I am trying to figure out if the rundown 2 story building next to my apartment in mid-Chelsea is likely to get torn down and renovated any time soon (blocking my lot line windows). Our Board President said the chance of anyone trying to develop that property is extremely low. The lot is 25x90 and can only go up six floors per DOB code. Both buildings on each side are also 6 stories, so the only... [more]
I am trying to figure out if the rundown 2 story building next to my apartment in mid-Chelsea is likely to get torn down and renovated any time soon (blocking my lot line windows). Our Board President said the chance of anyone trying to develop that property is extremely low. The lot is 25x90 and can only go up six floors per DOB code. Both buildings on each side are also 6 stories, so the only windows would be facing North and South. Also, residential buildings in this zoning area need a 30 foot rear yard, so the exterior dimensions could be no larger than 25x60 (interior probably closer to 22x57). Since the building will likely also need an elevator and code compliant stairs, our Board President believes it is not financially attractive to develop this site as each floor would have a relatively small foot print. That being said, I don't know the current development environment. As a novice, it seems to me that any time a property can be improved in the city, someone will do so.
Any words of wisdom?
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Response by Elleinad85
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 114
Member since: Jul 2011
The only way to protect potential development is to have your building purchase the building. 25X90 is a pretty decent sized lot (2,400 square feet per floor - a nice 3 bedroom condo potentially) which could be developed into a retail floor plus 5 residential condo's. 12,000 square feet, could potentially be worth $24,000,000 when developed. You just have to find a buyer willing to purchase the property for a few million and build on it.
The "any time soon" for you should include speaking with the owner and figuring out his/her time horizon to sell. If they purchased a while ago, they are probably satisfied with the current returns as-is.
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Response by nyc_sport
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 809
Member since: Jan 2009
I don't think you can ever assess this as you do. There is no square inch on the isle of Manhattan that would not be developed if the time was right and the participants were willing. Zoning rules change, and there are ways to expand upon them (inclusionary housing, community facilities, etc.) I have some doubts that the 30' rear yard requirement is real, but unless you are in the landmark area it is not clear that the lot owner could not acquire adjacent properties. Still, at the right price I would buy that. A 25 foot wide lot could make a quite elegant townhouse.
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Response by Aaron2
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 1705
Member since: Mar 2012
Depending on the other adjacent properties don't rule out a developer assembling a group and putting up a larger building on the combined lots.
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Response by NWT
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 6643
Member since: Sep 2008
Right, if it can be developed, it will be, someday.
The 30' requirement for mid-block rear yards is correct. The idea is that back-facing apartments get the same 60' of light and air that street-facing apartments do. On a typical 100'-deep lot, that leaves a 70'-deep typical floor. On wide cross streets, 60' or so.
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Response by kdawgydwg99
almost 10 years ago
Posts: 9
Member since: Feb 2012
Thanks folks! This is very helpful! A couple of quick updates, it turns out the building is even narrower than we thought (it's only 20'), which leaves less usable square footage internally. Also, the building is flanked on all sides by large condo buildings that can't be developed, so that may add a bit of protection, as well.
The only way to protect potential development is to have your building purchase the building. 25X90 is a pretty decent sized lot (2,400 square feet per floor - a nice 3 bedroom condo potentially) which could be developed into a retail floor plus 5 residential condo's. 12,000 square feet, could potentially be worth $24,000,000 when developed. You just have to find a buyer willing to purchase the property for a few million and build on it.
The "any time soon" for you should include speaking with the owner and figuring out his/her time horizon to sell. If they purchased a while ago, they are probably satisfied with the current returns as-is.
I don't think you can ever assess this as you do. There is no square inch on the isle of Manhattan that would not be developed if the time was right and the participants were willing. Zoning rules change, and there are ways to expand upon them (inclusionary housing, community facilities, etc.) I have some doubts that the 30' rear yard requirement is real, but unless you are in the landmark area it is not clear that the lot owner could not acquire adjacent properties. Still, at the right price I would buy that. A 25 foot wide lot could make a quite elegant townhouse.
Depending on the other adjacent properties don't rule out a developer assembling a group and putting up a larger building on the combined lots.
Right, if it can be developed, it will be, someday.
The 30' requirement for mid-block rear yards is correct. The idea is that back-facing apartments get the same 60' of light and air that street-facing apartments do. On a typical 100'-deep lot, that leaves a 70'-deep typical floor. On wide cross streets, 60' or so.
Thanks folks! This is very helpful! A couple of quick updates, it turns out the building is even narrower than we thought (it's only 20'), which leaves less usable square footage internally. Also, the building is flanked on all sides by large condo buildings that can't be developed, so that may add a bit of protection, as well.