Open House Today 1:30-4:00pm - High Floor Corner 1 Bedroom - 407 Park Avenue South #18B

I liked the apartment until I saw the maintenance.

The maintenance is 65% tax deductible. Our maintenance has not gone up in the past three years and there is no increase for 2009. We refinanced the mortgage last year and saved a lot of money, so the board is going to work at keeping the maintenance steady. The price has been lowered to offset the higher maintenance.

Cute apt, 407 - good luck! Let us know how it turns out.

You've got the pricing nailed, for both the building and the neighborhood. Especially since the other corner one-bedrooms don't have that second window in the bedroom.

BTW, that's a great refrigerator choice. Like how the freezer door is same height as the adjacent counter.

Good luck. But I want to say that I know of similar sized apartments priced at the low end of $400k in Kips Bay area. Granted yours is on a top floor.

Thanks NWT. You've got it, this is the only one bedroom in the building that has a second window in the bedroom. Light from two sides is more even and pleasing than light from one side.

Yes, the fridge is wonderful, I paid $3500 for it and will be sorry to leave it. Liebherr makes a quality product. I love not having to bend down to get things out of the fridge. The freezer is on the bottom.

manhattanguy,
Feel free to post a comp. I'll take a look. Yeah, which floor matters, as well as having some outdoor space.

Your apartment is lovely and very well priced.
The mt. is a bit high but I think you have compensated for it in the price.
Good luck

I know this place...doesn't Jill Layton live directly above this apartment?

No,but if she did, that would make me Buttle, but I consider myself to be more of the Harry Tuttle type, whose apartment was never shown in the film (Brazil).

407PAS - I am glad you dropped the price, I think it will increase your likelihood of success. Good luck.

407, good luck! It's a very pretty apartment. You've done a good job with the marketing. Best wishes to you.

Whooooooooooot! Good luck! and Best wishes for success!

Thanks, everybody. We're still on the field, let's see how things turn out.

We have received good comments from the people who have come to view the apartment. I think the biggest compliment we received this weekend was that our handout looked exactly like the apartment. I get the feeling from buyers that they often feel tricked by the pictures that are left out of other listings.

I hate to see people go to the trouble of seeing an apartment only to be disappointed by what they find when they get there. I think it is a waste of everybody's time.

Good for you..407 I agree with you

PAS - they put that fridge in my new rental - it's awesome. I was so thrilled. It's great. I was surprised to get such great stuff in a rental. The rest of the appliances are all GE profile

They put the Liebherr CS1601,

http://www.mannystv.com/catalog/brand/LBR/REF/FBOTF/liebherr_cs1601.html

in your rental? Amazing. Was that rental originally a condo that was going to be sold? It is hard to believe a landlord would spend the extra bucks. Maybe the guy got a deal on a volume order.

Looks exactly the same - no it's just a rental and they are slowly redoing the apartments - Rivergate - Manhattan skyline owns them. I was very impressed - sure they got a volume deal! Thrilled and the kitchen is eat in.

Good deal for you. Just for fun, could you look for the model number? Liebherr does make some cheaper models.

Well I finally found the number - cs1650 maybe just a new one. Wow it's cost $3799.

Yow-za. Thanks for posting that model number. I'm surprised the landlord hasn't bolted it to the floor.

Let me tell you when I walked in and saw an apt they already did all I wanted to do was move in. (our apt was a wreck) I cook every day and it is so much nicer to have stuff like this than the cheap white GE stuff I had in my other rental. Besides the fact that it's 400 sf bigger too and was almost the same price as the old place.

Here are past B-line sales at 407 PAS and the dates
of each sale. Looks like your price is still at or above peak-level
pricing. Seems to me you've got a few more chops to go.

07/23/2008 #14B $475,000;
02/11/2008 #16B $525,000;
08/29/2006 #22B $437,500;
06/14/2006 #23B $455,000;
07/15/2005 #4B $480,000;
04/20/2005 #11B $387,500;
08/24/2004 #20B $362,500

I think we look very attractive compared to what I see on the market. You may have your own opinions. Such is life.

I know the circumstances behind the sale of #14B and it is not a valid comp.

I'm with whathappened on this. If people with cash are shopping for 2001-2002 price levels, $450K for 650sf still doesn't sound like a bargain although it's a move in the right direction.

