Buying Now Beats Renting

His name is Robert Paulsen. Sorry, couldn't help myself. In all seriousness, that's quite a compliment, inonada. You're one of the few good posters around here anymore.

nada uses source materials quite nicely also. and he has a fantastic sense of humor. a veritable prince among men.

LOL, printer. Thanks, I think. Besides being like that in real life, I try to be measured in what I write since it lives on forever on servers in the ether. The SE meetup also made me realize that the group is much more heterogenous than I thought, and that things that might not seem hurtful to your peers but may be so to others. I don't know why, but I somehow imagined that all the SE posters were going to be replicas more or less of myself. See, that was an unreasonable thing to have thought. Ergo, I am male.

Buying always beat renting for people with money. Who wants to be a temporary resident with a landlord knocking at your door every month. Pay me, pay me. Yes Mister Landlord, please the heat is too low.

No, nada, the apology was necessary - I like to save my insults for those who deserve them.

And my poetry:

LICC posted no comp
but rather went off on a romp
to Gantry State Park
where he could hurl his stale snark
as his "home" sank slowly in a swamp.

Aw gawsh, I'm blushing.

thank you steve. quite princely of you to respond.

dabulls, i want to be a temporary resident. thanks for asking.

"Pay me, pay me. Yes Mister Landlord, please the heat is too low."

Plot from low-budget flick?

an off off-broadway musical, patterned on dickens.

lol

"dabulls, i want to be a temporary resident. thanks for asking."

Well good for you honey.
How soon are you going back to Wisconsin?

jokes about the midwest are simply hilarious. sweetie.

DaBulls - nice to have you back.

I'd rather have the landlord come a knocking than the bank. "Pay me, pay me. Yes Mister Rich Banker, please can I pay some more interest?"

HAHAHAHA!

Scene 1
-------
DaBulls: Pay me, pay me.
Inonada: Yes Mister Landlord, the heat too low.

Scene 2
-------
Banker: Pay me, pay me.
DaBulls: Yes Mister Banker, the interest too high.
Bloomberg: Pay me, pay me.
DaBulls: Yes Mister Mayor, the taxes too high.

Scene 3
-------
Inonada: Pay me, pay me.
Banker: Yes Mister Inonada, the bonus too low.
Voter: Pay me, pay me.
Bloomberg: Yes Mister Voter, here your free housing voucher.

Interest? Goes up?

If your interest expense is cutting into your hourly wage, then this isn't for you. I'm only talking about people who can afford NY.

"Bloomberg: Yes Mister Voter, here your free housing voucher. "

If that is the category you are in, I wasn't addressing you. I'm only talking to people who can afford NY and don't need housing vouchers.

What's the definition of "can afford NY"?

If you have to ask

Are you "people with money"? How much do you have?

"If your interest expense is cutting into your hourly wage"

I get paid by the word.

nada, the definition of "afford NY" are the people are that obnoxious "Selling New York" show: real estate agents.

You are a paid poster here? For the Ellington?
Why does streeteasy allow shills like you.

Steve, you live at the Ellington which is pretty crappy.

Crappy? How many stories does Stevejhx have to walk up when the elevators are broken?

Can afford NY? LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL

Missed a letter C, may be missed more then a letter? You rent for less then $100 in NY.

Maybe aboutready can help you, she has some suggestions on what to do if you are foaming at the mouth or just keep stuttering laughing.

Crappy? You mean completely renovated, right: new balconies, new lobby, new elevators, new kitchens, new bathrooms.

Or are you talking about an LIC slum that might have a similar name?

No, DaBulls, I don't get paid to post. It amuses me as I take a break from translating financial statements.

I wish I did get paid, though, b/c at 14 cents a word, I'd be richer than I already am.

LIC?
Long Island City? I don't even take the Queens Midtown Tunnel to get to get to JFK.

By the way, how did they manage to get you a new balcony?

nada, indeed words do remain in the internet ether. DaBulls, 21 months ago. How's the Alexander doing these days?

"Manhattan continues to be a solid market.

Take the following condominiums being built and on sale now:

William Beaver
29 Madison Park
W Residences
75 Wall
The Alexander, a very exciting development and for more established buyers
Lucida
and more"

yes, offering contract recission is SOOO exciting.

