Sale at 1056 Fifth Avenue in Carnegie Hill

No, really. My god that is shameful. Gimme a break. Why even say it, if you can't back it up? If you could, you'd be talking to a lawyer and not posting it here.

Lawyer? Co-op boards can turn you down for ANY reason and they don't have to tell you why.

I find it hard to believe that in a progressive city such as New York, co-op boards are allowed to operate without government or other regulations. There must be some guidelines that these boards have to follow! If so, where can I find these guidelines. Thanks.

i got turned down by a harlem coop, i suspect because i'm asian and my wife is white

Did they give you a reason for turning you down?

a coop in the upper east side turned us down, we are a same sex couple with strong financials. We were never given a reason.

After the Seller accepted our offer and our lawyer had done due diligence, we lost the contract the next day to another Buyer. Not unsual in NYC, except for this: The Seller claimed she had been pressured by another broker, who was the FORMER BOARD PRESIDENT of her building and still lives in that building, to take his client's deal. The Seller called me at home (!) and told me this herself; she said that the other broker (the former Board Pres.) called her and pressured her into taking his client over us, even though they were offering less $. She said she felt "afraid," and that he said "it only took a phone call" to get the Board to give us a thumbs down. It was the same story, more or less, that her lawyer told our lawyer about the broker. Who knows what the truth is, but she clearly didn't want to chance having to start the process all over again, if the broker/former Board Pres. carried through with his supposed threat. The very same broker threatening her was the broker who sold her the apartment a few years back, she said, and because he was the current President at the time, "he got her into the building." So much for progressive NYC. Try corrupt.

FYI: the above co-op is on the Upper West Side.

precisely the reason I never want to buy in a co-op

I second that. Condo is the way to go.
Can't believe this is happening in the 21st century. Where is the "Melting Pot"?

Why get lawyers involved??? We also got turned down for similar reasons. Any building that turns down minorities is NOT a building that we would ever consider moving to. It was a blessing in disguise...we have no interest in living in a building that has racists on the board.

Good point.

Just so I'm clear did anyone ever offer any specifics regarding 1056 Fifth Avenue, or is this just an unsubstantiated claim that the "Co-op board turns down minorities."

Screw the Co-op. It will be a cold day in hell some people, who make 1/4 of what i do, tell me I am not good enough for their building. There are too many places to live in NYC that you don't need to go through that junk.

The claim about this building is NOT unsubstantiated! The rejected couple...the husband is Latino and the wife is Jewish. Together they have a net worth 6 times the price of the coop apartment. After completing and submitting the "board package", the board requested additional information including an ADDITIONAL four letters of recommendation for the Latino husband only! After this additional information was submitted, the couple was turned down. Of course, the coop board did not give a reason for the rejction and never interviewed the couple.

This wannabe coop board did you a favor. You are better off living elsewhere. Nothing special about this building anyway.

Co-op Board--definition: noun. An unregulated governing entity, found exclusively in New York City, which is empowered to enforce various forms of discrimination at its own discretion. Usually, but not contained to, individiuals who could not afford to move into their own building, given the past and current market. Marks of integrity and morality only found in rare instances. Self-policing and self-perpetuating.

I'm sorry, but I am so tired of the "coop board did you a favor" line. NO. They didn't. They prevented you from purchasing an apartment. From buying a home. A place you wanted to live. Not to mention, the bank, a most stringent of entities when it comes to lending you their money, judged you as loan-worthy. A bank, filled with qualified individuals, with financial backgrounds, who did a credit check, background check, and the like. Unless, of course, you are paying in cash (and more power to you), in which case, coop board "rejection" screams of discrimination.

So who cares if there is"nothing special" about the building. It’s not about that. They chose the apartment, therefore, there must be something about it that speaks to them.

You live in your apartment with your family, or alone, or your dog, or whomever. Not the coop board. The board, albeit at the pace of a snail, changes. And most people living in coop buildings don't think a coop board is such a groovy thing either. They’re just grateful that they got in and loath the day they have to sell.

