OK to make an 'offer' on a rental?

Totally fine to do. But, don't be surprised if the owner says "no way." Depends on the current market and location, but who knows, you may get lucky.

Make an offer. The stated price is usually only an asking price and is jacked up for that reason.

Are they more likely to accept an offer below asking price of the rental if you ask to sign a 2- or 3-year lease?

Well the worst thing that happens is they say no. If they say no the first time change the terms with the longer term. It is a negotiation, do whatever you want.

Yeah, I'm just wondering if negotiation ever actually happens in the NYC rental market, given the ridiculously low vacancy rate and how fast things move.

Yes, negotiatins happen and should happen. But do your research about the market and comps, and use that to develop and support a reasonable position.
3-3 year leases, depends - that may not be attractive at all to a large landlord, but it may be somewhat attractive to certain landlords.

negotiations ...
2-3 year leases

If you are going to make an offer, do it properly. Have the application complete, all your documents ready and tell them you'll sign leases immediately after approval. I still would not expect a good outcome.

It is acceptable to ask, especially if it has been on the market for awhile or longer than the average listing.

See how long it has been on the market for. If its a brand new listing the owners might either say no or drag it out to see if theres anyone else willing to pay full asking first. You risk losing it to someone else though if it is priced fairly...

If the listing is through a rental broker, is it the broker's responsibility to convey such an 'offer' to the owner/landlord?

Is it advantageous to make such an offer before submitting an application or after being approved/before signing the lease?

* yes
* make the offer first. applying implies you have agreed to the price. even more obvious to do it before if you have to pay an application fee

Yes, it is the broker's responsibility. However, many rental brokers are so sleazy and lazy these days, they will try to convince you that it's not worth it, or, at least, not worth it to them. A GOOD agent will work FOR you. Such a person is hard to find.

I am with crescent22 in terms of the order of things. Make the offer first, but make sure that before you do you have whatever you need to make yourself look ready and "attractive." This could include things like a past landlord's reference/recommendation letter in hand, the first page of last year's tax return ready, copy of a W2, even a credit report, which is entirely fine and valid for you to do yourself. Many landlords (especially small/individual ones) are quite impressed if you come bearing your own completed credit report. It saves them the time and hassle, and shows that you are on top of and aware of your finances. Show up with all this in a nice folder, and say: "Here you go, feel free to take a look at all of this. I am ready to rent the apartment at $xxxx per month, right here, right now."

**All this being said, it IS possible to do an application, at least, with all but the signature, first, and then negotiate. It really depends on how hot the apartment is, or, at least how much in demand you think it is.

THe landlord relies on the credit report and we should expect him or her to accept whatever printed out document someone shows up with?

I guess it depends on how trusting a landlord is. If you (someone) wants to take the time to create and falsify a very official and very detailed 5+ page document (which most people don't even know what is contained in it), then the LL can decide at his/her own discretion. Not a good idea for say an online transaction or something similar, but if I was in such a position, and I met with the applicant, they seemed upstanding and decent, and had all the accompanying paperwork to go along with it and back it up, then I might very well accept the credit report. Keep in mind: a credit report primarily only reports credit. A person can have a 800 score and may still not want to pay his rent down the line (or on time). Similarly, if someone only uses debit cards (young people perhaps), a credit report will yield very little. That's why a responsible landlord will request other forms of proof.

And op, while you have been deliberating, someone whose more than likely rented the apartment you like.

And jimmyboy demonstrates why he's greyed out!

Maybe all the landlords YOU deal with (all 2 of them) wouldn't accept it, but other (decent) ones will. It's happened to me. Plus two other friends I have. So back to the circles of sleazy LLs and scum agents that you belong to -- that's what you know, not what others know.

(you might also want to check that POS autocorrect you're using -- it's making you look like even more of an idiot).

Nope doesn't happen, not In Manhattan. Perhaps in qnz, though I wouldn't know. Reason being it's all professional owners also run housing court checks. Twat.

Funny, all 3 examples I gave were Manhattan rentals. But hey, you say "nope" so it must be so! My personal experience is trumped by your "nope"!