What year did you buy & what was the sale price?

any landlord who puts a $3800 refrige into a rental is retarded. The refridge is not going to get you a penny extra in rent. And besides, be careful with high end appliances because they are often junk, ESPECIALLY Sub Zero. Total garbage.

We just had the greatest market crash since the great depression, all the
brokers and papers are talking about 25-30% declines in co-op prices, and you're
seeking the second highest price ever paid for a B-line, above all but one of
the 2004-2008 pre-crash prices.

Seems like this is just another example of a seller thinking all apartment
prices have declined except for his own.

My price is $489k, you misread the ad. When I bought and at what price does not matter. Everyone wants a market price when they go to sell their apartment, no matter when they bought. Personally, I am trying to find apartments at the 1995 price level and am having trouble. Our place looks good compared to what other apartments I see on the market.

I have not been able to find another apartment in this neighborhood that has outdoor space, open city views, light from the south and east, windows in every room, and is on a high floor. I have looked at a lot of listings.

Interested buyers should feel free to stop by and see our apartment this Sunday from 2-4pm. We have gotten good reviews from everyone who has seen it. Leave your broker at home. This price does not include any money with which to pay a commission to a broker.

Our website is here:

http://web.me.com/mac.hive/407PAS/18B.html

When I say that I have not been able to find another apartment with the features I listed, I mean an apartment that is priced as cheaply as mine, with these features. I can show you a place with a huge terrace that has a maintenance of $2800+ a month and is $146k more expensive.

alpine,
What are you talking about, what rental? I bought the expensive fridge for my own use, as an owner. I'm not fond of SubZero, the Liebherr is a great fridge.

You missed the sale of 8B for $515k, so you're wrong, whathappened, just wrong. Brokers and papers can talk about 25-30% declines but I do not see that reflected in market prices.

"When I bought and at what price does not matter."

Bullshit.

Not bullshit sticky, the truth. Do you own an asset you're trying to sell in the marketplace? Would you reveal its cost to buyers? What someone paid in the past does not matter. What someone is willing to pay for it today is all that matters.

And sticky, if you produce some good, would you reveal its cost to your buyers? Why would I ever pay you a penny more than you paid to produce the good?

407PAS - think about this. If your maintenance is 1600 - fine, with tax deduction, 1000. How much would it cost to rent an apt like yours? These are the kinds of calculations would-be-buyers are making. Wouldn't it cost them over $3000 to own, despite deductions? And the income lost on the downpayment?

Streeteasy does not list the 8B price yet, but it sold in July 2008, the height
of the pre-crash market. So what part am I wrong about? Your price is only
about 5% below that even if you only want to consider that one comp. Do you really
think buyers today only want a 5% discount over a July 2008 price?

I know you're on these boards a lot, you read all the "demonstrate market
movement with comps" threads, its hard to belive you really don't see the
price declines. In any event, you are free to ignore the pre-crash comps
in your own building if you like, but your prospective purchasers likely
will not.

This apartment would probably rent for around $2800-2900. The spread is not all that large from the purchase price. nyc10023, your argument seems to be that people should never buy. Well, some people don't agree with you and they buy for various reasons.

8B is a lot lower, it does not get good light. A higher floor matters. My price is my price. A real buyer can come and see the apartment and make a bid. You're just here to hate on me, which is fine, whatever.

407PAS: I respectfully disagree. And I don't think that people should never buy. But historically, people have never paid more to own than to rent for very long. I would hazard a guess that most people would even pay a small premium to own but that premium is huge for an apt like yours.

nyc10023,
I disagree, the premium to own my apartment is not huge. I could show you dozens of apartments where the spread is much much larger. Give me a break.

I'm not hating on you, 407PAS. You should see the vitriol heaped on me in another online forum when I put my investment property up for sale. I totally felt the heat. I think the market is painfully adjusting itself to historical norms. There will be outliers on the way, but in another year, I think the data will bear itself out.

Are you guys brokers who are mad that there is no margin in the deal for you? Well, after price cuts, there is no money for brokerage commission, absolutely zero.

