I'm in contract to buy a 1400 sq foot, 2 bdrm co-op. I recently had contractors in to bid for a renovation, and was told that the apartment is wired for 40 amps of electricity. They said that ideally, I should have double that amount - to be able to support modern appliances, get a washer/dryer, etc. But the building doesn't allow electrical upgrades. I'm trying to understand what this means. Will... [more]
I'm in contract to buy a 1400 sq foot, 2 bdrm co-op. I recently had contractors in to bid for a renovation, and was told that the apartment is wired for 40 amps of electricity. They said that ideally, I should have double that amount - to be able to support modern appliances, get a washer/dryer, etc. But the building doesn't allow electrical upgrades. I'm trying to understand what this means. Will I be able to run three air conditioners in the summer? Will I be able to have a washer/dryer? Get new appliances in the kitchen? Install overhead lights throughout? Use the microwave and a hair dryer at the same time? FYI - the apartment has circuits, not a fuse box, if this is relevant. Can an electrician work with the existing power but make sure that no one line is too heavily loaded? Any advice/information will be greatly appreciated. Thanks so much.
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Response by gut_reno
about 14 years ago
Posts: 24
Member since: Jun 2008
We have a similar issue with an apartment we are looking at. The apartment is wired for 60amps and I was told that the building doesn't allow electrical upgrades. Did you find out what happens? The apartment we are looking at has 2 fuse boxes. That's all we know.
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Response by Primer05
about 14 years ago
Posts: 2103
Member since: Jul 2009
sg007,
40 amps is a very small amount. You at the very least should upgrade the panel and then run direct lines but it still may not be enough. Did any of the contractors/electricians go to the basement to see what you really have? It might be different
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Response by gut_reno
about 14 years ago
Posts: 24
Member since: Jun 2008
Is even 80 amps enough? I'd love to know. My broker is saying 60 amps is standard for all postwar apts and we shouldn't have a problem. We're concerned that if it is outdated now, what would it be seen as if we are trying to sell it later down the road??
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Response by nyc10023
about 14 years ago
Posts: 7614
Member since: Nov 2008
40 amps is not sufficient to run all the services you're talking about simultaneously. No way - it just doesn't work. Each breaker is either 10, 15 or 20 amps - you do the math. Picture this scenario, you have the TV on, a couple of computers, refrigerator, 3 window A/Cs - and you're done.
What kind of bldg are you looking at? Townhouse/walkup co-op? The building is long, long overdue for a major upgrade from the street to bring in 300amp service if that's the case. Doesn't make sense in a larger building that you wouldn't have your own panel.
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Response by gut_reno
about 14 years ago
Posts: 24
Member since: Jun 2008
Sorry if this is too obvious, but what does it mean "upgrade the panel and then run direct lines"? Do you mean that we should ask to get more electricity from the basement using risers?
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Response by gut_reno
about 14 years ago
Posts: 24
Member since: Jun 2008
or are you referring to the electrical service panel?
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Response by Primer05
about 14 years ago
Posts: 2103
Member since: Jul 2009
You can get by with 80amps. I am not talking about bringing up more amps, there are a few buildings that allow it but most do not. The op stated that they have circuits. That should be upgraded
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Response by flarf
about 14 years ago
Posts: 515
Member since: Jan 2011
Hard to say if x number of amps is enough without knowing anything about the apartment. Is it a studio or a four bedroom? Natural gas in the kitchen or electric only? Southern exposure with 16' floor-to-ceiling windows that will need massive BTUs to keep cool in the summer or 8' ceilings and little sunlight?
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Response by gut_reno
about 14 years ago
Posts: 24
Member since: Jun 2008
Thanks for all the answers to my questions. I don't know about the op, but the apt we are looking at has central A/C and a gas stove & oven. So we're looking at fridge, microwave, dishwasher, washer/dryer, lights along with TV/computers and whether 60 amps would be enough for all of that. I guess we'll need to get an electrician into the basement. It's Eastern exposure 3 bd with standard windows (not floor to ceiling).
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Response by gut_reno
about 14 years ago
Posts: 24
Member since: Jun 2008
Hi everyone. So I know I took over someone else's thread in asking my questions so I am 'paying back' by following up on what happened with my situation.
I got a friend to take photos of the electric panel in the apartment after having confirmed with the broker what appliances in the apt were gas based and what was not. Then confirmed with the friend that despite the apt being wired for 60 amps because (i) the heating and AC were being provided by the building and (ii) the photos showed there were sufficient circuits to handle all the electric appliances and lighting. Thanks everyone for pitching in. This board is the best helpdesk I know!
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Response by gut_reno
about 14 years ago
Posts: 24
Member since: Jun 2008
My friend has a degree in electrical engineering and happens to work on commercial projects, but I also managed to look up things on the internet.
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Response by LENOXav
about 14 years ago
Posts: 150
Member since: May 2010
Last summer I was looking at a Gut Renovation Project that ultimately, I declined to tackle . . .
I did, however, have ALL the relevant Contractors come and take a look!
Regarding the Electrician, who is a Licensed Electrical Contractor, I simply made a list of everything I wanted in the New Space.
[Multiple AC Units, Kitchen Equipment, W/D, Computers, Lighting, Musical Outfitting..et al!]
I then simply asked, what could I have, or Not?
[It did turn out everything was possible, but that was due to a recent, entire Building Electrical Upgrade!]
I suggest you do the same with a Licensed Electrical Contractor, and proceed from that point!