[Keep trying noob, I'll keep schooling you ;-) ]

noob is funny actually. since I have been posting for three years more than you have. sonya, I will make this simple. I have seen thousands of lease transactions. all of them had credit run by either the owner or a third party. none had the tenant provide them. this is for the aforesaid landlord tenant screening. it's actually quaint when hayseeds like you and your friend show up with a "my free credit report" thing, but it does them no good.

you are proving yourself a liar. and now you are grey too, so fuck off to whatever little cave you live in.

further, have you ever read any other advice anywhere (provided by people qualified that is) on running your own credit for a rental in nyc?

When I said noob, I referred to your actual being, (and knowledge displayed here), not post count here on a message board. I will concede though, yes, you have me beat by the number of inane posts here on SE. Congrats (a big success in your world). And the only thing that's funny is this: "I have seen thousands of lease transactions." Ha! Yeah, knowing you and how you do business, you'd need to live to 100 to see that many. Stop pretending that you actually have clients. As such, you've just proved yourself a liar (wait, you've done that here before, just a bit, no?? LOL!).

so in your special world, how do you prove to a ny property owner that you have never been to landlord tenant court? that you aren't a terrorism watch list? that you aren't a pedophile, or a convicted felon? Those are all things a real background check provide answers to. do the "credit reports" you have ran provide that kind of information? do they call and verify employment, like property background checks? I wouldn't want to live in a building that didn't do proper tenant screening. that would mean someone like you could end up being my neighbor.

your advice is actually damaging to those that might listen to it. you should really stop.

crescent22

1 day ago

Posts: 690

Member since: Apr 2008

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* yes
* make the offer first. applying implies you have agreed to the price. even more obvious to do it before if you have to pay an application fee

This is the exact opposite of what I would recommend to anyone wishing to successfully negotiate a reduction in their rent with a ny landlord. applying shows serious intent by the prospective tenant. money need not change hands. the application is contingent upon the price being met. simple.

if, a potential tenant, you can't be bothered to put your best put forward by showing your ability to meet the monthly rent obligation and your seriousness about the apartment by having your paperwork organized, the owners will see right through it. they, like me, after all make their living in the real estate business. you clowns do not.

First of all, we are talking about a CREDIT CHECK, not a "background check" or whatever else you want. That's what I said: one can present their own credit check to be prepared, and then the LL can use his/her discretion from there (read above, genius). A credit check reports scores, bank accounts with institutions that report to credit bureaus, creditors, past addresses on file (whether they were the renter or not). It doesn't tell you if someone is a pedophile.

Now, if you want to do a background check (criminal history report), then by all means, go ahead. THAT will show felonies, etc., such as what you are talking about. But to imply that EVERY landlord in NYC does this is not genuine, it is ignorant, and shows your lack of experience in this field. Let me repeat: Yes, millions of renters in NYC successfully rent all the time without a LL checking to see if they're a terrorist.

Additionally, you have now said the opposite of what I and the other knowledgeable people in this thread have recommended -- also showing how lousy you seem to be at doing this. What you are recommending is not only not helpful, but very detrimental to anyone looking for help and advice in this area. I urge everyone reading posts by "jim_hones10" to ignore what he says, as it is incorrect and misguided (as are most of his posts from the last two years). Jimmyboy, you should really brush up on your facts before you start trying to "help."

Millions Sonya, really?

The check I mentioned above is sop for nearly every landlord in town. They are business people interested in prottecting their investment. You are an internet troll

And Sonya, look at your post where you mention your nice folder with your documents and credit check. Aren't you suggesting the exact same thing that I am?

"Millions Sonya, really?"
Depends on the time frame we're talking about. So yes, "millions" is definitely acceptable.

"The check I mentioned above is sop for nearly every landlord in town."
Really? Prove it.
(I guess you don't have to though really -- you said "nearly." Hence, what I said initially is correct).

----

No, you are (now) talking about a background check/criminal history report. Moreover, you are said that "there isn't a ll in this city that will accept a potential renters credit report." But now you've backpeddled and said "nearly." I am talking only about a credit check. Moreover, I suggested bringing one to show readiness, responsibility, and good faith, while the owner can ultimately decide what to do next, and what documentation he wants.

Stop trolling this thread. All you're doing is making yourself look more and more uninformed with each post.

How many years would you say it takes for millions of people to rent apartments in nyc? Do you know how many rent in Manhattan in a month? I do.