407PAS - please show me the calculations. Mortgage of 390k (assume 490k final price, 100k dp). That's 2338.25+1600 = 3900 + lost return on 100k (don't take today's interest rate, think about what historical interest rates have been). And maintenance, no matter how frugal your building is, will rise. NYC RE taxes have risen 50% since 1991 (I just looked this up today). If you qualify for a 390k mortgage in today's world, you probably don't get to deduct all of the mortgage interest & maintenance on your tax return. How much does your unit rent for? Not to mention the slight difficulty you've had selling your place currently. How many buyers would be able to stay in your place indefinitely? What are the chances that they would be able to get exactly 490k in 2 or 3 years (average turnover for 1bedrooms in your area)?

Nope, all the power to you for selling your place. But if you need to sell it, time is not your friend right now. Just do an auction-style type thing.

The other thing to bear in mind is location - is the buyer of your apt going to care precisely where on Park Ave they end up? While there may be no specific cheap apts to rent on your block, is the renter/buyer going to care where they ultimately end up in the neighborhood? I say this because there are doorman 1-bedrooms on the market for 2500 in Murray Hill a little farther north.

Look, I don't relish raining on anyone's parade but I own as well and it's not a pretty picture out there.

I have to agree with Whathappened. If I were a prospective buyer, I would look at the comps in the building - it seems transactions are getting done at 2004 levels today all over the city. Tomorrow, who knows? If 407 wants to wait and see whether prices go to 1996 levels or 2007 levels, it's up to him. If it's the former, he loses, if its the latter, he wins. Who knows what will happen, all we have is our opinions, he sounds like a smart guy and he reads the WSJ just like the rest of us. And if he doesn't want to find out, then he should hit the bid, and the market bid today seems to be 2004 level - which incidentally is about 100K below your ask.

See, your explanation just proved my point. The previous purchase price/year does indeed matter, which is why you prefer not to mention it.

Buyers today aren't going to agree with your "what someone paid in the past does not matter" philosophy. That's the "bigger idiot" philosophy in disguise; i.e., there's always a bigger idiot than me who will pay more than I paid for this apartment. Now people want to pay LESS than the present idiot if he bought in 2003 or later.

Your asking price still seems bubbly for a 650sf coop, and I just closed on a $541K condo 2 days ago.

Go off and hammer on someone else for a while. My unit is the lowest priced one bedroom for sale in my building. Why did someone bring this thread back up, because I told a guy looking at a one bedroom with $2837 maint and a price of over $6400k+ to take a look at my listing? You people are just mean and like to be negative. It's all just hate on StreetEasy, all hate, all the time.

Show me a corner one bedroom with outdoor space at $389k. That's $100k under my ask. Please show me the listing. I also look at the market and see nothing like that.

That would be $640k, one too many zeros.

sticky,
Post the floor plan of your $541k condo, the carrying costs, and the approximate location. Are you going to get slammed when those taxes rise every year when the abatements ease off? Is your building going to survive? Is the plan effective? Will people be walking away from it in droves? At least our building has a stable cost structure, and is completely occupied. Last year, we refinanced our mortgage for a substantial savings so that the board can hold the line on maintenance. Our maintenance is also 65% deductible, a very high number that helps a lot.

Mine is not the worst deal in the city, no matter how much you people pile on me. Just get a grip. We will find a person who likes the apartment and is happy to live in it, because, it is a nice place. There are lots of horrible, dark holes in this city, places I would never live in.

I think sticky bought in LA...

sticky - can you please explain why "previous purchase price/year does indeed matter"? I'm just curious...

Haha, I just had the thought that sticky bought in LA. Talk about comparing apple and oranges, or some other kind of California fruit.

You find out what someone paid and then you can heckle them if they stand to make a profit. If they stand to take a loss, you belittle them. It is simple.

Great looking place - I like the flow of the apartment and the light. Your website looks very professional done. Pictures are much better than what the brokers usually offer.

Good luck with your sale!

this is a hot debate in our house.

407PAS, I know how stressful it can be to be long in a falling market. If there is anything that I said that upset you, I want to apologize. I think maybe there is some glee among those of us who have been so wrong on RE for so long, and I think sometime it can come out mean. Again, I apologize.

And for whatever it's worth, I do not believe what you paid for your apartment is at all relevant. The only relevant number is what a qualified buyer will pay for your apartment.