25 months ago, Chelsea Stratus sold for $1,530,000. 21 days ago, sold for 24% increase.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/487765-condo-101-west-24th-street-chelsea-new-york
03/25/2007Previously Listed by Prudential Elliman at $1,530,000.
07/22/2008Previous Sale recorded for $1,530,000.
05/07/2009Prudential Elliman Listing sold. Last priced at $1,725,000.
01/08/2010Listed by Brown Harris Stevens at $1,975,000.
02/05/2010Delisted temporarily.
02/22/2010Listing entered contract.
04/01/2010Listing sold.
04/01/2010Sale recorded for $1,894,000.

Oh, but you had to pay interest expense on the mortgage and monthly condo charges. And you had to let strangers in for an open house.

"Manhattan continues to be a solid market.

Take the following condominiums being built and on sale now:

William Beaver
29 Madison Park
W Residences
75 Wall
The Alexander, a very exciting development and for more established buyers
Lucida
and more"

25 months ago, Chelsea Stratus sold for $1,530,000. 21 days ago, sold for 24% increase.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/487765-condo-101-west-24th-street-chelsea-new-york
03/25/2007Previously Listed by Prudential Elliman at $1,530,000.
07/22/2008Previous Sale recorded for $1,530,000.
05/07/2009Prudential Elliman Listing sold. Last priced at $1,725,000.
01/08/2010Listed by Brown Harris Stevens at $1,975,000.
02/05/2010Delisted temporarily.
02/22/2010Listing entered contract.
04/01/2010Listing sold.
04/01/2010Sale recorded for $1,894,000.

"how did they manage to get you a new balcony?"

Two of them, with a crane.

Ah, so that explains how you can get to your apartment when the elevator is down.

dabulls, the first price was a pre-construction price from way before 25 months ago....

no so swift with the data, are you...

are you alpo?

Some comment from apartmentratings.com on steve's building:

-Minuses include the neighborhood tourist factor which can be frustrating, but with the building's location what else can you expect; they rent out empty apartments to tourists who have no concern for permanent residents (loud music, asking to borrow the laundry machine card, etc.); lots of street noise even on higher floors (worst is from a nightclub up the street which often requires police presence when it closes); long-term problems with the elevators which were finally fixed after months and months of repairs and replacement; windows have probably never been washed from the outside since the building went up; rent has increased a total of 32% in the past 5 years (but there are more empty apartments now than I ever remember before, so maybe they will get real). The disadvantages are outweighed by the advantages lately.

- Stay Away From This Rip-Off- Currently living in the building (9/08) but getting out fast.
1) Both Elevators have been out since May 08.
2) Balconies have not passed inspection and tenants have been given three days notice to clean them out and wont have access until Fall 09. Look for full outer scaffolds to be constructed and remain for another year.
3) Supposed lobby renovation is non existent and was supposed to be completed by June 08.
4) Hall carpets are a mess
5) Fitness facilities have broken equipment and not maintained.
6) Management (Rose NY) doesn't care at all about the inconvenience

Seems like a dumpy place based on comments from people who lived there . . .

"that explains how you can get to your apartment when the elevator is down."

No actually - my plan was to string a high-wire from The Link across the street, but then I found out that the idiots there paying $11,000 a month for an apartment they rent out for $5,600 that I pay $3,600 for - DOESN'T HAVE WINDOWS THAT OPEN.

> Seems like a dumpy place based on comments from people who lived there . . .

Well, consider the source, the strange mind of Steve.

Where Clinton is a nicer neighborhood than Madison Square Park / Flatiron.
Where a building whose top amenity is "Dishwashers and microwave ovens in all apartments" is as good as the one with ubzero and DCS cooktops)
Where the one that has to specifically list "Individual year-round climate control" is comparable to the floor to ceiling windows one with CRAZY views for miles
Where a tiny gym that looks like the one from my high school is on the same level as the the crazy one with the skylighted basketball court, catering kitchen, and pool table.

I'm not saying that these amenities are worth it for anyone/everyone, but pretending they don't exist for the purposes of manufacturing a comp is wacky. About as equally crazy as pretending that clinton is anywhere as nice as Madison Square Park.

and I almost forgot... laundry on your floor that you share is equal to a W/D IN YOUR APARTMENT.

sheesh...

Ah, yes, you're taking LICC's comments on the building from disgruntled renters from 5 years ago!

The man who owns in LONG ISLAND CITY and won't even tell us where!

