90% Financing

Whats the purchase price range?

you can get it - but don't expect the rates to be great.

It means you wont get a 1000000 apartment in Manhattan, you'll have to buy a 500,000 dollar (20% down) in Queens or Brooklyn. Which means you'll have to take the subway to work and when your friends find out you live in the boroughs they'll abandon you. An example of how the credit crisis will affect your social life. Not a big deal. You'll still have heat and hot water. Your kids may even grow up normal. If you werent trying so hard to be a snob in the first place, the adjustment may not be so bad. Don't worry you wont be alone. You'll be together in a new class of displaced manhattan dwellers all over the boroughs. You'll all find each other and swap stories about your new cab driver, truck driver, waitress, bartender, office worker, landscaper, construction worker neighbors that you meet everytime you go out in the morning. You'll try to comfort each other and convince each other you are still better and part of some special clique but still be depressed. You'll be depressed because you tried holding your noses up high among your new neighbors but were only met with strange quizzical looks on their faces, they wont be able to quite figure out why you think you so special, if they ever interpret your attitude at all. They'll still be nice though, even when your still stuck-up, and eventually you may even begin to wonder why you spent so much money trying to be a snob in the first place. You may realize just across the river people were always nice, hard working, and intelligent in many new and different ways. When you car breaks down you'll be amazed how your neighbor, although not a world class attorney or investment banker, leaps to your aid with an incredible amount of intuitive and practical knowledge about your old run down used BMW. When the realization after living in the boroughs finally hits, you'll wonder what was so great about Manhattan living in the first place? All those shallow pursuits you had before, chasing every latest fashion, saving endlessly for that closet sized apartment, hopping from one overpriced bad restaurant to another every night. Who would want to go back to that, even when the economy does recover?

Now can you believe urban is a real estate broker selling in Manhattan.

ummm, dude, that's not urbandigs, its urbandirtbag.

You heard? from who? some friend or message board? definitely not a mortgage professional. What bank does it you say? Well, a real broker wouldnt just post that on a board would he or she? Why help all you little whiny buyers for free? When I walk into your business im sure you'll charge me.

Post your email and for a 2% origination fee, Ill get you 90% financing. Yes 2, not 1. The bad attitudes for brokers on here costs you more for the annoying customer you are going to be. Be happy, because I get deals closed other people can't.

oh

a digs alter ego maybe?

O boy, move to queens? or deal with that guy - (closein10days)

The price range we are looking at is $1.5-2.0 million. Thanks.

If your serious, post your email, you are not going to get good advice on here. What is FICO score and do you rent or own now?

90% not doable in that price range from what i've seen.

Phew, take it easy man, no need to be a shark, they can buy a nice home in the bronx, brooklyn or queens for half, 750k, more square footage, plus a backyard. 20% down and no need to deal with this guy. You see the boroughs has its advantages.

"Be happy, because I get deals closed other people can't."

Like what closein10days? What is it exactly that you can do that the other 5000 mortgage brokers in NYC can't?

From what you have seen? Are you in the industry? Do you track 70 banks a week? Or do you just claim Suzie Orman as your personal friend?

Just answer the question closein10days. What is it exactly that you can do that the other 5000 mortgage brokers in NYC can't?

Yeah, all 5000 mortgage brokers are all equally capable. Another mortgage expert on here from Bankrate.com. What's so hard, post your email, I'll send you my origination agreement, we'll see what kind of borrower you are and if your not on here just fantasizing we'll get it done.

I have 2 portfolio lenders that can look at it, thats all I say and I have already said too much. What do you do for a living Juiceman? Do you work for free.

So why did you claim this?

"Be happy, because I get deals closed other people can't."

If everyone is equally capable, what is it that you bring to the table?

Ummm, no offense closein10days but I was trying to take this thread in another direction. Chill out dude, they might like Queens.

Oh, closein10days, I hope for your sake that Steve doesn't see this string.

No. I don't work for free and wasn't asking you to work for free. I was just wondering why someone would send you their personal information based on a bullshit claim like "Be happy, because I get deals closed other people can't."

Juiceman, you not going to get me to reveal anymore so you can then turn around and cut me out. Nope sorry, doesnt work that way. Can another broker do it? a handful might....... go shop dozens of them yourself and find out. Besides your not the buyer here, so this aint your deal. If IGC wants it, he can post his email. Im not going to babysit and educate everyone else on here. I have better things to do than post on Streeteasy all day.