Good luck with your sale.

Yup I bought in LA in an auction. However I've lived & worked in Manhattan for 10 years, and at the moment I'm still here. Since you asked, you can see the floorplan for units 705-1205 here:

http://rowan-lofts.com/floorplans.html

I mentioned the price I paid because I could have bought a 650sf apartment for $489K, but don't think that much space is worth that much money, whether in Manhattan or not.

To uwsmom:

Most people are saying Manhattan will correct to 2001 or 2002 prices. I agree, because this is the case in cities like Las Vegas where the crash hit earliest and appears to have bottomed out. So unless you're madly in love with an apartment, or money is no object for you, why pay bubble prices? Aside from the good light, 407 PAS #18B doesn't strike me as architecturally significant or likely to appeal to the very rich. And whathappened just demonstrated with comps that pre-bubble prices for this apartment should be in the low 300s or even high 200s.

Even if this apartment was previously purchased in 1990, what's the harm in asking? It's one of, if not the, largest purchase you'll ever make, so why not pry & learn everything you can about its history? I'd do the same if I was buying a previously owned car or an expensive antique. The owner might not want to reveal that paid more than the apartment is worth, but why should we fall into the same trap?

To uwsmom:

Most people are saying Manhattan will correct to 2001 or 2002 prices. I agree, because this is the case in cities like Las Vegas where the crash hit earliest and appears to have bottomed out. So unless you're madly in love with an apartment, or money is no object for you, why pay bubble prices? Aside from the good light, 407 PAS #18B doesn't strike me as architecturally significant or likely to appeal to the very rich. And whathappened just demonstrated with comps that pre-bubble prices for this apartment should be in the low 300s or even high 200s.

Even if this apartment was previously purchased in 1990, what's the harm in asking? It's one of, if not the, largest purchase you'll ever make, so why not pry & learn everything you can about its history? I'd do the same if I was buying a previously owned car or an expensive antique. The owner might not want to reveal that paid more than the apartment is worth, but why should we fall into the same trap?

"Most people are saying Manhattan will correct to 2001 or 2002 prices."

Most people saying something does not make it true. Actually, apartments similar to ones we looked at, meaning the same layout but on a different floor but renovated, appear to be selling more quickly now. I don't know the contract prices yet, but I have a hard time believing that they're selling quickly at 30% below the prices we saw. It looks more like 10-15%. I don't believe that 28% number thrown around because I have not seen that in the market.

"Aside from the good light, 407 PAS #18B doesn't strike me as architecturally significant or likely to appeal to the very rich"

I never claimed architectural significance, just good features that make it a nice place to live. This is not an apartment for the very rich. This apartment is one step up from lowest level studios. By the way, my neighbor is asking $365k for a studio and my apartment is far better place than that. You people make no sense.

Please don't put LA apartments on here as some sort of comparable. That is complete nonsense.

Back to knowing what someone paid for something. I'll repeat what I said.

1) If someone stands to make a profit, StreetEasy posters will slam the person for being a money grubbing scumbag who is insane and delusional.
2) If the person stands to take a loss, StreetEasy posters will heckle the person for making a bad investment decision and tell the person they should have rented.

sticky,
If you think a $489k apartment is one of the largest purchases someone would ever make, you obviously haven't seen what other people pay to live on Manhattan Island.

Assets will trade at what people in the market are willing to pay for them. You can quote years all you want, but we are in this year, in this time. I will see what people feel the apartment is worth on the market, against other competitors.

By the way, if 30% off becomes the normal, than everything will freeze up even more and nothing will be moving. I may not get my two bedroom, but someone in a studio will not get my one bedroom.

Alpine - nice appliances in rentals are a plus and they sold us on the apartment. You really don't know what you are talking about. Some people look for condo finishes in their rentals. BTW- our high end appliances aren't junky. The fridge is awesome - as PAS will vouch for as well - as are GE profile. Hopefully the landlord thinks they will last longer and is investing in them as well instead of cheap junk. I doubt these landlords are idiots since they own a decent number of buildings (1500+ apts) and get volume discounts. This is no small landlord

Fine,
Here is my comp:

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/391640-coop-240-east-35th-street-murray-hill-new-york

Price $569,000. Maintenance $1612. I can't find the deductibility percentage anywhere, the broker doesn't seem to have published that number.

