I'm new to NYC and I had two apt visits set up on the same day with two different brokers. Broker A had shown me an apt a week earlier and then reached out to me about this new apt. I contacted Broker B after seeing a listing on rental website. Neither told me apt's exact address and as it turns out, both showed me the same apt. Broker A showed me the place first. When Broker B walked me to the... [more]
I'm new to NYC and I had two apt visits set up on the same day with two different brokers. Broker A had shown me an apt a week earlier and then reached out to me about this new apt. I contacted Broker B after seeing a listing on rental website. Neither told me apt's exact address and as it turns out, both showed me the same apt. Broker A showed me the place first. When Broker B walked me to the apt, I quickly realized it was the same place - not sure what to do, I just acted like I'd never seen it before. I decided I wanted the apt, and when both emailed me I had some discussion with each about their fees. After giving it some thought, I felt obligated to use Broker A - he showed it to me first and I had been working with him longer. I rented the apt, paid A his fee -- but now B has invoiced me for a 15% fee. I realize I screwed up by not being honest with Broker B - but my question is whether B has any legal standing to demand a fee. Should I just send a note to B and explain what happened, or just ignore the requests for $?
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Response by deanc
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 407
Member since: Jun 2006
don't ignore it, tell them you already paid the first broker.
man up (or woman up) and put your big pants on and quit being a baby.
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Response by fieldschester
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 3525
Member since: Jul 2013
Roger is a man.
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Response by raddoc
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 166
Member since: Jun 2008
Does REBNY address this issue?
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Response by 300_mercer
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 10567
Member since: Feb 2007
Roger, Did you feel at least a little bit dishonest emailing two brokers about the same apartment or just wanted to see which of them will be a lower fee? In my opinion, broker B should be very upset with you, sue you, and expect to get paid something. You genuinely used time of two professionals (?) with the intention of paying only one.
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Response by alanhart
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 12397
Member since: Feb 2007
It's an outrage! Next people will start getting quotes from two different contractors, knowing all along that he will wind up hiring only one of them.
The sad part is that contractors will spend way more time on walkthrough and putting together a proposal than will the professional (?) , possibly for less net profit. Plus the contractor knows how to read and write and might even have specialized experience. Not to include turning a key, of course.
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Response by fieldschester
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 3525
Member since: Jul 2013
You rented 1 apartment in 1 transaction. 2 brokers can't each be 100% responsible for renting 1 apartment and for 1 transaction.
300 mercer has a logic problem, and a reading comprehension problem.
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Response by alanhart
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 12397
Member since: Feb 2007
alanhart has a writing comprehension, referring in the same sentence to people and he, presumably meaning the same entity. Maybe they can become a rental agent grifter.
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Response by alanhart
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 12397
Member since: Feb 2007
Writing comprehension problem. Total incompetent.
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Response by 300_mercer
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 10567
Member since: Feb 2007
Alanhart, Rental brokers get paid for showing the apartment, if you end up renting it - that is the contract you sign with them. You may interview a rental broker (similar to getting an estimate from a contractor) without having him/her show and owe no money.
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Response by alanhart
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 12397
Member since: Feb 2007
They should throw in a few hits of crack to make it a value-added proposition.
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Response by snezanc
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 121
Member since: Oct 2007
refer Broker B to Broker A. Let them sort it out. I am a broker btw.
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Response by writerwrong79_1405916
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 0
Member since: Mar 2014
Broker A. is the person you are obligated to. But, you should have been honest with Broker B. People work on commissions. They don't want to waste their time with people, so it really sucks for Broker B. and probably will not have any legal standing to get his/her money.
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Response by fieldschester
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 3525
Member since: Jul 2013
The OP rented 1 apartment. = 1 fee. Any other suggestion is plain remarkable.
But did any of you read the rest of the context - the OP didn't know the address of the apartment B was bringing him to. He didn't know it was the same apartment. Maybe he felt it was awkward once he was in transit, but the obligation is not for the novice consumer in the arrangement. B's waste of time - if you can really call it that, what did it take from the point that OP realized until B was finished showing the apartment, 5 or 10 minutes? - is as a direct result of B's (and for that matter A's too) business practices which lack transparency and are built based on distrust rather than value add.
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Response by JJ2
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 114
Member since: May 2014
brokers .... mmmmmmm
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Response by bramstar
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 1909
Member since: May 2008
did you sign anything with broker B?
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Response by streetsmart
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 883
Member since: Apr 2009
You owe broker b a fee since you never told him you had seen the apt. already. I do believe that if broker b sued you he would win hands down. Yes 300_Mercer is right on.
As far as contractors go, there are no laws governing estimates. If a contractor wants to be paid for giving you an estimate he must disclose it before he spends any time with the client.
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Response by bramstar
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 1909
Member since: May 2008
Since broker A showed OP the apartment first, broker B would have a hard time successfully claiming procuring cause.
The question is--did OP sign separate contracts with EACH broker? Because in that case broker B may still be entitled to compensation.
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Response by streetsmart
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 883
Member since: Apr 2009
After discussing fees you felt obligated to broker A. Why didn't you feel obligated to broker A before discussing fees?
