The Phillips Club

And you don't just rent a hotel room because.....?

Kind of fun to do the arithmetic.

I see a one-bedroom for sale at $285,000. You get to use it 1/8 of the year.

If you wanted to use it for the full year that one-bedroom would cost $2,280,000. And the maintenance? For full year, $71,424. (Taxes look very low so will probably increase significantly over time.)

Maybe I'm wrong - but I think you can still rent a pretty decent place for $71,424 a year - and you don't have to pay $2.28 million for the privilege.

Such a deal for a one-bedroom!

that's a place where you can't afford nyc 365, so you buy little pieces... similar to a $500 hooker/nite... cause you can't afford her 365 days a year... .

NEXT.....

agreed... you have to be an imbecile to buy that....

"If you wanted to use it for the full year that one-bedroom would cost $2,280,000."

You're missing the point. If you only need a place for a month or six weeks out of the year, it may not be such a bad investment. The location is great, and you are not paying for 100%. The reason the taxes appear so low? Just multiply by 8 and you will see that those taxes are currently at fully appraised rates--not subject to rise higher than average.

Realistically, most people only use 2nd homes in the city occasionally. Paying a premium for a partial interest may be the smartest choice in the long run, particularly if you favor a Lincoln Center location.

PMG... how many Phillips units have you sold?

"Premium".... vs. full time town car to take you where ever and whenever you want....

I think I'll take a 365 day 1bdrm on 85th and 1st, and have a car on standby... hey maybe I'll even go DOWNTOWN for some noodles.... heres' the cool thing.... I can let friends and family use my 1st ave apt to visit nyc when I'm not there.... and maybe they'll scratch my back and let me stay at their condo in Tahiti....

phillips club. for fools!

you can rent a one bedroom at the Brompton for $3000. and you can even keep your slippers in the closet.

w67 very funny. I bought my hudson view studio for $179k with current carry charges less than 11k per year. So I get 100% access for about the cost of a philips club time share. I'm not selling phillips club at all, but for some people, who may want a "guest room" six weeks out of the year, or a pied a terre, it may be a cheaper alternative to buying an apartment.

PMG... LMAO. rich enough to want distance from a relative/friend who comes 6 weeks a yr in NYC but not rich enough to buy them their own pied..... hmmmmmm hmmmmm hmmmm I'm looking for a word.... hmmmm hmhm hmh hmmmmmm.... what do you call a person who can't afford something, but does something completely financially assed backwards.... OH I KNOW NINJA loan buyers and any fool who is forced to sell his home in the last year and bought in 2005-2007 (just pre-Lehman).... LMAO again....

http://www.stockbrokerfraud-blog.com/condo-hotel-buyers-sue-under-securities-laws/

bump8

thx 30yrs... I like that Babs quote on the other thread... get an exclusive long enough that when the seller is forced to sell, you still got the exclusive... Nice nice...

My wife and I own a two-bedroom there and love it. The economics aren't that complicated. If we spend 45 nights a year in NY, the amortized annual cost is about $300 a night. For that we get a fully and very nicely furnished 1300 sq ft apartment with two bedrooms, at least two bathrooms, large living area, dining table for six, fully equipped kitchen, three TVs, stereo, remarkably nice beds, washer and dryer, even iron, ironing board and umbrella; doorman, concierge; great location, steps from subways, right at Lincoln Center. I walk in, all my clothes, and even my computer and printer, are already there. I travel back and forth between the Phillips Club and our home in California with no luggage. My wife regularly has three girlfriends there with her. They can have dinner, eat popcorn around the TV, and then all go to their own sleeping areas. We can't get anything like that in a hotel.

If you spend less than 20 nights a year in the city, get a hotel. If you spend over 80, buy an apartment. Between 20 and 80, the economics work out and the comfort and convenience are unbeatable.

That cost includes daily maid service.

Maid service? For the 50% haircut in your initial investment, there better be 10 naked drop dead gorgeous maids whenever I want in the 30 days I am there wo the wife.