Breathe, everyone take a deep breath and focus on why you must spend 1.5 to 2 million in Manhattan versus 750k in Brooklyn. You are all attracting the likes of closein10days.

closein10days, I'm not a broker. I just thought your sales pitch was really lame, especially since it took about 2 minutes to unravel it.

IGC, apologies for interrupting your thread, you asked a very legitimate question. I just couldn't sit and listen to the used car pitch from closein10days without chiming in. Don't post your email to this stooge.

I have to prepare for work tomorrow, so Im signing off for the night. I have real customers to worry about. There is no pitch Juiceman, my explanation speaks for itself, if you cant figure it out, well your just not the astute businessman you think you are.

I didnt say you were a broker, you are just trying to get me to reveal my source so you can shop them direct or go to another broker and see if they can do the same thing at the same banks. I'm sure if someone tried to circumvent you in whatever business your in, you'd act the same way.

I said it upthread....... 2 portfolio lenders.......... figure out what a portfolio lender is first, then go shop everyone in the country and ask them if they can do 90%. One more hint........... New York is considered one of the last strong markets in the country...... so other "portfolio" lenders will say they only do 80%, but for some borrowers in New York will go 90. How do I know this...... I worked in this industry 8 days a week.
.
IGC can decide for himself how useful you are Juiceman.

Last hint......... its 90% on a 5 or 7 year ARM

Dont forget the 2%, yes 2 not 1, origination fee.

Paid at closing, when deal is done. No upfront fees. Real buyer has nothing to worry about.

Hmmm, 2% on let's say the bottom range, 1.5 million. That's $30,000!!!!!! Just the origination fee. That's a down payment on a big co-op in Jackson Heights. Nice area. Good restaurants.

Ummm, just curious, since we are on the topic, how many of those do you do a year?

Mortgage brokering is a tough, cutthroat business, u-dirtbag (heh). I doubt he does very many, like Juiceman says, 1000s of brokers out there. Guess why that guy has that attitude.

Translation, no one wants to do a 90% deal for that loan amount so your left dealing with the left over subprime brokers that will charge you 150% more than it should to secure a loan. That doesn't even factor in the rate premium, which will be significant.

You just proved you dont know Sh*t about mortgages Juiceman. I dont remember a single subprime lender that was a portfolio lender. Portfolio lenders keep the higher quality, A paper in their portfolios. Subprime lenders securitize and pass on their crap to everyone else. Thats why we have the crisis we do. Totally different ballgame and you dont know the basic difference. I proved my point, I am not going waste time on you know it all ingrates anymore.

I even gave you a chance to look it up first....... shows how uninformed you truly are.

IGC this guy is doing you no favor.

Uh o, even I knew that, looks like he is your daddy, Juiceman.

Uh, closein10days, didnt you say were signing off aready? Breathe, chill...... maybe they need to sleep on it and when you wake up in the morning they'll post their email. Easy on the heavy sales man.... really you kinda proved a point, but you're a little too aggressive. Give them the time to at least create some fake Yahoo email accounts.

Uh, hey, by the way closein10days, if you are still out there, how many of those do you do a year? Just curious.

wrong again closein10days, I didn't say subprime lending was the same as portfolio lending, I said you were a left over broker from the subprime lending sludge. You have to be with sales pitches like "Be happy, because I get deals closed other people can't." How many reputable portfolio lenders do you hear that from? 2% orig... ha ha ha ha ha

igc.i know it's diffcult to get 90 % but what i have seen ( and im checking this week ) is some of the new developemnts are offering 90 % through thier preffered mortgage brokerage...not too sure how will that work..

all i know is that anything over 729k is some what diffcult to get 90 % financing

urbandirtbag has now intimidated stevejhx from ever entering this thread.

I think you guy/gals are missing the big picture. The fact that you are arguing over this proves one thing. Getting any credit is getting tougher by the day. The truth is about 6 monthes ago all you needed to get a loan was just ask. Now you better have great credit for any type of loan. Jumbos are just that much harder. Putting 20% down is just another way of limiting your risk. If you can only put 10% down on $1M condo then perhaps your over your head from the get go. Just an opinion.

"Putting 20% down is just another way of limiting your risk. If you can only put 10% down on $1M condo then perhaps your over your head from the get go."

dco, you are spot on with this comment. 10% down jumbo's are tough to get for a reason and that's a good thing. Plus, if you have 20%-25% to put down, you will save a bunch in orig fees, get a better rate, and won't have to deal with slimeballs like closein10days.

