Hi all, looking for some advice. The last person who lived in my apartment renovated it before selling it to me, and the contractors did a shoddy job that has led to leaking from my bathroom and wall damage. The mistakes made by the previous contractor have been corroborated by two independent contracts I brought in. Okay, so that situation sucks, but whatever, chalk it up to never trusting... [more]
Hi all, looking for some advice. The last person who lived in my apartment renovated it before selling it to me, and the contractors did a shoddy job that has led to leaking from my bathroom and wall damage. The mistakes made by the previous contractor have been corroborated by two independent contracts I brought in.
Okay, so that situation sucks, but whatever, chalk it up to never trusting someone else's renovations and the pain of home-ownership. But now my coop's management company is trying to charge me $500-$1000 just for the RIGHT to repair this. They are claiming it is an alteration fee.
Naturally I think this is ridiculous because if I do not fix it, it will leak into the apartments below. I am doing the building a favor by paying for this out of pocket.
What are my options, aside from paying it? What can happen if I refuse to pay the "processing fee" to the management company that is trying to gouge me? I suppose the coop can threaten to kick me out of the building, but I doubt they would do that over $500.
I am not saying I will refuse to pay, but I am wondering what the ramifications may be, however insignificant or horrible. Thanks.
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Response by crescent22
over 10 years ago
Posts: 953
Member since: Apr 2008
That kind of alteration fee is standard. It's true your alteration is relatively minor and to fix a past bad alteration but the charge is a fixed one regardless of renovation breadth. If you don't pay, the mgmt co. won't approve the alteration to the Board in the first place.
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Response by uptown_joe
over 10 years ago
Posts: 293
Member since: Dec 2011
Agreed with crescent. This is a coop apartment you purchased, and the leaky portion is your plumbing (installed by the prior owner's contractor, which you then bought as-is), so you are going to be responsible for the costs of the remedies which includes the building management fees associated with executing those remedies.
You are not "doing the building a favor" by paying. If you delay and damage results in other units, you will just be adding more costs to repair the damage, plus annoyed neighbors and perhaps a fight with your insurer about why they should cover damage if you unreasonably delayed handling a known issue.
The fee is a typical magnitude for an alteration agreement; it sounds like this repair does require opening walls, performing plumbing work, and rebuilding the finishes, which is an alteration despite it not gaining you much.
You are free to try avoiding payment of the management fee, or try to proceed without management and board approval, but you will end up paying it anyway plus other penalties (financial plus headaches including that the super will shut down your repair project).
I know this is frustrating and expensive but the problem is really with the prior work. You might consider trying to recover costs (at least partially) from that contractor somehow. Or if there is other renovation work you had thought to do, lump it into this project which at least spreads the one alteration-agreement fee across multiple goals.
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Response by Flutistic
over 10 years ago
Posts: 516
Member since: Apr 2007
Did you see the film "Trainwreck"? Two kids (Amy and her sister as kids) are coached by their philandering father to repeat again and again: "Monogamy is unrealistic. Monogamy is unrealistic."
SO what you need to do is go look in a mirror and repeat, "I don't own an apartment. I don't own an apartment."
You are a renter with an equity interest in your landlord's company, which happens to be a nonprofit. So you get to vote for the board of directors, just as you would in any other little privately held company. But just because you own stock in Starbucks doesn't mean you get to drink all the coffee you want for free.
Managing agents are paid ridiculously little in New York City, in my view, as somebody who has hired a few of these companies in other regions of the USA. They make their money off of fees when individual residents need services, such as moving in and out or alteration agreement reviews.
You do understand fortunately that yes the landlord can evict you if you violate the terms of your lease, called a proprietary lease. It probably calls your monthly rent payment "maintenance" although the one we had used the word rent, in a refreshing bit of honesty.
That's a completely normal fee, and yes you have to pay it, and I try to be very nice to managing agents because they are just doing their jobs. They work for the board of directors, not for you. Your monthly maintenance does not reflect the true cost of their services, so from time to time you and your fellow shareholders are going to have to pony up extra money for extra service.
