133 W 22nd Street

$735K for a 535 sqft studio?????? who cares what the future plans are on 23rd. over $1300 ppsf -- either you have a lot of money you don't know what to do with, or your a fool. i think there are better properties out there for less.

First, I was not looking for a studio, so I am not sure where you are coming from with that. I asked if anyone knows about future plans on 23rd behind this building. Also since you seem to be an expert on real estate, maybe you can suggest a building with low maintenance and 421A tax abatement, in a good neighorhood with good pricing.

my thoughts are RUN DON'T WALK away and never mention it again. awful

there is some development plans already for 23rd. they are mid-demolition on two cool old buildings that should have been left alone. but they would only impact view to the northeast. you might lose the empire state building which would be bad but blocking the hideous stratus would be good. that development is not directly behind the building more like one lot over or so to the east and behind (north).
all that said, the current pricing is so out of whack. the gym is decent. there is a so small it might be useless outdoor pool. the bedrooms are pretty small in what they have left so don't even think about having a king size bed. they did something so horrible with kitchens it still makes me shudder. the counters are an all black 80's looking marble over shiny metal that you can see underneath and to the side of the marble. if you think it looks good in a rendering go see the real thing. it is an atrocity.

there is a thread on this building on here from before as well. you should do a search. there were some complaints of gangs of rats but hopefully that is over now.

oh and the bathroom sinks kind of suck as well. they are ridiculously shallow.

Wow, guess you don't like the place. I looked at a unit where the bedrooms were good size. At first glance the kitchens looked great, but now you have me thinking that I better look more closely. Losing views of empire state building certainly would not be great. Any thoughts on a similar size building with good floor plans?

here are the prior discussions

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/7268-building-at-133-west-22nd-street

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/2797-133-west-22nd

hmm i don't know. i've been looking a lot in the area and haven't seen anything just right yet. the indigo on the same block was ok but less amenities. did you look at their units at the yves. same developer. I don't love the look of it but it'll be pretty protected view wise.

yeah i usually don't strongly dislike buildings but 133w22 totally made me go there.

oh and i will say this. the stratus is ugly from the outside but with the views i actually prefer it on the inside to this building.

ok one more thing. the developer is kind of famous for his bad rep. google ben shaoul.

The problem that I see with Yves and Indigo, is that they have very few units and when the common areas and amenities need fixing and updating, you are talking a lot of bucks divided by very few people. Yves lobby stinks. Haven't been to indigo. I guess everyone has a different opinion, but I thought the amenities at 133 W 22nd were awesome. Rooftop is looking great and pool area below is nice to look at from gym too.

yet another listing that raises the question as to who is nuts: the SE bears or these sellers? These prices are so wacko, it just bewilders me. I think any buyer should go away and come back in six months.

They are negotiating down on Yves and 133 w 22nd. The list prices are not what they are getting.

I just used the studio to highlight the ridiculous prices on the aparments in the building.and yes there are plenty of condos with low maintenance and tax abatements- typically condos have lower maintenance than coops. also there are threads/articles about how 'tax abatements' may not be a beneficial to the owner as one would anticipate.

Went back to see apts at 133 W 22nd. I agree that the punch list will be long, but unfortunately this is how many new buildings are including the one I bought a couple of years ago. As far as the finishes here, you obviously have not seen other buildings or just have a huge beef with this developer because nothing I have seen, (chelsea stratus, sky house, chelsea house, the link) can compare to the nice kitchens and bathrooms in this place. Even the hardware on the doors are nicer. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but I felt that I should write mine too. I agree that the prices are unrealistic, but I also think the developer will have to come to his senses soon in order to sell the remaining units or ones where the deals don't go through. Jasonkyle, don't shoot the messenger, just stating my opinion and I am not a realtor or broker or in anyway connected to this building or developer.

i've seen every building you list actually and i still hate the kitchen counters at 133w22 the most. I really dislike the bathroms sinks too. i have no beef with the developer. i know nothing about him but i did the research on here and elsewhere and then read about how he showed up to that building in the east village with a crowbar to kick out those tenants. that's why i told you to google for yourself. there is no denying this guys rep. if you like it so much buy there. to each his own. i personally would rather live in 650 6th or the o'neill if i had to pick a building around there.