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Response by streetsmart
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 883
Member since: Apr 2009
P.S. I did assume that a contract was signed with each broker. I have never known a broker to start showing apts. without a signed agreement. If no contract was signed, he still emailed the broker , but the case becomes weak. But I still think in small claims court the broker would win.
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Response by fieldschester
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 3525
Member since: Jul 2013
Streetsmart, you are in over your head. Have you ever been to Small Claims Court on a matter like this? Do you have any legal background? Do you realize that if the brokerage license is held in a corporate name that Small Claims Court is not even available to the broker?
1 transaction. 1 fee.
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Response by Hammy
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 45
Member since: Mar 2007
You're wrong. Corporations sue in NY small claims court all the time! (Up to $5000) The client owes both brokers a fee. You can try to negotiate with the second broker but he/she will undoubtedly have proof to back up what happened and you will lose undoubtedly if it goes to small claims court.
I think you should tell the broker that you have already paid the fees to another broker. You should stay honest with your broker like I do. For any housing needs I always refer to my real estate agents at John Reider Properties.
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don't ignore it, tell them you already paid the first broker.
man up (or woman up) and put your big pants on and quit being a baby.
Roger is a man.
Does REBNY address this issue?
Roger, Did you feel at least a little bit dishonest emailing two brokers about the same apartment or just wanted to see which of them will be a lower fee? In my opinion, broker B should be very upset with you, sue you, and expect to get paid something. You genuinely used time of two professionals (?) with the intention of paying only one.
It's an outrage! Next people will start getting quotes from two different contractors, knowing all along that he will wind up hiring only one of them.
The sad part is that contractors will spend way more time on walkthrough and putting together a proposal than will the professional (?) , possibly for less net profit. Plus the contractor knows how to read and write and might even have specialized experience. Not to include turning a key, of course.
You rented 1 apartment in 1 transaction. 2 brokers can't each be 100% responsible for renting 1 apartment and for 1 transaction.
300 mercer has a logic problem, and a reading comprehension problem.
alanhart has a writing comprehension, referring in the same sentence to people and he, presumably meaning the same entity. Maybe they can become a rental agent grifter.
Writing comprehension problem. Total incompetent.
Alanhart, Rental brokers get paid for showing the apartment, if you end up renting it - that is the contract you sign with them. You may interview a rental broker (similar to getting an estimate from a contractor) without having him/her show and owe no money.
They should throw in a few hits of crack to make it a value-added proposition.
refer Broker B to Broker A. Let them sort it out. I am a broker btw.
Broker A. is the person you are obligated to. But, you should have been honest with Broker B. People work on commissions. They don't want to waste their time with people, so it really sucks for Broker B. and probably will not have any legal standing to get his/her money.
The OP rented 1 apartment. = 1 fee. Any other suggestion is plain remarkable.
But did any of you read the rest of the context - the OP didn't know the address of the apartment B was bringing him to. He didn't know it was the same apartment. Maybe he felt it was awkward once he was in transit, but the obligation is not for the novice consumer in the arrangement. B's waste of time - if you can really call it that, what did it take from the point that OP realized until B was finished showing the apartment, 5 or 10 minutes? - is as a direct result of B's (and for that matter A's too) business practices which lack transparency and are built based on distrust rather than value add.
brokers .... mmmmmmm
did you sign anything with broker B?
You owe broker b a fee since you never told him you had seen the apt. already. I do believe that if broker b sued you he would win hands down. Yes 300_Mercer is right on.
As far as contractors go, there are no laws governing estimates. If a contractor wants to be paid for giving you an estimate he must disclose it before he spends any time with the client.
Since broker A showed OP the apartment first, broker B would have a hard time successfully claiming procuring cause.
The question is--did OP sign separate contracts with EACH broker? Because in that case broker B may still be entitled to compensation.
After discussing fees you felt obligated to broker A. Why didn't you feel obligated to broker A before discussing fees?
P.S. I did assume that a contract was signed with each broker. I have never known a broker to start showing apts. without a signed agreement. If no contract was signed, he still emailed the broker , but the case becomes weak. But I still think in small claims court the broker would win.
Streetsmart, you are in over your head. Have you ever been to Small Claims Court on a matter like this? Do you have any legal background? Do you realize that if the brokerage license is held in a corporate name that Small Claims Court is not even available to the broker?
1 transaction. 1 fee.
You're wrong. Corporations sue in NY small claims court all the time! (Up to $5000) The client owes both brokers a fee. You can try to negotiate with the second broker but he/she will undoubtedly have proof to back up what happened and you will lose undoubtedly if it goes to small claims court.
Good luck.
previously from Hammy: http://streeteasy.com/talk/discussion/27983-need-a-new-category-clients http://streeteasy.com/talk/discussion/34304-broker-claims-apt-is-no-fee-then-asks-for-fee
I think you should tell the broker that you have already paid the fees to another broker. You should stay honest with your broker like I do. For any housing needs I always refer to my real estate agents at John Reider Properties.
Crains is pointing out that more buildings are offering to pay broker fees: http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article/20160324/REAL_ESTATE/160329919/apartment-vacancies-push-landlords-to-offer-freebies