What about small children and high outdoor spaces?

Why worry yourself with this? You won't sleep at night if you buy an apartment where your children won't be safe.

I'm mulling this too. If we're buying an apartment for the next 10 - 20 years, outdoor space would be a fantstic asset. Has anyone seen solutions which could work on both small but also larger (1,500 sqft) terraces?

I had a rental with a 900 SF terrace, and the people who lived their before me had kids. I also dog sat for a rambunctious pitt bull or two and left them alone outside. No jumping off the ledge occurred. The barrier was too high for small kids or dogs to jump over. Now a TEN year old probably could have if he wanted to (it would never be a girl doing such stupid things I think).

The building let my neighbors build a six foot wooden fence (solid wall of wood) between our two terraces. I suppose you could build that all the way around if you really wanted to. Instead of the fenceposts going into the ground, they went into concrete-filled flower pots.

Owner of this apartment has 3 small kids...

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/690872-condop-215-east-96th-street-yorkville-new-york

>Now a TEN year old probably could have if he wanted to (it would never be a girl doing such stupid things I think).

You have experience with girls?

We had a terrace in our last place and with two little kids, it made me constantly nervous to the point where I worried when we had a sitter. We otherwise enjoyed the place, but if you are nervous now, think about it seriously. For the first three years I had major buter's remorse. Most buildings in Manhattan will not allow you to add anything.

Too dangerous for whom? Make sure your insurance covers injuries to people at street level when they're beaned by something your kids dropped/threw off the terrace.

If the building allows, you can try Bamboo Fencing. Strong, lightweight, cheap, lets air through, and easily harnesses to metal rails with wire and plastic ties.

Can you dead-bolt the door to the terrace so it only opens with a key? That would be my solution.

I'm extremely nervous about letting any kids under 13 on our roof terrace unsupervised. We do have sturdy metal railings that meet requirements, but it would be very easy for a child to climb over to one of the neighboring roofs, which do not.

Even during parties of adults, I like to have someone I trust "stationed" on the roof terrace just to make sure no one gets any brilliant ideas. I'm lucky that my building is 6' higher than all but the immediate neighbor's, so we don't get people running across roofs, but I see roof parties spread out over 5-6 neighboring roofs all the time on the properties across the way.

No child should be left unsupervised on outdoor space.

if an adult gets hurt while indulging in idiot behavior, too bad (except they'll probably sue as if it weren't their fault)

That being said, it is also important to check the height of the railings (and their spacing) around the terrace.

good reason to be concerned. concern for your children and concern for their friends as your kids age. I'm more worried about when they are 15 hanging with their friends when your not in the house. Impluse supression develops late in some teens. That being said, I grew up with outdoor space and in the summers I was exposed to lots of danger from a house directly on the water. Lots of places to fall, lots of places to drown.

I probably should have called social services on my folks but...I love danger.

Well, here's one solution - albeit not an aesthetically pleasing one:

http://farm2.staticflickr.com/1086/1474650283_59888154d4_z.jpg

Walpurgis,
That photo has a williamsburg look to it. I've seen these cage type structures on housing built for orthodox Jews. I simply thought that they a spiderman phobia. Maybe this is the rabbinical answer to outdoor space and kids and danger.

They have a spiderman phobia.

Indeed, Falcogold - but it all stems from an unfortunate misconstrual, when a prominent Crown Heights Rebbe's wife warned him to stay away from Black widows...

RW: "Don't you ever let them near you! Once bitten, you'll never be the same & I'll lose you forever!"

R: "So vaht do you vant me to do?!? Build ah cage maybe?!? So I'm trepped like ah boid?!?" Nu?!? So then you'll be heppy?!?" EH?!? ACCHH!"

Oy...

Walpurgis...The picture you posted, which all would agree is not aesthetically pleasing, may have the desired effect of turning a balcony into a "catio" which allows an indoor cat to safely enjoy fresh air and observe bird life and other urban flora/fauna such as exists in that area. It unfortunately too easy for any cat to jump over a 5' fence or squeeze between the posts in pursuit of whatever it sees. Plus cats can "fly" quicker than a person can catch them. So unless you are willing to put up this type of structure the rules should be: NO CHILDREN OR DOGS ON BALCONY (OR TERRACE) UNSUPERVISED. NO CATS ON BALCONY PERIOD. I support the notion that people with kids or cats should have balcony doors with locks that require keys--or go for the Spiderman cage look.

i had that kind of cage for my kids on my terrace. was not pretty, but served the purpose.

@ab_11218 - thats your problem.. should've caged the kids, not the terrace.

Kids have a healthy fear of heights. Cant always live in a bubble.
Flip side of course is, what would Eric Clapton do?

Why, write a song, of course!

truthskr10, that's just a very sad reference.

I had a fourth floor terrace when our daughter was five. The cats probably would have survived the fall, but probably not the kid. But she was a very cautious kid who was never home alone. And the door was VERY rarely opened, one cat got out once but howled and got back in almost immediately. Still, I didn't really like the set up.

NativeRestless: I couldn't concur with you more. As much as I've always wanted a terrace or balcony, the desire went away with the addition of my two dogs.

for the cost of outdoor space, one can buy additional indoor space--much better value and utility--and safer.

I have a terrace which i use mostly to clip my toe nails.

So everyone below has the privilege of being caught in a clippings shower. So very thoughtful...& hygenic.

Are some at least fungus, so the unsuspecting passerby at least has some variety?

But WHAT ABOUT HIGH CHILDREN AND SMALL OUTDOOR SPACES?

i had nasty storm windows enclosing the terrace. they were ugly and made the space useless. having your kids run around in fresh air is better than keeping them caged at home.

if i had the money and the coop would've permitted, i would get the sliding glass walls that are popular in europe.

Alan THAT is a particularly dangerous (or tempting depending on how child intolerant one happens to be that day) circumstance.

AH, as long as they are tethered securely I sat it's all good.

F me. Say, not sat. I'm not used to the mini's keyboard yet.

As a last resort, you can always hook the tykes up to carefully pre-measured bungee cords, giving them an exhilarating, yet safe experience in the event of a misstep. Wheeeeee!!!!!

if you're nervous, don't even think twice, don't buy a place with outdoor space. My sixteen year old jumped from the roof of our building onto our terrace once because he was locked out and knew that the terrace door was open. My daughter and her friends used it to smoke, an unsafe number of people ( weight) on a small space. In NYC the furniture outdoors gets FILTHY. Most of the time, it's not private.
I say outdoor ground level space is better, but that wood make me worry about rats and mice. Buy a lesser apartment and rent a cheap country house upstate.