Hello all-I am returning to NYC to finish school, I have not lived there in over 10 years. I love NYC it's my home, but I am hitting a wall with both the housing dept of my college and the brokers/rental agents having this 40x/80x the rent rule-How do you get around this? Mind you, I am coming from a state with much lower salaries, I am looking for a 2-3 BR (I have 2 teens and a 9 year old), I... [more]
Hello all-I am returning to NYC to finish school, I have not lived there in over 10 years. I love NYC it's my home, but I am hitting a wall with both the housing dept of my college and the brokers/rental agents having this 40x/80x the rent rule-How do you get around this? Mind you, I am coming from a state with much lower salaries, I am looking for a 2-3 BR (I have 2 teens and a 9 year old), I know that there are still affordable places out there-looking to keep it between 1700-2300-2500 tops-If this ludicrous rule were true, no adult students could ever live in NYC-since you study FT and may not work at all or PT at best, you won't make six figures. I feel this tactic is aimed at prospective out of state renters-Feels like a grift right off the bat-No one I know that is in school makes 150-200k to qualify for a place. How does this work? I need a landlord whom will work with a FT adult employed student with kids and I am so aggravated I have been looking since April-since I am not 20 and can be gouged for a high dollar dorm, the achool's housing assistance is very minimal they're not at all interested in helping me and I have had to keep pushing my entry date over and over and am reaching the end of the time alotted to do so and it's stressing me out-I occasionally get an outdated off campus housing list to call or email. But again no family off campus housing is designated so I am up a creek in having their assistance.
Finding a safe dwelling from afar is very nervewracking, since I don't want to end up in crack town or a roach motel-Please let me know which one of you have had to make this move with modest means and from a lower paying state and had success without selling your soul or raising a year's salary to move, my window is less than 5 months. I am employed and will be in school for another 3-4 years. Areas of interest-Hudson Heights, Midtown, Turtle Bay, UWS, Murray Hill, SoHo, LES, Central Pk So. Looking for more family oriented areas-Not in B'klyn or any other gentrified urban burbs. I'm in my 40's, over that.
Just better HS's and Elementary Schools and safe lower crime area with affordable rent, limited entry, washer/dryer, updated no fee or by owner will do-I am flexible on the area-also realistic that some of the ones I listed may be out of that range-I was looking at these zips based on the schools-10010,10023,10011,10036,10001.10019. Any suggestions on neighborhoods, rents, schools and great buildings that are safe and family friendly are sincerely appreciated-Happy Holidays friends!
[less]
Response by kcin122
over 14 years ago
Posts: 3
Member since: Dec 2007
For the most part the 40x/80x rule is made by the landlord and not the broker. A landlord may forgive the fact you do not make 40x the rent if you can pay multiple months up front or have large amount of money in a bank account. Other than that I do not see you renting a 2/3 bedroom anywhere in those areas for that amount of money. Hudson Heights is your best bet.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by ph41
over 14 years ago
Posts: 3390
Member since: Feb 2008
Maybe Queens? Otherwise you have totally unrealistic expectations as to location (UES, CPS, Murray Hill). This has nothing to do with your being a student . Unfortunately your income is just too low for the size of apartment you need.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by Fairway
over 14 years ago
Posts: 156
Member since: Feb 2011
Either get a guarantor or you will pay a lot upfront. You should look in Queens, maybe Staten Island, nicer parts of the Bronx, New Jersey. If you want to be in Manhattan, look in Harlem, Inwood and Washington Heights. In the UES you may find a small 2 bedroom for $2500 but not a family type apartment by any means. Also forget about washer/dryer and you should look at fee apartments to expand your limited options.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by maly
over 14 years ago
Posts: 1377
Member since: Jan 2009
Manhattan (and probably Brooklyn as well) are pretty much out of the question with your budget and your public school requirements. Neighborhoods with great public schools are very expensive. I would look at Forrest Hills in Queens; it's family-oriented, it has some of the best schools in the city, and because of the low "fun" quotient (which you don't care about anyway, with FT studies and 3 kids), the rents are more affordable.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by ab_11218
over 14 years ago
Posts: 2017
Member since: May 2009
i would like the same as you just the difference is that i have the 40X based on your price range. you need a 3 br with the size of your family. i have to live in brooklyn to afford having the kids in a safe neighborhood with good schools and you will have to do the same.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by maly
over 14 years ago
Posts: 1377
Member since: Jan 2009
ab, can you get a 3-bedroom apt with good public schools in Brooklyn for less than $2,500?