Their terrace is a little bigger and the apartment is a little bigger, but they are also $80k more expensive than my place. Otherwise, this is a pretty close comp to my apartment. Why are they not listed in the high $300s?

Here is my search criteris from the Times:

Co-ops
Between 400-700k
1 bed 1 bath
private outdoor space
doorman, balcony
elevator
Murray Hill/ Kips Bay.

Knock yourselves out. If you want to slam my price than come up with something that beats me. Words are cheap. Show me a listing in the low $400s or high $300s that has my features.

407PAS: I'm not trying to hurt your feelings, I was just going to
let this go but you just don't stop. You're in denial, you want to
ignore the comps in your own building.

The "comp" you listed above is almost 33% bigger than your place, it has
a much bigger outdoor space, it is in a better area, it has a lower maintenance
and it is listed at only 16% more than your listing. Plus, like your place,
that "comp" hasn't sold either.

A "comp" is not what other places are listed for, it's what other places
have sold for - in the post-crash world.

I would add that comps are valueless unless they are the most recent comps - i.e. things that are actually going into contract now.

I am about to put my place on the market, and I am looking at similar places that are in contract now, getting a sense of where they went into contract and listing my place at a discount to the current contract prices. Not only do I need to beat the contract price, I also need to price my place comparable to a "lesser" place. So if I had a one bedroom, I need to price very close to what studios are asking for. The point is to get a huge amount in traffic in a short time, and work whatever bids I get. Buyers are very educated as there are so many listings out there. Then, having the contract signed, I can then in turn make lowball offers (say 30-50%) on properties that interest me. And so it goes.

Comps from previous years are only relevant in that buyers need to feel like they're getting '03, '04 prices. That they're getting a deal.

407PAS - you're in a great position. You don't have to sell, your carrying costs are lower (I presume) than renting an equivalent unit. Where's the harm in setting the price in the 300s? You don't have to accept a bid you don't like. Once you have a rock-solid contract and board approval of your buyer, you can in turn make the most "insulting" low ball offers on 2-bedrooms.

Another thought I had as a potential seller is that I'll just pick an arbitrarily low price - say I had a 1 bedroom, price it below current studios on market because I think asking prices are irrelevant in markets like these. I think I posted this before. The only catch is that I don't want huge crowds of unqualified buyers, so I'd ask for ID for open house walkins w/ no brokers.

High end appliances don't last any longer than cheaper ones. My grandmother recently dumped her GE refridge after she bought it 20 years ago. And stainless steel refridges keep yor food any colder than a white one.

"Most people saying something does not make it true."

Yes it does. It's called Wikiality. LOL:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikiality#Wikipedia_references

What a seller pad for their apartment is irrelevant. If an appraiser was trying to value an apartmrnt and he factored in the price the seller paid fior it 5 years ago, he would lose his license. The main reason some SE posters want to know what a seller paid is that, before they buy, they want to make sure that the seller is taking a bath. If the seller, however, stands to make even $1 in profit, they will not buy. This is the irrational justification as to why buyers think the purchase price is important.

* You guys never seem to mention that I am $80k less expensive than that place.

* That comp has a maintenance that is $40 less than mine. For all intensive purposes, they're the same.

* I think they lied in their square footage on that comp, why wouldn't they?

* nyc10023, you are a delusional buyer. There is no use listing a property at a price that a seller is unwilling to accept. I don't need a bunch of deadbeats in my home.

* That area is not better, it is further from subway and is kind of in the tunnel-hell zone. Also, the stupid drunken former frat boy zone.

* I'm on a higher floor and I am on top of a subway stop, 25 feet from the uptown exit.

* You still have not posted a place in the high $300s that looks anything like my place. People price according to their competitors in the market.

* Alpine292, excellent quality appliances actually do a better job of keeping food fresh and are more energy efficient. Our electrical bill went down by $15-20 a month when we got rid of the American piece of junk. Also, our lettuce didn't freeze anymore. This thing maintains a 40 degree fridge and a 0 degree freezer, at all times.

407: I wish with all my heart that I was all cash since '06 and short the RE market. Sadly, not the case but unprovable in public forums.

