Recession ending - you missed your chance to buy - again

"affected" not "effected"
thanks manhattanguy! I would hire you as my admin assistant anyday.

Petrified - I realize that you are a world class businessman and investor who has little time to post anonymously on msg bds, but when you provide links to the properties that are increasing in value (which I'm still waiting for), could you also provide a few ideas about which stocks are likely to outperform the market over the next couple of years? I'm interested in learning more about your innovative buy-high, sell-low strategy. Thanks again in advance for all the insight that you are about to provide to us bitter peons!

petrfitz, like a dog with a bone you refuse to budge. i never said that. i always discuss broad, general macroeconomic trends because the individual who makes more money this year is largely meaningless but for one apartment.

forest from the trees.

about, also any condo speculator had to come up with at least 20% down(plus other underwriter rules) unlike So Florida/Vegas/So Cali and you can't rent coops.

Bsexloser how many times do I have to tell you to look at the year end case schiller report? LES non doorman all categories up 8-10% yoy?

Please provide proof that I buy high? just because you dont know how to find under valued properties or stocks does not mean that everyone is incompetent in that area.

steveF, i'm sorry, but you're wrong. 10% down jumbo condos were the norm, and the underwriting was pretty shitty here too.

look, it's a very tiny market here, compared to population. it's very sensitive to momentum for that reason.

no problem stefeF, hopefully you will learn some manners along with some spelling

While unemployment is still rising, I don't see any market recovery for a long time. Just because petrfitz and his friends can afford buying a place doesn't mean market is doing great.

manhattanfox just because some Wall Street bankers lost their jobs and are not making as much as they used to, it doesnt mean that no one is making any money, it doesnt mean that some people are not making more than they ever have, it doesnt mean that all real estate is tanking.

Besexlessloser- another example is that every undeveloped peice of land in New York city was just appraised by the City as being worth close to 200% of the previous years value.

"Please provide proof that I buy high?"

I never said YOU bought high (how could I know if you don't post what you paid???) - I'm saying you are ADVOCATING THAT OTHER PEOPLE BUY AT THE HEIGHT OF A BUBBLE. Pretty good advice - LOL.

"just because you dont know how to find under valued properties or stocks does not mean that everyone is incompetent in that area"

Please, oh great one, inform us "bitter" "morons" where we can find these vaunted undervalued Manhattan properties - please, master, post some links to some of these properties! Yes, I barely have any savings after giving all of my money to my rich landlord, but I may just be able to scrape together a few pennies for a downpayment IF ONLY YOU WOULD GUIDE ME TO THESE UNDERVALUED PROPERTIES!!! PLEASE, PLEASE, KIND GENEROUS UBER-MAN, HAVE MERCY AND SHOW US BITTER RENTERS WHERE WE CAN FIND SUCH PROPERTIES SO WE CAN ESCAPE FROM OUR RENT-PAYING SERVITUDE FOREVER!!!

petr - But do you understand wall street is not the only sector that is being affected. All other dependent sectors are affected as well. They are all laying off people (media, tech, advertising, health care). Again just because you are well off doesn't mean everyone is.

"another example is that every undeveloped peice of land in New York city was just appraised by the City as being worth close to 200% of the previous years value"

LMAO - APPRAISALS!!! How well have appraisals across the country held up recently??? BTW, the only thing a higher appraisal brings is HIGHER PROPERTY TAXES, idiot - have fun paying 'em while your property depreciates.

petrfitz, so you will make me bring up the thread and call you out.

fine, no problem:

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/4206-mortgage-stops-lending-

---------------------------------------------------------
petrfitz in August, right before the collapse:

"There is the most opportunity in the RE market than there has even been"

to which I asked (even back then):

"petrfitz, I'm very interested to hear about these opportunities... specifically, how these opportunities are the "most than there has even been".

you sure that it's the "most than there has even been"? as in, better opportunities than let's say 2003?

please let us in on the secret!"

