sensationalize just about every weather related event to the point of making all the warnings a meaningless shout of "crying wolf".

An open window during a hurricane causes negative pressure. In a house, the roof will come off. Keep windows tightly closed.

http://www.snopes.com/science/hurricane.asp

A thought - the storm, although huge in size, seems to be weakening (the eyewall has collapsed) and most projections see this as a tropical storm in the NY area. What I perceive is a diffuse uber reaction. 1) Politicians, particularly Bloomberg and Christie, who were roundly criticized for their failures in the December 2010 storm are now proving that they are great disaster managers. If they over prepared, they will blame the forecasters. 2) The media - need I say more 3) The retailers - what a way to move inventory. Any thoughts?

yes.

if you were bloomberg or christie, would you now go to the media and tell everyone, no worries?

if you were the media, would you now no longer report on the storm or just scoff at it?

if you were a retailer, would you close?

FYI, the MTA is reportedly beginning a complete shutdown of the subway system starting on Saturday afternoon.

Now it's getting scary...no subway. Hope the buses will continue to run.

"Then the question is, how does one prevent window breakage on high floors?"

Cover every square inch with masking tape to minimize the glass blowout if and when they do shatter. That's all you can do.

Unless, of course, you followed the advice I've been giving all along about getting that 3M film installed on all of your windows to cut down on the UV and infrared sun rays, in which case you're covered.

Matt--off topic--do you have experience with that 3M film? How well does it shield UV rays? Does it actually prevent fading to fabric and other objects (paintings, etc)?

"Now it's getting scary...no subway. Hope the buses will continue to run."

Think again.

From the New York Governor's Office:

On Governor Cuomo's orders, the following actions are being implemented immediately:
•The New York Army and Air National Guard will deploy up to 900 soldiers and airmen and over 100 vehicles to support civil authorities; those troops have already begun to report
•The Metropolitan Transit Authority will institute a system-wide shut-down when trains and buses begin their final runs starting at approximately noon on Saturday; the shut-down will include subways, buses, Long Island Rail Road, Metro-North Railroad, and Access-A-Ride
•If sustained wind speeds exceed 60 mph, all of the following bridges will be closed to all traffic: George Washington Bridge, Tappan Zee bridge, all bridges operated by the Triborough Bridge and Tunnel Authority, and the following Hudson River bridges: Bear Mountain Bridge, Newburgh-Beacon, Mid-Hudson (Poughkeepsie), Kingston-Rhinecliff, and Rip Van Winkle (Catskill)
•The New York State Thruway and possibly other major highways will also be closed if sustained wind speeds exceed 60 mph; further closings will be announced as the storm progresses
•LIPA will have 2,500 line workers and tree trim personnel available throughout the weekend for emergency repair work, its largest emergency roster ever
•175 extra ambulances and personnel will be deployed in regions expected to be hit the hardest by the storm

"LIVE: Bloomberg Orders Mandatory Evacuations For Low-Lying Areas"

"Units will be patrolling streets to encourage people to leave. Bloomberg says no one will get fined or go to jail for violated the order — but people might die. He says the city doesn't have the manpower to go door-to-door to get people out. "We're not trying to punish people; we're trying to protect them."

http://www.businessinsider.com/live-hurricane-irene-charges-toward-new-york-city-2011-8-26

2:31 PM | Bloomberg on looting
"I think you can expect people in NYC to behave, and to understand we're all in this together."

this is really the end, isn't it. (sorry)

"Matt--off topic--do you have experience with that 3M film? How well does it shield UV rays? Does it actually prevent fading to fabric and other objects (paintings, etc)?"

It's amazing.

And during the warmer months it easily makes a 15 degree difference in the apartment, so AC doesn't have to work nearly as hard.

by the way lucille, you didn't answer my question on the other thread. Exactly what are you saying I did or said?

Matt--Sorry, do you have a link to that 3M film? Thanks.

Thanks, Matt--we've been considering using it because our new place gets mega sun exposure. Glad to hear from someone with experience.

Hug--just Google 3M window film

MetroSolar on Long Island did my windows. I think they're an exclusive distributor of the 3M window film. It cost me about $200 per window (standard sized double-hung). They did the installation (and did such a perfect job that it looks like the glass itself was slightly tinted).

your vacation

my vacation?

Open Houses on Sunday may truly be "open"

are we safe in Manhattan???

but you're already in hunters burg. no worries.

anybody knows wether Manhattan is a direct hit? what to be expected?

Bill Gates need to work faster!

"Five U.S. Patent and Trade Office patent applications, made public on July 9, [2009] propose slowing hurricanes by pumping cold, deep-ocean water in their paths from barges."

http://www.usatoday.com/weather/research/2009-07-15-gates-hurricanes_N.htm

"Bloomberg says no one will get fined or go to jail for violated the order — but people might die."

This sounds like something the Mob would say.

"Hope the buses will continue to run."

Nope, they are not running either.

so, if you were magically made the mayor, what would you have done?

Every ZipCar in NYC should be booked right about now...

you are a fool.

Are there areas of Columbia County that are in Zone A?

Worst.Discussion.Ever.

I guess all the adults have left the City already....

Correct. You are better than everyone else.

Lad - I know you're going through the roof with your renovation/expansion. Hope you're protected from storm damage.

http://www.stormpulse.com
tracking the exact path

midtowner: "anybody knows wether Manhattan is a direct hit? what to be expected?"

So far yes. The NYT.com site has a map on front page showing likely path of storm.

Ph41, thanks for the well wishes. Did I mention that a freak late July storm flooded our unit and two others? A hurricane with a temporary roof has me breathing into a paper bag, especially given that I'm out of town and can't make it home.