Yes, there are no places in high 300s that looks anything like your place - my point exactly, that is what will suck in the highest traffic if you are bold enough to do this. The fact that a place for sale right now is 80k is irrelevant.

It is also very hard to not feel defensive when it's your place on the market, under attack. When my place is on the market, I will not comment on it, hard though it may be.

407: Take $435000 if offered. Get out the trap- forget the cheese. Kenneth Privat

There is nothing at $435k with my features so your advice is most unwelcome.

High traffic does not mean a deal. We will abide.

407pas,

did you really lower your price? didn't we have a long discussion in which you said you would never, ever, under any circumstances, for any reason, lower your price? anyway, good for you: you are adjusting to reality. in the end i think you are probably going to stick it out in your place, you just aren't going to get a price that makes it worth it to you. but you are adjusting and that's good.

This is a tough one. It's getting harder to get buyers to see the value of unique elements like appliances or 2nd windows. The maintenance is $1350 effective assuming a 28% tax rate. A 400k 30 year 4.5% mortgage is $2025 or $1450 assuming full 28% deduction- $2800 is probably parity with renting but needs to assume all tax-deductions so depends on keeping a job and making interim cash flows work. There are other places at rent vs buy parity without tax deductions.

Quoting 407PAS:

"Back to knowing what someone paid for something. I'll repeat what I said.

1) If someone stands to make a profit, StreetEasy posters will slam the person for being a money grubbing scumbag who is insane and delusional.
2) If the person stands to take a loss, StreetEasy posters will heckle the person for making a bad investment decision and tell the person they should have rented."

That's not entirely true. If you bought in or before 2002, I don't think anyone here would object to your making a profit, albeit a modest one based on historic appreciation. But if you bought in 2003 or later, and are seeking to break even or make a profit, then yes, you'll be pilloried here. You're being pilloried here anyway, because your asking price is clearly above above 2002 levels. We don't need to know what you paid to see that.

"Please don't put LA apartments on here as some sort of comparable. That is complete nonsense."

I'm not trying to apply LA comps to Manhattan. But I think it's fair take a cue from trends that have already torn through every other city in the country, and are obviously beginning to run their course here. Buyers in LA, NYC, Miami, Vegas and everywhere in between are expecting a 30-40% discount off peak prices, which translates to 2001-2002 levels. I cited the price I paid for my own apartment because I'm asking you to do the same, and to demonstrate I could have paid well above than what you're asking.

"If you think a $489k apartment is one of the largest purchases someone would ever make, you obviously haven't seen what other people pay to live on Manhattan Island."

$489K isn't the largest purchase everyone in Manhattan will make, but it probably is the largest purchase anyone who would like to live in a 650sf apartment would make. And even people who are spending 6, 20, 45 million dollars on a sprawling prewar apartment or townhouse don't go on daily $489K shopping sprees. It's a lot of money no matter how wealthy you are.

Hey, it's your apartment. Remain firm in your $489K if you can. But I doubt it'll sell for that much.

happyrenter,
No, I posted a lower price but when you show up at my door, I'll quote a higher price. ;-) Yeah, I lowered the price. I never said I would never lower the price, I said I wouldn't lower the price based on posts on StreetEasy. My one bedroom is the least expensive one bedroom for sale in my building. We went to sell it and we think we are priced fairly in the market. You people may disagree, which is your right.

crescent22,
So, my place is basically at parity with rent but you still have problems with it? Man, tough crowd. Cut me a break for once.

"There are other places at rent vs buy parity without tax deductions."

Probably not places you'd want to live in. The whole system has always been about lowering the cost of ownership through tax deductions. Those aren't going away and I am sure my buyer will take full advantage of the deductions.

Look, prices are not back to 2001-2002 levels no matter how many times you say it. I could give a damn about LA, Miami, and Vegas. It doesn't mean anything. I think the market dynamics in New York are different.

I could have saved that woman at the Plaza $4.5 million dollars on a one bedroom. Yeah, my place is not the Plaza but it is a one bedroom and we breath the same air. $489k is not that much money, you only need $120k down. This is basically an entry level apartment for Manhattan, albeit, one that is decent and pleasant to live in, I know, I live in it.