To which we get the classic petrfitz response (no facts, just pot-shots taken):

"MMAfia - yes better opportunity than 2003 - less competition, more inventory to choose from.

You dont get it do you? That is why you are a renter."
---------------------------------------------------------

It's all there, in full clarity. Then, about a month later, the entire world goes into its worst nosedive since the Great Depression.

Better than 2003? Less competition? More inventory? and this, right before global collapse a month later?

Are you kidding me? Get outta here.

NOW, compare to what I posted and predicted 1 full year ago:

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/3199-who-listened-to-mmafia

So, dear petrfitz, I'm still waiting for your links that clearly show how real estate has made money since August of last year till now. I asked for it back in August, and I ask for it now again. Between August and now, show us real estate that made money. Or just do what you always do which is to sidestep and fire back with insults, which is the entertainment I expect to get out of you.

petrfitz, so you will make me bring up the thread and call you out.

fine, no problem:

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/4206-mortgage-stops-lending-

---------------------------------------------------------
petrfitz in August, right before the collapse:

"There is the most opportunity in the RE market than there has even been"

to which I asked (even back then):

"petrfitz, I'm very interested to hear about these opportunities... specifically, how these opportunities are the "most than there has even been".

you sure that it's the "most than there has even been"? as in, better opportunities than let's say 2003?

please let us in on the secret!"

To which we get the classic petrfitz response (no facts, just pot-shots taken):

"MMAfia - yes better opportunity than 2003 - less competition, more inventory to choose from.

You dont get it do you? That is why you are a renter."
---------------------------------------------------------

It's all there, in full clarity. Then, about a month later, the entire world goes into its worst nosedive since the Great Depression.

Better than 2003? Less competition? More inventory? and this, right before global collapse a month later?

Are you kidding me? Get outta here.

NOW, compare to what I posted and predicted 1 full year ago:

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/3199-who-listened-to-mmafia

So, dear petrfitz, I'm still waiting for your links that clearly show how real estate has made money since August of last year till now. I asked for it back in August, and I ask for it now again. Between August and now, show us real estate that made money. Or just do what you always do which is to sidestep and fire back with insults, which is the entertainment I expect to get out of you.

"another example is that every undeveloped peice of land in New York city was just appraised by the City as being worth close to 200% of the previous years value"

LMAO - APPRAISALS!!! How well have appraisals across the country held up recently??? BTW, the only thing a higher appraisal brings is HIGHER PROPERTY TAXES, idiot - have fun paying 'em while your property depreciates.

MMafia - you are saying that there is more competition and less inventory?

Please explain to me how LES non doorman real estate is 40-50% like you predicted instead of the 8-10% up like the data shows?

most renters will never amass significant wealth so none will ever......

"most renters will never amass significant wealth so none will ever......"

Good point, genius. I'm sure that if Warren Buffett had rented instead of owned his house the past 50 years, he would be on food stamps today. You're right, I stand corrected.

STILL WAITING PATIENTLY FOR YOU TO POST A LINK TO A SINGLE PROPERTY THAT HAS APPRECIATED THIS YEAR.

wow petr, you've been drinking the kool-aid again haven't you.

that one comment encapsulates your viewpoint so succinctly, you think owners are superior. all renters are doing so because they are bitter wanna-be owners.

wow.

"if Warren Buffett had rented instead of owned his house" yeah but he didnt. He owned and he is Warren Buffet. You rent and are not Warren Buffet. You are a powerless, assetless, renter losing his money in the stock market.

cu losers off to a Board meeting

you won't be missed. maybe i'll spend the quiet time tallying up the assets and figuring out how much I've saved by renting.

petrfitz, I hope you're lying about having children, because anyone who speaks as you do should just not be around them, let alone be responsible for their upbringing. Scary.

