Renovations after the move in?

Yes. It's an absolute nightmare. Either renovate now, or don't renovate at all. Or ... at least wait until you can afford to move into a cheap rental for two months during the renovation.

I would do the things the floors and paint if you are not planning on doing anything structural (moving walls etc. that will cause you to have to redo them later). These are really a pain to do after you have moved in because you have to move everything out of the way. Also, they are generally the least costly, Depending on what you are doing with the kitchen and bath, you are looking at a lot of money.

However, if you are worried about the liquidity I would wait on the other stuff. After you move in, you will have an even better idea of what you want/need to do. Also, these things always take longer and cost more than you plan. Contruction gets delayed and dealing with NYC Co Op and condo approvals can delay things further.

So you should make sure have enough money to pay for the work plus a cushion.

Yikes, what is exactly so bad? Just an inconvenience?

i can see the problem with the bathroom renovation, but is it that difficult to tuff it out on the rest?

i would say just do the floors before you move in....not a huge expense but much, much easier with nothing there plus you save the problem of cleaning the dust off of all your stuff for the next two years. also, makes a bid difference relative to the cost.

1) You have to move all of your stuff our of the way and mess is awful. You basically end up living with everything disorganized and covered in plastic.
2) Living with walls open, kitchen / bath not functioning, etc. is a pain.
3) Everything gets delayed. Plumbers, contractors many times take longer.
4) Depending on your building, the board may take a while to approve your changes. They also sometimes charge fees for renovations or to have the reonvations reviewed by an architect they are structural.

My galley kitchen and bathroom took two months.. and that was fast.

And everything costs more than you think it will.

Id be worried about doing the floors first if the workers end up scuffing them once we start the rest of the renovations. :(

I can definitely understand the inconvenience of not having the bathroom easily accessible but luckily we do have a building gym & bathroom. Kitchen might be the easiest since we eat out a lot. I really don't mind roughing it out with the plastic but the dust could get annoying...

Maybe we should just do the bathroom first, wait on the rest?

Picture everything in your kitchen (and believe me, you have way more kitchen stuff than you realize) piled up in boxes your living room. Ditto for all your bathroom stuff (is your building gym and bath accessible 24/7? If not, set aside a bucket for peeing and pooping. I'm not kidding.) Everything in your living room and bedroom under sheets of plastic (the dust gets EVERYWHERE). A delightful little side-problem: roaches. Yes, your building has them. ALL buildings have them. Only now, you're disturbing their home, and they're scattering everywhere.

Now, picture doing this for SIX MONTHS. Yes, the contractor said it wouldn't take longer than 2-3 weeks. They ALL say that. They all lie.

not a big deal to cover properly done floors with paper while other work is proceeding. generally, floor are done before painting because its difficult to impossible to not screw up basedboards with sanding equipment.

How about doing it your self? Do you require permit? Do you still need coop permission?

Here's a true story of a recent kitchen renovation in Chelsea. My friend wanted to gut the kitchen (TINY kitchen, by the way). New cabinets, floors, appliances. Contractor said it would be two to three weeks, tops. So he picks out what he wants, and work is scheduled to begin on a Monday. "Bob" empties out his kitchen ... pots and pans stacked everywhere. Cans and boxes of food behind the sofa, under the TV, even stacked in his bedroom. He's ready for the first day of work to start on a Monday. Except ... he gets a call from the contractor Monday morning -- it seems some permit wasn't properly filed with the city for work to begin. And the co-op board needs to sign off on it first. Delay: 10 days.

Finally ... work begins. Oh wait -- not so fast -- the dumpster they ordered for all the construction trash hasn't arrived yet. And it's not "the day" for appliance refuse pickup. Wait three more days.

NOW work begins. They're tearing out the kitchen. Now we're cooking with gas! Oh wait ... speaking of gas ... the workers accidentally severed the gas line. All work stops immediately while ConEd is notified of the problem. Luckily, ConEd doesn't piss around with gas leaks -- they're there within the hour. Problem fixed. Work will resume tomorrow, however -- it's quitting time.

So now it's been two weeks, and they're still not even done ripping out the old kitchen. Toss out that "two to three weeks tops" estimate for completing the whole kitchen project.

Three weeks later, you're still living amongst your pots, pans, and food like a homeless person in a cardboard box. But at least you're lucky -- you have a nice bathroom sink to wash your dishes (aren't you glad you chose not to renovate the bathroom too??).

Now that the old kitchen is ripped out, the fun begins! Today is delivery day for your new cabinets! Woo hoo! It's a good thing, however, that you took a day off work to supervise this part of the project -- they delivered the wrong cabinets! Drat! They got the order wrong! What's that? Another THREE WEEKS to order the right cabinets?? Well what choice do you have? Now that there's no work for three weeks for your contractor, he goes off to another project, while you continue to live like a camper in your kitchen-less apartment.