So let's see:

"Minuses include

* the neighborhood tourist factor which can be frustrating

True

they rent out empty apartments to tourists

False

loud music

The lady next to me is 93, and sometimes her TV is a little loud because she's deaf

asking to borrow the laundry machine card

There are only 5 apartments on my floor, so that's nonsense

* lots of street noise even on higher floors

Windows are soundproof.

* worst is from a nightclub up the street

No nightclub on this street

* long-term problems with the elevators which were finally fixed after months and months of repairs and replacement

Fixed - elevators are always out when they're being fixed.

* windows have probably never been washed from the outside since the building went up

Mine are clear as day.

* rent has increased a total of 32% in the past 5 years

Nope. Rents down.

1) Both Elevators have been out since May 08.

They were being fixed.

2) Balconies have not passed inspection and tenants have been given three days notice to clean them out and wont have access until Fall 09. L

They were fixed.

3) Supposed lobby renovation is non existent and was supposed to be completed by June 08.

Completed.

4) Hall carpets are a mess

Brand new.

5) Fitness facilities have broken equipment and not maintained.

Don't know - haven't been there.

6) Management (Rose NY) doesn't care at all about the inconvenience

The best and most responsive management company I've ever dealt with.

Seems like a dumpy place based on comments from people who lived there

SWE - sorry, Madison Park (Broadway in the upper 20's) is really seedy. Sorry.

All those amenities are wonderful - and they would cost me $10,000 to install if I wanted to.

They're not worth $7,000 a month.

Wow, new carpeting, laundry cards, and windows that you can open and see through!

Sounds like you've definitely proven that this is the equivalent of any high-end luzury building!

> SWE - sorry, Madison Park (Broadway in the upper 20's) is really seedy. Sorry.

Good to see you have no understanding of the map of Manhattan.... or are intentionally changing it to suit your needs (like moving times square 6 blocks to suit you).

MSP is not in the "upper 20s". Hell, the building is on 24th. Thats the LOWER 20s....

Steve, I love how you move entire city parks and plazas 5 blocks at a time to support your lousy case!

Not to mention, if you think upper 20s and broadway is seedy, then 52 & 8th is the ghetto... Hell, at 30th and 6th (WAY above) you have that new high end hotel. 29th & Broadway (also WAY above) is the Ace Hotel. Above the stratus you have blocks of high end apartment buildings. 26th is a primo culture strip, NYMag covered it, in the span of 100 feet to either side of 6th, you have Hill Country (best BBQ in city), Hog Pit, that nameless club, Gstaad, and Ainsworth, the super high end sports club (sounds weird, but its trut).

23rd, which is the big street ONE block south of the status, is the major thruway with the movie theater, RUB, Home Depot, Lenny's, Shake Shack within an avenue as well. If you want to call that Seedy, 52 & 8 is hell.

You're really grasping at straws, Eve.

oh yeah, and that whole seedy FLOWER DISTRICT, on 28th (4 blocks up)...

So, steve, what's high end to you? Port Authority?

> All those amenities are wonderful - and they would cost me $10,000 to install if I wanted to.
> They're not worth $7,000 a month.

Agreed.

Much of the difference is for location. Its just a much more expensive hood.

SWE - come on up and take a look.

Hmm. 24th is the "lower 20's." It seems to me that Madison Square Park itself runs from 23rd St. to 26th Street. It gets pretty seedy on the West Side up around 25th and 26th Street. On the east side you have the college, & that's not so bad.

52nd & 8th is a ghetto? Compared to 26th and Broadway?

Okay. I'll tell that to the guy who sells pretzels across the Street.

A SHAKE SHACK! Wow!

"Not to mention, if you think upper 20s and broadway is seedy, then 52 & 8th is the ghetto... Hell, at 30th and 6th (WAY above) you have that new high end hotel. 29th & Broadway (also WAY above) is the Ace Hotel. Above the stratus you have blocks of high end apartment buildings. 26th is a primo culture strip, NYMag covered it, in the span of 100 feet to either side of 6th, you have Hill Country (best BBQ in city), Hog Pit, that nameless club, Gstaad, and Ainsworth, the super high end sports club (sounds weird, but its trut)."

swe, don't disagree that MSP is actually fairly nice, but much of Broadway through the 20s is pretty gnarly. There's some recent activity there, but it's still a bit of a grimy area. It is kind of funny to hear someone championing the desirability of Hill Country (which I like, but talking about "great" bbq in this city is like talking about the best French food in Kentucky), and especially the Hog Pit, which is the kind of fratty dives that are a dime a dozen (and sadly lost much of its charm from the first location, now gone).