Will check out both of those buildings. Thx for the info, but how can you compare the kitchen cabinets and appliances at sky house with 133 w 22nd? Sky House finishes are sooooo much cheaper! Ceramic tile in bathrooms? So 70's!!

650 5th looks very nice but taxes about $1,000 more a month. Obviously no tax abatement. Cant find the O'neill building. Can you give me an address?

O'Neill: http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/building/655-6-avenue-manhattan

650 6th is priced even more ridiculously than the rest...1,550 sq/ft for a studio with one window that faces the rear.

WOW, you aren't kidding Nordberg. Can't believe that anyone would suggest an "Elad Properties" building!

the minute you walk into 650 6th they tell you to take 25 to 30 percent off the list price. so don't even consider those numbers. i like the appliances better there. the kitchen and bathrooms look nicer. the bones of the o'neill building are so much nicer than new construction although you'd have to do some work on the interiors.

we3 i think you are reading whatever you want to read. i didn't say anything about cabinets and appliances at sky house. i said i hated the "kitchen counters" more at 133w22 than the other places. the black marble/shiny metal combo is so thoroughly hideous. i don't know how to make that anymore clear. if you like them great. i don't know what else to say.

and i said nothing about the bathrooms except that i didn't like the sinks.

i will say i wouldn't live in any of the buildings you mentioned. they just don't stick out in my memory as awful as those counters do in 133w22. most of those buildings seem to varying degrees on the cheaply made side. but most new construction looks that way to me. we are leaning towards waiting for a unit we like in the mercantile.

jasonkyle
oh and the bathroom sinks kind of suck as well. they are ridiculously shallow.

another "deep" comment from jasonkyle

jasonkyle
hmm i don't know. i've been looking a lot in the area and haven't seen anything just right yet.

what's it been ... 9 months now that you are looking for "just right"?

You are the pickiest person ever. Sinks too shallow is one of your criteria. Amazing.
'

"i still hate the kitchen counters at 133w22 the most"

"the black marble/shiny metal combo is so thoroughly hideous"

oh gosh ebutterfly are you still cyberstalking me. wasn't it bad enough that streeteasy had to delete your homophobic comments the last time. do yourself a favor and get rid of your google alert on me. it's creepy

our lease is up in july. we started looking last september. what exactly is you're point? should we rush so it would make you feel better?

I never made homophobic comments. I wouldn't even know you were homosexual if you didn't broadcast it.

As for rushing, you are the guy who doesn't want to waste time as you've stated.

you know all this and you are a liar but just for other people who might be now tuning in:
the most disgusting post was when you lewdly stated my sexual position must be a certain way based on my posts. you used language that was insulting, graphic, repulsive and hate filled. matt at streeteasy deleted at least 5 of your comments that day. i asked him to put them back because people should see that kind of hate coming out of nowhere. especially since you made it clear from the first thread you appeared on that you were a broker for the listing we were discussing. in case anyone wants to check the listing is at 200 chambers, 12c. i wouldn't use this broker. i think people should know this is how laura cau from elliman spends her time on easter. people should also know she is a homophobe.

point to one homophobic comment or one piece of evidence that Ebutterfly is homophobic?

Oh, also point to one piece of hard evidence that Ebutterfly is Laura Cau from Elliman.

because we exchanged emails offline laura. i alerted you to the discussion on here and you immediately popped up defending your um... strategy on that unit. i guess you didn't know i was the one who emailed you to tell you about that orignal thread to let you come and defend yourself. now you do.

you said what you thought my sexual position must be one certain way based on my posts. i never took it to that level nor will i know. no one here is ashamed of anything except you probably of your own behavior.

jasonkyle
because we exchanged emails offline laura.

And the text of the email says that Ebutterfly is Laura Cau? Or the text of the email simply defends the marketing practice? I've never defended or degraded the marketing practice. Only degraded you for being so sensitive over nothing. Like how your time is "wasted" because the price changes by $1000. Or the sinks are too shallow.

As for your "sexual position" and your shame, post any link to a statement about your sexual position and then help me understand why you'd view that sexual position as something you'd be ashamed about?

laura you only post on threads i post on and you only come to start fights with me. i am one buyer who will buy soon and then never be in this world again. you are a broker and this is your livelihood. you should stop behaving like this on here and protect your future. i am worried for you.