11201962, I saw the thread. It sounds like urbandirtbag wants to live in Manhattan. S/he should probably try Inwood. Plenty of bargains there, nice prewar buildings, great views. Just don't park your car outside.

closein10days: do you do payday loans, as well?

steve, I had a feeling we would be on the same side of the fence on this one. Wonders never cease!

JuiceMan I posted this on another topic. I tought it would shed some light on how hard it is getting to get credit.

Great article in the NYT about Banks closing HELOC's on people with great credit in all areas of the country. IF anyone would like to review my past posts you will see I predicted this over a week ago. This is just another way that the credit problem will worsen over the next 12-18 months. This will cut off the revolving debt of millions of homeowners. They have already maxed out the credit cards and were using the HELOC to survive. Millions of people have literally been using their HELOC to pay the mortgage, groceries and gas. Now just imagine that this source of money no longer exists. What's the first thing that doesn't get paid. Yes, you guessed it the mortgage. So people ask why I think at times the sky is falling. This is one of the main reasons. These are the millions of home owners that have been hiding behind their HELOC's to cover their bills. Now not only are these homes going to almost double the foreclosures, but the secondary banks that hold these HELOC's are going to get hit a second time. Secondary banks get nothing until the primary mortage gets paid in full. Just think of the Billions in loses not yet factored in to "right down" equation. Once all the banks start to realize that people are using their HELOCs just to survive it will be a race against the clock to close them all ASAP.

If you are using your HELOC to pay your mortgage, groceries or gas there are only 2 ways this story ends.
(1) HELOC stays available and you max it out=Bank takes another $100,000 lose by Foreclosure
(2) HELOC closed= Bank loses $75,000 and house goes into foreclosure.

You guys see it? It's the Banks that lose the most. No one knows what the real damage is. The closing of the Helocs will force Millions of homes into foreclosure in the next 12 months. The lose for the banks will be staggering. People this is the perfect storm. Cash will be King when this goes into full swing and those with cash will make ton of money in the next decade

JuiceMan, sounds like closein10days would recommend you put your down payment on your Discover Card, to take advantage of the low teaser rates.

Nice to be with you, instead of against you. :0

understood dco but your a bit too doomsday for me, lighten up little will ya?

On the HELOC, your statement of "HELOC stays available and you max it out" is where I would have a question. My guess would be that the exposure over the last nine months has been limited. As property values sank, banks reigned the HELOC's and currently, there are very few people using equity to pay off bills. What equity? There is no equity to draw on. As for HELOC's before the housing bust, well, I would just lump that into the mortgage over burden that folks are currently walking away from. I really can't see how this materially changes the 12-18 month outlook from the existing subprime mess.

I used to get solicitations for HELOCs all the time from Citibank and Chase. They've dried up. Not one for months.

Who would want to issue a HELOC on a co-op, even one without an underlying mortgage?

Were HELOCs even available for coops? I thought they were fairly rare.

They offered them, they were available, I know someone who took one out. I said no.

If we had a regular real life conversation Juiceman, you might be able to weasel your way out of your obvious mistake. But its in writing, obvious and very clear upthread that you dont know what your talking about and are trying desperately to bluff your way out. There is no point arguing it anymore, your lack of knowledge is clear. As a matter of fact the more your write makes it more evident how little really do know.

Tougher deals call for higher origination fees. If it requires research and is something 98% percent of the banks wont do, there is either going to be an origination fee or the broker is going to build it into the rate or try to hide it as discount points. You'll pay either way. My approach is more upfront.

I wrote I get loans closed others cant because its true. The portfolio lenders I am talking about Ive had a long relationship with and they'll go a little further for me than for others because I watch out for them. If you knew the business well, you'd know brokers are notorious for scamming lenders. I don't, if I dont think a borrower is who he says he is, I wont pass them on to these lenders and they know it. In return when I think a borrower has solid credentials they'll take my word for it and check it out a little further. That is something that took years to develop and yes a borrower will have to pay more for it. Plain and simple. It is what differentiates me in this situation from almost everyone else.

"is something 98% percent of the banks wont do...."

Exactly! If it's something 98% of the banks won't do, it probably shouldn't be done.

JuiceMan is right. Some loans should not be done. That's why we are where we are today.

You're welcome, JuiceMan - nice to be on your side from time to time.

yawn

You know, Stevejhx, I dont spend a lot of time on Streeteasy but the little I have I noticed you are or seemed to be one of the smarter posters. Its clear Juiceman doesnt know what he is talking about and if this is some sort of online club and your just standing by your guy, friend, buddy whatever, I understand. But dont try to fool everyone else into thinking you are actually being informative. Having a chit-chat, fine. Getting real information across, not even close.