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Response by CoopCalamity
over 10 years ago
Posts: 3
Member since: Jun 2012
Sounds like the norm. Re: Flutistic - I am not receiving any additional service. It is pure mooching. I guess I will pay it because the alternative is likely more financially damaging than just paying it, but let's not kid ourselves that this is anything but a "nickle and dime" fee that adds absolutely no value to anyone except the management company's wallet.
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Response by jelj13
over 10 years ago
Posts: 821
Member since: Sep 2011
I don't know about this. My coop allows you to make repairs on contracted work for several months after it's done, no extra charges. The contractor is also allowed to return to "tweak" something done on the job.
On the other hand, if the leak is in the wall, why isn't the coop fixing it? They can't tell whether it's your replaced plumbing or old pipes connected to them unless they open the walls.
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That kind of alteration fee is standard. It's true your alteration is relatively minor and to fix a past bad alteration but the charge is a fixed one regardless of renovation breadth. If you don't pay, the mgmt co. won't approve the alteration to the Board in the first place.
Agreed with crescent. This is a coop apartment you purchased, and the leaky portion is your plumbing (installed by the prior owner's contractor, which you then bought as-is), so you are going to be responsible for the costs of the remedies which includes the building management fees associated with executing those remedies.
You are not "doing the building a favor" by paying. If you delay and damage results in other units, you will just be adding more costs to repair the damage, plus annoyed neighbors and perhaps a fight with your insurer about why they should cover damage if you unreasonably delayed handling a known issue.
The fee is a typical magnitude for an alteration agreement; it sounds like this repair does require opening walls, performing plumbing work, and rebuilding the finishes, which is an alteration despite it not gaining you much.
You are free to try avoiding payment of the management fee, or try to proceed without management and board approval, but you will end up paying it anyway plus other penalties (financial plus headaches including that the super will shut down your repair project).
I know this is frustrating and expensive but the problem is really with the prior work. You might consider trying to recover costs (at least partially) from that contractor somehow. Or if there is other renovation work you had thought to do, lump it into this project which at least spreads the one alteration-agreement fee across multiple goals.
Did you see the film "Trainwreck"? Two kids (Amy and her sister as kids) are coached by their philandering father to repeat again and again: "Monogamy is unrealistic. Monogamy is unrealistic."
SO what you need to do is go look in a mirror and repeat, "I don't own an apartment. I don't own an apartment."
You are a renter with an equity interest in your landlord's company, which happens to be a nonprofit. So you get to vote for the board of directors, just as you would in any other little privately held company. But just because you own stock in Starbucks doesn't mean you get to drink all the coffee you want for free.
Managing agents are paid ridiculously little in New York City, in my view, as somebody who has hired a few of these companies in other regions of the USA. They make their money off of fees when individual residents need services, such as moving in and out or alteration agreement reviews.
You do understand fortunately that yes the landlord can evict you if you violate the terms of your lease, called a proprietary lease. It probably calls your monthly rent payment "maintenance" although the one we had used the word rent, in a refreshing bit of honesty.
That's a completely normal fee, and yes you have to pay it, and I try to be very nice to managing agents because they are just doing their jobs. They work for the board of directors, not for you. Your monthly maintenance does not reflect the true cost of their services, so from time to time you and your fellow shareholders are going to have to pony up extra money for extra service.
Sounds like the norm. Re: Flutistic - I am not receiving any additional service. It is pure mooching. I guess I will pay it because the alternative is likely more financially damaging than just paying it, but let's not kid ourselves that this is anything but a "nickle and dime" fee that adds absolutely no value to anyone except the management company's wallet.
I don't know about this. My coop allows you to make repairs on contracted work for several months after it's done, no extra charges. The contractor is also allowed to return to "tweak" something done on the job.
On the other hand, if the leak is in the wall, why isn't the coop fixing it? They can't tell whether it's your replaced plumbing or old pipes connected to them unless they open the walls.