storage bins approach price of Manhattan studio

Then the Laureate's are a bargain. 13 have sold so far, but 12 were lumped in with apartments so can't tell the price. One sold separately for $839 per ft² to an earlier apartment buyer. There're three more unsold.

Those're rooms, not bins, with solid walls and 10' ceilings, and on the 5th-8th floors, so handier.

Wouldn't it just be cheaper to buy an apartment big enough for you and and all of your stuff??

Better yet, $15 for http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/hoarder-in-you-robin-zasio/1103607178?ean=9781609611316&itm=1&usri=zasio+robin

Wouldn't it just be cheaper to buy an apartment big enough for you and and all of your stuff??

Many people do. It's also done when people have full time house-keeper/nanny and/or expect guests frequently but don't want them sleeping in their apt.

This is not about "hoarding". This is about people trying to cram their lives into 400 square foot studio apartments, which never works without the help of expensive storage units. (And please, spare me the knee-jerk response about how people in Third World countries live in 10 square foot cow shit huts. We're not talking about them. We're talking about modern, sanitary, working class (and above) Americans.)

I'm always amused at the photos of these open-floorplan "high end" apartments that have instead of full-sized kitchens, a glorified wet bar on one end of the living room, with just one closet in the (smallish) bedroom and maybe one small coat closet near the front door.

These kitchens have no room for all the kitchen tools, pots, pans, cookie sheets, bowls, small appliances, etc. necessary for the actual proper preparation of meals.

The "hall" closet barely has enough room for a couple of coats. Where does one stash the cleaning supplies? The vacuum cleaner ... dust mop ... broom ... wet mop ... buckets ... cleaning solutions ... scrub brushes ... rags ... sponges ... laundry detergent ... iron and ironing board ... drying rack ... etc.??

Where does one keep the tool box? The power drill ... hammer ... screwdriver set ... steel wool ... glue ... caulk gun ... etc.?

And then there's the (smallish) bedroom. The photos never seem to show dressers ... only a big bed with one nightstand (only one, never two) in what appears to be a spacious room. Of course, the room only appears spacious because there are no dressers, armoires, or chests of drawers. These (smallish) bedrooms of course rarely have walk-in closets ... they're usually on the small side too. I'm hardly a clothes horse, but I had my small bedroom closet outfitted with a TRIPLE clothes rod ... AND I have a triple dresser and a tall chest of drawers. And everything is full. And I'm SINGLE! I can't possibly imagine a second person moving in here permanently with all THEIR clothes.

And we haven't even mentioned linens -- bath towels, wash cloths, sheets, blankets, etc. Enough, of course, for both you and your occasional guests. That stuff is all bulky and needs a place to store, as well.

And what about our "home office" crap that every household must now have? We all have computers that need a desk on which to sit. Laser printers. Computer "supplies". Some place to store all the paper stuff of our lives ... insurance forms ... stock certificates ... bank statements ... tax returns ... work stuff ... blah blah blah.

And what about the other "stuff" of life? Golf clubs. Ski equipment. Sewing machine. Whatever.

This is not being a "hoarder". This is being a normal person with a normal amount of stuff that we have to fit into our homes. And just because we don't all live with just a futon and a gym bag full of clothes like a gypsy or college student doesn't mean we're "hoarders".

What it means is it really IS ridiculous to pass off these absurdly tiny apartments as "homes". They're pied-a-tierres. Or crash pads. Or "second" homes in the city. But they're hardly appropriate as primary homes.

>And what about the other "stuff" of life? Golf clubs. Ski equipment. Sewing machine. Whatever.

Matt, you golf and ski?

Um, no--Power tools? you got to be kidding, it's not a staple.
Dresser is replaced with a California closet and off-site storage where you swap winter/summer clothes twice a year.
Stock certificates? Who does that anymore. Everything's book entry or held in street name these days.
Sewing machine is replaced with the Chinese cleaners down the block.
Most of the pots and pans never get used. A few of them do the trick and then you have the crowd that eats out or orders in or just shops more often.

It's really not that bad. most of the time the larger apartment just winds up being taken up by stuff nobody uses. You remember the George Carlin bit?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvgN5gCuLac

When I moved last time, I couldn't believe how much space I gained from replacing dresser with walk-in closet, CRT tv with flat screens on wall, big fat Gateway with 17 inch monitor with wireless IBM laptop.. the list goes on. And the 1980's style wall unit is long gone.

Struck a nerve, eh?

"Hoarding" is having more stuff than you've got room for. That's only a problem, though, if you're feeling stressed about it.

I'm in the middle of cleaning my spare room, and just found two cordless drills with their power supplies. Their cases are down in the storage bin. I think. Then there's one of those flexible-neck inspection cameras. Don't remember WTF I was thinking with that. Must've figured the case would look nice with the rest of the row of seldom- or never-used power tools. I did ship a biscuit joiner (don't ask) off to my brother, it being the one thing he didn't have.

"Um, no--Power tools? you got to be kidding, it's not a staple."

For nearly every homeowner, they most certainly are.

***
"Dresser is replaced with a California closet and off-site storage where you swap winter/summer clothes twice a year."

Or you could keep the dresser and keep the $1200/year (or more) you're paying for that off-site storage.

***
It's really not that bad. most of the time the larger apartment just winds up being taken up by stuff nobody uses. You remember the George Carlin bit?

