Home prices going DOWN again! Since July :-)

How could they be going up in this economy? Who can afford these multi million dollar homes?

even if you can buy, why when you know that prices should be a fraction of what they are?

till the gov doesn't allow prices to go down, buyers will remain in the sidelines imho

Nationally, that's probably true although getting less true by the day. Unfortunately, there still seems to be more demand than supply in New York. And if only 7.1% of properties in all of NY State are underwater, why should anyone expect significant declines in NYC?

Sure, I simply enjoy watching home prices go down to where incomes are.

NYC will dance to the tune of discretionary income of new yorkers, we will see how banking keeps on doing going forward.

if there were more demand than supply, then prices would be rising--which they are clearly not doing.

price declines are not just because properties are underwater. the pace of price declines may be accelerated by the amount of underwater properties depending on how home owners and their lenders react.

that's great but I don't see it...studios are still over $400k and one bedrooms, well they haven't moved much at all..I can't find a good one bedroom for $500k

People have a strong psychological aversion to losses, so are reluctant to price their houses below what they paid for them. The result is that prices are out of whack, with homes priced higher than they shoudl be based on the demand.

For the average U.S. market, a wait-and-see rather than a buy-now approach seems better for buyers.

the psychology changed a lot though, and this per se is enough to bring prices down.

who on earth is saying to renters on the sidelines "buy now or be priced out forever". the contrary happens, those that bought 2006 on are the ones regretting it (financially speaking). it'd be nice if we could know which % of transactions were made by those that expected increase home prices ahead and which % didn't care (just wanted to own regardless what prices might do ahead). the second group is the only one left standing now.

Does anyone buy a HOME anymore?

ya' know: a home . . . where one selects a nice home, and lives for a decade, or much longer.

. . . without much concern to FLIP n PROFIT in the next year, or in the 2-5 years down the road?

A Short term outlook probably means you should just RENT!

so true LENOX. normal mindset fits only normal prices. when prices are way above what incomes can sustain, speculation kicks in. years of price declines ahead can solve that, bringing normal mentality back. let's hope.

Julia, I feel your pain. Lenox, that's exactly what I'm trying to do. Not interested in flipping, want to be able to purchase a space large enough to stay in for a decade. Unfortunately, NOTHING IS AVAILABLE that fits the bill. What happened to the concept of staying in place is twofold: employment became less stable, and we had a housing bubble that made it impossible for first-time buyers to save enough to buy a large enough house. Everyone was telling you that your only hope was to buy the "starter" home and upgrade once home values appreciated.

I agree that a short-term outlook means you should rent, 100%. But part of the reason the psychology changed was that the economy changed, too.

"large enough house." My New York stockholm syndrome is showing. Sorry. Houses got a lot bigger during that time, so I totally take this back.

We are now nearly 3 years into the housing collapse and....NYC has held up remarkably well, particularly prime Manhattan and prime Brooklyn. All RE markets are local and NY seems quite strong in relation to the rest of the country. Why? We held up better than pretty much every region during the recession-lost fewer jobs etc. And we are bouncing back quicker. As the Tea Party nuttiness catches fire elsewhere and Americans become ever stupider, NYC beckons as one of the few sane areas of the country. People are going to need to move here.

whoa tonto.

the shit hit the fan almost two years ago to the day...not three years ago.

held up pretty well? that means down how much?

yes, we have done better than the rest of the country but that is a very low bar.

bounce back? what does that look like? we haven't bounced back. we've gone down less than the rest of the country and we're sitting there wondering about what comes next.

the tea party makes nyc better? are you kidding?

that reminds me of some 'apartment' or another I saw linked, somewhere-maybe here?--in Japan.
It was like 285square feet, and this guy used a series of moving panels that essentially gave him like 7 completely different Units 'within' the studio!

My personal belief is that we FLAT or slightly downward in pricing the next 18 months or more . . . .

Some sales of course, but not what the market could really handle, IF prices were more in line with incomes and employment.

I keep hearing that average FAMILY income in NYC is like 60-7-K/year for a 4 person family!

Really??--so theres enough folks at the top of the food chain to continue to purchase all these 600K 2 bedroom Units all over the place??

No. But there's a heck of a lot of more people in the $150k and up income brackets who want to buy. City average income is going to include all of the lower-income outer boroughs in Queens, the Bronx, Staten Island.

Lenox, I guarantee you I've looked at every single $600k "2-br" listings - many, particularly the few in Manhattan, are awkwardly configured overpriced 1-bedrooms - and any decent listing gets snapped up very, very quickly at near ask. This also holds true for $700k and $800k listings - unless they are dumb enough to expect those prices for the overpriced chopped-up 1-bedrooms I mentioned. Those sit, but sometimes, yes, they sell for those prices.

columbia housing began it's decline before lehman blew up and considering wall st was at the epicenter of this mess it is amazing that nyc held up as well as it did. that's called relative strength. and nyc remains a beacon for smart, sane, creative and ambitious people. as the rest of the nation becomes jerry springer land the more those people will want to come here.

but...what does that prove?

that there are some people who convince themselves to overpay?

that the market is still overpriced relative to what many can pay?

yes and yes.

everyone here talks about how purchasing is for the long term. etc. etc.

so...if you're contemplating a purchase that will last you 20 yrs---do you think that you'll remember that you waited for 3-4 yrs before buying?

nyc real estate did not react until lehman blew up. pure and simple.

the rest of your point is wishful thinking.

"Excluding distressed sales, the top five states with the highest appreciation were: South Dakota (+5.1 percent), District of Columbia (+4.9 percent), New York (+3.4 percent), Mississippi (+2.8 percent), and California (+2.8 percent)."

+3.4%...

so...if you're contemplating a purchase that will last you 20 yrs---do you think that you'll remember that you waited for 3-4 yrs before buying?

How old are you? 25? Of course you'll remember.

wow, you guys are still slogging it out here? jeez. oh, hi julia.

cnbc reported this am that month over month, foreclosures and the stages before (default, late payments) are all up.

yep, but in this area, the only auctions i've seen are in queens (mostly jamaica, which was the first place to experience price collapses, very subprime and speculative). remember that prices in jamaica began going down in 2006, so imagine, it took 4 years for me to see auctions of those shacks even though the entire world new it was coming down and hard.

bronk and bad parts of brooklyn have some stuff up for auction, not much. i'd say give it another couple of years. rent meanwhile. thanks to high fixed costs, NYC are is not the best place for the unemployed and underwater (i know, in theory we don't have much of those... but honestly, i know personally several underwater in manhattan as we speak).