Let's look at some more of Petrified's views from mid-2008 (i.e., pre-Lehman), with a few of my Editioral Comments added to the quotes for perspective - truly classic:) Thank god this genius businessman deigns to share his investing insights with all of us peons - one day we can only hope to be as enlightened as this visionary.

"I do believe that now is the best time in years to invest in NY. The rabble has been cleared, the near term future is less risky [EDITORIAL COMMENT - HAHAHAHAHA!!!!], and there are two years of sideline sitters waiting to get back into the market [EDITORIAL COMMENT - HAHAHAHAHA!!!!]. There is a baby boom in NY with familites choosing to stay in the city, there are macro economic forces causing suburbanites to flee their homes and move to the city [EDITORIAL COMMENT - HAHAHAHAHA!!!!]."

"Juiceman "I wonder what happens when softness in pricing meets with increases in rents?" What happens is stasis. Prices stabilize and start to go up [EDITORIAL COMMENT - HAHAHAHAHA!!!!]."

"Steve to make it simple for you. When people are not buying, and are choosing to rent, landlords like myself understand it, and start to raise rents. Rents start to go, as they are now, and fools like you who have been trying to time the market start to realize that all the insane logic they were trying to apply to the market is incorrect and that it is better to own than rent [EDITORIAL COMMENT - HAHAHAHAHA!!!!]. They see landlords jacking up rents, not improving units, and basically saying "Fuck you pay me.""

"This board seems to be reserved for those who are completely paralized by fear and cannot even begin to try to figure out how one could make money in a RE market with histroic softness [EDITORIAL COMMENT - HAHAHAHAHA!!!!], less compettion [EDITORIAL COMMENT - HAHAHAHAHA!!!!], and more units on the market [EDITORIAL COMMENT - HAHAHAHAHA!!!!]."

"Also your "dont buy in this market advice" is the same as all the doom and gloomers are saying. It is also not a way of making money [EDITORIAL COMMENT - HAHAHAHAHA!!!!]. It is a way of losing money - on rent on lost opportunity. There is the most opportunity in the RE market than there has even been - and you are missing it [EDITORIAL COMMENT - HAHAHAHAHA!!!!]."

"Please explain to me how LES non doorman real estate is 40-50% like you predicted instead of the 8-10% up like the data shows?"

petrfitz, I have never "predicted" that. go ahead, search the forum threads, you will never see me saying that manhattan real estate, whether LES doorman or non-doorman or anything, will go down 40-50%.

find it. it's not there. i intentionally never made metric % decline predictions because it is very, very difficult to do.

Here is the genius's opinion from 10 months ago - LMAO - man all that inventory is really getting snatched up, isn't it!!!:

"Steve how many buyers have been on the sidelines and have not bought this year? You dont see them all coming back in at the same time as soon as the press starts to call bottom?>

You dont think that that inventory will get snatched up?

Idiot"

i stand bye all the above statements. renting is not a way of making money. there are a ton of buyers on the sidelines. they will jump in as soon as the bottom is called. some already have - did you the sales and mortgage numbers jsut reported?

and since those 2008 quotes - MMafia and Bsexloser have spent over $100K in rent trying to time the market.

I doubt that pterozitz. Too little confidence for that to happen. And plenty of people have already called a "bottom," so even if someone calls it and is correct, it'll take a long time before most people are in agreement. This will likely be drawn out, and that's something you can't seem to wrap your head around. I wouldn't say renting is a direct way of making money, but for many people right now, it's a good way to avoid spending too much money.

"i stand bye all the above statements"

Of course you do - b/c you're not very bright and in denial.

"renting is not a way of making money"

It is if you employ your cash in better investments than overflated RE. But what would you know about that anyway?

"there are a ton of buyers on the sidelines. they will jump in as soon as the bottom is called"

Didn't you already call the bottom? Guess they weren't listening to you. LMAO.

"some already have - did you the sales and mortgage numbers jsut reported?"

I saw that sales this year have plummeted from last year - is that what you were referring to?