Yes, I remember the George Carlin bit. He had his nerve poking fun of people and their "stuff", given the fact that he had SEVERAL homes, including this beast: http://virtualglobetrotting.com/map/george-carlins-house-former/view/?service=1

>"Um, no--Power tools? you got to be kidding, it's not a staple."
For nearly every homeowner, they most certainly are.

Most Manhattan APARTMENTowners have supers, and more than likely, also porters and handymen.

My solution is purge, purge, purge! We recently moved to a larger apartment but I still dumped a ton of stuff before moving. The Goodwill guys know me by name at this point. I cannot stand clutter so am constantly tossing things, especially when new crap comes in.

By the way, we now have practically no furniture and very few random objects. So we wander around wondering where to sit and what to do with the empty spaces...

I used to watch this show on HGTV called "Small Spaces, Big Style" or something like that. They would have these 350-600 square foot apartments or a 1000 square foot house and everything was so well-organized. Just the right furniture with all these storage units in these apartments. They would open the closets and storage spaces and everything was so organized. I spent the whole summer donating most of my furniture and much of my former belongings to Housing Works and somehow I still have too much stuff. This purging is more difficult than I thought.

"I used to watch this show on HGTV called "Small Spaces, Big Style" or something like that. They would have these 350-600 square foot apartments or a 1000 square foot house and everything was so well-organized."

Yes.

It's amazing what an entire staff of organizational professionals and television producers can do to a space.

I donated a lot of clothing to Cancer Care Thrift Shop. I donate to them several times each year but I still had so many coats, pairs of shoes and bags that I don't wear.

My couch went to Housing Works and my elliptical machine went to a charity called Sports Jam.

My books were the major part of packing. I couldn't part with any of them. I still have the Hunter Davies bio of The Beatles which I bought in 1968.

NYCMatt: You are about 1000% correct here. Often feel I'm the only one who, when looking at cramped new construction layouts, how ungenerous they are with closet space and room size and stupid kitchens. One reason we had to look at 100 apartments during our search was that we were unwilling to compromise on a designated, ample space for two desk/workspaces, a true dining area, a bedroom with a walkin closet AND room for a dresser and two nightstands (we ended up building the walkin closet in a 20x12 bedroom), and true coat closet(s) and linen closet. In most of America these aren't even on the list of "must haves" since it is as standard as having windows and floor. In NYC it is hard to find. At least in a one bedroom in GV for $800K-$1.2MM.

Yes, normal people need a tool box. Probably a drill. And a step stool, ironing board, vacuum cleaner. And it isn't really extravagant to want a place in or next to a bathroom for sheets and towels and extra toiletries. It is also nice to keep at least two small pieces of luggage in one's apartment.

Our building rents fairly large storage lockers (about 5x5x10) for $60/month to handle the overflow like extra luggage, Christmas ornaments, folding chairs, ski boots, and other large items you don't need too often.

If you can afford $800K for a locker, you really would think you could afford a larger place but whatever--people think differently. I guess no matter how large your place you can always use more storage.

That's my list of apt. must-haves, kyle.

Except for the tool box.
If I had a hammer...

>NYCMatt: You are about 1000% correct here. Often feel I'm the only one

Kyle, you thought you were all alone, but now you know that you have Matt

huntersburg: Do you have a tool box at your place at the edge of Gotham? ;)

Thank you for the validation, Kyle.

I'll beg to differ with you on one small point, however: the linen closet. It really shouldn't be inside the bathroom, as moisture from the steam can cause mildew-y conditions in your linens.

I once looked at a studio apartment for sale in the Cocoa Exchange building. I swear it was like a glorified hotel room. ONE closet total. Absolutely no place (other than this one closet) to stash everything from coats and sweaters to the vacuum and mops.

mops?

That's right, huntersburg.
A broom closet. For mops, brooms and other verticle cleaning tools.
I love the Swiffer. Wet and dry.

Riversider: Howie Buffett for non-executive chairman of Bershire?
Warren thinks he will be good "because he understands the value of the company."

The shareholders I know think not so much.

BerKshire.
"As long as he does not have to stop farming" says Howie.

Riversider: Please just start a new discussion about this on the "anything".

I like this new se way of keeping cc. from trolling me.

"Yes, normal people need a tool box."

There are plenty of tool boxes right here on this board.

Matt, your comment is correct. The tv show that I watched usually featured apartments/houses which were owned by architects or designers who designed their own homes. Still the storage utility and the organization of belongings in these homes were impressive.

Look, California Closets are great. But they do not somehow magically *increase* the closet space; it's an illusion.

>>Look, California Closets are great. But they do not somehow magically *increase* the closet space;<<

A well-designed closet may not increase the overall cubic footage but they certainly allow you to get more use out of the space. You can store twice as many hanging clothes in a closet with multiple hanging racks than you can in the traditional one-rack variety, for example. So yes, a good closet design does in fact provide extra 'space'.

The biggest problem is that most people will fill and overfill whatever storage space they have. Stuff has a way of expanding to fill existing space.

"The biggest problem is that most people will fill and overfill whatever storage space they have. Stuff has a way of expanding to fill existing space."

Bramstar - oh how true!!

"A well-designed closet may not increase the overall cubic footage but they certainly allow you to get more use out of the space. You can store twice as many hanging clothes in a closet with multiple hanging racks than you can in the traditional one-rack variety, for example. So yes, a good closet design does in fact provide extra 'space'."

True, there is a point of diminishing returns.

My small bedroom closet, for instance, now has three rods for hanging clothes. There isn't an inch of unused space in the entire closet. And that's just three racks. Adding a California Closet unit would have taken up precious "square inchage" with the actual unit.