> Hmm. 24th is the "lower 20's."

Still, let me get this right... you're still trying to argue that 24th is the UPPER 20s?

This is getting funny.

> It gets pretty seedy on the West Side up around 25th and 26th Street

If thats your definition of seedy, what's clinton? Iraq?

> On the east side you have the college, & that's not so bad.

Steve, you should visit the area sometime. Seriously. "the college", I assume you mean baruch, is on lexington, not even close. On the east side of the park is the Met Life building (the clocktower, supposed to go high end condo, definitely a skyline landmark), the New York Life building (the gold dome skyline landmark), also Credit Suisse headquarters (or at least the First Boston part headquarters).

The west side is the toy building (oh so shady), actually two buildings, including the 40/40 club.
At the north end is the grand madison... oh so seedy.

lol.

But, again, if 24th is "upper", its clear you don't actually want the facts.

steve, seriously, you should visit the area... clearly you've never been there (at least in the last 20 years)

http://nymag.com/shopping/features/60104/

> 52nd & 8th is a ghetto? Compared to 26th and Broadway?

24th and 6th.

Wow, you really seem to have trouble with addresses!

rufus ... gone
comm ... gone
somewhereelse ... still here

SHUT UP ALREADY

ootin, why can't you be gone like them too? You were just as painfully wrong.

Painfully wrong as who? About what?

ootin, your amusing "disagreements" with dco/mmafia/steve are there for anyone who finds the search box to see...

Do you ever get tired?

How many times do you need to state your opinion on 24th and 6th vs. 52nd and 8th? Does it really matter that much? Do you even live at 24th and 6th? Do you live in Chicago? Are you in the teacher's union?

yes

Hey dabulls. how's the alexander doing? with it's more sophisticted buyers.

Watching "Selling New York", and have to say it is like a train wreck. I can't stop watching. Still waiting for a 52nd and 8th episode though

About ready, no reply to the new development that sold for 24% higher 24 months later? No single "ultra luxury" lease that is available today that you can show?

What is it you are about ready to do? Why can't you just actually do something? Just go those two extra steps. Get yourself ready. Then do it. Or you don't have the money?

By the way, do you even live in Manhattan or are you some bitter freak living with tinfoil around your head?Did the Alexander reject you or was a down payment on the 3rd floor studio out of reach?

"dabulls, i want to be a temporary resident. thanks for asking."

That makes sense if you live in a lousy apartment. Who wants to think that the rest of his life is in a lousy apartment? It makes sense to "feel temporary" and delude yourself that you will one day have the opportunity to live like others.

hmm. i sense something. i don't know what. something frustrated. something that has been very wrong about new development. oh well, can't think what it might be. maybe somebody of limited logic and wit?

" i sense something. i don't know what."
"maybe somebody of limited logic and wit?"

How is your little studio? Not quite like what you expected when you moved from Wisconsin, right?

" Who wants to think that the rest of his life is in a lousy apartment?"

...then why ever buy a coop or a condo? Apartment by any other name...

Oh right, Shakespeare is for renters.

is something, someone getting frustrated? i hope it's not still talking to me, because i couldn't give a rat's ass what it thinks, particularly given its sad lack of reasoning skills. poor thing.

i really hope it's happy. because i'm happy. and happy is good. so is lots of money, sometimes. and we're doing ok there too. i'm sure dashriveledballs will be happy for us there as well. nice sort and all.

It's? Do you have a problem connecting with humans? Is it the tinfoil?
dashriveledballs? Is that a problem you are familiar with?

" i couldn't give a rat's ass what it thinks, particularly given its sad lack of reasoning skills." But yet you returned hours later to respond only to me?

aboutready is being a foul-mouthed obnoxious hypocrite again. Shocking.

Clearly, SWE, I've never been there, you're right. I lived on 21st between 6th and 7th for several years, and on 20th and 7th for a few more years. I took classes at Stella Adler Studios, which is right not far from there and necessitated that I walk through there.

It's seedy. If you wasted your money buying there, good luck getting it back.

