Barrow Street PriceChop

If it sold tomorrow for $1.7MM, that would still represent fairly rapid appreciation. Whether the owner will make a profit, a loss or neither after transaction costs is relevant only with regard to the economics of bubble-style flipping. Also keep in mind that any profit (or loss) is a leveraged yield on a downpayment and closing costs of perhaps $250K total, not the full $1.5MM purchase price. So even a $50-100K profit is still a good return in two years.

Very pretty but it's really a glorified 1 bed/1.5 bath with a loft. Pricing it at $2.159 ($1800 sq/foot!) was crazy even during the height of the bubble days. I wouldn't use this as an example of an apartment having trouble to sell - more of a seller who should lay off the meds.

Seems like prices are less sticky on the downside than I thought, though even at $1.5 million it's vastly overpriced. When you take real estate commissions, conveyance taxes, mortgage recording tax, mansions tax, closing costs, etc., into account, amortize them over the length of the loan, you have, my friends, either a break-even or a net loss situation.

I guess if you were a Wall Street hotshot Master of the Universe & just lost your job, you gotta bail fast and head for Charlotte.

I said 2004 prices. We're already halfway there!

West81st, do you ever venture above 100th?

West81st, The take-away point from Apt_Boy's post is not about any profit the seller may make if the listing sells at the 1 May price, but rather about the fact that the listing price has changed so dramatically in a few months, in what is unquestionably a prime Manhattan neighborhood. Clearly, when the property was originally listed, the seller thought s/he would walk away with a lot more than $50-100K, no?

cherrywood, but the seller could not have expected that place to appreciate over $1M since 2006, or over 65%. Or shouldn't have.

The hundreds of screaming tranny's hanging outside that apartment every night add tons of curb appeal....

That went through my mind, as well. Until they close that Path station - which they won't - the dregs of society shall forever occupy that corner.

I was ready to be underwhelmed when I clicked over to it but it is a really nice apartment. That said, it is no 1200 sq. ft. Probably 900-950 actual, another 90 of terrace.

I wonder if the guy bought it like that or put $'s in after it was bought.

Major Take-aways from post:

1) Price appreciation does not equal the numbers pitched by all of the RE firms in their "State of the Market" reports

2) If sold for $1.7mm (which is a far from a given):

Original Closing Costs approx. 2% = $30k
Current Sales Cost approx. 8% = $136k

Total Transaction Costs = $166k

Leaving a profit of $34k

Not to mention other assorted costs of ownership and any $$ they put into the apt. for improvements and we are talking a break-even at best

and to West81st, there is a cost to that leveraged yield you speak of, it is interest payments on the leverage, so that "leverage" of $1.2mm @ 5% over 2 years cost $155k in interest

Something tells me Apt Boy is stevehjx. The same style oozed out. The thread should brace itself for thousands of convoluted made-up formulas with every math symbol imaginable. Amen.

Apt_boy: You are absolutely right about the cost of leverage. It's hard to be sure how that affects yield, since we don't know the rate, the seller's tax situation or whether this is an investment property vs. primary residence - and if it's a primary residence, what his alternatives were two years ago in the rental market. (You have to consider some portion of the net financing cost on a residence as a cost of shelter rather than a pure carrying cost for real estate speculation.) I just meant to point out that the investment is leveraged, not to suggest that the gain on the down payment is pure profit; thanks for clarifying.

Stakan: Yes, we're up there quite frequently. We have lots of family and friends in the low 100's from Riverside to east of Broadway. It would take a great deal to lure us up there to live, but only because we're so tied to PS9. At the moment, the price difference between the 80s and the 100s isn't all that big.

Nope, Apt_Boy is not me. I only post under my name. But perhaps stakan can explain what's wrong with what Apt_Boy wrote, rather merely state he can't multiply.

W81, you're right, but the real cost of the leverage would be the difference between the interest paid and the rent paid on a comparable apartment, since the owners would have to live somewhere.

West81st: there are very few open houses on W 100s. I'm interested only in the area east of Broadway and close to Central Park; planning to check out those open houses. If it were not for the school, what's your take on west 106 and 105? Jewish Home and Hospital is about to build the whole block there on Columbus. Also, I saw quite a few new quality restaurants, with European owners/chefs. I'm just reluctant to think that I will have missed the wave if I don't buy there.

Staken- I am just a I-Banker trying to find myself after being caught up in all of the firings...it gets a little boring working from home and not having all those interns in their thongs to look at all day...so I resort to posting here to keep myself from jumping off my roof

Apt Boy: Are you on PC (as opposed to Mac)? That bottom dash in your name makes me think so.
Anyway, getting back to the area I asked about...

stakan: Not meaning to hijack a Village thread, but to answer your question - no, I don't know much about that area, or even what to call it. I guess it's Manhattan Valley, but as you approach Amsterdam, I think you're getting into Morningside Heights. That's a neighborhood with some beautiful architecture and a ton of potential - so much, in fact, that UWS realtors have been touting it as the next big thing... for about thirty years. High risk, high reward. I don't know how much the Jewish Home & Hospital really helps the neighborhood. I think that kind of presence is a stabilizing influence, but not a dynamic change agent. It does very little for retail and nightlife, for example, and nothing for schools.

BTW, when you're up there, I recommend the pizza at V&T on Amsterdam north of 110th. Just close your eyes when the roaches scamper across the table.

Regarding dregs of society and the Christopher St. Path station: Curbed had reported that parking would be banned across the street so hustlers couldn't operate between the cars. Last time I was there the cars were still around. Anyone know what happened to that plan?

west81st: I that pizza is really good. Now, the former cancer hospital that is now 455 CPW 9W 106) really did a lot for the prices in that area. The Jewish Home & Hospital have some retail signed up, I believe. Also, I discovered a restaurant I'm planning to go to again. Called Voza, on Columbus between 106 and 107. They ask for reservation now! Also, I looked at the comps in that area for the last 5 years, and the prices seem to have tripled. Well, those open houses Sunday will fill in the blanks, hopefully.
Re Morningside Heights: it starts above Columbia U, (w 113).

Stakan: Did the Jewish Home get approval for the condo part of the redevelopment plan? Have they broken ground on it? Also, since the condo is supposed to fund the rebuilding of the nursing home, I wonder what the impact of tight credit and a slow market will be on the whole plan. I haven't been watching. For all I know, the thing may already be ten stories high.

OK, we have now officially hijacked a Village thread.

west81st: they did get approval. Regarding the hight: there was a fight with the community boars that shaved 1 floor off the top but I believe the condo thing will be 17 stories. And from what I know, they secured the financing a long time ago, so the fight with the community board was the only hurdle. They tell everyone they'll be breaking ground in September. The shops on that block are already emptying out.
3 years ago I almost bought a brownstone between w 106 and 105 on Manhattan Avenue, therefore discovering that this avenue really exists. I was procrastinating and someone bought it from under me for I believe 41.7M. Well, that whole block is landmarked now and the houses go for around $3M. I'm re-investigating that area to make sure I don't make the same mistake.

nice enough apt, probably spend less money on polishing those appliances though. did someone take a dump in the lounge ( what are those things )

does not look like 1200, looks smaller. saw a similar PH in the neighboorhood on a much better street for less which was actually a two bed.