"and since those 2008 quotes - MMafia and Bsexloser have spent over $100K in rent trying to time the market"

I paid $100K in rent over the past 8 months? Funny, that's news to me. I must rent at the Plaza or something. Nice try, dope.

BTW, all those that said no thanks to Microsoft, Dell and Intel at btwn $50 and $100 per share in 2000 were really morons, right? Idiot "market timers", they never learn! Keep trying to blow smoke up people's ass, Petrified, it ain't working (except on yourself - LOL).

ah there is the flaw in your argument "It is if you employ your cash in better investments than overflated RE." when you rent the money you would spend on a mortgage does not go to other investments it goes to rent. as an owner a portion of my money goes to a mortgage which is an investment and the remainder goes to other investments. As a renter 50% of your take home pay goes to rent - not an investment - a complete 100% loss, the remainder of your money goes to other investments. man you are slow.

Also if you are not spending money in rent what do you live in some shit hole studio and cook off a hot plate? You live in your parents basement and want us to believe you know about investing?

"as an owner a portion of my money goes to a mortgage which is an investment"

petrfizz, you do know that a mortgage is only a security for debt, right?

"As a renter 50% of your take home pay goes to rent - not an investment - a complete 100% loss"

Where do you get this malarkey? When I rented, I paid much much less than 50% of my take-home. Except for one, they were beautiful apts in prime areas.

petrfitz,

so you stand by the statement that rents are going up? you stand by the statement that early 2008 was the best time in history to buy nyc real estate?

you would have a lot more credibility if you would simply admit what is obvious to anyone with a pulse: you were wrong.

"when you rent the money you would spend on a mortgage does not go to other investments it goes to rent. as an owner a portion of my money goes to a mortgage which is an investment and the remainder goes to other investments"

Hey, dunce, does the money you blow on interest, maintenance and RE taxes go to your other investments? What about the closing costs you blew when you made your purchases? The only portion of your monthly nut that qualified as an "investment" is that which goes to pay down your principal balance - and this is a small % of the total amount. Get it?

"As a renter 50% of your take home pay goes to rent"

Wrong - my rent is about 20% of my after-tax pay - try again.

"Also if you are not spending money in rent what do you live in some shit hole studio and cook off a hot plate?"

No, I have a nice place - 1-bedroom - much more for the money I spend than I could have afforded had I followed your idiotic advice and bought a condo at the absolute top of the RE cycle last year. And my landlord hasn't raised my rent in several years.

LOOKS LIKE YOU STRUCK OUT - AGAIN - NO SURPRISE THERE, THOUGH.

"blow on interest, maintenance and RE taxes go?" they go to tax deductions. You pay these fees for the landloard as a renter and you dont get any tax deductions.

"What about the closing costs you blew when you made your purchases" - tax deductible.

I am sure that your landlord loves the fact that you think paying his mortgage, taxes, interest and maintenance costs each month for him in rent is an investment. I know as a landlord I love idiots like you.

"I have a nice place - 1-bedroom" good for you. I live in a 4 bedroom unit with 2 living rooms a huge garden and 8 car private parking. Most of the costs of the place that I live in is paid for by the tenants of my investment properties. I guess you got it better than me.......

""What about the closing costs you blew when you made your purchases" - tax deductible."

No - you can deduct points, but not transfer taxes (if any), mansion tax, legal fees, etc.

"and 8 car private parking."

I thought it was 10. What happened to the other 2?

yes you can deduct many of the other fees if you are buying as a business....... RE 101

petrfitz: looking forward to buying some of your properties for $0.40 on the dollar in, say, 2 years.
(and i already own...)

you are a complete idiot - at least you're still here - unlike spunky et.al.

it gets too tight with 10 cant move around as well.... you can fit 10-12 when i have a garden party bumper to bumper

"they go to tax deductions"

Oh, OK, so they're not real costs after all? Good one. Hey everyone, Petrified has just clarified things - APPARENTLY THERE ARE NO TRANSACTION COSTS OR CARRYING COSTS INVOLVED IN BUYING AND OWNING REAL ESTATE!!!! WHEW, THAT'S A RELIEF - NOW WHERE DO I SIGN UP TO BUY SOME OVERPRICED PROPERTIES? AND HERE I WAS THINKING STUFF LIKE MANSION TAXES ACTUALLY HAD TO BE PAID - SILLY ME.

