Open House Anecdotes - 4/13 - Upper West Side

West81st, have you already checked out the two listings at 515 West End? Thinking about going over there today. What was your perspective?

EAO: I saw the Elliman listing a few weeks ago, and it's very nice. I also like the broker (relatively speaking), and I suspect we'll see another price cut soon. The layout of the Stribling listing didn't look good for us at all, so I passed on that one. Looks more like 1.75 than 2.175 to me, but I'm a buy-side bigot.

Thanks for the feedback. The Elliman listing has actually now dropped to $2250. Do you think it will go further? From the pictures, I was uncertain about the restructured layout and the light.. guess, I will check it out today and see for myself. In terms of the Stribling listing, it looked from the pictures like every window except one faced a brick wall.

I'm very curious about whether people going to open houses for a while now detect any changes in attitudes/sales pitches of brokers--whispering about flexibility, still suggesting a very strong market and confidence in a quick sale, etc. Personally, I've senses a softening of approach in about 1/2 the brokers I'm talking to lately as opposed to a very sort of "better hurry!" attitude last October. Several have been very willing to discuss how offering prices were arrived at and what comparables they looked at when I've inquired after not being able to understand the price.

If the property has been on the market for a while, the brokers are usually fairly eager to make a deal. It's hard to use a "better hurry" approach when every one knows that it is just sitting there. With newer listings that are either priced well or just great properties, I have not seen any flexibility and typically the "better hurry" approach. Having been looking since last summer, I am amazed at how many properties have been just sitting on the market. It seems when I started looking, things moved much quicker and usually close to asking.

EAO: Oh - that's the price cut I was predicting on 11D. Guess I was a little late predicting it. I thought the flow of that apartment was pretty good - except for the massive built-in wall unit in the living room, which is easy to fix by removing it. I liked the kitchen, especially the way the laundry gizmos are tucked away. Not sure it works so well as an eat-in. You'd need a very narrow table.

Kylewest: Definitely. The details vary, but there's a pervasive change in tone from "You need me" to "I need you."

West81 we might run into you at 201 W 89th, but we are at a distinctly lower price point than you.

This is our first time looking since last Spring when we looked aggressively for about 3-4 months before realizing the market was completely out of whack and in need of correction and we weren't going to buy at the top of a bubble. I'm surprised at the number of offerings in our range...in fact there are too many to look at today! I still think prices are going to come down drastically (no need to start a discussion on that on this thread, though), so we aren't really serious about buying, but think we should educate ourselves a bit better on where the market is now.

drg: My eyes are bigger than my bank balance. I have reasons for checking $3MM listings, but buying them unfortunately isn't a realistic option.

Did anyone see a place with a real terrace (not a balcony!) on the UWS under $2.1?

Inquirer: No, but terraces aren't a big attraction for us anyway. At that price point, I suspect a real terrace might cost you a room.

Lunchtime update: I have seen the first six properties on the original list. Looks like I'll cover all eight. There's some funny stuff out there.

West81st, curious why your south boarder is 79th st. Is that a personal bias or just based based on how much time you had to look at open houses today?. Also, have you heard anything new on the Harrison? Walked by today and was surprised by the progress.

juiceman - I share West81st setiment area-wise. It's just not the same below w 79 and above w 106. From W 106 down to w 91 IT is only west of Broadway. On Amsterdam and Columbus IT didn't get threre yet for various reasons, and CPW is not everyone's cup of tea. There's a small Manhattan Avenue (starts on w 100), and it's been landmarked for a 1 block, I believe between w 105 and w 106.

okay so we are just back from our open house viewings and here are my thoughts:

186 Riverside Drive Apts. 8A ($1.395) and 9A ($1.285):
these units were unsuccessfully marketed together late in 2007 and are now represented by different agents by the same shop. We saw 9A first and we about #7 on the list at nearly the end of the open house. The unit needed work. It was livable, but looked a little tired in my opinon. We didn't spend much time here as we were in a hurry (hubby back late from the gym so we were late to start) and I was much more interested in 8A, which was advertised as renovated. The view to the east was partially blocked in the living room by the mechanicals that are on top of the school building next door. This is not as big a deal in the bedroom, which also has an east-facing window, but the window is much smaller and on the side of the bedroom. You basically have to stand *at* the window to get the view. Hubby was busy looking at the fuse box to see if the apartment would need to be rewired in a renovation and the answer is "yes." This is a big deal for him, because when we renovated our existing apartment, it was a nasty surprise when renovations began. The agent offered another viewer the info that there was an offer, but we didn't stop to chat.