So, if there are any potential buyers who have read to the bottom of this thread. I congratulate you on your fortitude. You have the skills necessary to fill out a board package. Stop by my open house tomorrow, from 2-4pm, and see for yourself.

The website again, is:

http://web.me.com/mac.hive/407PAS/18B.html

Good luck to everyone in their real estate dealings.

"My one bedroom is the least expensive one bedroom for sale in my building."

It's also the smallest 1-bedroom for sale in your building, isn't it?

Good Luck 407PAS and nyc10023. I imagine this is a very anxiety provoking time to be selling ...

Yes, my one bedroom is slightly smaller than the other one bedrooms on the market. I have better views though. Everything is a trade off.

uwsmom,
Thanks for the kind wishes. Actually, it is not that anxiety producing, we talk to people and see what they think of the apartment. We have gotten a lot of positive feedback from the people who have shown up to our open houses. We have to clean the apartment once a week anyway, it is not that big a deal to show it to people for a few hours.

We would be anxious if we had bought another apartment before having sold this one, but we did not make that mistake.

Nice place 407 PAS see ya tomorrow

407: Been there. There are no buyers only lookers. If you need to sell take $435000. You will thank me.

407 - best of luck tomorrow. you know as an FSBO myself i wish the best for you. on another note - you'll drive yourself crazy replying to everyone here trying to pick things apart. remove the thread from email updates and just go with gut. don't forget the warm cookies!

Thanks sniper but I'm not feeding people. Did you hear the story about the real estate agent who served food at some large Georgian townhouse she was selling. She got 500 people to show up and not a single followup.

The townhouse must have been overpriced.

the cookies aren't for feeding them...it's for that wonderful "this feels like home" aroma.
c'mon - that Open House 101

sniper,
It has nothing to do with pricing, there is an infinite demand for any free good. I was reminded of this yesterday at the deli while waiting to buy prosciutto. Someone was eating free sample after free sample of cheese until the deli guy yelled at him to go away. Of course, the guy walked away without buying anything. Typical.

We'll stick to selling the apartment. ;-)

For those who missed it, we're showing from 2-4pm today:

http://web.me.com/mac.hive/407PAS/18B.html

First, I have to go out and run that 15k race in the Park. Ugh.

Look luck. Hopefully there is still someone out there who wants quality, not price. Let us know how it goes.

We give quality at a good price. Speak to the woman who bought the $5 million dollar one bedroom at the Plaza to see how much more you could pay for a one bedroom. There is an apartment at every price point.

So how'd it go?

407, wish you best of luck selling your place and impressed your doing it yourself... but one thing ive noticed while reading this thread.. If i was a buyer, and i saw all this negativity - both from the bears and from you, i'd probably avoid this listing.. why? because while i understand that you have to defend yourself from the haters - you come across as a very aggressive person that i would prob want to avoid doing biz with (not worth the headache).. im sure you're a good person, but the meanness in your responses is very apparent, and cld push people away. once again, i know why you have to do it to defend vs. people micro analyzing every aspect of your sale, but it comes off as grating.. examples:

- "There is nothing at $435k with my features so your advice is most unwelcome."
- " I think they lied in their square footage on that comp, why wouldn't they?"
- " nyc10023, you are a delusional buyer. There is no use listing a property at a price that a seller is unwilling to accept. I don't need a bunch of deadbeats in my home."
- "Are you guys brokers who are mad that there is no margin in the deal for you? Well, after price cuts, there is no money for brokerage commission, absolutely zero."
- when sniper tried to be helpful re a cookies idea you smacked him down.

unfortunately, dont have any other suggestions since you obviously want to use the distribution capabilities of streeteasy.. btw, what is your argument for not paying a buyers broker, and just not hiring one yourself?

also, what was the original price before taking down to $489k?

I agree with jenny9823. In general, there are too many nasty, personal people on SE, and then other people fall in to the trap and respond.

My substanive comment: the maintanence on this apartment seems HUGE to me, and ought to have a major impact on the price.