"I live in a 4 bedroom unit with 2 living rooms a huge garden and 8 car private parking."

Sure you do - WINK WINK. While you're at it, why don't you give everybody your personal make believe up-to-the-minute net worth figure as well? BTW, I never claimed to be rich - but I have a lot of time ahead of me to make money - whenever I get to your advanced age, I'm sure (based on your obvious lack of financial acumen) that I will be a lot wealthier then than you are today.

Do you have 8 cars? Or do you rent the spaces out? In which case, it would be quite unlikely you could have 10-12 cars in there for your "garden parties," since, you know, everyone would have to move their cars for you.

hmm $0.40 on the dollar? care to wager that will be the market price in 2 years? Even still I bought them in 2000 and $0.40 on the 2008 dollar would be abotu a 400% return (not counting all the rent i collected.

Why am I an idiot as an owner and you are not? what do you own? I have 4 rent producing building in the LES that have recently been upzoned to double FAR. What are you holdings?

I own 2 cars. Only keep 1 in the city. rent 1 spot. the rest are open for friends and vistors.

you have eight parking spaces in manhattan? that's classy!

you can own a home with eight parking spaces, or you can rent a home with eight parking spaces. you can waste your money on an apartment you can't afford to rent, or you can waste your money on an apartment you can't afford to own. you can lose your shirt renting or lose your shirt owning.

is your argument really that it is not possible to rent a nice home? are you really trying to convince us that it is always, under all circumstances, financially beneficial to own rather than rent? this is just such a pathetic argument i'm amazed that you have the gall to make it.

there is an apartment right now at 51 5th avenue asking $3 million and $2500 per month in maintenance or available to rent for $8,000 a month--you can look it up. so i put it to you like this: you have two options. option 1: rent the apartment for $8k per month and invest your money in munis or equities or whatever you want. option 2: buy the apartment and rent it to me for 8k per month.

so petrfitz, i'm asking you, which option do you take?

you have a net worth of only $11 million and you tie up $1 million of it in a bunch of empty parking spaces for your 'garden parties'? you really have quite the financial accumen putting 1/10th of your net worth into empty parking spaces for your friends to use every once in a while.

i buy properties that i can afford. i buy properties that i find as undervalued. your idiotic scenario above is jsut that idiotic. i take neither because it is not a property that i would buy nor one that i would own.

my argument is that it is not too difficult to find a property to own that is a good investment if you have a brain and look past the first building and broker you see.

I am currently looking at buying a $2.5 million brownstone in Park Slope. That same Brownstone would rent anywhere from $10K -15K month. I chose to buy because it makes sense with my cash situation - need to roll over - taxes etc.

pterifizz, do you have a curb-cut permit?

happyrenter - i actually have about $3 million in value tied up in parking spaces. It is a property that someone else will develop. i dont need the immediate cash and its current use makes an acquisition easier. the acquisition is greater in value than any revenue i could produce from it now.

Alanhart - yes I do.

petrfitz,

it may be easy to find undervalued properties to buy--i'm not a real estate investor so i wouldn't know. i can tell you that it is extremely easy right now to find undervalued equity investments--it is shooting fish in a barrel.

so if i choose to rent and to deploy my capital in other ways that can earn me a better return than i believe i can get from tying it up in owner-occuppied housing, and then spend a few thousand bucks a month to rent, why do you think i shouldn't?

as for my supposedly 'idiotic' scenario, it is not 'my' scenario at all, it is a real-life scenario that currently exists at 51 5th avenue. you won't answer because, obviously, it would make far more sense to rent in that situation than to buy.

you are still not going to even acknowledge that there are SOME circumstances in which it makes more sense to rent than to own? incredible.