Three weeks later, the cabinets arrive. Finally! Of course, the timing is off -- you'd originally ordered the new appliances to arrive AFTER the cabinets, so there wouldn't be a space crunch. The new fridge, dishwasher, microwave, built-in ovens, and cooktop have been neatly piled in your empty kitchen, but now they have to be jammed into the living room and bedroom (where you already have boxes of pots, pans, and food) while the workers install your cabinets. Don't worry ... it's only a matter of days now. Sleeping next to your new refrigerator isn't all that bad.

A week later, they've finished installing the cabinets. And now you find out that the granite counterop is on back order -- 6 weeks! No problem, at least you can install the appliances now!

OOPS. Uh-oh. Looks like someone miscalculated the measurements. The space for your 24-inch custom-sized (and non-returnable) refrigerator is only 23 1/2 inches wide. Will not fit. Now what?? Well, you tried so save money buying stock cabinets ... now at least the one closest to the fridge needs to be custom-resized. For an extra $1000, of course. Can the contractor do it? Well, no -- but he has a guy who's excellent at it, but he's busy doing another job in Yonkers. He'll be available in two weeks. Can't wait? Well, there's this other guy, but he's not really as good. It'll be done by tomorrow, but since you're paying so much money, why not wait and get it done right? Yes. Absolutely. We'll wait for "Pedro", the resizing guru.

Two weeks pass. Unfortunately, Pedro has had a death in the family and is returning to Colombia -- indefinately. No problem, the other guy isn't that bad -- he's available next week. Oh, and better give the countertop people a heads-up on the new measurements.

The other guy does a great job, actually, for only $500. Phew! Now the appliances are being installed -- but wait! Oh no ... this new fridge is more powerful than the old one, and now needs a dedicated power line. Your electrician is only a "certified" electrician -- you need a REGISTERED electrician, as per the building code. That's going to cost an additional $750. Oh, and he won't be available until after next week -- he's on vacation.

Now the cabinets are in. The appliances are in, and operational. You still have no countertop or floor. The countertop won't be in for two more weeks, it was backordered TWICE.

Three more weeks. The countertop arrives. But remember that little measurement problem you'd HOPED the contractor had fixed by giving the countertop people a head's-up? He forgot. Countertop is too big for the space. No worries, there's a stone mason who does this kind of work ...he can cut it down to size for you. He's available next week.

Stone mason comes, fits the countertop beautifully. Now, at least, you can move your kitchen crap back into the kitchen. The floor is installed (amazingly) with no problems two weeks later.

Start to finish project length: EIGHT MONTHS! Cost overruns: $8,000.

Depends on your tolerance for pain. Mine was pretty high. We renovated a kitchen & bathroom once while living in the apt. The kitchen cabinets were delivered a few weeks early and sat in the living room for a while, making the LR unusable. Bathroom mess wasn't too bad as we had 2 bathrooms. Dust was everywhere, but we worked long hours and were barely home.

2nd time around, we did another reno (floors, apt combo) while living in one, crowded room of the apt, watching TV, eating takeout, sleeping in a 10X14 room with lots of crap around. It was bearable except for 1 week when the fumes from the floor got too much for me and we decamped to a hotel for a week.

3rd time around (yes I am a glutton for pain), I moved into a place with no hot water or cooking facilities (toilets were fine) with a young child and heavily pregnant. My partner took cold water showers while I decamped to a friend's to shower, surf and watch TV in the afternoons (yes, no TV or Internet).

Please listen to NYCMatt. Think his story is the exception to the rule? Think again.

Sad but true, Matt, but you forgot to mention all the dust & grime throughout the apartment & the delicious smell of paint & other potions used in a construction zone. Can you live with it? Yes - but far from optimal. 8(

Yes, I glossed over that part. I also left out the part about "Bob" having to board his cat for three months, then having to move her in with relatives for the rest of the duration, because the poor thing was freaked out by all the noise and activity, and had nowhere to hide in the tiny apartment.

Good lord. I'm calling my contractor on Monday...

NYC Matt: Thanks that is so truthful. It helped me decide. After reading it I may pass on signing this contract.

umbrella27, all you have to do is to be extremely prudent in selecting the contractor. These days, with little work and a lot of competition, they suddenly became very accomodating and diligent. I could tell a few stories but take my word for it: at some point any renovation is done, and you are free to enjoy your home.

Staken,
How can a gut renovate 2b/2b 1200 sq ft in 60 days (that is the time the board allows.) not possible. built into their bylaws states fines for each day over 60 days. very strict coop.

"How can a gut renovate 2b/2b 1200 sq ft in 60 days "

2 chances: slim and none.

I'll bet on none.

The co-op board goes over your plans first and approves them. If the 60 days rule is unreasonable, believe me, they'll agree with your timetable.
Depends on your plans, you see. If you want to move walls, the building and its architect may not allow it, and so on.

The '60 day' rule in my case was interpreted by all parties as 60 working days. Holidays didn't count. Since my contractor got along well with super and followed all rules and was very considerate about keeping noise down, cleaning up each day, being polite and promptly fixing any problems, no one ever cared when the project ran about 15 - 20 days over.

Wow kylewest your contractor sounds great is there anyway you could e-mail his contact info.?