Call an owner like Related tomorrow (as an example) and ask if they perform a back ground check like I described.

Yes I suppose outer borough slum lords may not perform these checks. As I said, I wouldn't want to rent from one of them. I guess it's important for someone like you to find the most common denominator.

I think coming with your own credit report is a good idea if making an offer below asking... to show that they'll want you as a tenant. Of course you'll still have to fill out their application and submit to their credit check, but having your own excellent credit report on hand before filling anything out, and making an offer, might help budge the price down..

If you know how many people rent in a month then you can easily find out how long it takes for a million. When you come to your answer, you can come back here and say to me: "yes, you were right. Millions."

So, you think if I call 1 brokerage house and ask if they do a background check, that means every renter in NYC has had their background checked? How about if I call 5? Does THAT mean everyone has gotten a background check? (wow, didn't pass 4th grade, did ya?).

And there are two things you must realize: my statement was about CREDIT checks, so before you go bunching up your panties about something else you can't handle, first try to argue your point about that. (what? slowly now... CREDIT checks). And the second thing to realize is that we're not talking about what you'd want. I never made any assertion as to what jimmyboy likes or doesn't. Your personal wishes and single anecdotes don't hold any water here. As such, another fail for jimmyboy.

wiivile, exactly.

Like myself and others here (besides bozo the clown jimmyboy) have said, bringing the more pieces of information the better. Show whatever you can to put yourself in a good light. Then the landlord can take it or leave it, or any part of it. All this does is show that you want to move along quickly and smoothly, which, as it turns out, is exactly what LLs are after.

It would take nearly 20 years for one million apartments to rent Sonya let alone millions. You are like a little kid making things up. And Related isn't a brokerage toots, they are one of the largest owners in the city. Like the time warner center. You thought Related was a brokerage but claim to know nyc real estate?
If you are trying to prove that there may be a landlords out there that doesn't do due diligence and screen tenants than I suppose you must be right. Again though, through thousands of transactions I have yet to see it happen. You claim you have seen our happen three times but you do the way you behave here makes your seem full of shit. Just another troll.

Wow, you come up with some 4th grade math only to find out what I said was true. Congrats. And yes, over the past 20 years, many people have rented without the LL checking if the potential tenant is a terrorist.

And on the second point, you say I'm right again (sorry, I did mis-type about Related, I was on my way out the door and I completely realize that). Still doesnt change what we're talking about or my point. Also keep in mind that you say you've seen "thousands" but everything you've said has turned out to be bullshit. So I call bullshit on your self-touting claim. To get back to the original issue (credit checks), no one in this thread agrees with you, so take your misinformation and bad "advice" elsewhere.

How do you know who agrees? You are the only one responding. You and the millions of people who leased apartments with no credit check going back 20 years. If you had any idea how ignorant that made you seen to anyone with industry knowledge you would have quit already. That you haven't shows how horribly clueless you are.

I know from reading the above responses. You should try it. (Only the past few have been me and you).

I didn't say without a credit check. Get your shit straight. A credit check is not a background check. (i actually said bring a credit report early, genius). You're mixing things up. You obviously don't know the facts, which are apparent to everyone else here (probably why we are all agreeing, while you are just blabbing).

You are a troll.
Owners don't run credit checks. The duo run back ground checks. Which is why I stated from the beginning your idea was worthless. In fact it's potentially harmful since your score can be impacted negativeky impacted by too many inquiries.
But hey, millions have done it right Sonya?

Yes, millions have, you said so yourself (after you realized what I taught you). And yes, owners (or an agency acting on their behalf) do run credit checks, especially when it comes to individual landlords, who own maybe just 1 or 2 buildings, or just a condo apartment, for example. You obviously don't know this, or have any experience with it. You dont know the basics. You have demonstrated that. You may be a moron, but you don't have to take my idea. wiivile and others will (and have) and have rented successfully, ahead of people who come unprepared. I guess you are one of ones. Who knows, maybe someone I have known beat you to the punch in the past, LOL!

Sonya_D

"Yes, millions of renters in NYC successfully rent all the time without a LL checking to see if they're a terrorist."

Millions rent in NYC all the time? How many millions have rented in NYC this year so far?