One other thing, are you of the financial school where a company is worth more because the company does a 50 to 1 split?

One other thing, what about 21 days/yr guy or the 79 day/ yr guy? Still make sense, or for the rest of your life you gotta spend 45 days in NYC (let's call it a sweet spot). How about your wife falls in love with Paris for a few years? Or you fall in love with canada?

All the baggage of hateful wife wo the child rearing and sex.

w67 you are occasionally funny (as is your arch nemesis pigshrimp, and unlike wonderboy who is plain stupid)... but mccaskey made a well reasoned argument as to why this is a better option than paying $300 for a hotel (which rate will go higher in an inflationary environment). 50 for 1 splits or naked maids have nothing to do with that

Se. Totally disagree with you on shrimpie. Mental, yes, funny , no.

financially, time shares in general are great for developers (looking for cheap financing from gullible buyers) and operating companies (who makes money even after paying their union doorman $20/hr) at the expense of mcclaskey who 'assign' value to being able to 'lock' in rental rates and warm and fuzzies.

Like almost the entire time share markets around the world, people are voting with their feet and selling. Bc of the pure 'investment' nature of the phillips and their ilk, their beta is through the roof. And if time shares were so great for NYC, don't you think we'd have more than a handful for a city with millions of people? No bc Phillips and all time shares were in part a symbol of the re bubble. If a whole house is great investment then a small share is even greater investment thru the magic of Diversification!?

obviously by now we're all familiar with rent vs buy argument and numbers. What makes this 'potentially' different/interesting is time share vs hotel argument. I simply haven't run the analysis so don't know... Also it's unique because it's NYC. A timeshare in Mexico, etc might be silly, but I can totally see the clientelle to spend 30-60 days in the city every year. If his analysis on ammortised cost included depreciation of capital than it might be valid, if it didn't than not.

Perfect comparable market is netjets. It's for people who can't afford a full private jet. Yes there are cattle that take first class, but usually the netjets guy is comparing owning a full plane versus 1/8. Se10024, please tell me how the private jet share market is going?

from the investment standpoint buying at >1k/sqf in manh, buying a timeshare, buying a fractional jet is bad right now, people overlevered ,etc... no argument from me. point is, if you are not overlevered, spend 60 days a year in nyc, want to be close to lincoln center, can you ammortize this apt over 10 years and is it better than spending $300/ night in a hotel?

I didn't include depreciation in my calculation. We bought our two bedroom almost exactly four years ago for $290K. I see one is in contract now at $265K, down 12%. So it's down more than NYC condos in the same period (0%-5%), but down a whole lot less than the rest of the country (25%-30%). Kind of in the middle. Since the property is in the city, but buyers are from outside, maybe that makes some sense.

The monthly fees cover all the maintenance and upkeep, so you don't need to spend that few percent a year (and all that time) painting, fixing the washer, replacing the pillows, upgrading the televisions (3 42" TVs just installed!), etc., etc. So in thinking of the finances, I don't include depreciation as I do with a property where I need to do all that. (Or interest payments. People who buy here don't need mortgages.)

Remember, my $300/night number gets you a two bedroom (and kitchen, living room, walk-in closet, blah, blah). So that's like two hotel rooms or suites (which you'd need to book for those four-girlfriends-go-shopping-in-NY weekends).

A better comparison to a regular hotel would be the studio units. Owning and staying in one of those 45 nights a year works out to about $150/night (and the studio is still 50% bigger than a hotel room).

Hmmm, hadn't thought about these numbers recently. No wonder owners like this.

And about that Tahitian, yes, you can let your friends use the apartment when you aren't there. We do it all the time.

In fact -- and this is really cool for, say, reunions in the city -- there is even a way to let your friends stay in one apartment while you are in another.

Cool that is, as long as when we check in there isn't a mixup and they don't walk into the apartment with my slippers and my, uh, private stuff, in the closet.

so is investment in a condo hotel at philips club real estate or a security?

