be@Schermerhorn 4 months later -- below market?

supply and demand, supply and demand

Still overpriced. Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay overpriced. For a "developing neighborhood" I'd never pay over $100k, no matter the size of the apartment or amenities. It's like spending a day at the track. Pure gamble.

JRob3529, I think we all agree that "Be@" developments are generally SOLID ivenstments, and their Schermerhorn development is no exception. The bldg is well planned and executed in my opinion, and the units are priced more *realistically* than others in the area--although, given the market, it may need to come down further.

However, the downtown Brooklyn/Ft. Greene market is beyond dead (see BellTel, Forte, Oro, One Hanson, etc.). In addition to people not buying at all anywhere, downtown Brooklyn/Ft. Greene has taken a severe hit because developments there often target those who have been "priced out" of Manhattan.

But one is now able to find good condo conversions in Manhattan in the $750/SF range (e.g., take their own "Be@William," for instance, which is quite reasonably priced). In this price range, most potential buyers would probably prefer to be in Manhattan...

By the way, I just looked at the floorplans. There is not a single 2-bedroom apartment that I would ever want to live in. They are TINY!--most are in the 800-850 square foot range (based on their calculation)--I imagine the true figure is less than that. I want to revise my previous post and say that I'd never pay more than $50,000 for one of those apartments. This is another example of what happens when greedy developers try to peddle %$#% for $800psf in a "developing" part of Brooklyn.

CORRECTION: They claim 850-1,050 square feet for the 2-bedrooms, but I still think it's less than that. In any event, the bedrooms are TINY (12 x 12 for a master bedroom is a joke).

Calm down, Slope11217. It's okay. We got your point the 1st time, although a new construction 2BR in the middle of nowhere in one of those square states would cost more than $50k.

Thanks duvravcic. So do you really think the neighborhood is dead, or it's development is just going to be slowed as a result of more people staying in Manhattan? I live a few blocks south in Cobble Hill, so the neighborhood is less of an issue for me. My big questions are if a) they'll sell the building out on a reasonable timeframe and b) if the building itself will be desirable enough in 3-5 years to attract renters at a rate that will cover the mortgage. As for the pricing, the sales rep was offering a sort of price protection when i visited the condo -- if a comparable unit's price is cut before closing, the price cut will be applied to your unit as well. They just slashed 18%, so not sure how much lower they'll go -- but seems like a good deal to me.
Thanks again for your feedback!

the ceilings are low. That isn't something that can ever change - it isn't like you can buy the apartment above you and knock out the floor/ceiling.

JRob, again, it's a very nice bldg., and I have never heard anything bad about Be@ properties. With this said, nobody in the right mind would recommend you to buy at a development w/ zero % sold in this climate. NOTHING in that area is doing well (110 Livingston was the last development to do well).

I'd urge you to check out their "sister development" at 90 William--Be@William. The last I heard, it's 85% sold/closed and they want to wrap it all up ASAP. They're priced well to begin with, but they sound highly motivated and are apparently paying closing costs.

If I were in your situation, I'd probably forget about Schermerhorn (which will turn into a rental bldg shortly because nobody would be able to close w/o a set % of units sold) and check out Be@William. franko would be happy to know that Be@William has very high ceilings. More importantly, the bldg. is financially sound, you WILL get a good price there, and you will also get the same Be@-brand amenities. I think the website is beatWilliam.com ... yes, beat him! Good lock.

Thanks for the Be@William advice, but their cheapest studio is $200k more than my budget (even factoring in how comparable units have been negotiated down). So unless they're now REALLY eager to sell...
I'll be sure to let you know what I decide to do. Thanks again for your thoughts.

Major price cuts here. I wonder what this means in terms of the fate of the building going rental. Ideas?

Yeah I saw in my email update a few places got cut ~10%.

I like the layout of #17J
http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/346103-condo-189-schermerhorn-downtown-brooklyn-brooklyn

There's a lot of reason's why I wouldn't personally buy at that location, but the building seems nice enough.

oops - reasons. My pre-latte grammar is apparently lacking.

Yeah nice exposures and layout indeed for 17J. But it'll take some courage to go in with 230 units still available.

Cut 17J to $300k and I'd be thinking pretty seriously about the risk/reward balance....

I do believe they'd convert the entire building to rental before selling at prices that low however.