You start fights with anyone. Fighting with Ben Shaoul, fighting with buyers at 133 West 22nd, fighting over a $1000 change in a listing price.

Also, offer one piece of proof that I am a broker or have anything to do with real estate whatsoever?

why do you think being me being gay equals me being ashamed? why do you even keep mentioning shame. you are really harping on that. do you not get that it is not working for you? do you not see how repeatedly asking such nonsense is offensive? you made a couple of stupid homophobic comment and they all got deleted. get over it. no one is going to repost them or repeat them for you.

You've said you are ashamed and embarassed about your "sexual position." I've never met you, let alone engage in sexual activity with you, so I really have no idea.

ps - why are you offended? What is offensive? Is truth offensive? Or is a misrepresentation offensive? Which is it?

fighting with ben shaoul by mentioning a huge article about him in the observer? or telling someone to google him? fighting with a buyer at 133w22nd? who is buying there on this thread? he asked for opinions. i don't like it and i stand by that. what is your contribution to streeteasy except to show up and post only on threads after me. we both know who you are. i don't really have to prove it to anyone. that's the thing. i am an anonymous buyer and you are a broker who should realize this is a public forum. you have the most to lose here. you should move on with your life.

my contribution vs. your insight about shallow sinks being your main criticism of a new development.

hmm, you've still failed to prove that Ebutterfly is Laura Cau. Even though you want to pretend everyone believes your opinions, you have no proof, and frankly your opinions are as shallow as the sinks at 133 West 22nd Street and your original ideas as big as the price movements at 200 Chambers 12C.

when did i say i was ashamed about anything. you are really reaching now. do you have reading comprehension issues. the comment you made was disgusting based on the language you used and your assumptions. not based on what i do in real life or who i am.

i engage in threads on here all the time with lots of different people about different things. you only come on here to attack me. i think more people here will believe what i say than you. i hope for your career enough people don't care either way.

you keep talking about "my" career. What about your career? You've acknowledged that your boyfriend is the breadwinner and all you do is search on streeteasy and pretend you are a buyer, but yet you've gotten nowhere on anything. In any case, must be pretty embarassing to be a stay-at-home

We also know you aren't a buyer. No "buyer" has proven himself less serious than you. This is hardly more than a high school project for you.

oh you take everything so literally. i forgot you have no sense of humor. i have a career. i do have an incredibly successful partner as well. who do you have in your life?

and what do you have anything to add to this discussion? have you seen the building? what are your thoughts? you like new devs right? have you sold either of the units you have at 200 chambers yet?

lol, what kind of career could you possibly have? you have no judgment skills. no ability to differentiate important from trivial.

And then, you come up with statements like "you take everything so literally. i forgot you have no sense of humor." but you are the one who was "outraged" over a transparent price change on an apartment (that was outside of your search area) of $1000.

Where is this so-called partner of yours now?

It looks like "I" have two listings for sale and two listings for rent. What about you? How's your latest success at "work"?

i wasn't outraged. i thought it was a dumb tactic to raise and lower your old stinky unit 1000 dollars just so it could pop up as new when it wasn't. i also don't think your tactic worked cause your unit is still on the market even now that you finally have had a real reduction. let's not worry about my career when clearly you should be focusing on your own.

oh right, I suppose your porch is swept. You worry about $1000 price changes but don't even have steady work, aren't even looking in Tribeca, and aren't even in that price range.

it's so sad that you keep bringing up our original discussion. who else would care so much about that but the broker of the unit. you are making it so obvious i don't even have to point out who you are anymore. do you not see that no one else in the world would be talking about this 2 and a half months later on threads that have nothing to do with it. you defended your tactic on two separate threads about that unit. one i didn't even have anything to do with starting.

is the end of july in two months? i didn't realize the calendar worked like that.

goodnight, kisses jason.

it must be sad for you because you clearly can't get past it. you should find a 12 step program so you can move on with your life. i am going to bed now with my incredibly successful partner. so feel free to try and do that moving on now, or post more inanity. whatever you prefer.

oh look we both are giving up and going to bed at the same time. how cute. til next time. xoxo

Wow, what a difference a night makes. Cannot believe I woke up to this insane argument between "ebutterfly" and "jasonkyle." I simply was looking for guidance about 133 W 22nd. I am very interested in a unit there and besides the usual construction problems in new buildings, I wanted to know if anyone else had experience with this building. I truly don't care about the size of the bathroom sinks. What does one do in a sink? I brush my teeth, so I don't care if the sinks are a bit shallow. As far as the color of the kitchen counters, thx for your opinion. Black doesn't bother me and if it does in the future, I can change them. Overall the kitchen is very nice including the cabinets and the appliances. I'd much prefer this kitchen over any other ones I have seen. 240 PAS also has nice finishes, but unfortunately many of the apts there don't get much light.