I own one-eighth share of an apartment. The transaction is executed at a regular real estate closing. I have a fractional deed. I'm on the hook for 1/8 of the property tax on my particular apartment (though I just forward the tax bill to the managing agent who covers it out of my monthlies).

I stay in my own apartment only about 10% of the time. There are eleven apartments, all very similar. As part of the closing, each of the 88 owners (8 x 11) signs an agreement to share with the other seven owning that apartment and with the other 80 owning similar apartments.

So, net, a group of eighty-eight owners own a pool of eleven similar apartments -- and one big sign-up sheet.

A 2001 New York Times article about the place: http://www.nytimes.com/2001/03/04/realestate/habitats-phillips-club-66th-street-west-broadway-buying-time-share-for-visits.html.

And you don't just rent a hotel room because.....?

Well, what's lost in this discussion is there is more that a dollars and cents comparison to be made. Renting a hotel room means the hassle of making a hotel reservation. Is there room at the hotel I want? Which floor will they put me on? Will I have a decent room? Dealing with transient folks coming and going. Wondering who will be making noise in the next room or hallway to disturb you. Packing and unpacking.

TPC is just a different experience, combination of private residence and exclusive club. There are no crowds. The apartments are spacious, and essentially soundproof. I have never heard any noises from neighbors even though the club is usually fully booked. It's located in one of the best neighborhoods in Manhattan. Your stuff is stored and waiting for you. A supermarket downstairs, or your fridge stocked if you like. Free access to a health club across the street that rivals anything you will find at any hotel, resort or country club. Safety is never an issue... I might have qualms about my wife or daughter staying alone in some NY hotels, but I have no worries here.

There is just no comparison to a hotel stay. Not that all hotels are bad. I've stayed in some terrific hotels in NY. But this is a different experience, more residential. Is it more cost effective to own a year round condo? It might be if you really need full time access to NY. But not for a month or two's use per year.

I don't expect to necessarily turn a profit if I sell one day but, unlike a timeshare, there is an active private sales market and I do expect club ownership will hold its value.

I understand what is involved will full condo ownership: the expense and hassles of furnishing, maintenance, board issues, etc.. In fact I do have full time ownership in a resort condo elsewhere. The extent of my usage there makes the expense and issues worth it. But would not be for 6 weeks usage per year.

So for those of you posting that owning at PC is for fools, makes no financial sense etc... Sorry, but you don't know what you are talking about. It's not fair to discuss fractional ownership in general and extrapolate to this project. This place is unique in its location, quality, management, and amenities. It's been around for ten years, units hold their value relative to the overall real estate market, and there is relatively little turnover for a project of its size which tells you owners are happy. And we are not talking about fools here, but sophisticated people. It doesn't work for everyone but for those of us looking for a piece of NY, there is nothing like it. One of the best moves I've made. And no, I'm not a salesperson. Just a satisfied owner.

do people still see these as a good investment? I know they have come down in price, but is it because of the market or just low demand for this property? are the owners still happy with their investment and usage?

Hello to all the Phillips Club Fans,
I'm a student at Juilliard graduating May 20th and although my parents stay at the Phillips Club as a hotel very, very often, I do not have access to the Library. I need a place to congregate my extended family for an afternoon and was hoping a member of Phillips Club I could write a short letter on my behalf. I understand it's quite a liability, but I hope someone will be generous enough to understand. My email is mcj@juilliard.edu . Please help and graduating Juilliard Student go out into the world! If you're a member, it'll only take a few minutes. Thank you!