I have it on good authority that they are definitely planning to go rental once selling a certain number of units. Apparently, they're trying to avoid having to go rent stabilized, so they have to sell a certain percentage of the units to change the status of the building. Why anyone would want to buy in a building with so many common elements when it is just going to go rental is beyond me, Why pay so much for your condo only to have to share laundry facilities with renters who couldn't care less about maintaining an investment in the building? I guess people are believing the selling agents when they say that there are no intentions to go rental. They are gonna be sorry!

The laundry room is too small for 250 units. Also, did anyone turn on those 'hotel like' air and heating units below each window. NOISEY! Why would they build this nice building and not go the extra step?

I checked their website & damn, the rooms ARE tiny. The 900 - 1100 sqft 2 Bed/2 Bath could work if you tear down the walls for the 2nd bedroom and basically convert it into a 1 bedroom with a larger living room and dining room.

The lack of washer and dryer in the units is a big mistake. Just about everything about this building screams it was meant to be a rental building from the start. BTW, what exactly is the ceiling height? And, can people actually wear shoes in this building on the hardwood floors without the neighbors below them hearing it?

I'm happy to see that the over $1,000 per sqft insanity is gone for this place but if they want to actually sell, the prices will have to come in the $400 - $500 per sqft. Even then only a few will bite but at least some will and just maybe they'll sell enough to not turn into a rent stablized building.

Saw them in person today, and the apartments are smaller than I expected - the second bedroom in the 2's are tiny. Decent views on the South-facing units. The air conditioners where disappointing - too noisy as someone else pointed out. I liked the peninsula sink with deep countertops. The location is great for commuting with all the nearby subway lines and LIRR, but it does not feel like a Brooklyn neighborhood - that area has always felt more like downtown in some southern town more than anywhere in New York.

And they say move-in date will be in Q4, which probably means Q1 of 2010. After seeing what looked like reasonable prices online, after seeing them in person, I have to agree that they will have to come down at least $100/sqft to get a lot of interest in this market. I'll be watching.

Q4 movein? What's taking them so long? The facade has been done for like 6 months now.

Why buy an apartment with an @ in the name?

no washer and dryer in the unit, do something to distinguish you building

1OneWon, I do think your reply is relevant here. I thought I'd jump in and tell you that LG also sells some environmentally-friendly all-in-one laundry units that are small enough to fit under the kitchen counter/by the island, in the closet, etc. w/o vents. They are said to be much more energy efficient. If the lack of w/d is a deal breaker for you, you might consider this option.

Went to OH yesterday and the number of people who showed up was laughable. I was told they are currently 12% sold. Basically the same pros n cons. Great location close to subways and smith street but nothing special on the inside. I would almost describe it as cheap and unattractive. Besides the GE appliances, the rest of the place reminded me of a cheap motel and the gigantic air conditioner takes up a sizeable space in what's already cramped. Maintenance is high for Brooklyn standards ($450 for small one bed) and tax abatement still pending. Is anyone knowledgeable with tax abatements? Do most developments like this end up getting the abatement or is it a toss up? Overall, I agree with everyone that it needs to drop another $100-$150 per sq ft. Currently at around $700.

ripfuel45, I agree.. they really went cheap with cutting corners. No laundry hook ups in units. Can you imagine sharing that small laundry room with 250 units? I don't get it... why make the thing and then make it like a flea motel. I too didn't like the HVACs and if you turned them on... ugh..

They've now pushed the completion date for the north tower from june/july (when I last spoke to them in April) to first quarter of next year.

Unfortunately what the market needs is quality housing for stable home-owners, not a fall-back to a rental because corners were cut.

Sales have picked up considerably in the building recently. The be@ community is a lifestyle: you stay in your apartment, you live in the building and the building is an extension of the city. Check out the other be@ buildings and you'll understand

"The be@ community is a lifestyle: you stay in your apartment, you live in the building and the building is an extension of the city."

Holy crap. Do you guys repeat this stuff in unison at the REBNY brainwashing sessions?

it's a lifestyle alright, a douchebag lifestyle.

No, Williamsburg is the douchebag lifestyle.

Life style...I love it!
...sung by Billy Joel..."Is that all you get for your money"
The world is your oyster...now go live in one.

