Devonshire House

Soon.

Is this a pre-war building?

Yes, it's a pre-war building. The lobby is amazing--the woodwork looks like it's from an English chapel.

30yrs have you heard anymore about this building? I would luv to buy there when it finally converts.

From the outside, windows are all done and it looks like they are installing in wall a/c. It will be really interesting to see where they price the units since most in this neighborhood are falling below the $1k/sq ft range

mmmmm...more inventory.

Awesome! Thanks GettingOut, I can't wait to go to an OH :)

Has anyone else heard or seen anything regarding this conversion? I wonder if it will really be ready in the Fall

I wouldn't mind seeing it either.

The Devonshire house website is up. They're definitely pricing way above $1k/sqft. Check out devonshirehousenyc.com. Apt. 4K looks to be one of the better deals. Didn't realize this project existed - I'd been looking at 82 University, but this will add quite a bit more condo supply to the neighborhood.

There is no website at that url.

It's up now at http://www.devonshirehousenyc.com

I saw it too, they are very nice. I can't wait to see one up close.

i'll take 4K.

Ooo I looked at the floorplan for 4k, you have good taste AR I can't wait until they start showing these :)

it's really nice. if i were to buy i'd like a 2.5 bath, but that layout is great. few new conversions can combine the real feel for an open kitchen with a traditional layout. to me it's the best, some would still prefer the kitchen separate. but i like people around while i cook, and 85ish% of my prep dishes are in the dishwasher before food is served.

actually luchias, i didn't notice, hmm mentioned 4K first. but not many floorplans are up. dreams.

There are floorplans for each available apartment on the "Availabilty' page of the website AR, they come up as pdfs you need to download.

I agree 'dreams' but hey at least these are nice ones :)

I'm not interested in a studio but I inquired b/c I have a friend who is and this is the reply I received from the sales office:

"Thank you for your interest in the Devonshire House. We are currently taking appointments beginning Wednesday September 9th, and our hours are 10 AM-6PM. We do not offer studios; the residences are 1-4 bedroom only. More information, availability, and floor plans are available on our website. Thank you!"

So there you have it folks. Appointments begin on Wed. Sept. 9th. Good luck to anyone who goes, maybe I'll see you there :)

What do we think about the pricing on this thing?

2L - $1,302 / Sq ft (1 br/1 ba)
4K - $1,182 (2/2)
6D - $1,635 (3/2.5)

Very interesting. It will be fun to see what they look like on the inside. I have a feeling they are still priced high but who knows...

I agree GettingOut they do seem to be overpriced but I just have to go and see them....I would LOVE to live in a Pre-war condo in this part of the city. We shall see :)

we all know i'm not really buying in this environment, if ever. but if you really wanted to and you had at least a seven year holding time, you could do much worse than 4K. the building i've been following to determine if i'm going to lured into buying in 2012 is 260 PAS (i would want a condo). and i think 4K compares VERY favorably to this:

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/387297-condo-260-park-avenue-south-flatiron-new-york

the taxes are high for both buildings, but if you are buying with a seven-year holding period they would be close to that by your sale date anyway. i like both locations, but devonshire's has much more staying power. and 260's lobby is not my cup of tea.

Seems like most of the units for sale are not original layouts but combos of some sort or another?

Also, if that's really all they have available, I think they are extremely fucked.

probably just initial release. they do seem to be combos, some more successful than others.

obviously, you'd want a very good lawyer drawing up the contract.

30yrs, can you take a look at the listing history for the nolita auction thread apt? isn't that a bizarre rental pattern, i see it was an artists' group. any ideas?

i loved living there when it was a rental, not sure i would buy at those prices. that being said, the conversion was extremely done, from the ones i saw. the main issue is the lack of light you get facing the courtyard, even on high floors. nice building all in all, though

Gopher_1 how was the noise issue in this building?

two types of noise issue: 1 - delivery trucks for the shops on 8th (surprisingly noisey even on a high floor) 2 - drunk students coming home late at night to the nyu dorms in the vicinity. 2 was the worst as it is never regular enough to become white noise. all in all though if you got sound dampening blinds, i'm sure it wouldn't be an issue
one other plus point about the building is that the staff are fantastic.

Thanks for the info Gopher_1, I do appreciate it :)

Looks like the listings are finally up in SE

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/building/47-university-place-new_york

Ooo thanks for the heads up GettingOut, I'm so excited, I can't wait to check these out!