"you're still trying to argue that 24th is the UPPER 20s"

No - I never was. Reading comprehension skills! I said that that's where it was most seedy, and that is very close to Madison Park, which ends on 26th Street. Is that clear?

JUICY! Nice to have you back! Maybe The Link will be on that show some day. After all, they focus on overpriced apartments, and that certainly meets the definition.

SWE, I forgot to ask: since Madison Square Park is such a dynamically wunnerful area, HOW'S THE MUSEUM OF SEX, which is right there?

You know, I hear they only put museums of sex in THE BESTEST NABES EVER. This one used to be on Park Avenue in the 80's, on the upper floors of a Rosario Candelabrum building, HAHAHAHA!

Another ridiculously dumb argument by steve. And how many strip clubs are right near 52nd and 8th?

"And how many strip clubs are right near 52nd and 8th?"

Absolutely 0 as far as I know - never been to one.

You obviously don't come into Manhattan very often LICC - must be because that one subway stop is always broken.

Actually, there are several lines that run through LIC, and the 7 is one of the most reliable in the city.

Thanks for more lies and stupid comments steve.

I wouldn't want to live in madison square park, 52nd and 8th, or LICC. I win.

Wad, you win just because of your name.

"there are several lines that run through LIC"

Sure - if you want to walk a thousand blocks, one to the other, or take the GEE TRAIN.

HAHAHAHA!

I just realized cleaning my toilet why they call it the Gee Train: "Gee! Here comes a train!"

HAHAHAHA!

This has gotten ridiculous.

The funny part about all of this is how Steve tries to claim facts supported by how he THINKS things should be.

Buy vs. rent ration, yes, I agree is often very high. Folks misunderstand the true cost on both sides. Got it.
But when Steve starts using "evidence" that is just how he thinks it SHOULD be (and this isn't the first time).

Compare the link sale to the link rental. Fair comparison. But then Steve compares his own building because he thinks is SHOULD cost as much.

Then he goes completely insane. He compares it to neighborhoods that are MUCH more expensive. Btw, last set of Miller Samuel data has Chelsea as 30% more expensive than Clinton. But hey.

Yes, I get that Steve thinks the back end of times square SHOULD be worth as much as the madison square park area, but the rest of the city doesn't. Apples to apples price comparisons on sales vs. sales or rentals vs. rentals aren't even close.

Yes, Steve can say that 1 Madison Park and Chelsea Mercantile SHOULD be the same price as his dump. But, guess, what, that does not a stat make.

Steve's apartment is cheaper than apartment in a neighborhood that is MUCH more expensive. No brainer.
Steve's apartment is cheaper than a beter building across the street. No brainer.

But how he pretends that is rent/buy data is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard Steve say. And thats saying a lot.

"Clearly, SWE, I've never been there, you're right. I lived on 21st between 6th and 7th for several years, and on 20th and 7th for a few more years. I took classes at Stella Adler Studios, which is right not far from there and necessitated that I walk through there."

Steve, you live 5 blocks from Times Square and don't know where that is either, so, yes, absolutely, not surprised at all you have no idea what you are talking about (as usual).

Do you ever get tired?

Do you ever just walk away from an argument because it isn't worth winning?

Have you ever conceded defeat?

Is anyone else ever right?

SWE, you've gone off the deep end. When did I ever say anything about the worth of any particular apartment in Madison Square?

Not ever. Not even once.

I was talking about The Link, which is DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET from where I live, and 2 blocks away from the other market rental I compared it to, Archstone Midtown West.

According to NYC Finance

http://www.ci.nyc.ny.us/html/dof/html/pdf/condo_coop_comps/mncondos2009.pdf

a comparable rental to The Link is Le Premiere, which has a 2-bedroom available for $4,495:

http://www.230west55.com/availabilities.aspx

with a balcony, bigger than The Link apartment:

http://www.230west55.com/layout_availabilities.aspx?apt=B&file_name=f-B_big.gif

That's as far as my comments on the value of apartments went.

With regard to Chelsea Mercantile, from the day it opened I thought it was vastly overpriced, and I stick to that assessment. With respect to Madison Square Park, I said to the west of it was somewhat seedy, and I stick to that assessment. I said to the east is nicer. Yes I know where Baruch College is, it is somewhat further to the east but the students are present all about. That was my point.

Technically, my apartment is not in Clinton, it's in Midtown West. Not that I care where you put it, but that's where it is. Regarding its relative rental values, those have not yet been published as the building is too new.