8A was in much better shape, but in this apartment the view east was completely blocked by the mechanicals, so no matter how nice the renovation, it is a no go for us. We didn't even sign in. I had wondered why the photos on-line showed the top half of the blinds lowered (but not the bottom) and the reason is is that they needed to block out the top half of the vent that is about 15 feet away from the window and painted black.

I liked the building, which had a nice lobby and good hallway renovations. Also, lookers needed to be escorted upstairs, which is nice if you become an owner. Proximity to the park is also nice, but I thought the hike to the subway could get old, especially in the winter. I would look at lower floored apartments here on the westside of the building, but for the A line you really need to be floor 11 or higher, in my opinion.

201 W. 89th St. #4G ($1.195). We rushed here from Riverside and arrived after the official open house ending time. We went in anyway. I don't know how many people had been there because they had put the sheets away and the agent handed me a new sheet to fill out. It was a real turnoff when the agent's assistant handed me a photo copy of yesterday's NY Times "Greatly Exaggerated?" column. It is almost as if they are trying to convince buyers that it is still a seller's market, which just goes to show you what a big lie that is! The apartment didn't make much of an impression. I couldn't get over the views of the walls from nearly every room and the cheap-o hardware store shades. The bedrooms were fairly small and the kitchen wouldn't work for us. It is basically a galley kitchen with no window, painted red. Yum. The building is beautiful, with a nice lobby and renovated hallways.

Our last stop was 514 WEA, aparment #5C ($1.275). Again, this apartment needed work. The kitchen was listed as "renovated," but the flooring was cheap-looking and there is a funky space (basically the hallway with the service entrance) that has been converted into storage with metal shelves that you can see. Also the refrigerator jutted out a good 6-8 inches from the wooden trim around it. The view was good, with an exposure on the north side and west over West End. On the 5th floor it is more of a slightly above tree top view, which I do not find objectionable. The unit has been reduced a few times since it was listed. We were 3rd on the list at about 30 minutes into the open house. Agent questioned us many times about how the unit worked for our family. We are not big talkers at open houses (why give the agent ammunition?), but my husband offered that at least the airconditions are through the wall. This was a big selling point to me, because the living room airconditioner is about 8 feet off the floor, and there is no way to hide that! Will be interesting to see what this one goes for.

should read "air conditioners are through the wall. This was *not* a big selling point to me, because the living room air conditioner is about 8 feet off the floor..."

JuiceMan: It's a school thing. The southern edge of the PS9 catchment runs in a jagged line, mostly along 80th and 81st streets. The northern edge is at 85th, but I have other ties to the area from 86th to 90th. We have practical reasons for favoring to the catchment, since nobody knows whether the sibling variance will survive from year to year. It's not an absolute requirement - just a preference.

drg: Great writeup. I'll do mine tonight. I agree with you completely about the apartment at 201 W. 89th. Mounting the air conditioners in the bedrooms higher would help; currently, they block the only decent views in the whole apartment.

GREENWICH VILLAGE and CHELSEA:

105 W 13 St, 14E: $1,235,000/$1891(!) maintenance. New listing. At 13th and 6th Ave. Pro: real 2 bdrm/2 bath in decent shape with good views and light, kitchen can have small table for a.m. coffee. Cons: claustrophobic low ceilings, high maintenance, washing machine is in kitchen and has no dryer; very awkward closet in master bd-room; very average slightly homely building. My take: Knock out the second bedroom, remove the extra shower and open up the kitchen and you have a 1/2-way decent 1-bedroom but at $1.235MM and high maintenance, I'm not sure this will sell right away mostly because of the low ceilings and high maintenance.