Are these the only inventory they have? Did the renters get advanced buy options?

I just got an update from Streeteasy with a listing too. No floorplan on that one but didn't bother to go to the website. Too rich for me now.

There aren't actually 131 units in this thing, are there? I assume that was pre-conversion? Great looking building, but pricey, of course.

it was 131 or so pre-conversion. there are some rc/rs left, but not many. a lot of the other apts have been combined

Not many RS left? I find that very hard to believe. Did they get so much turnover that they had mostly free market tenants? Because we know they can't have too many units vacant, otherwise they'd run into "warehousing" issues with the AG.

when i say not many, i believe the building was over 50% rs/rc pre-conversion (that was what i read on the broker's listing - linked from curbed i believe). it is now less than 25% rs/rc

30yrs, what are 'warehousing' issues?

"Under the law, an excessive long-term vacancy rate exists when the number of apartments not occupied by lawful tenants for five months or longer is greater than 10 percent of the building's apartments if that rate is twice the normal average vacancy rate for two years before the January of the year the red herring was filed. The law applies to both cooperative and condominium conversions".*

NY Times http://www.nytimes.com/1982/08/01/realestate/complaints-rise-on-warehousing-for-cooperatives.html

still 54 rent-regulated tenants.

http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article/20090903/FREE/909039991

Earlier this week, the developers began marketing units at the building for an average of $1,436 per square foot.

With an eye on the recession, the developers cut their asking prices by 10% to 15% from levels they cited last year in original plans for the condo conversion, according to Jenifer Steig, a partner of The Cheshire Group. Brokerage Stribling was hired to market units in the building which was designed by famed architect Emory Roth.

%u201CWe are going to be realistic about what we can sell at a reasonable pace,%u201D said Ms. Steig. %u201CWe are priced for today. No one can say this building is overpriced.%u201D

"No one can say this building is overpriced"

The building is overpriced.

Damn you modern, you are so old fashined.

Conversions are bad. There's no good that can come with a building where more than 10% are receiving priviledged rents and you are paying more than full price.

Rosario Candella is saviour of here.

Has anyone actually seen the units here? Curious about the feedback (even though its clearly overpriced)...

Saw the units yesterday and today. More than 60 people showed to the open house Sunday. Their appt book is also packed. There is lots of interest.

the finished show unit is a stunner (it's a three bedroom with huge library so it should be nice). Even though people are saying they are overpriced it is attracting a ton of attention.

Market is crap but I have a feeling that these will move quickly. There is some pent up demand for newly finished prewar condo with doorman in this location. We shall see soon.

got to wonder about financing. as in will any be possible? given the location i tended to agree with you, but finding out that so many units are still RS gave me a very cold feeling about this.

good question. This price range is very hard to get lending at a fair interest rate and who knows how the rs units affect it. from what sales agent says, they need to sell 15% of the units for sale(45 are for sale and 54 are still rentals) for condo plan to go effective.

I just saw a banner ad for Devonshire and clicked through. Pretty nice. But I'm kind of with Blorkk above except that I think 10% is low - definitely if 50% of the building is there under totally different economic circumstances based on the number from aboutready, I think that might not be ideal for such a big investment.

I was also intrigued by the banner & had a look. I see Emory Roth & it gets my attention & Victoria Hagan is much respected, at least by Architectural Digest. The architecture looked great & I was pleasantly surprised that the interiors looked warm & pleasant & not these aggressively modern, sleek interiors I've seen stuck into these beautiful old buildings. The prices do look aspirational but perhaps in that location they will sell? Time will tell.

Potential problems at The Devonshire:
The tenants' association is contesting the conversion plan on warehousing grounds. This could postpone any sales from closing and even prevent the owners from selling apartments for years to come.
The tenants' association is in possession of an engineer's report they commissioned. This report exposes serious conditions in the building that possibly will rise in time to haunt buyers. This report is leaked to interested parties.
Aesthetics aside, anyone can see the shoddy work done on the lobby floor - cheap and mismatched tiles were laid unevenly and already started to crack.
The old water/ drainage systems that will keep serving the rental units runs through the renovated apartments. This could potentially expose the buyers to the risks of well documented leaks and mold. Same for the old electric supply that will remain buried in the walls.

"30yrs_RE_20_in_REO
about 3 weeks ago
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Not many RS left? I find that very hard to believe. Did they get so much turnover that they had mostly free market tenants? Because we know they can't have too many units vacant, otherwise they'd run into "warehousing" issues with the AG."