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by Fairway
over 14 years ago
Posts: 156
Member since: Feb 2011
Good public schools? The kids will have an interesting year and what doesn't kill you makes you stronger.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by nyc10023
over 14 years ago
Posts: 7614
Member since: Nov 2008
Are your teens already in HS or middle school? There are no good zoned middles in Manhattan, except for UES. Zoned HS in Manhattan uniformly bad. Your best bet for zoned schools going from K-12 is in Queens - look up B. Cardozo and also Midwood in Bk.
As for income requirements, smaller LLs who live in their buildings are probably the most flexible. No-one's looking to gouge you from out-of-state, we all get the same treatment.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by nyc10023
over 14 years ago
Posts: 7614
Member since: Nov 2008
Also, do you have to be in the city? How about an apartment in a town with good schools in NJ or Westchester?
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by ab_11218
over 14 years ago
Posts: 2017
Member since: May 2009
i have 3 br/2 bth for $1850 and moving to one for $1650 in a month. have to pay for my own heat and hot water ($150 winter/$40 summer). i am way out south though.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by NYCMatt
over 14 years ago
Posts: 7523
Member since: May 2009
"I know that there are still affordable places out there-looking to keep it between 1700-2300-2500 tops-If this ludicrous rule were true, no adult students could ever live in NYC-since you study FT and may not work at all or PT at best, you won't make six figures. I feel this tactic is aimed at prospective out of state renters-Feels like a grift right off the bat-No one I know that is in school makes 150-200k to qualify for a place."
Gosh golly gee. Life isn't fair, sweetie.
I'd love to quit my job and devote my life full-time to volunteering at soup kitchens. But alas! No adult full-time soup kitchen volunteers make six figures! How could they possibly live in NYC?? Could this "ludicrous" 40x tactic be aimed at prospective out-of-state renters who want to serve soup to the poor and hungry?
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by gumball
over 14 years ago
Posts: 39
Member since: Aug 2008
is this a joke..? are you sure you're originally from nyc? even people with full time jobs can't afford to live in manhattan. what makes you think you can find a 3br apartment for 1700??? get a reality check, you will have to commute from the outer boroughs. if you care about your kids' education, probably queens is the best option for you.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by angray
over 14 years ago
Posts: 103
Member since: Sep 2011
Stuck in prices when she was last in NYC?
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by NYCMatt
over 14 years ago
Posts: 7523
Member since: May 2009
It's the sense of entitlement that's most galling.
So she's a single mom. So she's in school. So of COURSE a landlord should just let her pay whatever she wants, because she "needs" a three-bedroom in a good school zone.
Hell, I think the mayor should also give her a Maybach to ferry her precious flowers to and from school. They need transportation, after all ...
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by West34
over 14 years ago
Posts: 1040
Member since: Mar 2009
Re: It's the sense of entitlement that's most galling
Seems more like naivete (Soho, CPS). Kinda cute actually.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by dwell
over 14 years ago
Posts: 2341
Member since: Jul 2008
IMO, it makes no sense to "finish school" in the most expensive city in the USA as a FT student with 3 kids & school isn't giving you any $. Probably better to finish school in a cheaper city & then get a job in NYC.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by Squid
over 14 years ago
Posts: 1399
Member since: Sep 2008
First off, paragraphs are your friends. Do everyone a favor and use them next time.