306 W 13 St, #5: $895,000/$904 maint. New listing. At 8th Ave and W 4 St. Pros: Very 'Village,' renovated kitchen and bathroom, nice floors. Cons: 4th floor walkup; some broken glass tiles on bathroom wall, somewhat quirky/awkward bedroom nook configuration with huge sliding dividers that may not be to every buyer's taste; television and audio built into tight corner and would take a contractor to alter; view from bedroom is through sliver b/w buildings of Luke Oil gas station on 8th Ave. Bottom line: may appeal to spry single person who loves Village quirkiness and charm of squeaky narrow stairs leading to ample-sized apartment they don't have to do much to.

29 Perry St, 4R: $1.3MM/$1080 maint. New listing. Pros: pre-war arches and moldings, nice light, cool window in livingroom; baronial decorative fireplace in medieval inspired lobby (no doorman). Cons: walkup, tight for two people (although perfect for one). Opinion: may want to play with configuration of bedrooms to make one larger and one office. Doesn't work as true two bedroom because apt too small for grown kid and no one with a baby would want to walk up this far with a tot while toting a carriage and groceries. Expensive.

29 W 15 St., PH 10B: $1.1MM/$888 maint. B/w 5&6 Ave. Pros: rooftop deck comes with apartment along with private storage closet and washer/dryer off public hall outside apt. Cons: Kitchen and bath need total renovation; bedrooms tiny and narrow. IMHO: This apt need a lot of work--must reconfigure it to make it work by moving bathroom and combining two tiny bedrooms. I think it's expensive because it requires about $150,000 and still will have narrow bedroom; rooftop is nice and special though.

10 W 15 St., PH F: $1,295,000/maint $1112. Off Fifth Ave. Pros: Awesome light and narrow but sunny wrap around terrace for plantings and outdoor dining (at small table); high quality construction of built-ins with total top to bottom renovation with finishes that will appeal to most buyers; large walk-in storage closet. Cons: So designed that you cannot put much of a mark on the style without tearing out built ins which cover every wall. Assessment: fabulous bachelor pad; could work for a couple; great if you don't want to do a thing, but you'll pay for someone else having done it for you.

18 west 90th St, $1,749,000: really nice apartment, mint condition. both bedrooms have nice views of townhouses'gardens, the 2nd bd is small and one bathroom has a weird layout with sliding doors. the townhouse is not the prettiest one and the elevator is really small but at least there is one. maybe possible to create a 3rd bd in the front of the apt.
any comments if you have visited this apt as well?
I have questions for the ones living around there: how's the area? is it desolate at night and difficult to find a cab or not great to walk from the subway stations? what about restaurants, grocery shopping, deliveries?

ninux: I haven't seen that apartment. The walk from 86th and CPW is absolutely fine. There are grocery stores around the corner on Columbus, including a D'Agostino's.

Here are brief, totally subjective reports from my first five visits:

180 Riverside Drive 6B $3,675,000 3 beds 2 baths Co-op
Activity level: low-moderate

After seeing so many generic apartments at absurd prices, it was nice to see something special, even if it’s out of our price range. This is a true Riverside classic, a home many UWSers aspire to.

The first sign that I had moved up in class was the implausibly attractive young blonde accompanying visitors from the lobby to the sixth floor. For those who know the location, 6B is the “point” apartment on the narrowed corner of 90th. As a result, the shape is unusual, almost a wedge, and the views looking west and southwest from the BRs are gorgeous. The steep downward slope of the park makes the apartment feel higher than the sixth floor. The place is entirely habitable as-is, but nothing has been done since the early 70s and it shows, especially in the kitchen and baths.

There are three BRs in the corner wing facing the park and river. The public rooms face 90th Street; though it’s not the river, you could do worse than looking at 175 RSD over dinner. The kitchen wing has plenty of space for one or two more small bedrooms, home office, etc.