>>I was reminded of this yesterday at the deli while waiting to buy prosciutto. Someone was eating free sample after free sample of cheese until the deli guy yelled at him to go away.<<

GUILTY! Though I've never been yelled at... ;)

Jenny, I disagree with your assessment. If someone wants 407's apartment, they're not going to give a rat's ass about what type of 'person' he is. So, he's aggressive. Big whoop. So are most buyers. This is a business transaction, not a Mr. Congeniality contest.

in a situation when a transaction is done arms length (i closed in december on my sale) it's fine. i didnt even know if my buyer was a woman or a man as he/she had an androgenous name your right - it doesnt matter.

however, if you have to negotiate and work with a FSBO my view is that it's not worth the headache (unless the price is dirt cheap). there is a lot of property on the market, and it's a buyer's heaven.. so i wld probably move onto the next place - unless i was IN LOVE WITH IT.

using that deli example... if i go to gristedes and the deli guy is a prick, ill gladly say goodbye and move onto the dag's or associated aroudn the corner to pick up my cold cuts... or ill ask the manager to work with me... in an FSBO, there is no one to go to... and lots of other apts "around the corner."

Hello jenny9823,
I am sorry that you feel I am so mean-spirited. Tone of voice is often hard to convey in these postings. I am actually a nice, honest, and fair person who tries to work with people. Yes, I have been drawn into defending my property when it has been attacked. I have no choice. StreetEasy works as a vehicle for spreading negative information about all listings. All I can do is to give my side of the story. Mine is not the only property that has been attacked.

"btw, what is your argument for not paying a buyers broker, and just not hiring one yourself?"

I just stated my argument for not paying a buyer's broker and you completely missed it. I'll write it again:

"Well, after price cuts, there is no money for brokerage commission, absolutely zero."

If I am going to take a beating on price, I certainly am not going to pay some agent on top of that. That only adds insult to injury and costs me too much money. My argument is against the cost of the brokers. They cost too much and do too little. I have explained this countless times on this board.

As a funny aside, I met a nice person who read about my property on StreetEasy. He visited my open house and he liked my place. He told me that he does not accept all of the negative comments on this board. He also feels that people on this board are not buyers, only people who will never offer a fair price for an apartment. I have to agree with him.

In this age of instant communication, we have to fight for ourselves in cyberspace. You will see that if you ever list a property for sale.

We originally listed at $539,000, if I recall correctly, dropped to $510k, and are now at $489k. I think we offer a good value for the price and I have not seen units with these features at a similar price. I also look at properties on the market.

The maintenance is 65% deductible. This is a large percentage where compared to other units. The board refinanced the building's mortgage last year and saved a lot of money. Their philosophy is to hold the line on the maintenance. We have not had an increase in three years and there is no increase in 2009.

My price has already been reduced to take into account the higher than average mortgage. My build has a stable cost basis going forward and will not expose the new buyer to high risks, like they would find if they invested in some condo unit with tax abatements, etc.

It is what it is.

I am sorry I shot down sniper's cookie idea. ;-) I meant that in good humor. I'm not into trying to provoke a response in people with food. Of the countless open houses we have attended, we saw food in one place, and that place sat on the market for months. The sandwiches did not make the deal. I would rather stick to apartment selling and not mess up my apartment with the hassles of free food.

My goodness, if a buyer sees a dirty dish in the sink, they will never buy the apartment.

"however, if you have to negotiate and work with a FSBO my view is that it's not worth the headache (unless the price is dirt cheap). there is a lot of property on the market, and it's a buyer's heaven.. so i wld probably move onto the next place - unless i was IN LOVE WITH IT."

You'll find plenty of headaches from working with brokers. Godspeed.

The hard truth is that brokers raise the cost of housing for everyone. Your dismissal of FSBOs makes no sense. I will buy from a broker-represented apartment or from an owner, if I find the right place at the right price, it does not matter. Once price is agreed to, the lawyers on both sides take over and the deal is done.

407 PAS - It's a nice apartment - but too pricey at over $700 sq/ft + the super high maintenance. I don't think you can compare with other comps in the building due to the drastic changes in the market. I think it's worth between $300- 359K - sorry the high maintenance is the deal killer.

I don't think the deli guy was being a prick for calling out a guy who is trying to eat twenty cups of cheese from the sample tray.

Like I said, there is an infinite demand for free goods. Prices are the only thing that separates us from anarchy.

I should add, "free" goods, for, of course, there are no free goods.