Why do real estate agents do this? Do they think buyers are stupid? This studio is listed at 530 square feet and at the listed price, the $/sq foot looks reasonable. But looking at the floor plan, the studio is only 400 sq feet and the terrace is 130. Is outdoor space really living space? How much living do you think was done on the terrace in the last couple of days in the rain? At least the... [more]
Why do real estate agents do this? Do they think buyers are stupid? This studio is listed at 530 square feet and at the listed price, the $/sq foot looks reasonable. But looking at the floor plan, the studio is only 400 sq feet and the terrace is 130. Is outdoor space really living space? How much living do you think was done on the terrace in the last couple of days in the rain? At least the agent included the floor plan which clearly indicates that the studio is only 400 square feet. Clearly buyers aren’t impressed, it’s been on the market a loooooong time….
https://streeteasy.com/building/three-worldwide-plaza/2ll?utm_campaign=Agent_Update_Saved_Folder&utm_medium=email&utm_source=Iterable&utm_term=1667276[less]
Response by 300_mercer
19 days ago
Posts: 10151
Member since: Feb 2007
Eyeballs! And no one complaints to the brokerage company or licensing board.
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Response by Rinette
18 days ago
Posts: 513
Member since: Dec 2016
Graig is a combination of Craig and Greg.
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Response by steve123
18 days ago
Posts: 806
Member since: Feb 2009
If you sleep on the terrace its a 1BR.
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Response by MTH
18 days ago
Posts: 375
Member since: Apr 2012
I never saw the appeal of terraces in NYC. I bet most people get no more than a few days out of the year from them due to inclement weather - it's either too hot or too cold.
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Response by Rinette
18 days ago
Posts: 513
Member since: Dec 2016
>I bet most people get no more than a few days out of the year from them due to inclement weather
are you nuts?
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Response by 300_mercer
18 days ago
Posts: 10151
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MTH, While pre-covid people didn't use their outdoor as much, but I see people using their outdoor space a lot more. For a studio or small 1 bedroom, I would rather have inside space (even 25-30% of the outside space will be useful) rather than a terrace.
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Response by Aaron2
18 days ago
Posts: 1601
Member since: Mar 2012
I've got a balcony, and spend more time on it watering the planters than actually using it, but it visually extends the LR, and, if you're stuck at home, gives one more option to spend time in. As terraces go, the one in this listing isn't terrific, but this building has some units with much larger ones, which I've seen kitted out with all sorts of furniture, and used regularly (can see them out my office window).
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Response by Rinette
18 days ago
Posts: 513
Member since: Dec 2016
>watering the planters than actually using it
This is use
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Response by MTH
16 days ago
Posts: 375
Member since: Apr 2012
Maybe I just don't notice it walking down the street or maybe most of the activity is at night. On the front of some of these enourmous 60's buildings I see one or two apartments (maybe) with people sitting outdoors.
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Response by multicityresident
16 days ago
Posts: 2210
Member since: Jan 2009
If the terrace has a view, I will camp on it; if it has no view, I will never use it. Case in point: Our rental at 310 E53rd (unit 20A) had a terrace that we never set foot on because the view was uninspiring; our little loft here in Columbus has a small terrace that we spend lots of time on during every season because it looks out at park.
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Response by steve123
16 days ago
Posts: 806
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Most terraces are perfunctory and not worth $1 of additional rent/sales price.
Why?
EITHER - high with no view & too windy to leave anything out, while also being permanently shaded and not legal to grille on.
OR - lower floor no view & no privacy fishbowl situation where surrounding buildings all look down onto your terrace.
BOTH of these tend to be walled in on 3 sides
If you have pets or kids they are another thing to worry about as well.
The rare high-floor, decent privacy, decent view, no shade, maybe legal to grill terrace is worth something, and a completely different beast.
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Response by stache
13 days ago
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Member since: Jun 2017
I still wish I had one as a place to repot plants etc.
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Response by MTH
12 days ago
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I'm surprised grilling is allowed at all in such a highly regulated city. And I'd think all it would take is a cranky neighbor.
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Response by MTH
12 days ago
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Member since: Apr 2012
(and no one wants to breathe someone else's charcoal smoke)
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Response by 300_mercer
12 days ago
Posts: 10151
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I think we need to be clear about distinction between terrace and balcony with former being a setback in the building and usually bigger. Balconies aren't used much beside smoking, some plants as they are usually too small to have an outdoor table or lounge and rarely have privacy. Grilling is not allowed by code and building rules. Terraces on the hand, tend to provide more privacy and enough space for a dining set up and/or some outdoor furniture. Grilling is allowed depending on the distance from other buildings. Electical grills I believe are allowed.