Fortunately I have two people watching the apartment for me and the contractor has also promised to stop in. And all throughout the previous August hard rains, the roof has held up with nary a drip. Breathe, breathe, breathe....

Update at 11:00am Saturday:

ConEdison will most likely shut off power in Lower Manhattan on Saturday night. NY1 suggests you move uptown or be prepared to use stairs since power to elevators will be down, no refrigerators, etc.

East River between 4am and 8am Sunday predicted to flood parts of Downtown, Battery Park.

Sustained, repeat, sustained winds predicted at 50mph, gusts up to 70. Truth, you may wanna maybe bring those trees in.

50-60 mph winds often happen in a severe thunderstorm. Why are the city officials and others freaking out to this degree over a severe thunderstorm? Of course, we should be aware, vigilant, careful, etc., but cutting off power, shutting down the subways and the like is just not called for. It is likely that the real disruption caused by this storm is the over-reaction, not the storm itself.

Here is the map of the storm's path.
http://www.nytimes.com/projects/hurricanes/#!/2011/Irene?hp

"50-60 mph winds often happen in a severe thunderstorm. Why are the city officials and others freaking out to this degree over a severe thunderstorm? "

You are mistaken. There are often GUSTS of UP TO 50-60 mmiles per hour during severe thunderstorms. There have NOT been, in this decade, SUSTAINED winds (as in for hours at a time) that strong or stronger in NYC. The above map actually shows that the winds will be more like 70-80MPH. And SUSTAINED. Not short gusts.

>50-60 mph winds often happen in a severe thunderstorm. Why are the city officials and others freaking out to this degree over a severe thunderstorm? Of course, we should be aware, vigilant, careful, etc., but cutting off power, shutting down the subways and the like is just not called for. It is likely that the real disruption caused by this storm is the over-reaction, not the storm itself.

Brilliant. A virgin mid-40s paralegal living in a smallish 1 bedroom rental in midtown east to be close to work is someone who has the most expertise on this matter.

I did not say that 50-60 mph winds are sustained in severe thunderstorms (I said it hits that), so you have re-framed the argument to suit your purpose. What happens at 70-80 mph winds? Trees in Central Park get knocked over. Don't go to Central Park. The winds topped 90 in Hurricane Gloria and not that much happened in NYC. I am not saying we shouldn't be prepared for significant flooding, high winds and other things. I am all for being prepared by staying indoors, avoiding windows, stocking up on water in case we lose power, etc. I am, however, against panicking, which is what closing the subways and shutting off the power is. It also unnecessarily freaks out people.

We know exactly what you said, we quoted you, our freaked out delicate virgin flower in midtown east.

Its unsafe for above ground trains to move in sustained winds above 40-50 MPH. Second, the subway system flooded in 2008 and the trains did not work.

Third, hurricane Gloria was not on a direct path for the City the way this one is.

Hard to say if this is being over-hyped, but it sure feels like it. It's down to a mid level category one and may only be a tropical storm when it hits Manhattan. Did Katrina scare politicians into action regardless of need for fear of being compared to George W?

what would you have done if you were in charge?

I did not put ANY words in your mouth, MidtownerEast. I simply stated the facts. The fact is there are often GUSTS of UP TO 50-60 mmiles per hour during severe thunderstorms. There have NOT been, in this decade, SUSTAINED winds (as in for hours at a time) that strong or stronger in NYC. The above map actually shows that the winds will be more like 70-80MPH. And SUSTAINED. Not short gusts.

Meanwhile the anticipation is getting boring. I can't settle down to a project, so shuttle between naps and reading and looking at maps.

Went to the deli for brownie mix. There's a line all the way to the back of people stocking up, so settled for pecan bars at Giacomo's.

will windows pop out?....if this is so serious, isn't that a serious worry?

if the issue is water at ground level, other than the hassle of knocking out power, is that a one or two day pump it out problem, or something more serious?...

They might leak, but unlikely to pop out and go flying. High-rises are over-engineered to cope with more wind than we'll get. I don't know about those standard aluminum replacement windows that most pre-war mid-rises have.

The flooded cellar is the problem. After getting rid of the water, there's lots of stuff to fix or replace. E.g., the motors that pump water up to the roof tanks or to apartments, all the electrical/HVAC/elevator/gas stuff, and on and on.

There's an interesting discussion about window performance at http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/windows/msg0809090610559.html

We are of the same mind, NWT. I just made cookies.

ali

That's a better idea. Brownies are too easy, anyway. I just found a bag of pecans from Christmas, so tomorrow will be Pecan Meltaways.

According to New York City's Office of Emergency Management, the last hurricane to pass directly over the city was in 1821. The storm surge was so high that the city was flooded up to Canal Street.

so where is this f'in storm

in huntersburg

hey there cc. how are you holding up?

take a hint:

300_mercer
about 7 hours ago
ignore this person
report abuse

Lucillebluth is a typical example of useless chatter (not saying offensive). Just look at this post itself.

at least i'm not offensive. i won't even tell you what they say about you.

CNN now has it down to 85 mph. This seems in line to what we experience along the Hudson on windy days. I think the only people who should be concerned are those that have exposure to flooding.

Make sure to tape up the window in your shower.

If I had windows....

It's coming: full force should be felt between Saturday evening into Sunday evening. The Governor upped the number of National Guardsmen available for NYC to two thousand. The hurricane is six hundred miles across and the center of it is still on track to hit NYC.

riversider has once again won the stupid riversider post of the month.

way to go.

CNN: Irene down to 80 mph

be sure to walk the dog around midnight right down by the river.