Mark
mcj@juilliard.edu

We are in our 4th year of ownership at The Phillips Club and love it. It has exceeded our expectations in terms of usage. However, my personal feeling is that using timeshare in the same sentence as investment is blasphemous. Phillips Club is a complicated product; if you like spending multiple two week stretches in New York city with your dogs in a well-run condominium with excellent services and are prepared to pay a premium for that, then consider it. Since we have been renting full-time in New York for past 18+ months, we have been using it as guest bedroom; our friends and family members like it so much that they come to NYC on the pretense of visiting us just to use our Phillips Club unit. Somehow, they never make it across town to actually see us, and upon conclusion of their visit, they immediately ask us if they can book it again. Funniest thing is that they have started fighting over it (My brother: "But Aunt Sally used it twice last month alone. It's our turn!" Aunt Sally: "My bridge group and I have tickets to the Ring Cycle - I need both units for all those days!") Not sure how the next year is going to shake out in terms of where we end up in New York real estate decisions, but worst case scenario for me, which is still pretty nice, is that we revert to pre-2011 status of using Phillips Club as our pied-a-terre. So lovely to check in to an 1100 square foot condo that is run like a 5-star hotel (same people who run the good Ritz in NYC and all the beautiful Four Seasons) in an awesome location with your stuff already in the closet and the welcoming and professional staff. No headaches. Fabulous? Yes. Financially savvy by any objective measure? No.

multicy: is that you?
I'm asking you a question on the rental discussion thread.

Yes.

You're not a novice anymore.
Why not just go by "multicityresident"?

NYCNovice is the paying account. I may inadvertently appear again as MCR next time I am at computer where I used that login, but if that happens, I am going to logout and re-login as NYCN.

O.K. with me.

Can't keep two logins names straight, but fabulously wealthy. Just throwing $$$ billz to mooching aunt sallies.

Flmaozz

Compare room rates at the Mark to fractional ownership at Phillips to a 2br rental at the Aire/other luxury building.

2br suite is 3500/night (probably 20% lower if you are a long-term guest). At 30 nights/year, that's 100k/year. Compare to 24k carrying costs + lost opportunity cost on 300k. OTOH, renting a 1br at the Aire is 4k/month (no 2brs on the mkt currently, I'll just say it's 8k). 8k -> 96k/year and you can probably sublet for the months you're not using the apt.

FWIW - one BR/ 2 bth at Aire, with small alcove that can be walled off, $4,900 (lease started in August). And they probably have some rules about how short a sublet they would allow.

but no terrace.

OR ya can buy this for $699K and pay $1.6K month.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/714507-coop-316-west-82nd-street-upper-west-side-new-york

3 floors too much to walk up... buy the identical 2nd floor one...

or RENT IT for $2.9K/month.... or buy 2R, 3R, 4R.. and make a triplex for $2.1MM... but I'm thinking there's a bargain for bulk buyers in this POS...

FLMOAZzzzzzzzz... but at least you CAN USE IT ALL YEAR ROUND... maybe airbnb it and make coin, turn it into a whore house... or hold onto to it and see if it'll double to $4.2MM in 2 years or least beat SPRINT.

Serious question - if you wanted to be in NYC for 4 weeks of the year, and needed a 3br apartment (all mod cons + doorman, preferably furnished), what's the most economical & flexible option?

I'm on vacation right now, plenty of sublets available here. Paying 300/night for an apt that is worth 1m. No-brainer, rent!

2b2b (very small) at the Beacon Hotel was 450/night. Is there an apartment hotel option that is somewhere between that and the Mark?

Something like this:

http://www.draycotthotel.com/default.aspx?pg=rooms-suites

My favorite (and very central) part of London. Elevatored, central A/C, backing onto private garden. The 2b2b suites go for about $800/night, and definitely cheaper with long stays. An equivalent apartment across the gardens go for USD3m. No-brainer, rent!