LMFAO

Good call!

My point about there being not many RS tenants was that the doorman I spoke to saying that the building was about a third full after the market rate tenants left. I didn't consider the fact that the market rate apartments probably had more occupants (lots of the RS tenants were sole occupiers - not all, but lots of them). So while there were a lot less tenants, the number of RS apts was still >50%

Can anyone enlighten me as to the connection to between the warehousing issue and the engineer's report? Are they connected, or is the above poster just highlighting two potential issues?

I think DevonT is throwing as much spaghetti as possible at the fridge to see what sticks.

I have listed potential problems with purchasing units at the Devonshire House, but they are not necessarily related to each other.
The facts are available from the Devonshire Tenants Association, and are to be used at the discretion of those interested in buying.
As for the specific issues:
1. Individual parties are not allowed to inspect the building, and therefore an objective engineer's report, not the one presented by the owners, in invaluable. The Association commissioned their own engineer's report which was performed before the plan was approved by the AG.
2. Only current residents of The Devonshire can attest to the real condition of the apartments before walls are plastered to cover old leaking pipes.
3. As for the quality of the renovation, anyone can take a look at lobby's flooring and evaluate for themselves.

When I lived there I had no problems with leaky pipes, but then I wasn't in an RS apt. Just out of curiousity, why do the current residents want to contest the conversion plan? What am I missing?

The current residents are contesting the details of the conversion plan, not the conversion plan per se. They're negotiating the terms (insider prices, reserve fund, etc.) upon which they'll buy into the building, just as anyone would. If no agreement is reached, and the sponsor therefore can't get purchase agreements for 15% of the building, the plan falls apart and the sponsor has to try again later. It can take many amendments to the offering plan to get anywhere.

Looks like they sold one:

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/467810-condo-28-east-10th-street-greenwich-village-new-york

Dying to know whether it went at ask. I'm guessing it'll be below $4MM but how much? At $1800 / sq ft it is expensive for the neighborhood...

Looks like Curbed got some better pick of the model apt. Very nice. I still want 20% off their list prices and them I'm all in...

http://curbed.com/archives/2009/10/05/curbed_inside_old_meets_new_at_devonshire_house.php#more

What's teh point of having a totally open kitchen to a FDR? I can see the point (even though I don't like it) of havng and open kitchen to a "lofty" LR. But to a FDR? WTF?

Openness aside, I love that kitchen. And the bathroom too.

looking at other new downtown developments and this looks under-priced...

i like the layout 30yrs, you don't. simple. you'd take 20 pine over this? sorry, snark.
and i do really like the feel here. alas, i'd never do it.

I think that's a bit of a stretch... lol....
I don't hate the whole layout, I just think the idea of having a FDR is negated by the open kitchen: you either have a "formal"/classic layout or you don't. I think the "in between" does the usual "try to be all things to all people" and end up being something which does the opposite.

When I hear the reasons given for open kitchens, I don't know if this fits. Some say they like being able to watch their kids while they are in the kitchen. So you're going to have your kids play in your FDR? others say they like to talk with their guests while cooking. So your guests are going to sit at teh FDR table for an hour or two instead of in the living room?

30yrs, the 4k layout does everyting I'd like. A large congenial place to cook and have people near with enough space for them not to be in my face. And a place to go that is not food oriented. I like lofts. Truly. But I can't see why you are so against analternative which is merely different. It is still functional unlike some of the atrocities we've seen. And while overpriced, particularly given the conversion issues, I'd take this over a glass box any day

I sincerely mean this: I'm not against it for being different, I'm against it because I don't see how it's an improvement. I admit i don't like open kitchens in general, so I listened to teh reasons that I *thought* the people who did like open kitchens gave for liking them, and I still don't see how this (although by this, i was talking about the 2e) met those objectives. I'll have to look at that 4k now.

OK, just looked: I very much more see 4k 'working" for someone than 2e (just regarding the open kitchen, not the rest of the apartment. What i mean is in 4k i don't think the open kitchen "fights' the gestalt of the rest of the apartment as much as in 2e.

30 YRS - re: 4K I think you're responding to the fact that you don't see the kitchen equipment from the iving room, whereas in 2E living room looks directly at kitchen equipment. Nicer to not have to look at all the dirty dishes , pots with your guests in the living room after dinner.

As a former resident of the building I think that it's important that you are above the 8th floor, so that you get at least some sunlight. The apts. facing 10th and University are brighter than the garden-side apartments, which are especially dark in the winter.