Hope you guys stop going at it. I'd really like to keep this to discussions on 133 W 22nd

westsider3, don't be all holier than thou. If you were really serious, you would have done 3 minutes worth of research and found that discussion already existed and continued with that one.

i agree that the shiny black kitchen counter tops are cheezy and very 80's! the polished black granite kitchen counter can be made to look more modern (and in keeping with the rest of the kitchen) by having it honed (matte finish) & sealed by a marble professional, which is what i did for $600. it makes a huge difference. it doesn't show fingerprints and smudges.

Hi Westsider. The Black counters and sinks are not the best in the world but should not be your key purchasing driver, they can be changed. They structural and location qualities are much more important for the future value of the apartment. This building is in a good location. Construction is pretty good. I don't know what unit you have looked at but I have seen better layouts in this building than most (and I have looked at hundreds of listings for over 1 Yr). Prices are flexible. Amenities are quite good, more family-friendly that most of Chelsea. Apartments are quite bright and some have a good view. It's not extremely West like others mentioned above and close to subways. 22nd is a quieter street, while the O'Neill and 650 6th are VERY loud, I can guarantee you. I wouldn't discount it so fast and I wouldn't really listen to most comments. Just make a list of what matters for you and compare the listings in a price range you can afford along those dimensions

Last but not least, when you see extremely discounted new construction, check the financial backing of the developer. Some of them are in real trouble and are offering huge discounts because they need cash to cover their loans. Very risky. This building is almost completed, 60-70% sold and much less risky.

westsider closed on a unit here ages ago. did you not notice how old this thread was before you posted?

no I didn't. I guess I was too overwhelmed by that nasty argument that took most of this post so I didn't look at the date. Good enough. I guess he figured out that the black counters are not the worst thing ever.

well i hope you never have to get 'nasty' like i did. although that was after months of homophobia directed at me from that poster who has since been banned for that reason.

Westsider is in and warns people about this developer. Investigate the developer very closely. Ben Shoal has only a small piece of development. Check out principles of Ascend. One is Rob Kaliner. They are also doing Georgica. Not sure what financial problems they are faced with there.

how are sales in this building? i noticed the sales listings and it says that on oct 8th, about 30 apartments got sold. is the developer having issues closing? the closings started last year, but it looks like it is not fully closed yet. whats the status on this building?

Developer sketchy but I heard they are giving huge discounts to get rid of last of inventory. Don't be afraid to offer 30% less

about 30 properties all listed as sold on the same day in October, don't show closings for them yet. bulk sale to investor? anybody know?

Do you know which 30 apts were all sold on one day? Most developers attorney's don't schedule more than 2-3 closings per day so this would have to indicate a bulk sale. Very interesting to know!

ｉｆ　ｄｏｇｓ　ｒｕｎ　ｆｒｅｅ．．

some loss here on new construction...d'oh

Sold on Mar 22, 2010 for $590,000
133 West 22nd St, 7A
Manhattan, NY 10011
Boro-block-lot: 1-798-1506

Sold on Dec 19, 2008 for $705,000
133 West 22nd St, 7A
Manhattan, NY 10011

The unit 10B displays a square footage which seems wrong. On Acris ''condo declaration'', on propertyshark, on natefind.com, the size I've found is 934 sqft. On the floor plan, I calculated the area and I've found near 934. On google, there is file registered in NYC which also states 934 sqft. On Zillow, the number was 934 sqft and the description itself of the listing sold in 2009 stated 934 sqft. But what is very strange is that the square footage has been removed...
934 or 10005 sqft, it is equivalent to about $100,000 of difference, if we caluclate the price per sqft.
I may make a mistake. But I wanted to give this information.