"i buy properties that i find as undervalued"

So I guess you bought a bunch of properties in 2008? Per your posts, you clearly thought it was a great time to buy last year. So how many undervalued properties did you buy last year?????

AND I AM STILL WAITING FOR YOU TO IDENTIFY A SINGLE PROPERTY THAT HAS APPRECIATED IN VALUE IN 2009. The fact that you attempt to ignore the question is an obvious indicator that you can't name one.

petrfitz,

ah, i see. so you DON'T live in a home with ten parking spaces at all. you live in a home that abuts an empty lot on which you can park. thanks for clearing that up.

"so if i choose to rent and to deploy my capital in other ways that can earn me a better return than i believe i can get from tying it up in owner-occuppied housing, and then spend a few thousand bucks a month to rent, why do you think i shouldn't?" Then why do you spend all day on a real estate investment board trying to convince others not to invest in real estate?

Bsexless loser - i bought 1 poperty in the last year. A beach house in an estate next door to a property that i already owned. my property hindered the other properties riparian rights and i was able to buy the property from the estate at a huge discount.

this is a real estate investment board? huh, last time i checked it was a board primarily for people looking for a place to live--that is, to buy or rent an apartment to live in. owner-occupied real estate is not an investment.

"i bought 1 poperty in the last year. A beach house..."

So you couldn't identify a single property in Manhattan worth investing a small portion of your massive income (courtesy of your dopey renters - WHAT FOOLS THEY ARE TO HAND ALL THEIR $ OVER TO YOU!!!) on as an investment???? Meanwhile, you were telling everyone else that it was the best time to buy NYC RE in recorded history. I guess you were full of it, then, huh? And how many Manhattan properties have you bought in 2009 - surely you've at least made a few offers on all the massively undervalued apts out there - better hurry up before all the sideline sitters rush in to scoop up the bargains!

pterifrizz, what's the curb-cut permit number?

Don't get me wrong, I find petrfitz crazy. But if he bought a while ago and his rent roll is higher than his mortgage plus maintenance, he truly doesn't care whether his apts are worth less. He can literally wait 30yrs until his property is paid down and then sell.

"i actually have about $3 million in value tied up in parking spaces"

LMAO - let me guess, you have an appraisal for $3MM, right? HAHAHA - "Hey, Mr. Prospective Buyer, I know you will only offer me $750K for my beautiful parking spaces, but...but...but I have an APPRAISAL, see??? It says $3 million!!!" Get real, clown.

"he truly doesn't care whether his apts are worth less"

Huh, that's funny, considering all the time he spends trying to pump Manhattan RE on this board. If he didn't care he wouldn't be here. The point isn't whether it was a good idea to buy in 1997 or 2000, the point is whether it is a good idea to BUY TODAY - or whether it was a good idea to BUY IN 2008, as Petrified advised everyone else to do. Clearly he has been 100% DEAD WRONG about everything for the past year and is likely to continue to be 100% DEAD WRONG.

ueside, i really don't give a rat's ass what petrfitz is doing with his jolly effin money. The question is whether or not it makes sense, and in what circumstances, for people to choose renting over buying. petrfitz is insisting that it is currently idiotic not to search for a buy now, while i really couldn't be bothered to do so at a time when both rents and sales prices are declining, and may very well fall off a cliff. even if they don't, there's little downside for me as i would pay far more to buy what i currently rent, even if i take into account the modest equity that i would gain.

happyrenter... petridish is so full of his own left side/right side brain.. .that when he sees someone with more "business" acumen.... he thinks to himself "I'm so much more artistic than that guy." And when he sees someone who excels in the arts (much more than he), he states "I am SO much more business savvy than that guy." Dude is in complete denial....

pertridish, how was the RPIE filing this year? Sucks doesn't it?