Dear w67thstreet,
My good man, we would never be seen walking out of the apartment you posted. In fact, last summer when we were slumming with the Romney's in Mass I mentioned to my wife, Loviee, that we need a weekend at the Club.
Good Day,
Thurston Howell III

A few points:
(1) I have to defend Aunt Sally's honor - she is anything but a mooch and shows appreciation through dinners at Picholine, theater tickets, and the like. Also, my brother offers us their house at Smoke Tree in exchange, etc. These are have been fringe benefits of our TPC purchase that we had not anticipated, but love.
(2) The cash carrying cost is not $24,000 per year; it is $9600 per year, a portion of which is tax deductible because it goes to real estate taxes. The delightful surprise here is that the annual fee (paid on monthly basis) actually decreased last year - thus my point about the excellent management.
(3) Agreed the opportunity cost on the $300K is real, plus no certainty that you will see any of that $300K ever again. While TPC has a nice resale history, I believe every resale has been at a 10-20% discount to original purchase price (I only did cursory research on this when we were purchasing - again, for us this was a consumption decision). Accordingly, TPC makes no sense for 99%+ of society, but for us it has been great. We bought it for the long haul with our eyes open. So far, expectations exceeded.

I am sure you got meaning, but correct iteration is annual fee is paid in monthly installments.

I just took a look at W67th's posting and love it. Again, we have considered going that route, but ownership is work.

Giving props to Aunt Sally!

Sing it with me, NYCNovice:

"Watermelon, cantaloupe, peach tree puddin'
ain't half as sweet as my little Sally Goodin..."

("Sally Goodin", Woody Guthrie)

Truth - you are a comforting presence; thank you.
And to Falcogold and W67th - While portions of my family are stuffy, I am not. My husband and I just want a nice living space in proximity to activities we like. I have broken the code in dropping some of the names I have on here, but I have found it to be oddly liberating. I am not allowed to talk about money or really anything of substance with my family, and certainly not with friends. I could certainly never ask friends who invited us to explore River House if we meet financial criteria; they just assume we do. And while we are comfortable enough, we are certainly not fabulously rich; if we were, then we could buy at River House without worrying about seeing that capital again. Finally, the sleuths on SE do creep me out a bit - I am going to assume Falcogold had no idea that we have spent some time on Lake Winnipesauke, but not with the Romneys.

You have money and you're an attorney. But you are not a snob.
You're good with Truth.

More power to you if you can rhrowoney away like that. Bravo..

Throw money away

nyc10023, I think the 2B2b option is much more common in London hotels than in Manhattan. I had a pleasurable stay in one of those a couple of years ago (Milestone, on Kensington High St, but facing Ken Gardens). Very doubtful the same experience is available here.

What happens if any or all of the seven other people you share the apartment with want to use it on the same days you do?

Aunt Sally's coming to stay with you, Matt.

It is a complicated product in that you technically own a certain percentage of a given condominium with X other owners, but are not competing with the owners of your particular unit per se for availability. Buying a percentage of a particular unit allows you access to the entire inventory of that line in the building on an onging advance reservation system. We never have a problem reserving 30 days in advance. There is a nice last minute feature where if you call 48 hours in advance, you have access to the entire inventory of the building for a maximum of 2 night stay. For business travelers, this is a great feature. For anyone who is serious about TPC, the head of sales over there is a straight shooter - he is the least "salesy" person we've ever dealt with. He really did not appear to care whether we purchased or not and told us only about the risks of the product. We actually thought we were being punked he was so unsalesy. For anyone who is really interested in TPC, I would also advise looking up who has actually purchased there on ACRIS. Those whose names one might recognize would not appear to be idiots; then again, I know some people who did not appear to be idiots who invested with The Fairfield Greenwhich Group, so one should never buy anything just because other seemingly intelligent people did.

Wait, so no particular unit is yours?

So you can't keep a wardrobe of clothes there, or other personal items?

This is starting to sound more and more inconvenient ...

From a casual analysis of the situation, it seems that there is a market for such a product. Short-term furnished luxury rentals with hotel amenities that don't cost 3500/night are not widely available in "prime" Manhattan.

I am intrigued by the lack of a price spread between the studio/1br and the 3br product. I haven't looked on ACRIS, but the 3br prices (9-29 and 10-29) hover around 300k (X8 = 2.4m) which is much less than comparable condo product in the immediate vicinity.