This listing could be an opportunity for somebody with money to realize their dream home. The bones are all there, nothing has been spoiled, and the building is great. The owners are empty-nesters moving to the Midwest. It's sort of like an estate sale without the obnoxious heirs. I hope a good family buys this place.

325 West 86th Street 4A $1,795,000 2 beds 2 baths Co-op
Activity level: low
This one is an actual estate sale, with all that connotes. It needs everything: new kitchen, new baths and probably reconfiguration to make the bathrooms viable and add some decent closets. The floor plan tells the story here: six rooms lined up neatly in a row. All rooms face north, which is OK because the townhouses on 87th are low and form a pretty nice backdrop. The price needs to come down to reflect the fixer-upper condition. At the right price, this one has potential for a small family that likes peace and quiet. The building is so-so. Look for a big reduction, probably very soon.

201 West 89th Street 4G $1,195,000 2 beds 2 baths Co-op
Activity level: moderate

Drg covered this one thoroughly. A few quick fixes would make it more appealing: raise - or remove - the BR air conditioners to restore the garden view; brighten up the kitchen, and maybe down-size to a fridge that’s more in-scale with the rest of the apartment; the washer-dryer might have to go. It’s hard to hate a realistically-priced apartment in an excellent building. Maybe we’re nearing the day when this kind of unit crosses back to the correct side of the $1MM barrier.

251 West 89th Street Apt. 7D $2,795,000 3 beds 2 baths Condo
Activity level: low
Quick: what’s the first thing you do after buying a 1900 square foot pre-war condo in the Admaston? Why, rip out every stick of wood flooring, of course - and replace it with granite tile! Between the floors, the country kitchen and the oak built-ins, the whole apartment is a perfect union of 1986 style and 2006 pricing. Even if the price plummets, leaving budget space for the necessary restoration, there’s still a fundamental problem: of the four exposures trumpeted in the listing, three face brick walls, and they aren’t particularly nice brick walls. So aside from the two back bedrooms that face Broadway, this $3MM investment gets you the sort of view usually reserved for inmates. Yeah, I hated this one, which says a lot because I really like the building.

425 West End Avenue Apt. 4A/B ↓$3,695,000 5 beds 4 baths Co-op
Activity level: low
There’s a story behind this listing, and I think the headline is something like “Calypso superstar’s son bites off more than he can chew.” This isn’t a typical case of neighbors joining forces to market their apartments. The way I pieced it together, the B*l*f*nt*s have owned both units for years, and apparently inhabit both, but haven’t gotten around to merging them. The problems here are daunting. Not only do the apartments clash; they aren’t even internally consistent. The bathrooms reflect at least four distinct styles. To merge the units successfully would be a huge project, and would probably require buying some common space from the co-op. 4B does have a nice kitchen, and I think (though I'm not sure) that it could stay where it is.

After months (at least) of construction and carrying costs, the buyers will move into a spectacular $5MM apartment with unattractive views in a smallish co-op with shabby hallways and no doorman. It didn’t help that the public spaces smelled like rotting onions. According to the rattled agent, the disposal shaft had picked an unfortunate day to back up. I suspect, though, that 425 WEA might be the kind of building where that sort of thing happens fairly often. So if I had $5MM, I'd be heading for 180 RSD. People who want this kind of headache for $5MM belong in SoHo.

Three more to come in a separate post.

ninux - That neighborhood is quite safe. It is quiet but not desolate quiet, more like residential quiet. While I don't think the immediate shopping is all that great it is still a "park" block which counts for a lot. The grocery store is good but most of the good shopping is on Broadway (Barzinis being the better local green grocer/specialty food purveyor) and more of the restaurants will be on Amsterdam or farther down on Columbus. I once looked to live a block from there and my biggest beef was not having a gym close by. (I know, I know, running or walking to the gym should not be an issue, but proximity does help in getting ones butt there.)

excellent post w81
cant wait for your further reviews

Last three write-ups follow:

225 Central Park West Apt.111 $3,995,000 3 beds 2 baths Co-op
Activity level: low

Once you get past the over-the-top décor and the price, there is much to like about this large ground-floor unit in the rear of the Alden. The three-section, indoor-outdoor patio/solarium space is fantastic, the great room is an excellent entertaining area, and the master suite has walk-in/walk-through closets and a Tuscan-spa bathroom that most of us can only dream of. And while the lacquered built-ins, the Chinese red silk wall treatments, the Playboy Mansion-style family bathroom and the nursery’s massive Peter Pan murals didn’t speak to me, there might be a buyer who will pay a premium for this apartment’s idiosyncratic embellishments.

The question is how big a premium. For $4MM, outdoor lovers can buy a garden triplex in a really nice townhouse. Another million or two will land a whole brownstone. As we’ve discussed elsewhere, the Alden is a nice building, and it’s getting nicer with the just-launched hallway renovation; it’s just not the kind of building where people pay $4MM for a quirky ground-floor apartment – as they might, say, in a certain landmark on the other side of 82nd Street.

325 West 86th Street 11C ↓ $1,995,000 2 beds 2 baths Co-op
Activity level: low-moderate, perhaps diminished further by the doorman taking a long break.

What you see on-line is what you get. The diametric opposite of 4A (reviewed above), 11C is a pristine, impeccably tasteful designer showplace that will not interest anyone with children. That still leaves lots of empty-nesters and childless couples of various orientations as potential buyers. This apartment features one of the best eat-in kitchens I’ve ever seen in a unit this size. My guess would be that there’s better value available for people without kids; I’ve been out of that market segment too long to have much feel for it. The price here was reduced about 12% last week, and may have to come down more - or the owners may wind up throwing in the furnishings, which are currently priced around $400K. (Jeez, it’s nice, but it’s still used furniture.) BTW, the flip tax here seems very high: 7% or 5%, depending on tenure.

127 West 79th Street 8GF $2,295,000 3 beds 3.5 baths Co-op
Activity level: high

First, kudos to the Elliman team of Lense and Connor for drawing a big crowd to this open house and staging the apartment beautifully. They are marketing it as a 3BR, which is a bit disingenuous. It’s really a fantastic 2BR with an excellent family room that would serve as a comfortable guest room on occasion. Put a kid in there full-time and you’ll have a lovely view of his mess from the sleek great room. Or you can close that room off and spoil the flow of the layout.

The renovation is a pretty successful grafting of modern style onto prewar bones. Again, what you see in the pictures and the floor plan reflects reality. The look they have adopted here is popular in new construction and recent conversions. There are no really daring touches and the whole place is easy on the eyes. For a couple with money and no more than one child, it’s a turnkey solution. For a bigger family, I think a classic six - or seven, money permitting - might work better. The unit does have an excellent laundry area, which enhances its family-friendliness.

One clarification on 325 West 86th 11C: The second bedroom isn't even a bedroom anymore. It has been converted, thoroughly, to a library/study/home office. It could be converted back, but with so many classic sixes on the market, why bother? That's the main reason I can't see anyone with children buying the apartment. I realize that there are people with kids who like perfectly decorated spaces; but even Jennifer Garner's character in "Juno" wanted the baby's room to look like a baby's room.

Additional notes:

* The flip tax at 325 West 86th is a percentage of profit, not price.

* 180 RSD 6B probably needs new windows. Even if the co-op has a deal with an installer, the job will cost serious money. At least the new windows will have a view that's worth the investment.

* There are some amusing parallels between the dual units at 425 WEA and the double spread the owner's father had, six blocks south. And Dad initially overpriced his place by 30% too, before selling it for $10 or $11 million. That's still a lot of bananas for the tally man to count. Day-O!

My appreciation again goes out to W. 81st for succinct and interesting take on open houses. DRG as well.

If you would not mind considering a request from a loyal reader, would you consider adding the listed square footage as a point of critique?