"Not in B'klyn or any other gentrified urban burbs"
You couldn't afford it anyway. And FYI Brooklyn is not a "burb". It is a borough.
"looking to keep it between 1700-2300-2500 tops"
Good luck with that. Maybe, but not likely, in Wa Heights or LES. But you'll probably have to suck it up and deal with a "roach motel" in a "crack village". (Really?)
"brokers/rental agents having this 40x/80x the rent rule-How do you get around this?"
You forget trying to live in NYC. You find an affordable home in the burbs and commute like everyone else of limited means.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by uwsmom
over 14 years ago
Posts: 1945
Member since: Dec 2008
Hmm, interesting. I agree with dwell, but perhaps your decisions are already made. as others have said, your budget for manhattan is not realistic. the only other alternative I can think of is a work-for-rent situation. I did this early on in grad school (working part-time as a nanny/housekeeper in exchange for rent + 2nd job + grad school). I suppose your school, or others nearby, may have postings for this type of live/work situation. Or maybe your teenage children, if old enough, could work after school and help contribute to the rent (no, i'm not joking). good luck!
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by West34
over 14 years ago
Posts: 1040
Member since: Mar 2009
Here's an idea - $2500 will get you a nice little Manhattan one bedroom - buy a set of bunk beds and a pullout couch and treat the whole thing as an extended urban camping trip for the whole family.
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by MAV
over 14 years ago
Posts: 502
Member since: Sep 2007
What part of "If I can make it there, I'm can make it anywhere" sounds like the easy part?
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by MAV
over 14 years ago
Posts: 502
Member since: Sep 2007
or something like that....
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by gumball
over 14 years ago
Posts: 39
Member since: Aug 2008
only ingredient missing from this story to make it a bonafide trollpost is if she was pursuing a degree in poetry or philosophy from devry
Ignored comment.
Unhide
Response by Wbottom
over 14 years ago
Posts: 2142
Member since: May 2010
sandy--work as a private tutor--i am not kidding--many wealthy parents in ny dont blink at paying tutoring companies several hundreds of dollars per hour--here's one that charges up to 550$ per hour for "master tutors"--not sure how much trickles down to the tutoir, but it is probably substantial
For the most part the 40x/80x rule is made by the landlord and not the broker. A landlord may forgive the fact you do not make 40x the rent if you can pay multiple months up front or have large amount of money in a bank account. Other than that I do not see you renting a 2/3 bedroom anywhere in those areas for that amount of money. Hudson Heights is your best bet.
Maybe Queens? Otherwise you have totally unrealistic expectations as to location (UES, CPS, Murray Hill). This has nothing to do with your being a student . Unfortunately your income is just too low for the size of apartment you need.
Either get a guarantor or you will pay a lot upfront. You should look in Queens, maybe Staten Island, nicer parts of the Bronx, New Jersey. If you want to be in Manhattan, look in Harlem, Inwood and Washington Heights. In the UES you may find a small 2 bedroom for $2500 but not a family type apartment by any means. Also forget about washer/dryer and you should look at fee apartments to expand your limited options.
Manhattan (and probably Brooklyn as well) are pretty much out of the question with your budget and your public school requirements. Neighborhoods with great public schools are very expensive. I would look at Forrest Hills in Queens; it's family-oriented, it has some of the best schools in the city, and because of the low "fun" quotient (which you don't care about anyway, with FT studies and 3 kids), the rents are more affordable.
i would like the same as you just the difference is that i have the 40X based on your price range. you need a 3 br with the size of your family. i have to live in brooklyn to afford having the kids in a safe neighborhood with good schools and you will have to do the same.
ab, can you get a 3-bedroom apt with good public schools in Brooklyn for less than $2,500?
Good public schools? The kids will have an interesting year and what doesn't kill you makes you stronger.
Are your teens already in HS or middle school? There are no good zoned middles in Manhattan, except for UES. Zoned HS in Manhattan uniformly bad. Your best bet for zoned schools going from K-12 is in Queens - look up B. Cardozo and also Midwood in Bk.