I've never meet a buyer, seller, or broker who thought the coop board did much beyond impede progress. Isn't it amazing how condos stay financially afloat...

You're right. It was also sad that the children of the "turned down" buyers had seen the apartment three times and were looking forward to living there and had told their friends at school that they were moving to this apartment. I wonder if the coop board knows how much damage they have caused.

I just checked out this sales listing on the web and noticed that the listing broker is a member of the coop board. It doesn't make sense!

How do you know that? Do you live in the building?

Live in the building? NO. If you go to the listing agent's web page (in the Douglas Elliman web site) and read her bio...she is a member of the coop board. But that was not the point I was trying to make.

the price was reduced only 2 days ago, so they would rather sell it cheaper than have any minorities move in,
my wife and i offered full asking price and were turned away basically

We are updating our time on market calculations and there was a bug. I've removed two comments as a result. Our apologies.

This coop has been on the market for a long time and they are turning away buyers?

Went to see this coop. Two apartments joined into one. It sucks.

if your going to make an investment, buy a place where u can live and enjoy, and allow you to really own the property.
with co-ops, u are just buying shares.
life is too short to be dealing with unnecessary grief. go with condos.

Coops are private corporations. As such they are allowed to make their own rules, and each one runs differently. Unfortunately this also means that they are subject to manipulation for the benefit of the (or certain) shareholders. Some buildings are better managed than others...just like a company. And like a company, is held accountable to its shareholders, most of whom unfortunately don't have the time or desire to volunteer to serve on their coop board.

Most buildings in NYC (about 70% I think) are coops, and from my experience as a buyer, and from friends who have purchased coops, the scary stories you hear are few and far between. Most coop boards just want to know that you're financially stable. A good buyer's agent will steer you towards easier boards.

And it's not unusual for RE agents/brokers to serve on coop boards. By law these folks must recuse themselves from board decisions (though proving it may be tough). But it's an advantage for the building to have someone on the board who understands the pulse of the market and what other buildings are doing.

Advantages of coops are that you know who your neighbors are, which can be reassuring in a big city like NY where you could otherwise be living next door to drug dealers or high-end prostitutes. Plus they're much less expensive than condos and retain their value more in a bear market.

all that said, from what I understand, rental buildings are no longer 'going coop'. instead converting to condos.

and to the poster above, it doesn't make a difference whether you own shares or 'real property' - you stll get the same tax benefits and all the equity you gain is yours.

To the poster above...The problem with coops is that when you are ready to sell, you are at the mercy of the coop board,(in addition to other market issues). Selling a condo is a straight forward business transaction between two parties and free of interference from corrupt, opinionated and racist coop boards (such as the one on this building). Condo is the way to go.

"Advantages of coops are that you know who your neighbors are, which can be reassuring in a big city like NY where you could otherwise be living next door to drug dealers or high-end prostitutes." Please. I live in a condo, and I know my neighbors, and not just one my floor, and they are lovely. My best friend lives in a coop and has a neighbor from hell. It's a case by case situtation. Not a coop vs. condo, when it comes to neighbors.

Re: the co-op board did you a favor. I agree. Sure it's a hassle to deal with the board & if they're discriminating against certain people, "God will pay them" but my feeling is, "If you don't want me, I don't want YOU even more. I'll find a far better place to live and away from YOU."

The idea of a co-op is very appealing due to the long term value. These are homes, yes, but also sound investments. If you don't get through the board of one, try another apt in another building. If you get rejected maybe you should look at your financials or attitude in your interview. In the end its all about $$...those who want to keep it. Condos remember are sig more $$ due to the lack of a board, however its worth it in the end.