Your just responding with more nonsense.

This is a site for high end borrowers isnt? Dont you all claim to be better qualified than the bulk of borrowers out there? There are people in Manhattan who are clearly in the top 2% when it comes to qualifications. So no its not a case of maybe its something that shouldnt be done. Unless you really believe Manhattan is going to tank and lose tremendous value. There are lenders who will even take a chance on that happening because they still believe Manhattan borrowers would be less likely to walk away from an apartment even if it loses 20 to 30% of its value. Manhattan is one of the last strongholds in the lending business, isnt that what you all post about endlessly?

Your comment "Exactly! If it's something 98% of the banks won't do, it probably shouldn't be done." doesn't show any deep indication of real knowledge. You just making wild guesses and flailing around blindly like your newfound buddy juiceman.

Yawn - exactly. Glad you finally bored yourself juiceman.

Remember 2 point origination. 2 - Two - not 1. Paid at closing. No upfront fees.

Look he's back! Whoa, tough salesman sticking to his price. Look, I dont care for all the arguing either. Just answer the question....... at 2% how many of those to do you a year? 2% of 1.5 million, thats 30,000. What are your expenses? How much of that 30,000 goes into your pocket. You know, take home pay, after rent, advertsing, dinners for all your uber-rich clients? You do dine them, don't you? 30k paycheck, that has to be at least a $200 dinner.

Really, I'm just curious. O yeah, by the way, how long does it take to get to your exalted position? You keep mentioning years. Is a person better off trying to be a mortgage broker or just skip it and go back to med school?

closein10days, I do really well, but lots of posters here make and have a lot more money than I do. I'm in the top 1% of the country, top 2%-3% of Manhattan. But I'm by far not the wealthiest person on any thread.

See our earlier posts on probability, from over the weekend, about what can happen in the future and why being conservative in financing is a good idea. A 2% "origination fee" is basically getting your money before the default happens. Sort of like 20% on credit card debt - banks really don't care about the write-offs, because they have their money in advance.

And actually, closein10days, I used to work for Bank of America and Price Waterhouse (as a bank auditor). Let me tell you a little anecdote: I was the lead auditor for Banesto in Madrid some 15 years ago, and the bank couldn't provide me data on mortgage amortizations, and I refused to certify their results, and because I was on the IT side, it went to the finance side, and we had a gigantic meeting of all the partners and managers involved - I had gone to headquarters in London I was so concerned - and I was overruled and they accepted the results of the computer systems that they wouldn't give me data to confirm.

And I quit and returned to the US, and 6 months later I was walking with my sister through Coconut Grove in Miami, and I read the headlines of El Pais, the dominant Spanish newspaper, which said that the government had seized Banesto and arrested and thrown into jail the entire board of directors for cooking the books.

The year was 1993-1994. Look it up on the Internet. That's why I don't work for Price Waterhouse anymore even though they begged me to stay, and it's why I know you're full of hot air. Don't talk to me about what deals should be done. You might want to sell snake oil, but I know a lot more about how things work than you will ever know. JuiceMan and I disagree on lots, but he's right: a loan with a 2% origination fee is one that shouldn't be done. Get the origination fee, then scoop up the property on foreclosure.

And JuiceMan, hope that "yawn" wasn't for me coming to the rescue! I think our posts overlapped, judging by the "minutes ago" business.

You really are spinning a huge story trying to overwhelming the naieve on here with massive amounts of irrevelant information. The broker, me in this case, sets the origination fee. It's 2% not 1 precisely because I knew on here I would get your kind of customer. An ungrateful, know it all, who is going to pull teeth over every minute aspect of the deal. There is nothing illegal here. 2% is for the headaches of having someone like you, juiceman or whoever as a customer. It has nothing to do with risks involved in lending. Its the price for my expertise.

I dont care where you worked. There are billionaires, pension funds, hedge funds who invested hundreds of billions in mortgage backed securities because they didnt know what was going on on the origination side. Plenty of higher ups who were blind (compartmentalized) to entire areas of this business. I could write for hours about the different angles of the crash and this business. If you were so brilliant why couldnt you have warned everyone and stopped the current credit crisis? You're the 100% know it all expert here? You know everything about this business? Why dont you tell me to google the articles on where you predicted the crisis in subprime or Alt-A in 2006 before it happened. You can't because they dont exist and if they do you didnt write them. Show us how you tried to warn everyone with your overwhelming insight, you wise or should I say wannabe internet sage.