"The be@ community is a lifestyle: you stay in your apartment, you live in the building and the building is an extension of the city"

wow..sounds like something from zoolander

"The be@ community is a lifestyle: you stay in your apartment, you live in the building and the building is an extension of the city"

What is so special about this lifestyle? Any building can claim this. LOL!

the developer is sds procida - so sdsbrooklyn must be the developer

I just heard that they took listings for this building off the market... there's rumors of it going rental...

Wait, it's going rental? I wanted to buy there. If there are any available apartments left for sale, someone please direct me to them. I'm tired of renting and want to buy soon. All cash. PLEASE DON'T GO RENTAL BEFORE I GET MY PIECE OF HEAVEN!!

Does anyone know what is really going on with this development?

Something is going on, All the sales listings on Corcoran have been pulled. Unless there's another round of price cuts it very well could be going rental.

It could be going bankrupt. I tried calling their sales number and it is disconnected.

it is disconnected..thats not good

Yup it is. I'm surprised Curbed or Brownstoner hasn't posted anything about what's going on.

I called the listing agent Aaron Lemma asking about the open house here is a recap of the conversation?

AL: Hello(Whispering like he was trying to disguise his voice from someone he owed money to)
Me: Good Morning is this Aaron Lemma
AL: Who is this?(Reacting like I was a telemarketer)
Me: I was just calling about the condos at 189 Schermerhorn Street
AL: How did you get this number?
Me: From your company's website Corcoran.com; I wanted to know if there will be an open house this Sunday?
AL: There won't be any open house for this month.(Replying with a piss poor attitude)
Me: Thank you, nice attitude!

WTF? The weird thing is, I noticed some of the other RE agents are still posting adds for this building on Craigs List. He emailed me back when I was pre-approved for mortage I wonder if I should shoot an email back asking of the property is still available and see what I get.

I hope he doesn't have an @beatschermerhorn.com email address the server is probably shut down.

wow, they're probably tied up in some kind of litigation.

I always thought this was one of the worst excesses of the Brooklyn condo boom. A bad location -- right near Fulton Mall -- and really unattractive apts. Prices through the roof -- it never made any sense.

HH11231, I am a bit surprised to hear this. I've dealt w/ him before, and my honest impression was: "Wow, for a cute boy, he is really, really nice and courteous!" Seriously, he was exceeeeeeedingly nice. Sure, he didn't seem to be the sharpest knife in the drawer, but he was pretty nice--and pretty.

Anyhow, about his phone manner...I wonder if it was his summer intern that took the call...

Actually the prices of this place are far from through the roof like others in the general area. Toren, Oro and Forte in bad locations and charging way more for their condos.

This building was in a better location, close to more subway lines and technically, only one block outside of Boerum Hill proper. The inside looked like most of the other new buildings going up everywhere else. There's really not a lot of difference when you get down to it.

No, not a whole lot of difference except for:

1. Smaller sizes of comparable units. It's the mini-me of studios, 1 bedrooms, & 2 Bedrooms.
2. No washer/dryer in the unit. Not even hook-ups.
3. Price psf is way too high.
4. Thin walls. (To be fair, that is the standard these days.)

On the other hand, it will make for a nice rental for students and short time renters. It's practically made for NYU students, and now that NYU has taken over Brooklyn's Polytech University, (was cities oldest uni., older than NYU) the students can live here. I think it's a match made in heaven.

I think the target market segment there (young professionals in their late 20s to early 30s?), unfortunately, got hit VERY hard by the recession. It is a pity if it becomes student housing, but that would be a more realistic pathway than, say, trying to convince financially stable older adults/families to purchase smaller units w/ no W/D hookups.

If they would have completed a couple of years earlier... They would have sold out in a heartbeat.

The sales # is back up and working now. Perhaps they could be holding off sales until the end of summer.

Did anyone answer the phone?

I guess not.

This building is toast

what are the latest comps.

like i said toast

What is possible in this building is to put 2 adjacent apartments together, creating a sizable layout and the possibility to add washer dryer in unit. The prices for doing that then make it very competitive with other Bklyn properties. The question is what all these delays really mean and how much rental will be there. All condos will have some rentals because many people buy as investment properties. This is a tricky one though in a messed up economy. Make low offers and see if anyone bites.

How is that "deal" coming along?

;-)

Aren't they still in negotiations with their lender? They do need to lower prices even more but I also think the fact that it isn't over 50% sold is still keeping people away. No one wants to pay an extra % for a mortgage with rates as low as they are and that's probably keeping a lot of people from buying in any new building that is having those problems.