Doorman Strike

Doormen in my building will block package deliveries if/when they strike, apparently, which in my opinion would be harassment and blackmail.

What is the advantage for buildings to be part of Realty Advisory Board on Labor Relations (RAB), the organization that negotiates with this union? The coop and condo buildings are mom and pop owned and independently operated. This industry is as fragmented as it gets and employers don't have any outsized power, so why are they bargained with as if they were some big bad monopoly?.

So is it true that not all doormen are building staff are unionized? Because in my building there have no announcements regarding this so I’m assuming my building is not affected I guess? All the building staff in my building staff are excellent and very professional so what is the advantage of going to a union staff?

No real advantage for the dweller but I don't mind paying a living wage plus benefits to people that are essentially my servants.

No one gets 100% employer paid health insurance anymore. No one - it is ridiculous. These guys have their hands out every year and drive up the cost of rent and maintenance fees. When we bought our apartment it was not because of the doormen - we stupidly didn’t pay attention to how they suck money forever. The cost of staff in our building literally drove us out - I’m perhaps the rare person who has primarily felt resentment at these guys - go home, let me open and close my own damn door and save $$$$$$$$$ in costs. In many cases they aren’t needed any more and it’s literally creating jobs for jobs sake. If elderly lonely residents want a companion to talk to, that’s fine, but let them hire their own….

@yentle - Agree once again. A super is important but a doorman? ButterflyMX or the equivalent is fine.

I think for large buildings, you need doorman for security and sort out deliveries.

Less than 10-15 units, it is really optional.

Imagine a delivery pretender buzzed by some one lurking in the hallway.
When there are hundreds of deliveries a day, no way you can manage without doorman in a high rise.

>> No one gets 100% employer paid health insurance anymore. No one - it is ridiculous.

This is true. At my company, you have to pay $1 per paycheck. Or $2 for a spouse (or another form of a +1). Thankfully, I don’t have a family… because that would cost a third dollar.

>> When we bought our apartment it was not because of the doormen - we stupidly didn’t pay attention to how they suck money forever. The cost of staff in our building literally drove us out - I’m perhaps the rare person who has primarily felt resentment at these guys - go home, let me open and close my own damn door and save $$$$$$$$$ in costs.

Yes. It’s their fault for taking a job in a building that desired their services, that you then bought into, and from which they didn’t immediately resign as a consequence… because the building still desires their services. Shame on them.

>> Doormen in my building will block package deliveries if/when they strike, apparently, which in my opinion would be harassment and blackmail.

At least one (and maybe two) in my building expressed annoyance with the union and the potential strike. His complaint was that the union doesn’t even ask the members if they want to strike, or much of anything. I didn’t look into what he said any further. Just relaying one viewpoint expressed, without me asking about it.

Doormen pay is pretty low. $50-$70k plus tips. Bottom line is that full-service building is not for every one. Building can reduce service over time (they wouldn't as many people don't want to change what they bought into) and people can find non-doorman buildings. But in Manhattan, since you have to pay through the nose for property taxes, people decide that they want a doorman.

The reality of Manhattan is that taxes for many units have gone up significantly close to 30% cap every 5 years and it is hurting.

I have considered developing a small 3-5 condo building without doorman or amenities in Manhattan but there is not much demand for this product. While in Brooklyn, this type of product is very common. To justify the development cost in Manhattan, you have to do luxury full-service.

Wow. Most financial services firm pass-on 20-30% of the healthcare cost to the employees if you make more than say $300k. I don't know about hedge funds.

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This is true. At my company, you have to pay $1 per paycheck. Or $2 for a spouse (or another form of a +1). Thankfully, I don’t have a family… because that would cost a third dollar.

Btw, people don't realize with increased package deliveries in the last 20 years, doormen are rather busy as people don't shop in person as much. It is just not drycleaning and food deliveries any more. And food delivery people are not vetted as they don't work for the restaurants any more. May be it is just me, but I think there is a significant increase in food deliveries over the last 10 years.

p.s. I live in a non-doorman small building.

>>>No real advantage for the dweller but I don't mind paying a living wage plus benefits to people that are essentially my servants.

@stache I don't mind this either. I just don't understand why there needs to be a buildings union to negotiate with a doormen union, instead of my building's doormen negotiating with my building directly. My building is not a giant company with monopoly powers over local jobs. And the doormen might not want to strike either. This is just a weird set up.

>>>Btw, people don't realize with increased package deliveries in the last 20 years, doormen are rather busy as people don't shop in person as much. It is just not drycleaning and food deliveries any more.

I live in a doorman building and this is true. Doormen in my building do not open the door - we have automatic doors! They WATCH the door and manage deliveries. By the way my building now does not allow deliveries to the door because a single on-duty doorman isn't able to effectively monitor the door AND watch the cameras for delivery people on multiple floors simultaneously.

My building has no other amenities: no gym, pool, kids playroom etc. When we were buying, we were looking for a large (to spread out the cost), low amenity, doorman building. Which is what we have and are happy with.

>>> This is true. At my company, you have to pay $1 per paycheck. Or $2 for a spouse (or another form of a +1). Thankfully, I don’t have a family… because that would cost a third dollar.

My partner's employer is a mid to large tech company. His insurance is covered, but his +1 and +2 add some sort of cost sharing. His company's insurance is great. Low copayments, no in-network deductible.

At my employer in the financial services industry, insurance costs are exorbitant and insurance sucks. $75 copayment for any doctor, $2k in-network coverage deductible, etc
My employer is extra large with over 200k employees.

