Buying without Representation

Also, if I were to go into contract, what are the required fees and if the contract falls through, do I get the say 10% deposit back? Thanks in advance for any help!

Gettting a lawyer is critical. The whole idea that both buyers and sellers need a broker is a brilliant idea probably dreamed up by the Real Estate brokers themselves to increase the odds of hooking a client.

Yes, I have a lawyer already. He has previously performed transactions for me and I am very comfortable with him, however, he is still a lawyer, I am the one throwing out the money, so I wanted to enlighten myself about this process as well.

Newbie - does your lawyer do a lot of real estate transactions? Or he/she just done other business transactions for you in the past? There is a difference.

Why not have someone represent you if this is something you have never done?

I just do not understand this logic. Do you buy a book on how to do a root canal yourself?

Only in NYC do buyers think that they know everything and do not need professional help...

We're not using a buyer broker, we researched places that we wanted online and then contacted the seller brokers. But beware, we definitely screwed up the first time we negotiated on a place. With our new experience we did much better the second and third times around. The broker can be helpful walking you through the buying process, acting as a liaison with the seller's broker, and helping you figure out if you are getting a good price. However, I think that the seller's brokers have a definitive incentive to get the deal done with us since it means they're going to get double their commission.

You only get the deposit back if it is stated so in the contract. It depends on the reason that the deal falls through. If something is essential it must be written in the contract.

I might have given off a wrong impression, I have never purchase an apartment without broker representation, I have however, purchased in manhattan. And yes, the lawyer representing me is a licensed RE lawyer and has performed my previous NYC RE transaction.

MichaelG - Yes, that's exactly what my lawyer told me as well about the deposit.

Well I would certainly give myself a root canal the second time around...

I don't think root canal is a good metaphor. Maybe giving yourself a tattoo?

MichaelG, I personally relate purchasing (not selling) an apartment to buying stocks. Would you purchase stocks on your own without "professional" advice? With enough knowledge/research, most people would say yes, obviously with some exceptions.

Dear NewbieBuye,
I am a broker myself in NY and I am looking to buying a small property at the Hamptons and the first thing I did was to hire a broker from another company to act as my broker. Tecnhically I could well do this transaction myself and save a 2% or 3%, but in my opinion the valute that you get when you work with a professional broker is much higher. May be I think this way since I work mostly with buyers and I do everything I can to find them the best possible deal.

As I said before, we're trying to buy without a broker. All I can say is that it's definitely a learning experience. I'm thankful for Streeteasy.

mrossi, I appreciate your candid reply. Perhaps this thread will enlighten me on what a buyer broker's responsibilites are as I have already narrowed my search to an apartment that I like and negotiated on a price that I am comfortable with, what can a buyer's broker provide for me other than forwarding to me (perhaps hand deliver them to me) documents I will need to sign and prepare with my lawyer? As such, this is why I started this thread, to broaden my horizon on the process from offer to closing.

I am sure there are folks who would like to hire a buyer's agent, that's wonderful. A lot of people prefer not to deal with the searching and/or negotiating, thus, I agree, a buyer's agent is wonderful.

Personally, I'd never subsitute a brokers opinion for price in front of my own. The only area where I could see added value is in collecting and presenting a large number of ACRIS reporting closings and history. This is relatively simple to do, and in my humble opinion should be fee based if there is to be compensation.

MichaelG, I personally relate purchasing (not selling) an apartment to buying stocks. Would you purchase stocks on your own without "professional" advice? With enough knowledge/research, most people would say yes, obviously with some exceptions

This is a great question: The truth in what that process is...well comparable to visiting the kitchen of that take out chinese place...You don't want to know.

I think this whole thread is a fish story.

I'm not sure I understand your criticism here, I just want to know all the steps from the moment after you have selected a property to closing, what exactly did I say to "offend" your profession or you? The fact that I am not using a buyer's agent? Trying to understand what else does a buyer's agent do if I have performed the search, located the property, and negotiated a price that was reasonable to me? Or is it the fact that I utilized an analogy of buying stocks instead of tattoo'ing someone or performing a root canal?

Newbie - I don't know who "you" is in that last comment. Who is that directed at?

Riversider - I do believe that the entire stock market is a sausage factory, and not just because it is male-dominated.

30years - But who really knows what goes into that thai fish sauce that smells so bad but makes Pad Thai taste so good?

I was replying to 30yrs and hopefully I did not interpretted him incorrectly.

NewbieBuyer - Ask your attorney exactly what steps are involved. If he can't tell you, get another attorney.

MichaelG, care to elaborate on how you feel you "screwed up" the first time around?

I bought with out a broker. Only regret I wish there was a broker to guide me through the COOP up paper work.

Dear NewbieBuyer, if you have already negotiated the price and you are at the point of signing a contract you should just ask your attorney to do a good due diligence and after you have a fully executed contract you can start working on the board package. In order to do that you can request the assistance of your attorney and/or of the seller's broker since he has an interest too and will probably review the documents before submitting them to the board. A buyer's broker would make sense when you are still looking for a property. In your case just make sure that the due diligence is very strict.

bhh - It all started when we went to view a new coop building totally unprepared. We viewed multiple units in the building with one sponsor's broker, and showed way too much interest in the units that we liked. We only looked at "affordable" subsidized units, which we thought were a good deal, however the price with that subsidy did not nearly reflect the new market reality. We also viewed the apartments with our respective parents, and basically told the broker how much we could afford. we then negotiated with the broker at the office in the building, and he pretty much led us to where he wanted us to be. After the sponsor rejected our offer without making a counteroffer, we held pretty firm and got close to what we wanted, not because we thought the apartment was not worth more, but rather because we could not afford to pay any more.

In summary, we acted way too interested in the apartments, gave away how much we could afford, and didn't do enough research to get a good idea for what the current market was. I hope that a broker could have helped us avoid making those mistakes.

Thank you mrossi.