How much are you renting the parking spot for... I just picked up a 997 Turbo for $80K... can you believe it, it was trading $140K new and $95K just 7 months ago b/f Lehman....

Now the Classic 7 on CPW is coming to me at $500psf.... just saved the mrs and I 10 years or work... it's coming to me so quickly, I might have to step out of the way to catch my breath... :)

Petrified - you'd better not read the following, it might scare you too much. Sorry bro, looks like all your dreams concocted in the fantasy world you inhabit are in the process of being shattered completely. Sucks for you:

http://www.reuters.com/article/reutersEdge/idUSTRE52U72220090331

we67, so let's say instead of $4mm you pay $2mm. To make $2mm difference net (let's say $4mm gross) you need 10yrs of work? So you make $400k per year? With that you def. shouldn't buy a $2mm place imo.

there are also buildings that hold cars. They are called garages

Alan tell me your social security number and I will give you my permit number. Deal?

more great news for the NY economy ;-)

New York’s Tax Increases Larger Than Announced for the Wealthy
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By Michael Quint

April 1 (Bloomberg) -- New York’s higher tax rates, proposed in the state budget plan, would apply to wealthier residents’ total taxable income, not just the amount exceeding their tax bracket threshold, as state officials have said.

The $131.8 billion budget agreement revealed Sunday includes plans to raise $4 billion through increases in “the marginal state personal income-tax rate for higher-income filers,” New York Governor David Paterson and the Division of Budget said in a press release.

The statement wasn’t consistent with New York’s so-called tax benefit recapture rules, which deny wealthier individuals the benefit of lower tax rates on the first dollars they earn. Instead, all their income after deductions is taxed at the highest rate.

“The tax benefit recapture rules mean that New York actually collects more than other states with the same tax rate,” said E.J. McMahon, director of the Empire Center, an Albany-based group that analyzes the state’s economy, taxes and spending. “For those with high incomes, the state charges a flat tax at the highest rate.”

For a married couple filing a joint return with an adjusted gross income exceeding $350,000, the new 7.85 percent tax rate would apply to all their income, after deductions. If the new tax was a “marginal” rate, as the governor and Division of Budget said in their March 29 press release, the same couple would have paid rates of 4 percent to 5.9 percent on income between $16,000 and $40,000; 6.85 percent on income between $40,000 and $300,000, and 7.85 percent on the remaining $50,000.

omg, this is just too funny... petrfitz can't be THIS wack.. i'm beginning to think this is all a front by petritz just to rile people. people can't be this @#$%$%... can they?

umm... actually, i think they can. i just remembered his old comments about his trophy ex-model wife who is super rich. bwaahaahaha... this just keeps getting better and better.

"New York’s higher tax rates, proposed in the state budget plan, would apply to wealthier residents’ total taxable income, not just the amount exceeding their tax bracket threshold, as state officials have said"

Uh oh, Petrified, you'd better jack up those rents quick on your idiot wannabe bitter tenants. I would actually suggest doubling the rent on each tenant. Luckily for you, the fact that rents are plummeting throught Manhattan will have no impact on your ability to do this w/o losing tenants, since you and your properties are immune from market forces such as supply and demand.

ueside.. sorry about not getting back to you on the "snarky" comment... it's like tourette syndrome.. .when I get on an anonymous board.. I lose all sense of social decorum and become my inner "bull" hating self.. but otherwise my wife thinkz I'm the main squeeze and my children (3yo and 5yo) adore me. :)

Hmmmmmmm let's see.... $1MM cash, wife a doc ($400K/yr), I've got commercial RE (backstopped by an LC from Citibank, thx u for the bailout monies) CF $350K/yr (remember I've got a 4% annual increase for 10 yrs), no debt, 997 Turbo (leased for my business, thx you tax payers), RR HSE (promised wife to sell - soon), Honda Odyssey (touring- top of the line baby) for kids, and Cayenne Turbo for wife (thank you Sec 179 big truck tax deduction BUSH).... you are right, after nannies (3x), private schools (2x), ancillary trips to Maui (4seasons - you'll find me in cabana #2), upkeep on sailboat, yacht club membership... 401K savings etc.... it would take us 4 years to save the $1MM - if we keep the 3/4 trip to Tahiti down....