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Response by Aaron2
11 days ago
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Member since: Mar 2012
@300. "we need to be clear about distinction between terrace and balcony." Absolutely. Now if only those involved in flogging real estate would learn the distinction and show their knowledge.
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Response by steve123
11 days ago
Posts: 806
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@Aaron - exactly.
Simple search for Manhattan + Private Outdoor space quickly returns many gems.
For example, about 15-25% of the listings don't even have private outdoor space despite having the feature selected in order to turn up in searches..
And a further 15-25% seem to have balconys labelled as a terace.
But other than that, the distinction is very clear.
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Response by 300_mercer
11 days ago
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I think more agents know but some on purpose want to call a balcony terrace. In the original example, it is indeed a terrace.
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Response by multicityresident
6 days ago
Posts: 2210
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I just learned something new. In my small mind, I think of a "terrace" as not having a roof, and a balcony having a roof. The "set back" definition appear more accurate than what I had in my mind.
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Response by Rinette
5 days ago
Posts: 513
Member since: Dec 2016
MCR, maybe you can ask the moderator if your post can be removed.
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Response by stache
3 days ago
Posts: 1163
Member since: Jun 2017
And while you're at it, ask if Rinette can be removed as well.
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Eyeballs! And no one complaints to the brokerage company or licensing board.
Graig is a combination of Craig and Greg.
If you sleep on the terrace its a 1BR.
I never saw the appeal of terraces in NYC. I bet most people get no more than a few days out of the year from them due to inclement weather - it's either too hot or too cold.
>I bet most people get no more than a few days out of the year from them due to inclement weather
are you nuts?
MTH, While pre-covid people didn't use their outdoor as much, but I see people using their outdoor space a lot more. For a studio or small 1 bedroom, I would rather have inside space (even 25-30% of the outside space will be useful) rather than a terrace.
I've got a balcony, and spend more time on it watering the planters than actually using it, but it visually extends the LR, and, if you're stuck at home, gives one more option to spend time in. As terraces go, the one in this listing isn't terrific, but this building has some units with much larger ones, which I've seen kitted out with all sorts of furniture, and used regularly (can see them out my office window).
>watering the planters than actually using it
This is use
Maybe I just don't notice it walking down the street or maybe most of the activity is at night. On the front of some of these enourmous 60's buildings I see one or two apartments (maybe) with people sitting outdoors.
If the terrace has a view, I will camp on it; if it has no view, I will never use it. Case in point: Our rental at 310 E53rd (unit 20A) had a terrace that we never set foot on because the view was uninspiring; our little loft here in Columbus has a small terrace that we spend lots of time on during every season because it looks out at park.
Most terraces are perfunctory and not worth $1 of additional rent/sales price.
Why?
EITHER - high with no view & too windy to leave anything out, while also being permanently shaded and not legal to grille on.
OR - lower floor no view & no privacy fishbowl situation where surrounding buildings all look down onto your terrace.
BOTH of these tend to be walled in on 3 sides
If you have pets or kids they are another thing to worry about as well.
The rare high-floor, decent privacy, decent view, no shade, maybe legal to grill terrace is worth something, and a completely different beast.
I still wish I had one as a place to repot plants etc.
I'm surprised grilling is allowed at all in such a highly regulated city. And I'd think all it would take is a cranky neighbor.
(and no one wants to breathe someone else's charcoal smoke)
I think we need to be clear about distinction between terrace and balcony with former being a setback in the building and usually bigger. Balconies aren't used much beside smoking, some plants as they are usually too small to have an outdoor table or lounge and rarely have privacy. Grilling is not allowed by code and building rules. Terraces on the hand, tend to provide more privacy and enough space for a dining set up and/or some outdoor furniture. Grilling is allowed depending on the distance from other buildings. Electical grills I believe are allowed.
@300. "we need to be clear about distinction between terrace and balcony." Absolutely. Now if only those involved in flogging real estate would learn the distinction and show their knowledge.
@Aaron - exactly.
Simple search for Manhattan + Private Outdoor space quickly returns many gems.
For example, about 15-25% of the listings don't even have private outdoor space despite having the feature selected in order to turn up in searches..
And a further 15-25% seem to have balconys labelled as a terace.
But other than that, the distinction is very clear.
I think more agents know but some on purpose want to call a balcony terrace. In the original example, it is indeed a terrace.
I just learned something new. In my small mind, I think of a "terrace" as not having a roof, and a balcony having a roof. The "set back" definition appear more accurate than what I had in my mind.
MCR, maybe you can ask the moderator if your post can be removed.
And while you're at it, ask if Rinette can be removed as well.