Junkie: None of them jumped out as especially inflated. I don't pay much attention to listed square footgage anyway. I'm more interested in how an apartment would be inhabited by a real family than a raw number. We're not talking about loft space here.

West81st, thanks once again for your commentary. One question, did you think the property at 127 West 79th street was over-priced?

EAO: I think EVERY property is overpriced. I'm not sure what the comps are for that unit. If you take my view that it's really a fantastic 2BR, then $2.3MM might be a little rich. If you see it as a workable 3BR, then the price is relatively reasonable - which accounts for the big crowd at the open house.

West81, I also wanted to say thanks for your contributions. I'm not looking and don't know much about the UWS, but I enjoy your descriptions nonetheless. I'm in contract on a 3 bedroom downtown (I have 2 kids) so I enjoy looking at comparable apts.

From looking at the pictures of 127 W 79, it seemed reasonable to me to close off that 3rd BR. I wouldn't be surprised if that place sold pretty quickly at or near that price, course maybe thats cause I'm more familiar with the downtown market and a lot of places uptown seem cheap (relatively speaking) to me. I also know nothing about that building.

Thanks again.

West81st we are looking for a place for us and 1 child so the place could potentially work. I just feel that the living area is rather small and only works because of the extra room. I'm not really sure where you would put a tv if you used 3rd bedroom as a child's room. For all of those reasons, I feel it should be priced closer to $2MM. In terms of comps, there was a larger 3 bedroom that sold for $2.5MM in the building, but this was a combination of 3 1 bedrooms versus 2, so once again I think it is overpriced. We'll continue to watch the listing and if it moves downward, we may act.

EAO: If the prices wind up about the same, I personally prefer 515 WEA 11D, although the layout is choppier. Maybe it's my PS9 bias and my sentimentality about traditional floorplans. Both apartments are very nice, and it makes intuitive sense to me that they are around the same price point. They will appeal to slightly different buyers, but the overall value package seems very comparable.

If you want open entertaining space (as in "talking to your guests while you cook dinner"), the apartment on 79th is clearly a better choice. Good luck.

ccdevi: Happy to do it. I hope your purchase goes smoothly. And yes, uptown is (relatively) cheap.

West81st, why do you have a PS9 bias? I'm buying in that catchment, and haven't heard much about the public schools there. My broker told me how wonderful PS87 is for resale, etc., but I haven't heard anything similar about PS9. Thank you.

Jeff260: They are both very good, and I've never heard of anyone devaluing an apartment north of 81st because it was zoned for PS 9 rather than PS 87. The usual capsule view is that 87 does a better job of "leaving no child behind", while 9 gets points for a great G&T program (plus Anderson, which is actually a different school but inhabits the same building). I don't really have an opinion on that. Our bias is simply related to already being happy PS 9 parents and not wanting to split up the family if the sibling variance gets suspended again.

Not sure if this is the right thread, but has anyone been to an open house at 101 W. 87th St.? It's a 85 unit conversion called Park Columbus. The website makes it sound/look interesting. I am looking at 2BR/2BA units on the UWS in the 1.5mm - 2.0mm range for use as a pied a terre. Most of what I've seen either needs work or is badly configured.

mfromm: Yes. See separate thread: http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/2985-park-columbus

Jeff260: I think the description of PS 9 linked below is fair, particularly with regard to the distinct difference in racial composition between G&T and GenEd:
http://www.insideschools.org/fs/school_profile.php?id=68

thank you; very helpful

anyone's been to 170 west 74th st? 3bd/3bath - 1.95M. it's the top floor, combination of 3 apartments so maintenance are not low .. $2,500/month. the owners have done some renovation but not the whole apartment so at the end it needs a good amount of work. the apt is facing north and east and get good light and open views. the broker also told me we can buy roof rights to create an outdoor space, the other apt on te top floor starting doing that and built a green house on the roof.
I guess they'll need to lower the price b/c in that state the apt doesn't look really nice.

Ninux: Haven't seen it. That listing seems to have bounced around between brokers, which probably hasn't helped the marketing. It's interesting to see different agencies use the same pictures, with the same suspiciously vivid views (Photoshop, perhaps?).