In order to preserve value - they also need to allow sales. . . you cannot deny that there can be discrimination in some circumstances too. . .

yes but we cannot judge the co-ops motives. they may have 6x the cost, but how did they get that $$? the lottery? a recently sold business? were they crooks being investigated by the sec? who really knows. their broker was an idiot for putting them in that position to begin with. a good broker will give you a heads up on a tough board, etc. if this really happened, i feel bad for the couple but come on.

i guess i am just saying you are denying that discrimation is possible - and i am just being realistic. I wasn't speaking about this case in particular.

ok - well yes of course discrimination is possible. not denying that. but to have a poster put their story on a streeteasy board without all the info, it raises questions about their motives and what really got them rejected to begin with. my friend is a broker and has people with tons of cash get rejected from boards because the board members know they cheat on their wife...etc.

alas - i am glad i just closed on a condo! I am sure those co-op boards love to dig. Now your example above certainly wouldn't help a co-op owner getting their best price if they want to resell. . . .

very true - but i guess i am just defending this particular case in that just because someone is rejected its easy to cry "racist" when you dont have the whole story. anyhow i am about to close on a condo - and was still required to provide 10 letters!

I provided 5 - anyway there is a nice mix i guess so that they can still know something. No interviews though and no deep digging. .

oops i only needed 3 letters - i meant to write that and not 5.

Wow! This coop board just turned down another buyer. Maybe they are not racist after all. Feel sorry for the seller...and the next buyer.

The 'problem' with co-ops, and it can be a problem, is that besides being a business entity the building also can function as a kind of private club so if you get stupid or social climbing types in the building and on the board things can get very weird.

While in most instances co-op boards do not have to disclose their reason for denying an applicant this is untrue in instances where a claim of racial discrimination can be substantiated. Any member of the board who perpetuated a discriminatory act in denying admission on the basis of race or national origin can be personally sued.

If this couple really had 6x's the coops financial needs they should consult a lawyer as it sounds like they have a case.

Unfortunately, yet understandable, in most instances where racial discrimination plays a role in rejection the buyers move one and get another property allowing the same .

Alas, in a court of law you need PROOF and not allegations so it would surely be VERY difficult to prove. It's a high-end building, the board can't be dunces & even if they were turned down due to race, the board members probably voiced a concern other than race. These people may be nasty human beings but it's doubtful that they're stupid; they're sitting on the board of a multi-million dollar company.

we were a trio of three loving and young lesbos and two kids from former marriages and we were denied already three times. coops suck. we finally found our home in hoboken and are very happy.

Racism is hard to prove. It's just a shame that the coop board in this "high end building" could not rise above that!

i thought if you have enough money why would the board care what color someone is.

Well, to date there have been TWO rejections by this board on this $4 million apartment and the listing broker use to be on the board and lives in the building. What does this tell you?

The reason why condos sell at a premium over coops.

Whoever the idiot is that keeps saying "alas" you sound like an idiot. Go to hell.

Alas, this building...is hell.

If I’m not mistaken, this is the building that Goldie Hawn, Diane Keaton and Bette Midler careered down the front of on a painters’ scaffold in “First Wives Club”. Alas, they didn’t get in either.

Once again, the guy who keeps saying alas should jump up his own ass.

What is BARFS?

This 3000 sq ft coop will sell for $1,100/sq ft...my prediction. Two buyers rejected by the board already!

This apartment is vacant, the owner is living in Texas, the listing broker is clueless and the coop board members are crazy a-holes. I agree with #56, this apartment will sell below market value.

Offer $2,900,000.

Am looking for a 3 bedroom in the $3mil. range - has anyone seen the apartment? Should i bother to take a look?

Yeah! Worth looking at, but keep in mind that the reason this apartment will sell super cheap (3 million or less) is because the coop board is NUTS.

The Douglas Elliman website indicates that the apt. is back in contract- I guess I will have to wait until the Board does another turndown to take a look!

Will the third time be a charm? If not, the price of this apartment will go down further.

anyone know what the price is on the most recent contract?

Another rejection by this coop board?

Under contract. Alas...coop board rejection pending.