If nearly a million leases took almost twenty years (based on absorbtion rate) how many would your millions take? 40? 50?

in the hear and now, a real tenant screening does more than check credit. but you say millions have rented with no vetting whatsover.

right.

Ah, still harping on the "millions" thing... Well, it makes sense, losers with nothing to back themselves up will often avoid the main subject (in this case,credit checks) and try to nitpick a single word until blue in the face. Meh.

"How many millions have rented in NYC this year so far?"
Don't know, don't care. I never made any statement about 2013's rental frequency. Nor about 2012, or any other particular year. Nor do I care how long it would take, nor did I make any statement about any time frame.

"a real tenant screening does more than check credit."
I never said it didn't. In fact, I never said anything about a tenant screening. You need more practice in keeping your shit straight.

"you say millions have rented with no vetting whatsover."
Please point to where I said this. Put up or shut up.

You're looking absolutely ridiculous. Keep it up noob.

Educated offers made on demonstrably overpriced units, supported by successful recent transactions on comparable units in the same neighborhood or building ("comparable" meaning significantly similar...walk-up for walk-up, doorman for doorman, no remarkable difference in views/transit vicinity/amenities) go through with well-qualified applicants semi-often in slower seasons. Offers from applicants who spend hours/days attempting to under-pay on an accurately/under-priced rental, while aggressively putting on a narcissistic song-and-dance about how great their credit is and how financially sound they are are never well-received. I have never worked with any Owner with property in Manhattan that has given a verbal or written preemptive "OK" on an offered price before seeing a full app package...full app package includes credit+background report run by Owner/Owner's Agent. All Owners I have ever worked with have said, "I might be able to do it because of ABC, and if XYZ checks out we can go with it, but I have to see all paperwork and I need to run credit and background before I make any offer of tenancy, full asking or not." Offers should definitely always be supported in some way by the product or the market (or lack thereof) for it at a specific time...and offers should always be graciously presented. I have never met an Owner who has appreciated or approved an applicant who refuses to complete the application process while simultaneously telling the Owner, "I do not want to pay the rent you are asking. I know the market better than you, and I also have excellent credit and plenty of money...but I am not committing to you enough to have you run my credit without you telling me that I can start this relationship off by bossing you around." An aggressive/unsupported/arrogant-natured offer is a failure from the start because it begins the would-be relationship on the wrong foot. A well-supported offer with utmost willingness to provide anything necessary? Different story - usually one with a happier ending. We do have to present all offers to the Owner at all times, but we also have to be transparent with full fiduciary responsibility in an exclusive agreement. That full responsibility comes with having to honestly and accurately disclose an applicant's behavior during the process - good, bad, or in between. Brokers may be reluctant to "dump a deal" on an Owner's desk without bracing the applicant for what may come of the submission. We may have worked with the Owner for several years and know their red flags or pet peeves. We are not all "scummy" or "skeezy". Enough with the broker hate, it is trite.

Prime, TOTALLY agree with your statement, and it goes along with EXACTLY what I've been saying the whole time. I NEVER said that a self-supplied credit report was all that was needed to get the deal done (as jimmyboy would like to believe, see quote below); its just to show a prepared renter has all his ducks in a row. Jimmyboy can't understand the basics (re credit report, background check, criminal history report) and he still hasn't put up the proof when he made this statement:

"you say millions have rented with no vetting whatsover."
(and so I returned: "Please point to where I said this. Put up or shut up.")
He did in fact shut up for a bit, not able to find where I said that, but hey, I guess you can't keep a good troll down. One that has been on ignore by the entire community for... years maybe?

"have you figured out yet how long it would take "millions" "
-jimmyboy
"It would take nearly 20 years for one million apartments to rent "
-jimmyboy

This is obviously an important issue to you (compared to no one else, who recognizes it for what it is). I don't care so much about this expression. Based on the two above quotes, I urge you to take it up further with yourself.