In an update on last week's open house reviews, the price just dropped $245K on the 6-into-4 at 470 West End Avenue, an apartment that probably appeals to the same buyers as 127 West 79th #GF, but with everything upsized. At $2.75MM, it still marks the high end for a six on WEA. That's probably where it belongs, although the premium they're asking for the renovation still seems a little steep.

The bigger question is where and when prices in that sector will start to stabilize. At the moment, the retreat seems broad and rapid, although so far, most asking prices only seem to have fallen into line with 2006/2007 comps. Here's an amusing comparison:
http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/193957-coop-470-west-end-avenue-upper-west-side-manhattan
vs.
http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/17220-coop-470-west-end-ave-upper-west-side-new-york

Talk about getting to the same place from opposite directions. Same footprint, four floors apart; slightly different uses of space - 6B is obviously intended for a family with young children. One sparked a price war and traded at $2.7MM, 18% above ask, two years ago. The other started at $3MM. Where it winds up, we'll see,

Has anybody seen 315 west 86?

W81
That is an amazing comparison on the two apartments at 470 WEA
One selling for an huge markup over ask in a bidding war in the most overheated market in the history of the city
The other starting at an aspirational level and falling into line(?) as buyers balk lately.
Interesting to see where the latest one shakes out
My two cents is that before hte correction cycle is over, we will see prices come rougly in line to where they were in 2004, just a guess.

315 w 86 - I saw 14F. The light is that line is great and plenty of windows. My friend's contemplating it.
Inquirer - most of the posters on this thread seem to have families and are not interested in 1-bdrs. I liked the building, though.

136 W 75th st #3A $1.2MM - 2bed/1.5 bath Nice apt. with tree top views. Activity level was medium. There seemed to be a lot of brokers. Not sure about the price point especially since it's a non-doorman building.

12 W 72nd St $1.095MM - 2 bed/ 2 bath - Ick. Views looked onto another building. Everything needs to be renovated. Especially the black marble with mirrors bathroom. You can feel the 70's calling. Also the mtc is $2158 which is pretty high which would explain the lower price point. Overall feel was pretty shabby. Attendence was med.

161 W 75th St #6A $1.095MM- 2 bed/ 1 bath - Fully renovated, nice apartment. It felt a little small since the DR and LR feel like 1 room vs 2 separate areas. Attendence was medium.

Westelle: Some of my best friends don't have any kids. All are welcome here - except maybe kylewest, who eventually found the right thread. :o)

bfgross: Can't read too much into the comparison at this point. So far, all that's happened is that the two listings have found the same level. Maybe the lesson of that 2006 sale is that if you're going to buy a classic six, make sure one of the bedrooms can be split into two kids' rooms. That way, you can have a third bedroom (with its attendant resale advantages) and still have space for a trophy kitchen in the maids' wing. If you think about it, kids need privacy more than they need floor space. And turning the foyer into a windowless playroom makes up for not giving the tots any spare space in their bedrooms. Brilliant!

west81st: I didn't mean to exclude anyone. Sorry of it was taken this way.

It wasn't an open house but I saw an apartment at 2166 Broadway. The Harrison is being built right there, so I wanted to see what's up with the prices. The maintenance there!!! And the place feels/is cramped. Any thoughts?

Another update on 470 West End for bfgross and other UWS market-watchers: 10B just dropped by another $155K, to $2.595M. That puts it 5% below the price where 6B sold two years ago. Both are nicely renovated, but with different philosophies, as mentioned above. Maybe the difference is just the market; maybe it's the less family-friendly layout of 10B. Maybe it's a little of both.

westelle: The tradeoff at 2166 Broadway has been pretty consistent over the years: relatively low purchase prices in exchange for high monthlies and crummy layouts. Not sure what the underlying financial issue there is; the commercial space downstairs probably doesn't help much (a theater and a seedy basement health club). Some sellers seem to think they can trick the market, but these units eventually hit the bottom of their comp range.