Legally one particular unit is partially yours; this will only come into play if everything goes to junk and you effectively are left with a TIC with the other owners of your particular unit. You have a rolling wardrobe that the staff keeps in storage for you. Whichever unit you are staying in will have your wardrobe, plus anything else you ask for in it when you arrive.

With that rolling wardrobe set-up you are like a rock star out on tour, NYCNovice.

NYC10023 - the 3 bedrooms are resales. I did quick look on ACRIS and looks like 3br sellers can realistically expect their interests to sell around $233. Some bought these for $410K back in 2007. Over 5 years, did sellers get usage worth [(410,000 - 233,000) + (6 x annual fee) + transactions costs]? This is the salient calculation for these particular sellers to determine whether 2007 purchase was a good one for them. Also, to answer your question about alternatives, the conclusion we came to was sublets were only alternatives. When I was researching, sublets did appear to be the more economical way to go. Phillips Club also has an apartment hotel component. No idea what current prices are for 30-day stays.

Flmaozz.

'I'm feeling horny. Honey can you pencil me in for September 26th?. No, how about oct 12? How about oct 15? Great.'

Prostitute.

'I'm feeling horny. How much? $100. How about $10? Ok. Great.'

You are like my 'friends' who bought a time share in hawaii. They look at the list price of the 2bdrms for $650/nite who ever realizing the hotels run specials for $300/nite.

They keep quoting the $650 and run the comps. Flmaozzz. You know the Macy bed 'sales' are the same. no fking sane person ever paid '$5k for that pos bed'. All you gotta do is say 'boo' and they'll tell you there's a sale next week but you can Pre buy it bf the sale for $600.

This is hilarious. When I sell you a 75 ft boat for $200k. It means it needs $3mm in work.

It also means free is a valid offer for that Pos boat.

If I'm a sandbagging hedge fund manager, my 10% return looks great compared to a -2% TIPs.

Yeah, but I made ya 100% return with 1/2 the risk on sprint in 4 months. Fk it. I'll go away for 10yrs and do nothing with your money and I'll still beat 99.99% of 'professional' hedge fund managers out there!

Flmaozzz.

Well let me say. If money is your goal, any form of 'ownership' in nyc makes absolutely no sense. I'd take sprint at any price point up to $10 versus plunking it down to the 'false/bullshit' nyc re mkt.

Yes, these are a liability if you don't use and love them. Consumption, not investment. Not quite on par with opening a restaurant on your boat, but not an unreasonable comparison. And not throwing money away - we prefer to say lighting it on fire.

Sorry. Now I'm talking to a person who smashes 2week old puppies' head on the sidewalk for sport. I don't get you.

I guess anything seems reasonable to a person comparing spending money on anything versus 'lighting' it on fire.

$400k to $233k plus carry plus trans cost. That works out to $2.55k/nite if they took all 30 days. W67 got an offer for 3bdrm for $600/nite at some point.

4x more for less flexibility. I guess the morons were hoping for $400k to $1mm making the hotel rooms not an expense but a lottery tkt.

You get more than thirty days. You can use your unit as many days as you want throughout the year, but you cannot have more than 2 weeks reserved at any given time. I think we have used ours on average 60-70 days per year.

So w67thstreet, what do you think of American Tel & Tel's common shares at the present moment in time?

NYCNovice, Does Phillips any fees aside from monthly/annual ones? Reservation? Move-in/out? Per stay? Cleaning? Per stay exceeding a certain time period, like 30 days per year?

Yes, per stay housekeeping fees. For our line I believe it is $50/night with $85 final night of stay. More for larger units, less for smaller units. Good point; one has to factor these in as well. This is what keeps common charges down and also puts greater cost on those who use property more than others. If you have guest stay there, they just pay housekeeping fee directly with a credit card. Housekeeping fees are same regardless of how much you use unit. Our friends who stay there are delighted to pay $385 for the week; we are delighted to have them subsidize common charges.