Any broker who reads this thread in New York will know who is right and who is blowing hot air. No matter how hard you spin, they'll be able to see through your overcompensating bull. Please spare me the BS. 2% origination is not unusual at all. It may not be routine in Manhattan, but its routine everywhere else. Your long drawn reply is completely irrelevant. Futile attempt to sidestep the issue. Bottomline is I have 2 lenders who can do Manhattan deals for the right borrower at 90%, 5 or 7 year ARMs. End of Story. Huff, puff and obscure all you want. Its not Bank of America or any other major national lender. Its a lender with its own business model and appetite for a certain type of costumer. Your experiences are irrelevant here.

Another reason the stupidity here is unbelievable is because even though I wont post my sources, there still may be other ones besides my own out there. The lenders I know are still brokering some loans. There are probably a few more in the private banking arena that dont broker that will still do 90%. I can't believe you people come up with these long drawn arguments and no one has even mentioned that yet. Maybe you're all not as wealthy as you say you are.

Deep former banking connections you must have stevejhx (and friends).

Ok, Ok, Ok, you can do it........ I BELIIIIEEEVVEEE YOU!!!!

Me, yes...... I'll take your word for it.

Now, forget those guys and tell me...... 30K origination... How much mullah is that in your pocket. You know, how much time before you get the Rolls Royce? Med school or mortgage broker, where should someone devote there efforts? (Is there a school for mortgage brokers? never heard of one.)

"An ungrateful, know it all, who is going to pull teeth over every minute aspect of the deal. There is nothing illegal here. 2% is for the headaches of having someone like you, juiceman or whoever as a customer."

I AM NOT YOUR CUSTOMER.

"even though I wont post my sources...."

I will.

"The lenders I know are still brokering some loans."

Yes, and if you want a 33% credit card rate, or a payday loan rate, I have a few million I can lend you, too.

You're out of your league, closein10days. I do this on a daily basis. I have the contracts for CDO's on my computer. I have the lawsuits on my computer. You need to be peddling your wares among the unwary.

Look, I don't agree with JuiceMan, or Malraux, or Spunky, or eah, or a lot of people here, but none of us is so stupid as to believe anybody who starts a paragraph with "Any broker...." We're not that dumb. Anybody who posts here is smart enough to know what goes on, even if s/he has a different spin / interest / outlook. But not one of us will take out a payday loan.

Begone! You have no power here!

you can still get 90% from some banks directly. but you need good credit/income, and yes, the rate may not be as good. no reason to go to a broker though.

More irrevelant drivel, spin from stevejhx. You really are clueless. Can you have a discussion without making up pure bullshit? The rate for 90% on 1.5 million for a truly qualified borrower is about 3/8 to 1/2 % more than regular jumbo rates. That's it. 33% is a number you pulled out of your as* to make yourself feel better. Spin, Spin, Spin.

"I have the contracts for CDO's on my computer. I have the lawsuits on my computer." And?
So did the last attorney I did a mortgage for.

Bye. have fun stroking each other's egos even if not much else gets done here. This thread is good material to spread around the office for a good laugh. I never considered you a customer stevejhx, just used you as an example of the tongue twisted anal buyers I encounter regularly. Your bad attitude and arrogance increases the cost of lending for everybody.

Remember, those of you who haved waded through this thread. Do not follow Juiceman's or Stevejhx's example. If you want to know what the deal is. Post your email and I will send you an origination agreement, answer a few questions and I will follow up with a Good Faith Estimate. It's that simple. You will see how wrong Stevejhx and juiceman really are, then you can all write about it and poke fun at them.

Its late and I have to sign off again. I have real customers with real money I need to worry about tomorrow morning

Wait!!!!!!!! Don't go yet...... C'mon man answer my question. It's simple.

30k -minus- expenses = equals = How much net profit?

??????????????????

Ballpark? rounded to the last 1000 dollars? 100 if its not too much to ask. You did say you set the price, so it goes into your pocket right?

Dude, you dont have a lot fans here, at least I'm open-minded. I am trying to be nice. I do know what its like to get picked on in a thread even when you are the smarter guy.

Everybody else be quiet until he answers my question. Can't you see he likes big money without having to type too much. You are wearing him out.

evillager, from reliable sources you can't get 90% for a jumbo nonconforming. Verified from multiple sources. closein10days will sell his mother for his origination fees.