THE KEY to the equation is the downpayment. Let's say wife and I save $400K more in the next 2 yrs.. .so liquid at $1.4MM in 2011.... NYC RE continues to dump.... mmmmm I wonder if I could lowball a prime 7 on CPW that requires 50% down maybe 20 to 30% off list... you think I won't be able to pick up a prime CPW 7 that was listed at $7MM at Dec 2007, for $2.8MM by 2011? CASH is king and at the open house, I intend to take a nice dump, flush the toilet and walk out and lowball 30% off.... and look at the ex-banker's eyes and know he's got no other bidders...

Next question?

"as an owner a portion of my money goes to a mortgage which is an investment"

petrfizz, you do know that a mortgage is only a security for debt, right?

----

Don't confuse perfitz with any words longer than 4 letters... he just doesn't understand 'em

"Let's say wife and I save $400K more in the next 2 yrs.. .so liquid at $1.4MM in 2011.... NYC RE continues to dump..."

W67th - don't you know that "market timers" are idiots, as per Petrified? I mean, it's ALWAYS a good time to buy, regardless of stupid stuff like RE bubbles. You missed out on your chance to buy last year, but it's not too late! Don't try to lowball people, just take your life savings and put it into that CPW property you've been eyeing at whatever price they're currently asking. See, Petrified has taught me that it doesn't matter what price you pay for an asset, so long as it's RE in Manhattan - eventually it will go up in value. Don't worry, be happy - step up and buy now - be like Petrified.

a mortgage is a security which lays out the terms for the repayment of a loan. it is an investment for the person or institution who owns that security--that, is, the person who owns a right to an ongoing, usually fixed but sometimes variable, stream of interest and principle payments. it is most definitely not an investment for the person who is required to make the monthly payment.

someone pls explain to me what "final price reduction" means?
http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/358634-coop-41-central-park-west-lincoln-square-new-york

Before I shoot myself in the head? Let me get this straight... the seller is threatening the buyer... that's it, I won't cut anymore? THIS HAS GOT to be the funniest stmt in the whole of SEdom. Sad part is my statement was "I won't bid above $4,999,999." shrug....shrug...more open houses here i come.

my goal in life is to have widestance's gait and petridish's swagger.... only if I could buy all of manhattan at $2000psf... I'd be rich in 1000 yrs....

w67th - looks like you missed out on your shot to buy this property - they just jacked up the price today. Damn, oh well, maybe next lifetime.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/365898-coop-115-central-park-west-lincoln-square-new-york

Bsex.... that's the "sick" deal agentrachel spoke about... I think it's funny that people are actually raising prices in this market.... I guess that what they teach you at Broker 101 class. Too bad I flunked.

"Let me get this straight... the seller is threatening the buyer..."

w67th - allow me to translate:

"FINAL PRICE REDUCTION" = final price reduction...until our next price reduction in 3 weeks

"SEE THIS APARTMENT BEFORE IT IS GONE!" = let's hope we can con somebody into bidding; if not, we'll just give up and take it off the market

"that's the "sick" deal agentrachel spoke about"

Oh, right - well, I guess she got so many bids they had to raise the price. Makes sense.

This one is 1/2 way to zero in just 3 months - reminds me of LEH at $20 / share last year - keep cuttin' guys, eventually a bidder will show up - or not...LOL.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/371292-coop-730-park-avenue-lenox-hill-new-york

21K monthly carrying cost - good luck