So you get the right to use at least 45 days in your line, but you can stay more if there are empty slots (so long as you pay housekeeping).

What keeps someone from booking 2-weeks every 2 weeks?

Inonada - close. You get the right to use it as much as you want subject to availability. The 45 day thing is just a number that they throw out as equal to the fraction you buy, but there is no contractual provision tied to that number. In theory, nothing keeps someone from booking 2 weeks every 2 weeks (except I believe there is a rule in the bylaws that you need to check out at least once ever 90 days or something like that). In practice, the club is usually fully booked two weeks out from when you begin your two week stay. You can pretty much count on getting two weeks out of any month, but getting four weeks in a row is tough.

I think the 45 day number is what you would get if every owner were using every reservation opportunity. During our tenure, we appear to be among the higher usage owners; there are some corporate owners who do not appear to maximize usage.

"You can check out any time you like
but you can never leave..."

look. as indicated soo many times by NYCNovice.. it's for consumption.. not an investment.. If he/she has money to spend by all means spend. Its like paying for a $15 Heineken on the Peninsula Hotel Roof top or buying a $1200 bottle of vodka at your favorite club.. ITS A WASTE OF MONEY... but let he/she waste the money as he chooses. If they want to impress people by saying they have a exclusive timeshare in Manhattan great.... Most will know what its for..Status or to impress. He/she earned it, and can spend it whatever way they like.

No, it's for Aunt Sally.

Do they allow low-end escorts to buy in? And would I have to tip the staff, or it being a club that's not allowed anyway?

Only if your name is Phillip.

Brooks2 gets it, but I quibble with one small point: It is not for status or to impress. Telling someone you own a timeshare is the quickest way to become the laughing stock of pretty much any gathering. This is not something we publicize. The friends who introduced us to the club did so only after we swore not to tell anyone else that they were members; they only introduced us to the concept after listening to what we were looking for. We, likewise, did not publicize our purchase. However, our secret got out in the summer of 2010, when we ran into some friends from California who were in NYC shooting a movie and staying in the hotel portion of TPC on an extended basis. They have since been our guests a few times in exchange for not making us the butt of any jokes in their work.

Theater people, just awful ... I wouldn't trust them in that exchange.

Thanks, NYCNovice.

Are the bookings week-long, or nightly? If the latter, are weekdays or weekends usually more filled?

For Immediate Release:

NYCNovice owns a timeshare at The Phillips Club in Manhattan. She and Aunt Sally are the subject of the upcoming documentary: "Me and My Aunt Sally". Produced by their friends from California."

media contact: inonada #212-ino-nada

Bookings can be any length up to one week. Thus, the maximum you can book at any one time is two bookings of one week each. If you have a booking of one night, the second booking can still only be for maximum of one week. Weekends during certain times of the year (May and June; November and December) tend to fill before weekdays do.

You also get an annual reservation that is a third reservation on top of your floating two reservations. If you have one week that you absolutely need or want to be in New York, you use your annual reservation for that.

Wow.

Paying 4x the price of a comparable condo straight up;
Booking 30 days In advance;
But for No longer than 2wks Except on leap years;
Acting like a time share owning donald trump;
Bookings more complicated than united airlines with Miles from cuban airlines;
Having to wait in the lobby till check in time whilst other 'owners' take their last shit;
Getting a call at 3:05pm asking when the fk your gonna leave;
Priceless.

Oh I bet you get annal reservations......

NYCNovice: When you read w67thstreet, imagine his words in the voice of Dr. John.
67 has that jazz-jive speak down.

That was a great song,w67th.

anal, w67th.

Alanhart.

I think longer term as mobile phones become 'credit cards' it will blow the mkt cap of Amex, visa, discover cards. One can picture taking a phone to do currency transactions, think of how much of a bid ask spread there is going to Europe or Asia. That's pure bank profits that can shrink significantly as mobile phones take that over.