When I retired early, it never hit me that the biggest thing I would miss by far is my employer covered health insurance. When you don’t pay it, you really have no idea how much it costs. If you have to buy your own health insurance, it’s crazy expensive. I also find it ridiculous that as someone who runs 12-13 miles a day, no pre-existing medical conditions, never any personal or family history of health issues, non smoker or alcohol drinker, no drug use, I pay the same as someone who has smoked a pack of cigarettes for 40 years. I wish health insurance were more similar to car insurance, they check your driving record and if you’ve got a history of accidents, claims, etc, you pay accordingly vs. someone who has a clean driving record. I’ve heard stories of relatively wealthy early retirees who get a job at Starbucks or similar solely for the health insurance. But then you aren’t really retired

Well, healthcare costs have been out of control. Obamacare cost has been going up 7-10 percent per year in NYC. So I understand why having a doorman is increasingly a luxury product in NYC.

I remember my old employer charging $300- $500 per month 10 years back depending on what plan you chose. If I remember correctly analysts 1-3 year out of undergrad didn’t need to pay much.

If you made more than $1mm per year, they charged even more.

>>>I just don't understand why there needs to be a buildings union to negotiate with a doormen union, instead of my building's doormen negotiating with my building directly. My building is not a giant company with monopoly powers over local jobs. And the doormen might not want to strike either. This is just a weird set up<<<

That is how a labor union works.

>>>That is how a labor union works.

Actually, the union is only able to do this with buildings that are members of RAB, a "bargaining entity".

For a building being a member of RAB is voluntary, and I am not sure what buildings get out of it, other than a strike.

Labor unions are good for their members and especially good for their leaders. They are absolutely no good for anyone else.

>> Most financial services firm pass-on 20-30% of the healthcare cost to the employees

I think the full story is that my firm requires something like that for the fancier insurance (with an exceedingly ridiculous co-pay of $5). The less fancy one (with a plainly ridiculous co-pay of $15) is $1. I figure the firm is paying the same amount per employee but is then leaving it up to the employee whether they want the fancier plan (paying the incremental cost themselves).

Union leadership is a very good high paying job with benefits. Very competitive to get that via election etc.

>> When you don’t pay it, you really have no idea how much it costs.

It’s more expensive when you go it alone than through an employer. That’s the real BS, what Obamacare partially set out to resolve.

In any case, you should make sure to play games on your income so you fall into just the right band. It’s the American way. I’ll add you to my personal list of Medicaid / Obamacare sugar babies under my patronage. I could use an affluent, early retiree runner.

SEIU 32BJ president’s salary seems fair at $225k plus they tend to have very generous benefits. I would have guessed, he gets paid more in $300k range.

“I’ll add you to my personal list of Medicaid / Obamacare sugar babies under my patronage. I could use an affluent, early retiree runner.“

I’m honored…

https://www.wsj.com/economy/housing/the-week-new-york-citys-affordability-crisis-came-to-every-doorstep-ba7f0a2c?mod=mhp

Crisis averted! They guys (always guys, no?) seemed happy when I came home today. One of them said he’s glad he could go on his planned vacation rather than be forced to picket our building by the union, where basically the on-premise staff outnumber the residents on any summer weekend. That would have been the height of comedy, whereby the staff are putting on a picketing show they have no interest in participating in, for the benefit of a basically empty building.

Isn’t NYC grand?

Inonada, I feel you and I are kindred spirits!!!

My condo would drive you crazy. There is basically ~20 people on staff for ~20 apartments where average occupancy is ~5 apartments. We do it out of humanity, I think. Unlike your building, there are too few residents here for them to chitchat with, so we need many on each shift so they can chitchat among themselves to pass the time.

We have about 15 staff plus a full time super for about 150 apartments and I think it’s the right number. They are never too bored that you see them chitchatting amongst themselves. Interestingly, they rarely open the door for anybody unless you are lugging a bunch of packages. But the best amenity is a live in super/handyman. They will actually fix a lot of little things like small plumbing issues, replacing a faucet, fire detector replacement etc, often for very little cost. Our freezer had a leak. We mistakenly called an appliance repair company. $200 for the visit and diagnosis. They never really identified the solution to the problem but a lot of upselling of other parts that we didn’t need like a new seal around the fridge doors. We learned our expensive lesson. We then called the super, he said it’s a not uncommon issue in the fridges in our building and he sent the building handyman. He fixed the problem for $100. Now whenever we have a repair, we ALWAYS call the super first to see if they can take care of the problem. We the unit was rented and I was on the West Coast, I never felt the need to hire a property manager because when issues came up, the super and building staff took care of it. A good handyman that is honest and you trust is like a good auto mechanic, they are priceless. And although there are a multiple of things I dislike about NYC, my condo, it’s management, and the level of amenities/service for the HOA dues I pay is not one of them. I feel it’s a pretty reasonable deal

And just to add…I’m pretty sure they are not unionized and I don’t know their salaries but we tip them pretty generously every Christmas

15 staff for 150 units is reasonable. You cannot receive a luxury level of service with that, but the basics are covered well.

In terms of how much they get paid and benefits, here’s more than you’d ever want to know:

https://outpost.me/blog/nyc-doorman-salary-what-youll-really-earn-working-manhattans-most-exclusive-buildings

I think it averages to $100K/yr total cost per unionized doorman (confirmed by Gemini). As a point of comparison, Gemini puts unionized NYC school teachers at an average of $145K/yr across a 40-year tenure (at 2026 compensation rates).

Entertainment unions still get 100% insurance coverage. Of course there still might be copayments, deductibles etc. depending on the plan. Pretty sure a lot of Fed/state jobs get full coverage plus postal workers.

Agreed a good super is worth his weight in gold.

Federal and State employees pay into their retirement as well as health care. I was paying about $500 plus/month for health insurance