Electric Capability and Safety is of Prime Importance.
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Response by Squid
about 14 years ago
Posts: 1399
Member since: Sep 2008
Why are you Capitalizing every other Word? You wouldn't Happen to be a Broker, Would you?
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Response by Primer05
about 14 years ago
Posts: 2103
Member since: Jul 2009
Gutreno,
I am currently on a project where the panel showed that we had 100amps, after going to the basement we found he only had 70 amps. I would check the basement to make sure
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Response by kylewest
about 14 years ago
Posts: 4455
Member since: Aug 2007
FWIW, we had 40 Amps in our apartment when purchased. We gut renovated and contractor explained building (post war) pumps 60 amps to each apartment, but for some reason our box only tapped into 40 amps. So he recommended we upgrade the box to make use of the full 60 amps. We did (I think it was about $1500 but it was 3 years ago and I don't exactly remember). Now we have enough to comfortably run two air conditioners and both of our computers and the microwave without blowing ourselves up. Maybe once we blew a circuit breaker. Typically, we don't run all of that at once, anyway.
I seriously doubt that we could run 3 a/c's plus computers and tv and a kitchen appliance without tripping a breaker. I would think a two bedroom requires 80 amps and would be even better with more.
We have a similar issue with an apartment we are looking at. The apartment is wired for 60amps and I was told that the building doesn't allow electrical upgrades. Did you find out what happens? The apartment we are looking at has 2 fuse boxes. That's all we know.
sg007,
40 amps is a very small amount. You at the very least should upgrade the panel and then run direct lines but it still may not be enough. Did any of the contractors/electricians go to the basement to see what you really have? It might be different
Is even 80 amps enough? I'd love to know. My broker is saying 60 amps is standard for all postwar apts and we shouldn't have a problem. We're concerned that if it is outdated now, what would it be seen as if we are trying to sell it later down the road??
40 amps is not sufficient to run all the services you're talking about simultaneously. No way - it just doesn't work. Each breaker is either 10, 15 or 20 amps - you do the math. Picture this scenario, you have the TV on, a couple of computers, refrigerator, 3 window A/Cs - and you're done.
What kind of bldg are you looking at? Townhouse/walkup co-op? The building is long, long overdue for a major upgrade from the street to bring in 300amp service if that's the case. Doesn't make sense in a larger building that you wouldn't have your own panel.
Sorry if this is too obvious, but what does it mean "upgrade the panel and then run direct lines"? Do you mean that we should ask to get more electricity from the basement using risers?
or are you referring to the electrical service panel?
You can get by with 80amps. I am not talking about bringing up more amps, there are a few buildings that allow it but most do not. The op stated that they have circuits. That should be upgraded
Hard to say if x number of amps is enough without knowing anything about the apartment. Is it a studio or a four bedroom? Natural gas in the kitchen or electric only? Southern exposure with 16' floor-to-ceiling windows that will need massive BTUs to keep cool in the summer or 8' ceilings and little sunlight?
Thanks for all the answers to my questions. I don't know about the op, but the apt we are looking at has central A/C and a gas stove & oven. So we're looking at fridge, microwave, dishwasher, washer/dryer, lights along with TV/computers and whether 60 amps would be enough for all of that. I guess we'll need to get an electrician into the basement. It's Eastern exposure 3 bd with standard windows (not floor to ceiling).
Hi everyone. So I know I took over someone else's thread in asking my questions so I am 'paying back' by following up on what happened with my situation.
I got a friend to take photos of the electric panel in the apartment after having confirmed with the broker what appliances in the apt were gas based and what was not. Then confirmed with the friend that despite the apt being wired for 60 amps because (i) the heating and AC were being provided by the building and (ii) the photos showed there were sufficient circuits to handle all the electric appliances and lighting. Thanks everyone for pitching in. This board is the best helpdesk I know!
My friend has a degree in electrical engineering and happens to work on commercial projects, but I also managed to look up things on the internet.
Last summer I was looking at a Gut Renovation Project that ultimately, I declined to tackle . . .
I did, however, have ALL the relevant Contractors come and take a look!
Regarding the Electrician, who is a Licensed Electrical Contractor, I simply made a list of everything I wanted in the New Space.
[Multiple AC Units, Kitchen Equipment, W/D, Computers, Lighting, Musical Outfitting..et al!]
I then simply asked, what could I have, or Not?
[It did turn out everything was possible, but that was due to a recent, entire Building Electrical Upgrade!]
I suggest you do the same with a Licensed Electrical Contractor, and proceed from that point!
Electric Capability and Safety is of Prime Importance.
Why are you Capitalizing every other Word? You wouldn't Happen to be a Broker, Would you?
Gutreno,
I am currently on a project where the panel showed that we had 100amps, after going to the basement we found he only had 70 amps. I would check the basement to make sure
FWIW, we had 40 Amps in our apartment when purchased. We gut renovated and contractor explained building (post war) pumps 60 amps to each apartment, but for some reason our box only tapped into 40 amps. So he recommended we upgrade the box to make use of the full 60 amps. We did (I think it was about $1500 but it was 3 years ago and I don't exactly remember). Now we have enough to comfortably run two air conditioners and both of our computers and the microwave without blowing ourselves up. Maybe once we blew a circuit breaker. Typically, we don't run all of that at once, anyway.
I seriously doubt that we could run 3 a/c's plus computers and tv and a kitchen appliance without tripping a breaker. I would think a two bedroom requires 80 amps and would be even better with more.