And, evillager, you now that I disagree with you about just about everything. But read what he's writing: "the tongue twisted anal buyers I encounter regularly." Fine, that's who I'll be.

But closein10days, begone. I don't need your money, or your origination fee. Begone!

I know, I know, I know. Its 2 not 1. How much of that 2, I got it, 2 point origination fee not 1 goes home with you? Hello!!!!!!!!!! Simple question, before you pee, have your milk and go to bed.

Closein10days, how many times do you pee a night? When you get up in the middle of the night, too pee, can you just post a quick response? I cant stand the thought of having to go back to that med school application. Please?

Urbandirtbag Only - I close about 2-2.5 million in a slow month, 4 million in a good month. Thats all loan sizes. I dont make 2% origination on everything only the toughest deals. It took me a longtime to build my business and if you have a chance to go to med school, go to med school (you can always learn brokering later.) This business is not what it use to be and who knows where it will be in 5 years. You dont want to spend all day dealing with customers like Juiceman and stevejhx. I have to go f__k my wife and go to bed, maybe I'll say more tomorrow.

Reliable sources, ahahahhaahaa, stevejhx got on the phone and is now calling all the online lenders that are open late at night. Eloans, quicken, ahahahahahahaha. Cant wait to pass this around to other brokers.

"I dont make 2% origination on everything only the toughest deals." "You dont want to spend all day dealing with customers like Juiceman and stevejhx."

You are correct about something closein10days, steve and I would be your toughest customers. We would call you on all of your complete and total bullshit (and enjoy it). You can't close deals with people like us. That's why you feed on people that are less likely to call you on your bullshit and why the housing crisis is as bad as it is. Keep talking, you are educating everyone on what a scumbag you are.

"I have to go f__k my wife"

Would you trust this guy with your $2M purchase?

The guy who doesnt know the difference between subprime and portfolio lending, now has to cover his blunt stupidity with more and more irrelevant remarks to the topic at hand.

Find a better broker than me........ or loan officer at a direct lender. Ahahahahaaha. Others will coddle you, feed your ego, cater to your vanity and then turn around a charge you much more than me. Higher rates, fat back end premiums from your nicer, clean cut banker all wait for those who are averse to origination fees. Mommy and Daddy must have sheltered you all life because you have no idea how the real world works.

Bye. Wasted enough time today.

x

I was just on the phone with counrtywide. 945,000 loan. 750 credit rating. They want 25% down and told me I was in a soft market. I told him not to say that, a broker would snap your head off.

stevejhx got on the phone and is now calling all the online lenders that are open late at night.

No, actually, I cold buy cash, but I don't buy hot dogs on the street, & I don't do your sort. JuiceMan's right, & I disagree with him on just about everything: if you say, "I have to go f__k my wife," it's like:

YOU HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDING!

I'm waaaay gay, & couldn't say that about anybody. & if my brother-in-law said that about my sister, I'D SLIT HIS THROAT.

And he's a heart surgeon, so he might just survive.

closein10day: just crawl under a hole and die. The entire streeteasy community, not just juiceman and me, will gag till you die.

HOW COULD YOU SAY THAT ABOUT YOU WIFE?

Begone!

steve, notice that I said "you do not need a broker", I don't get my info from some scumbag on a message board like this guy. but yes, you can get 90% from very, very reliable sources, it's just harder to come by and depends on your (verifiable) income and credit. a broker will not help you though.

My current experience in the loan market is consistent with evillager's statement. I would add that a longstanding relationship with an institution seems to carry some weight these days. What goes around does come around eventually. Show a good banker some loyalty over the course of a couple decades, and he/she can provide a lot of help for free, including many of the services for which closein10nanoseconds charges 200 points.

stevejhx: In our age bracket, most of the wives I know who get it on a regular basis are pretty happy. The "have to" part is a bit troubling; but IMO putting the boots to one's better half on a regular basis is a fine and happy thing. If he had said he had to go BEAT his wife, that would be offensive - even more so than his origination fees.

Granted, stevejhx, closein10drek could have chosen his words and venue more delicately. But if your brother-in-law excuses himself from the dinner table one night and says, "You know Steve, this discussion of Manhattan real estate trends has been fascinating, but I really need to go bang your sister," there may be more appropriate responses than slitting his throat.

It's just a nasty thing to say, West81st, even if you say "bang." But in any case I wouldn't have to do it. My sister would.

Wow.