"The funny part about all of this is how Steve tries to claim facts supported by how he THINKS things should be."

Holy crap, I actually agree with swe.

"Absolutely 0 as far as I know - never been to one."

Try FlashDancers (52nd & 7th), but it probably isn't your cup of tea. It's filled with Russian boobies, not that I would know or anything.

> I was talking about The Link, which is DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET from where I live, and 2 blocks
> away from the other market rental I compared it to, Archstone Midtown West.

While ignoring the rental comp to the link IN THE LINK! You refused to consider the CORRECT comp because you THOUGHT it should be cheaper. Again, exactly what I said... when your comps are comparing A to what you THINK B should be, thats not a comp. Thats made up.

> Technically, my apartment is not in Clinton, it's in Midtown West.

And its the same price zone in Miller Samuel. Its called "Clinton/ Midtown West". And the stats have it as 30% cheaper per square foot than Chelsea.

> With regard to Chelsea Mercantile, from the day it opened I thought it was vastly overpriced, and I
> stick to that assessment.

Yes, we get that you think certain neighborhoods shouldn't be worth what people pay for them, but the market disagrees with you. You might love your times aquare adjacent apartment, and access to Clinton field (if Madison Park is seedy, what's that crack den?) but what you THINK should be the case does not a stat make.

This is the exact mistake you've made for years on your rent/buy calculations.

> "The funny part about all of this is how Steve tries to claim facts supported by how he THINKS
> things should be."
> Holy crap, I actually agree with swe

Yeah, even before steve went off on the deep end, especially with his stock market stuff, when I mostly agreed with him, I disagreed with him on his rent/buy analysis. Not saying I didn't think the ratio was off, but his logic just went into nonsense place.

There was one instance where he said such and such ratio is X/Y for something specific, and I said "oh really, the price on Y is now ???, where did you see that, I'm interested". And his answer was "well, thats what it should be if the ratios are". I wish I could find it but its not an obvious search... but it was hillarious.... and complete circular logic.

> Do you ever get tired?

Lots of strength and I'm a *very* fast typist.

> Do you ever just walk away from an argument because it isn't worth winning?

Well, no argument on this board is "worth" winning. There is no prize. There is nothing to gain. But since just about every regular poster on this board argues (particularly the ones who complain most about arguing). We're already here, we're already wasting time on this - and complaining about time wasting is just a hypocritical way to waste time - so complaining about how much time OTHERS waste is wacky. Anybody pretending they're regular posters here for some real value is nuts... hence the hypocrisy of the regular complainers.

I would enact a SE rule that if swe and I agree on something then it has to be fact. No need to check sources, references, or anything else. It's just a plain old fact.

I'll throw in the broker exception, of course, as it does help their business... to a fault for the nasty ones.

"I would enact a SE rule that if swe and I agree on something then it has to be fact. No need to check sources, references, or anything else. It's just a plain old fact."

Seconded.

;-)

JM, same here. swe and I can go at each other on real estate, but in political discussions we are usually on the same page. And also when it comes to steve's insanity.

"I would enact a SE rule that if swe and I agree on something then it has to be fact."

Why do you need SE? You think everything you say is fact anyway.

SWE - when did I say you used the "wrong" comp on the Link? Not ever, yet again, not once. When choose a comp I hadn't seen the one at Link.

What I did say, however, is that the one at the Link seems high - and that is borne out not only by the rental listings I picked, but by the NYC Dept. of Finance itself.

You are really getting very upset over a) nothing at all, and b) nothing that I said.

But, in fact, you're talking out of your ass (since you made me look there). According to MS,

10011

Chelsea / Village 10011 average price per square foot is $1,228

Midtown West 10019 is $1,813.

And 1 Madison Park is in 10010, where the average price per square foot is $1,196.

I currently live in 10019. I used to live in 10011. Your Promised Land is much cheaper than both of them.

Because it's slimy.

Now shut up.

Case closed.

http://realestate2.nytimes.com/community/manhattanMarketData.asp

Juicy: "FlashDancers": Are you sure it's on 52nd Street, because what's there is the Novotel. I think it's on Broadway.