Some of the floorplans are original, but the large 3-4 bdrm units have been combined. The developer has to build around tenants in their RS apts, so they can't do all the combinations that they had wanted.

The building staff are phenomenal, though the mgmt. company had begun to lay many of them off before the conversion.

There were ~40% RS units left when I moved out. I have no idea how many are left now, but the building was like a ghost town when we moved out this spring, though we were one of the last MR units left.

Now up to 5 in contract, they are selling these apts like hotcakes.

And it's not the cheapest one's they are selling, either.

I was there for the open house a week ago Sunday. It was busy and people seemed to be shopping seriously.

Ok, so i've been to the Devonshire twice now. I like it. But the place wants $200,000 for a higher floor apartment than the one I want. $200,000 for 4 floors. Does anyone have any idea what the places in contract are selling at? Clearly, sales are going well, but how well? Anyone out there have ANY IDEA WHATSOEVER!?!?!?!?!?

No idea, but since they just opened for sales, I would guess they are at or near the listing price. Though I suppose they could be taking 10% off just to close a few units quick, but somehow I doubt it.

CENTRAL VILLAGE—Curbed favorite the Devonshire House, a renovation and condo conversion of a pre-war rental on East 10th Street, is doing pretty well for itself. According to building reps, there are seven signed contracts and four more contracts out awaiting Johnny Hancocks. More: "According to Stribling Marketing Associates, the building is averaging approximately $1,600 per square foot and four of the seven signed contracts had back-up buyers." FrenzyWire!!! [CurbedWire Inbox]

i wonder how easy it's going to be to get mortgages.

For all those who questioned if the apartments would actually sell I think that's been answered. They may make further price adjustments but well done condos in this neighborhood are scarce. There is demand. Since they have 7 contracts signed and if those actually close I think the condo plan would be declared effective since they meet the 15% requirement.

Did anyone see the first price increase on one of the apts? The sales must be doing well...

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/450774-condo-28-east-10th-street-greenwich-village-new-york?email=true

14 contracts and counting! Wow, lots of sh!t talk from many commenter here about the poor layouts, ugly design, cheap lobby floors etc. Well I guess you can put your foot in your mouth, these have moved quite well and the only ones still sitting are the small dark units in the back of the building on low floors.

It is genuinely impressive that the sales have gone so well. While I love the neighborhood and would have liked a unit in the building, its still too high for my taste - especially with no outdoor space. Its great to know that a good building in a great location can still sell even in the toughest of markets...

What's the timeframe for this development -- i.e., when do they expect first closings?

I wonder what type of discount did the buyers who are under contract get from the list price? Is any one under contract?

300_mercer...wondering the same question as well.

and, any idea of projected closing dates?

i'm guessing the people who bought early got some discounts on the asking prices however any contracts signed within the last 4 months probably did not see much discount from list. The condo market in this hood has been pretty crazy. I think in hindsight, those who bought the few two bedrooms available early on made great decisions.

People who were looking for Greenwich Village RE to crash and burn in the downturn have been sorely disappointed. The oft cited value of a AAA location is not just talk.

Wow, several closings OVER asking prices. These contracts were signed during a tough market. Very impressive. Fun to look back at all the comments from about 9 months ago.

td, you sure got that right. No fire sales in GV. A dip, but no slashing. Overall area has/is faring much better than most of the the rest of Manh.

Lets go M-E-T-S....

fastball inside got 'em swinging

Looks like the actress Amanda Seyfried bought the apt discussed above, unit 4K.

http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2010/11/01/actress_amanda_seyfried_buys_at_devonshire_house.php

The artist who did the faux bois and venetian plaster lobby is Darlene from Impressdesigns.net.

alec baldwin just closed on the penthouse...

"Last year, under orders from their lender, Cheshire Group and Sterling American Property sold a block of 33 rent-regulated units at their Devonshire House condo conversion in Greenwich Village to Aby Rosen’s RFR Realty for $32 million."
https://therealdeal.com/issues_articles/solving-nycs-condo-riddle/

I was just looking at that a few days ago. You have to wonder how that impacted the profitability of the project for the developer. One, because in general you make your money on the last 25-30% of the sales, and two, because if they still had a loan out and were forced into the sale by the lender, had they even turned much of a profit already?

They got tired. Once the new condo owners move in, there's no incentive for the rent reg tenants to move out. So the developer gets tired, sells.