In the end the pipeline that will let that occur is what I am investing in. Sprint is just the most beaten down player bc they tried to swallow Nextel. But there in lies the 'pop'.

But AT&T is great if you are a widower or don't like to make as much money ;)

Like McCaskey, when s/he posted, I had not looked at this or thought about it in awhile. I just ran the numbers on ours mostly because the real world project I am working on right now is so tedious that I will do anything but focus on it. Were we to sell today and get the same price that the resale of our line got in June of 2012, our total out of pocket would amount to $442.86 per night of usage, calculated by taking original purchase price minus resale price plus annual fees for three years (they gave first year free) plus usage fees for all nights we've used over those four years plus transaction costs of original purchase plus transaction costs of resale, all divided by total number of nights of use. Accordingly, as I evaluate this decision today, it actually makes sense from financial management perspective. However, we have no current plans to sell, and who knows what the market will like when we do or how many days we will have used it in the interim or what will have happened to taxes and common charges in the interim. I note that my calculation does not include opportunity cost of capital that was tied up during the four year period, but we don't ever factor that into consumption decisions. If we did, we would go mad and never consumer anything. I am wondering if W67th hangs out on car blogs and rants at people who buy new cars? With that said, I do give props to his analysis of Sprint - went back and found it and have no arguments with it. I just can't figure out why he is hanging out on a real estate site since I don't see any love of real estate in his postings. I think many people who really love real estate view it as part consumption, part savings - a bit like life insurance. I go nuts when anyone tries to sell me life insurance as an investment. That is not to say that there aren't good life insurance products out there that have an investment component that might pan out. It's just that if investment is my objective, there are better investment products out there than life insurance policies. I am in KeithB's camp where in one post he said "why not own the place where you live and also invest in sprint?" However, I have digressed from the discussion of The Phillips Club (and I thank Inonada for trying to bring it back on track earlier) - I view The Phillips Club as 100% consumption with no investment or savings component and I love it.

I got majorly burned on betting fibre optics in '99.

I want the phone in my head.

One question on transaction cost of resale - I used 7.5% of sales price but don't know if this would be accurate because I've never sold any real estate in NYC. I assumed 6% commission to broker plus 1.5% in recording and other fees.

Come on NYCnovice. I enjoy reading your posts, but this makes no sense from a financial mangment perspective.

I don't know the whole w67th story.
Some on here say he was fired from his father's RE co.
He grew up poor. At some point his dad was able to get into RE.
He's not stupid, as we can see by his action on Sprint.

"W67thstreet" is a character. His cyber alter-ego.
He's funny and sometimes I can't help it -- I laugh at his shtick.
He's (I believe from his comments) married to a surgeon and has two little kids.
He seems to dote on them and I also believe he's a good, fun daddy.

I also grew up in a family without money and he seems to have a (grudging) respect for me.

>I don't know the whole w67th story.

Did you ever notice that he strongly hates female senior citizen New Yorkers?

Brooks2 - Fair enough if you mean it makes no sense from financial management perspective to spend 70 nights per year in a hotel in New York at a cost of $450/night, but if you want or need or have some mixture of want-for-personal/need-for-professional reasons to be in NYC for 70 nights per year, this is actually more cost-effective than any hotel I'd want to stay in with lots more space, plus feels like home, and they even know and welcome our dogs. But you are right that from a financial management perspective saving and staying at home is better than consuming anything.

Truth - Thanks for the background on W67th. I still don't understand why he is hanging out on a real estate site; he does seem to have excellent equity analysis skills; why not hang out on a Yahoo finance chat board if that is where his passion lies?

uh oh....TMI

what's columbiacounty's new beef with NYCNovice?

huntersburg: Well, he doesn't like ph41 and I can now see why. She's a snob.
She tries to make me feel inferior to her. It's her thing. She seems to get a perverse pleasure from just attempting it because I don't let her get to me.
She just makes herself look bad, with her blurting out my address when I refused to let her perverse pleasure escalate.
She lost that argument (if you could call it that).