As for income requirements, smaller LLs who live in their buildings are probably the most flexible. No-one's looking to gouge you from out-of-state, we all get the same treatment.
Also, do you have to be in the city? How about an apartment in a town with good schools in NJ or Westchester?
i have 3 br/2 bth for $1850 and moving to one for $1650 in a month. have to pay for my own heat and hot water ($150 winter/$40 summer). i am way out south though.
"I know that there are still affordable places out there-looking to keep it between 1700-2300-2500 tops-If this ludicrous rule were true, no adult students could ever live in NYC-since you study FT and may not work at all or PT at best, you won't make six figures. I feel this tactic is aimed at prospective out of state renters-Feels like a grift right off the bat-No one I know that is in school makes 150-200k to qualify for a place."
Gosh golly gee. Life isn't fair, sweetie.
I'd love to quit my job and devote my life full-time to volunteering at soup kitchens. But alas! No adult full-time soup kitchen volunteers make six figures! How could they possibly live in NYC?? Could this "ludicrous" 40x tactic be aimed at prospective out-of-state renters who want to serve soup to the poor and hungry?
is this a joke..? are you sure you're originally from nyc? even people with full time jobs can't afford to live in manhattan. what makes you think you can find a 3br apartment for 1700??? get a reality check, you will have to commute from the outer boroughs. if you care about your kids' education, probably queens is the best option for you.
Stuck in prices when she was last in NYC?
It's the sense of entitlement that's most galling.
So she's a single mom. So she's in school. So of COURSE a landlord should just let her pay whatever she wants, because she "needs" a three-bedroom in a good school zone.
Hell, I think the mayor should also give her a Maybach to ferry her precious flowers to and from school. They need transportation, after all ...
Re: It's the sense of entitlement that's most galling
Seems more like naivete (Soho, CPS). Kinda cute actually.
IMO, it makes no sense to "finish school" in the most expensive city in the USA as a FT student with 3 kids & school isn't giving you any $. Probably better to finish school in a cheaper city & then get a job in NYC.
First off, paragraphs are your friends. Do everyone a favor and use them next time.
"Not in B'klyn or any other gentrified urban burbs"
You couldn't afford it anyway. And FYI Brooklyn is not a "burb". It is a borough.
"looking to keep it between 1700-2300-2500 tops"
Good luck with that. Maybe, but not likely, in Wa Heights or LES. But you'll probably have to suck it up and deal with a "roach motel" in a "crack village". (Really?)
"brokers/rental agents having this 40x/80x the rent rule-How do you get around this?"
You forget trying to live in NYC. You find an affordable home in the burbs and commute like everyone else of limited means.
Hmm, interesting. I agree with dwell, but perhaps your decisions are already made. as others have said, your budget for manhattan is not realistic. the only other alternative I can think of is a work-for-rent situation. I did this early on in grad school (working part-time as a nanny/housekeeper in exchange for rent + 2nd job + grad school). I suppose your school, or others nearby, may have postings for this type of live/work situation. Or maybe your teenage children, if old enough, could work after school and help contribute to the rent (no, i'm not joking). good luck!
Here's an idea - $2500 will get you a nice little Manhattan one bedroom - buy a set of bunk beds and a pullout couch and treat the whole thing as an extended urban camping trip for the whole family.
What part of "If I can make it there, I'm can make it anywhere" sounds like the easy part?
or something like that....
only ingredient missing from this story to make it a bonafide trollpost is if she was pursuing a degree in poetry or philosophy from devry
sandy--work as a private tutor--i am not kidding--many wealthy parents in ny dont blink at paying tutoring companies several hundreds of dollars per hour--here's one that charges up to 550$ per hour for "master tutors"--not sure how much trickles down to the tutoir, but it is probably substantial
http://www.advantagetesting.com/locations/new-york
If you are a lawyer charging $1,000, it's no big deal to pay $550 for tutoring. Just stay "one more" hour "in the office"