@PrimeProperty:
Although you only have 3 posts here, I agree that not all agents are "scummy" or "skeezy". There are some very good ones out there, and they should get the respect they deserve. Just like with ANY profession, there are the good ones, like you seem to be, and then those one the other side, the jimmyboys of the world.

jim_hones10

8 days ago

Posts: 3236

Member since: Jan 2010

If you are going to make an offer, do it properly. Have the application complete, all your documents ready and tell them you'll sign leases immediately after approval. I still would not expect a good outcome.

what you mean twat, is that everyone is saying exactly what I said, first, over a week ago. of course if I said a you'd say b and claim that you said a all along when you didn't think anyone else was looking. we have, of course, an accurate record here or who said what. your sole contribution was "bring a self ran credit report" which the two professionals here (me and prime) scoffed as being useless. not to mention the fact that you don't seem to understand that to an owner, a credit report/background check are one in the same.

but you and your millions must be right, because you say so.

Wow, idiocy abound!

The record (see my quoting your words above. you don't even have to go up that far!) shows what's what. Not what you say it is. Show me where Prime "scoffed" at bringing one's own credit report. Put up or shut up. (closest would be this: "Offers from applicants who spend hours/days attempting to under-pay on an accurately/under-priced rental, while aggressively putting on a narcissistic song-and-dance about how great their credit is and how financially sound they are are never well-received.") Which is TOTALLY true, something I NEVER denied, and something YOU never said. It also is completely compatible with bringing one's own CR.

"that to an owner, a credit report/background check are one in the same."
I don't care about "to an owner." The owner ain't the one presenting their info in the best light. Let the owner do whatever the hell they want. Fact is fact: one report is one thing, the other is another thing. They are even generated by entirely different outfits. Different enterprises entirely. You pay a fee for a 3rd party to compile everything, BECAUSE they are different and seperate, genius. But nice try in DESPERATELY trying to backpeddle and lump all the reports together, which has NOTHING to do with what I said, simply to make your half-assed point look somewhat legit.

So Jimmyboy gets schooled again. Just like I've done multiple times, here and in other threads.

The owner gets to decide if you live in his building or not whore.

But you and the other few million folks who don't even need to have your credit run know better.

Again, some reading this through from the beginning sees the validity of my points. You even affirmed then by agreeing with other posters who said similar things.

"The owner gets to decide if you live in his building or not whore."
Never said they didn't. (point to where I said this).

"But you and the other few million folks who don't even need to have your credit run know better."
Never said this, or that they did. (quote me where I said this).

Again, read carefully. Each time you respond, I prove you wrong with exact quotes from what you write. You, on the other hand, haven't been able to affirm a single thing you have said about me. The things I've agreed with (from others) were never things you said (see my last post, first paragraph, second to last sentence).

Wow, this is becoming easier and easier. Keep going noob.

"that to an owner, a credit report/background check are one in the same."
I don't care about "to an owner." The owner ain't the one presenting their info in the best light. Let the owner do whatever the hell they want. Fact is fact: one report is one thing, the other is another thing. They are even generated by entirely different outfits. Different enterprises entirely. You pay a fee for a 3rd party to compile everything, BECAUSE they are different and seperate, genius. But nice try in DESPERATELY trying to backpeddle and lump all the reports together, which has NOTHING to do with what I said, simply to make your half-assed point look somewhat legit.

So Jimmyboy gets schooled again. Just like I've done multiple times, here and in other threads.

"one report is one thing, the other is another"

no, they are not. that is the point you are too dense to understand, and why a "credit report" in and of itself is worthless as it doesn't screen the tenant properly. not to the people who are going to make a decision. but you don't care what they think. even though, they are the exact people you are trying to impress. what kind of logic is that?

"Yes, millions of renters in NYC successfully rent all the time without a LL checking to see if they're a terrorist. "

You wrote that, didn't you?

"no, they are not."
OK, prove to us that a credit report is the exact same thing as a criminal history report. That's what you just said. And don't give me bullshit about what it's "worth" or how each one "matters" or "doesn't matter" or what's included in a whole package used for vetting a tenant. Because that's not what I said, ever (point to where I did say this if you want to keep arguing this inane "point" of yours).

I never made any statement about the "thoughts" of a landlord. Get your facts straight.

Yes, I did make THAT statement about the millions. You then went on to agree with me a few posts later, along with a timeframe. Thanks for providing that for me. So by your own admission, my statement stands (with even more accuracy.)

keep digging yourself deeper, jimmyboy. [first on the adgenda: waiting for the proof that credit report = background check]