SWE, JM, (LICC): Let's just review the FACTS:

SW: "Yes, Steve can say that 1 Madison Park and Chelsea Mercantile SHOULD be the same price as his dump. But, guess, what, that does not a stat make. Steve's apartment is cheaper than apartment in a neighborhood that is MUCH more expensive. No brainer. Steve's apartment is cheaper than a beter building across the street. No brainer."

FACTS:

Chelsea / Village 10011 average price per square foot is $1,228

Midtown West 10019 is $1,813.

And 1 Madison Park is in 10010, where the average price per square foot is $1,196.

I currently live in 10019. I used to live in 10011. SW's Promised Land is much cheaper than both of them.

Because it's slimy.

Now shut up.

Case closed.

Oh - and I stand by my stock market picks, as well. Shares today are being led by homebuilders.

HAHAHAHA!

Now let's see: banks are being re-regulated - no effect on the stock market.

Greece needs a bailout - no effect on the stock market.

Portugal is next - no effect on the stock market.

Home builders skyrocket based on a 27% increase in new housing starts coming on the heels of the lowest number of new home sales ever, and an expiring tax break.

Unemployment 10% and sticking - no effect on the stock market.

Stocks up 70% since March 2009 - longest upturn in stocks since 1987.

Stocks up 4% in April 2010 alone.

Government money flooding the market.

Interest rates going up.

Tax rates going up.

Overnight LIBOR 50% above where it was last year at this time.

Banks not lending - making money on trading alone.

Stock market volume very low.

Cramer says we're headed to Dow 12,000.

And you believe that this rally is going to last?

I don't.

"Oh - and I stand by my stock market picks, as well. Shares today are being led by homebuilders. HAHAHAHA!"

Yes, keep standing by, steve. Down up, what 1000, since you said it wouldn't go anywhere? (and that was just last time).

ROTFL.

> Stocks up 70% since March 2009 - longest upturn in stocks since 1987.

And right at the beginning of that, you told us you were SELLING. Nice job, steve!

Please, keep standing by your picks, we need the laugh!

"And 1 Madison Park is in 10010, where the average price per square foot is $1,196."

Ok, now we're really getting funny. 10010 includes a cutout for MSP specifically, absolutely... and then the rest of it is the EAST SIDE. The exact part that steve said was the GOOD side!

I love it!

Yes, steve, you finally figured out that PETER COOPER VILLAGE is cheaper!

You cracked the case!

rotfl.

http://www.unhp.org/crg/indy-maps-manhatzip.html

jeez, steve, don't let the facts get in away of our amusement!

omg, i love it... steve was LYING with his facts...

Zip Code Neighborhood Median Sales Price
10010 Gramercy/Flatiron 975000
10011 Chelsea / Village 830000
10019 Midtown West 799000

> I currently live in 10019. I used to live in 10011. SW's Promised Land
> is much cheaper than both of them.

Steve, you should repeat yourself a few more times... your lying is hillarious!

Even with your "fancy easy side" included, its 20% more expensive!

rotfl

> Because it's slimy.

Yes, I agree that "times square adjacent" is slimy.

> Now shut up.
> Case closed.

Agreed.

Once again, YOU LOST.

still having fun with your link Steve...

Zip Code Neighborhood Median Sales Price Media PSF
10010 Gramercy/Flatiron 975000 789
10011 Chelsea / Village 830000 662
10019 Midtown West 799000 657

Nonsense.
But I don't think that the predictions of quick price declines have come true or will come true.
I suspect that the real NYC declines will start soon when some of the older condos, e.g. in Lincoln Center, owned as pied-à-terres or as investment properties, start to go on the market by owners who realize that while they are covering their carrying costs (because they were bought quite some time ago), they money is needed elsewhere or the rental income isn't what they got in 2007 vintage leases, or that maybe they should start getting out to start planning better for retirement, or that they see taxes increasing (these are apartments without abatements).
So starting to have more volume in one good Manhattan area, this starts to expand and ...

Nonsense.
But I don't think that the predictions of quick price declines have come true or will come true.
I suspect that the real NYC declines will start soon when some of the older condos, e.g. in Lincoln Center, owned as pied-à-terres or as investment properties, start to go on the market by owners who realize that while they are covering their carrying costs (because they were bought quite some time ago), they money is needed elsewhere or the rental income isn't what they got in 2007 vintage leases, or that maybe they should start getting out to start planning better for retirement, or that they see taxes increasing (these are apartments without abatements).
So starting to have more volume in one good Manhattan area, this starts to expand and ...